Question, concern PCIe 4.0 / PCIe 3.0

[RadeonProVega]

What is the point of even buying a video card that uses PCIe 4.0 if people have motherboards that only have PCIe 3.0 slots?
I have multiple gpus, currently using a radeon pro w5500 PCIe 4.0x8 which for the most part does what's needed, no problems with videos or gaming(for the most part, it does have opengl issues, and some games doesn't seem to using its full power/gpu power) (that beta driver that fixes opengl, does fix those opengl issues though).

However , my WX 7100 and RX 570 8GB PCIe 3.0x16 for example so its using its full power/potential and at times soem games run faster than the w5500. And from my understanding Intel motherboards that have pcie 4.0 slots are only what 2 exist?

I was thinking about buying a Radeon Pro W6600 PCIe 4.0x16 but again, what