Is this THE WORST TIME EVER to buy bits for a new PC?

[Bleeding-Edge]

I am in the market for a new PC. I have been looking into it ALL since December after a long time of not looking. It's been a fairly bewildering time even although I am Computing "professional" and have been for the last 25 years....I have just been happy with my old Ivybridge system until recently as it really is starting to show it's age now....I have been skint too ;-)
I am trying to decide on which platform to buy into.

Intel's 12th gen and DDR5, Intel's 12th gen and DDR4, Intel's 11th gen and DDR4 or the Rysen CPU's.

It looks like the 12th gen CPU's are fraught with problems currently and I really don't want to use Windows 11 as it's so new it's bound to SUCK for a few years. Pairing a 12th gen CPU with DDR 4 seems like a poor option. The cost and availability of DDR5 and it's stability seems like a huge AVOID RED FLAG of a warning. I really don't want to wait for another year before I can run software I want to run...IF "they" fix it...It could be that just about everything I like won't run on them.....

The motherboards for the 12th gen CPU seem to be old motherboards that have been re-worked to use the LGA1700 socket and there is very little new to the market. The semi conductor crisis seem to have paralysed R&D and QC as well as availability and pricing....Perhaps it's just me but the current line of motherboards for the 12th gen seem like "cut and shuts" an old board with new tech bits strapped on with zip-ties....

I am an Intel person so I am leaning now towards the 11th gen Intel CPU's as I believe they are slightly better in gaming and single core hyper threading than the Rysen CPU's...BUT is this true? It is also a well developed stable platform and widely compatible with everything. I also have a ATI Freesynch monitor so I want to get an AMD video card and perhaps this paring might work better than an Intel/Nvidia system...Does it? I can drop £600 on a graphics card at a push but less obviously would be better....

I fancy the idea of a multi cored CPU with the virtual cores the way AMD do it. It is new technology and its had time to mature. I don't think the 11th gen Intel CPU's are like this are they? They aren't very "new" are they....Just re-worked old tech boosted up. What IS the difference between say a 11th gen Intel CPU and an 10th gen one? Two hyperthreads per core instead of one?

However I would imagine they are nice and stable and compatible....

My main interest in performance is purely for gaming, I don't do much that is CPU intensive, rendering video or audio or virtual machines so I probably won't need a high core count.

I am tempted by the Rysen CPU's but I am put off literally by the flimsiness of the AM4 socket. I managed to pull out a Rysen CPU from it's socket recently when trying to remove the heat sink and I wasn't impressed with the motherboard, a gigabyte Aorus, it felt cheap and nasty.

I am particularly interested in Star Citizen and I just read on the RSI web site that it does not work with a 12th gen CPU currently....Probably due to Easy Anti Cheat but who knows......

Video cards are also insane right now. The worst time ever to buy one......

Money...£1500 ish is ready to go.......I just need a push in the right direction...

I would like to hear your thoughts on all this. I am not after exact specs right now just an idea about which platform to go for.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Is this THE WORST TIME EVER to buy bits for a new PC?

I don't think it can get much worse, but I would not bet on that either.

On top of still unresolved COVID supply chain issues, fuel costs, shortages in production capabilities in essentially all computer component (or just "all") industries, and particularly in microprocessor (chip) production, and now Putin's war all affecting supply and costs, there could easily also be another natural disaster (flood, hurricane, earthquake, etc.) wiping out major production capabilities that compounds matters even more.

I too am looking to upgrade as my current system, this one, is getting long in the tooth (I built it in Feb 2016) and does not support W11. Plus, I have "that" incessant "itch" starting to drive me crazy.

But my punishment for doing my homework and buying quality parts 6 years ago is that this system is still working great and is still easily meeting (if not exceeding) my "needs" (other than that damn itch). The problem is, my "wants" are far greater than my "needs".

Another downside to today's current scenario is all the shortages have resulted in fewer choices. Makers are producing fewer models, and retailers are not even stocking all of those.

So I have decided to wait. The chip shortage, high fuel costs, supply chain issues and Putin's war will end (hopefully with Ukraine still a sovereign nation). Availability will go up causing demand to go down, and that, in turn, will allow prices to go down too.

So, IMO, unless you must buy a new computer now, I say wait. Keep doing your homework to stay current in the technologies. Keep building up your budget savings, then pull the trigger when the dust settles and the pickings are ripe, and plentiful.

 

[Cutechri]

I would wait, unless you really need one right now. Yes, this is the worst time.

I was lucky enough to somehow grab a Ryzen 5000 CPU and a RTX 30 GPU at MSRP or even under, in early 2021, but not everyone has that luxury. At least I'm fine for a few more years.

 

[80-watt Hamster]

EDIT: Re-reading your post, you were looking at platform advice. IMO, you can't really go wrong with 11th gen or Zen3. If you're more comfortable with Intel, go Intel. Just make sure you've got decent cooling if going with 11600K or above.

Graphics is awful; everything else isn't too bad at the moment. If you re-use your case and storage, platform+PSU can be had for under GBP500:

That leaves you 1K for graphics, if you're OK with paying current prices. If an RX 6600 is enough, you can snag one for less than 400 quid. You'd be out the door for less than a grand.

(5600G was just an example, mostly picked because it was almost exactly 200.)

 

[r9]

The world is about the end so I think its perfect time.

 

[Bones]

I am in the market for a new PC. I have been looking into it ALL since December after a long time of not looking. It's been a fairly bewildering time even although I am Computing "professional" and have been for the last 25 years....I have just been happy with my old Ivybridge system until recently as it really is starting to show it's age now....I have been skint too ;-)
I am trying to decide on which platform to buy into.

Intel's 12th gen and DDR5, Intel's 12th gen and DDR4, Intel's 11th gen and DDR4 or the Rysen CPU's.

It looks like the 12th gen CPU's are fraught with problems currently and I really don't want to use Windows 11 as it's so new it's bound to SUCK for a few years. Pairing a 12th gen CPU with DDR 4 seems like a poor option. The cost and availability of DDR5 and it's stability seems like a huge AVOID RED FLAG of a warning. I really don't want to wait for another year before I can run software I want to run...IF "they" fix it...It could be that just about everything I like won't run on them.....

The motherboards for the 12th gen CPU seem to be old motherboards that have been re-worked to use the LGA1700 socket and there is very little new to the market. The semi conductor crisis seem to have paralysed R&D and QC as well as availability and pricing....Perhaps it's just me but the current line of motherboards for the 12th gen seem like "cut and shuts" an old board with new tech bits strapped on with zip-ties....

I am an Intel person so I am leaning now towards the 11th gen Intel CPU's as I believe they are slightly better in gaming and single core hyper threading than the Rysen CPU's...BUT is this true? It is also a well developed stable platform and widely compatible with everything. I also have a ATI Freesynch monitor so I want to get an AMD video card and perhaps this paring might work better than an Intel/Nvidia system...Does it? I can drop £600 on a graphics card at a push but less obviously would be better....

I fancy the idea of a multi cored CPU with the virtual cores the way AMD do it. It is new technology and its had time to mature. I don't think the 11th gen Intel CPU's are like this are they? They aren't very "new" are they....Just re-worked old tech boosted up. What IS the difference between say a 11th gen Intel CPU and an 10th gen one? Two hyperthreads per core instead of one?

However I would imagine they are nice and stable and compatible....

My main interest in performance is purely for gaming, I don't do much that is CPU intensive, rendering video or audio or virtual machines so I probably won't need a high core count.

I am tempted by the Rysen CPU's but I am put off literally by the flimsiness of the AM4 socket. I managed to pull out a Rysen CPU from it's socket recently when trying to remove the heat sink and I wasn't impressed with the motherboard, a gigabyte Aorus, it felt cheap and nasty.

I am particularly interested in Star Citizen and I just read on the RSI web site that it does not work with a 12th gen CPU currently....Probably due to Easy Anti Cheat but who knows......

Video cards are also insane right now. The worst time ever to buy one......

Money...£1500 ish is ready to go.......I just need a push in the right direction...

I would like to hear your thoughts on all this. I am not after exact specs right now just an idea about which platform to go for.

TBH I'd rather have pins on the chip than down in the socket, at least you CAN fix a bent pin on the chip easily (Enough) if you have one, fixing one down in the socket is akin to micro-surgery at times and if you break a pin off there is a chance the board is toast - Good boards aren't exactly a dime-a-dozen these days in price or availablity.
And (Once again) here's that Intel 1151 socket I had to fix:


And yes, it works fine now.

It's possible to get an AMD with pins on the chip working even if you've broken the pin(s) off the chip.
My point is the newer sockets with pins down in the socket aren't as great or robust as they are made out to be and I have both here I've ran and fixed to know.

As for whether to go AMD or Intel, that's up to you and for and right now they are pretty much on par.
I can't say if 12th gen Intels are good simply because they haven't been out long enough to have proven themselves as "Reliable".
AMD's most recent offering as of this post has been out longer so there is a longer track record you could go by with those.
Intel still has an ever-so-slight lead in single threaded performance, with muti-cored programs and games AMD is on top and we know some games are indeed multi-threaded so bear that in mind.

Don't skimp on the board or RAM, and if going AMD, DO NOT mix Corsair RAM and Ryzen!
They do not like each other, esp the Vengeance sticks and mixing these is just asking for trouble.
G. Skill sticks works great for both and I do suggest those overall and roughly 16GB's minimum is what to get, but you can get more if you want to stretch system viability further for future things that may demand even more RAM in the system later.


However - With all that being said:
I guess the REAL factor is the size and depth of your wallet, that determines all when it comes down to it.

 

[Selaya]

as long as you buy like a 12400 you should have no issues whatsoever w/ ADL - the only potential issues it may have is from E-Cores, and the 12400 doesn't feature any of them

 

[68Olds]

Personally, if I were looking for a new PC, I would be looking at pre-built "gaming" systems. Asus, MSI, CyberpowerPC, IBuyPower, among others (in the US) sell complete systems at or below what it would cost to build it yourself. That's taking into account the inflated cost of buying a mid-level gaming card. You have to see who sells good complete systems in the UK.

I would go i5 or i7 gen 12 & DDR5 if I needed to buy today.

 

[bug]

Honestly, I got a 12600k, disabled the E cores, paired it with DDR4 3600 (which I already have) and couldn't be happier. If all cores are the same, you don't actually need Win11's scheduler.
Getting a video card on the other hand...

 

[xtreemchaos]

+1 for zen 3, intels too much money for me at the mo but im a tight git.

 

[Mac the Geek]

TBH I'd rather have pins on the chip than down in the socket, at least you CAN fix a bent pin on the chip easily (Enough) if you have one, fixing one down in the socket is akin to micro-surgery at times and if you break a pin off there is a chance the board is toast - Good boards aren't exactly a dime-a-dozen these days in price or availablity.
And (Once again) here's that Intel 1151 socket I had to fix:


And yes, it works fine now.

I've bent pins back into place on server motherboards, but the process (even with high magnification) starts playing tricks with your eyes. I don't even make the attempt anymore; instead, I only deal with stuff that's still under warranty, and let the vendor worry about pin repair. Kudos to you for making it work.

Back on topic... is this the worst time ever to build a new PC? I can't answer that without quoting Obi-Wan Kenobi. It's true... but only from a certain point of view. The answer is a graph with two axes; one is your personal budget, and the other is your personal patience level. If you have plenty of patience, you can find bargains here and there and eventually get what you need for less than other people are paying. On the other hand, if you have cash burning a hole in your pocket, you can make a scalper happy and get what you want nownownow.

I think "the worst time ever" would be a time when parts are unavailable in any channel, at any price. We aren't at that point today.

 

[Mescalamba]

Close to it. But I remember when GeForce 256 was new and that wasnt cheap.

 

[Chomiq]

In terms of GPU since you're in UK you at least have an option to buy:
- RTX FE from scan.co.uk - sign up to stockdrops and partalert on Discord and enable notifications for UK drops
- AMD Reference from AMD shop - queues are usually on Thursday around 2PM GMT, suggest using discord for that too.
If you're in a rush go through regular retail, but be prepared to overpay. Prices are going down but not to the level that they should be at almost 2 years into current generation of GPUs.

Rest comes down to Intel vs AMD. I would not recommend picking DDR5 as prices are heavily inflated at the moment and it makes more sense to pick any platform using DDR4 instead.
If you're only gaming pick either 5600X (which have already came down in price or are about to see a price drop) + B550 (or X570 with a good discount) or 12400 (or better if E-cores aren't an issue) with a decent DDR4 board (I don't really follow Intel's lineup).

I'd say for now create draft builds on pcpartpicker for both AMD and Intel, without the GPU. See what it comes down to in total, then estimate what sort of GPU you want/can afford for each variant. Remember that there are some elements that are usually transferred over to the next build, i.e. case or a PSU.

 

[Bones]

I've bent pins back into place on server motherboards, but the process (even with high magnification) starts playing tricks with your eyes. I don't even make the attempt anymore; instead, I only deal with stuff that's still under warranty, and let the vendor worry about pin repair. Kudos to you for making it work.

Back on topic... is this the worst time ever to build a new PC? I can't answer that without quoting Obi-Wan Kenobi. It's true... but only from a certain point of view. The answer is a graph with two axes; one is your personal budget, and the other is your personal patience level. If you have plenty of patience, you can find bargains here and there and eventually get what you need for less than other people are paying. On the other hand, if you have cash burning a hole in your pocket, you can make a scalper happy and get what you want nownownow.

I think "the worst time ever" would be a time when parts are unavailable in any channel, at any price. We aren't at that point today.

I can't see as well as I could before myself, that's one reason I don't like LGA sockets but I do as I must when the occasion comes around.
As for the socket itself, as long as you aren't swapping chips all the time like I do (Competitive OC'ing) it's not a problem and the system will just work, provided you don't bork the install when you build it.

Yeah, even though there has been a price drop (Or so they say) with certain pieces of hardware, I'm not so sure right now is a good time BUT at the same time will things get better or worse from here?
No real way of knowing so if you're going to do it, just do it and do it right when you do.
That way you'll have a setup that should last for a long time with proper care.

For Ryzen an X570 board is cheap enough and about as good as you'll do for price vs performance. Although I'm not an MSI fan they have made some good boards with AM4 and one such as the Unify/ACE series are good enough without breaking the bank, of course you could just go for the top-dog model in any make (Except Biostar) and probrably be OK.
I've seen suggestions for a 5600 and that's not a bad chip as long as the price is right.
Since DDR4 is still mainstream and plentiful I'd go with that and get at least 32GB's for the reasons I gave.

Sure, 16GB's fine for today's stuff but spec'ing it according to "Todays" needs certainly won't be viable tomorrow.
If you have long range plans for it just build for what you know will be, not what is today and game on.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

No idea what their prices are like but someone like pc specialist or scan and go for a prebuilt especially if you want a new GPU that not being sold at scalper prices.

If you want to save a few quid and use your older hardware personally I'd say +1 for Ryzen again you could even look at preordering one of the new chips coming out soon "xt" or whatever it's called and if your scared of the socket buy from scan and pay for the 30day insurance if they still do it, that way if you mess up the install they will replace the parts no questions asked.

 

[Bleeding-Edge]

Great answers so far. Thanks guys. I wonder if some manufacturers use crappy AM4 sockets and some don't....Hummmm
Its a tricky one isn't it.

So what's particularly good about the Ryzen CPU's over Intels offerings?

What's particularly good about Intels offerings over the Ryzens?

That bit about turning of the E cores on the new 12th gen CPUs is interesting....Does that make them compatible with things they aren't compatible with?
I am still not at all convinced buying into this platform is a good idea right now.....

I think what might happen is that AMD will do something much better soon and the Intel 12th gen platform, as it's got off to such a bad start in life already what with the component crunch and much en-fiddlement going on with the global economies Intel 12th gen CPU's might just fizzle away into a cloud of bad memories.

Remember RAMBUS? A total flash-in-the-pan.....DDR5 seems a bit like that.....

No idea what their prices are like but someone like pc specialist or scan and go for a prebuilt especially if you want a new GPU that not being sold at scalper prices.

If you want to save a few quid and use your older hardware personally I'd say +1 for Ryzen again you could even look at preordering one of the new chips coming out soon "xt" or whatever it's called and if your scared of the socket buy from scan and pay for the 30day insurance if they still do it, that way if you mess up the install they will replace the parts no questions asked.

I am not sure about pre-built PC's. I had a good look into a major system builders offerings and to be honest it did seem like they used the pre builds as a way of shifting stock they might now other wise sell.... to noobs.....ah hem....

 

[ThaiTaffy]

So single core performance as far my knowledge goes is just gaming these days, so 11th and the haha 10th are more gaming focused that's why AMD has has a good few years finally, even more so since ryzen 3000 series came out.

They not only have a better multi-core performance but the efficiency is also great and with the market finally having a positive look on AMD patches and firmware for motherboards has been great.

I am not sure about pre-built PC's. I had a good look into a major system builders offerings and to be honest it did seem like they used the pre builds as a way of shifting stock they might now other wise sell.... to noobs.....ah hem....

I don't know I've been out of the UK for a good few years and hadn't looked.

Just when I was there those were the only two companies I had positive experiences with.

 

[80-watt Hamster]

Great answers so far. Thanks guys. I wonder if some manufacturers use crappy AM4 sockets and some don't....Hummmm
Its a tricky one isn't it.

So what's particularly good about the Ryzen CPU's over Intels offerings?

Efficiency. Intel still hasn't caught up in performance/watt. And if you happen to be looking for a reasonably capable IGP, AMD's the only game in town. All chips except high-end include a modestly capable cooler.

What's particularly good about Intels offerings over the Ryzens?

Maturity, at least through 11th gen. Intel didn't do anything drastic architecture-wise from Nehalem through Rocket Lake. It's nearly certain that any board/CPU/RAM combo will work without a hitch.

That bit about turning of the E cores on the new 12th gen CPUs is interesting....Does that make them compatible with things they aren't compatible with?
I am still not at all convinced buying into this platform is a good idea right now.....

I think what might happen is that AMD will do something much better soon and the Intel 12th gen platform, as it's got off to such a bad start in life already what with the component crunch and much en-fiddlement going on with the global economies Intel 12th gen CPU's might just fizzle away into a cloud of bad memories.

Remember RAMBUS? A total flash-in-the-pan.....DDR5 seems a bit like that.....

DDR5 will come around. Every generation of the standard takes a year or two for manufacturers to resolve manufacturing and optimization and for supply to saturate the channel.

I am not sure about pre-built PC's. I had a good look into a major system builders offerings and to be honest it did seem like they used the pre builds as a way of shifting stock they might now other wise sell.... to noobs.....ah hem....

The big OEMs have the purchasing power to spec their own AICs, and they are often inferior to retail AICs in entry level and midrange. System integrators are generally limited (AFAIK) to retail parts, so even if assembly's a bit shaky, the components should be alright. Or at least alright-ish. A member from the UK will have better insight on SI prebuilts available to you than I do, though.

EDIT: grammar

 

[Bleeding-Edge]

so 11th and the haha 10th

Why do you say that? Whats up with the 10th gen CPU's?

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Why do you say that? Whats up with the 10th gen CPU's?

They were a dumpster fire quite literally, just a 6th gen cooking itself to death and being called a 10th gen.

 

[Bill_Bright]

if I were looking for a new PC, I would be looking at pre-built "gaming" systems. Asus, MSI, CyberpowerPC, IBuyPower, among others (in the US) sell complete systems at or below what it would cost to build it yourself.

But it has always been that way so if saving a few bucks is your goal, then fine.

I have always told my clients I cannot beat the big factory builders in price, but I can always build a better "custom-built" computer, and one specifically designed for their needs and not 10,000,000 others just like them.

Dell, HP, Acer and the others can go to Intel, AMD, Foxconn, Microsoft, WD, Micron and other OEM makers and promise to buy 1,000,000 units over the next year, then demand and get super discounted, less than wholesale volume prices. Me, as a custom builder for a client or for myself, buying 1 at a time, I get prices at whatever Amazon or Newegg will give me. So as 80W Hamster notes, they have tremendous purchasing power over custom or self-built. Even if a client orders 10 identical computers, I cannot beat Dell, etc. But again, I can build better. And I will NOT cut corners like the big makers do. I won't cheap out on the case or the all-important PSU.

***

Let's not turn this into yet another fanboy fight over Intel and AMD. This thread is about the timing of buying parts for a new build. @Bleeding-Edge - if you want to debate Intel vs AMD, pick a specific Intel CPU and compare it to a specific AMD CPU. It makes not logical sense to get into a Brand A vs Brand B debate.

Also, much MUCH more than just the CPU determine a computer's performance (and price).

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Let's not turn this into yet another fanboy fight over Intel and AMD. This thread is about the timing of buying parts for a new build. @Bleeding-Edge - if you want to debate Intel vs AMD, pick a specific Intel CPU and compare it to a specific AMD CPU. It makes not logical sense to get into a Brand A vs Brand B debate.

Also, much MUCH more than just the CPU determine a computer's performance (and price).

What fanboy fight are we talking about bill everyone has just stated facts if he's primarily gaming or wanting to use thunderbolt go intel just not 10th gen if he wants multi-core and efficiency go AMD.

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
My 10900k is doing just fine

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Hi,
My 10900k is doing just fine

How many litres are in your loop Thrash?

 

[Bleeding-Edge]

I am no fan boy. I have read the reviews, watched the bench marks, it boggles my mind....I am just looking for some anecdotal statements and people's thoughts on the state of play in the market right now...Not really the specifics of CPU performance just yet anyway. I am just torn as to what platform to go for. I remember in the past, in the days of the Athalon how AMD CPU needed some absolutely horrible chipsets to run, remember Opti chipsets...*shudder*.....It has put me off for a long time going to AMD....They seemed like the poor man's CPU.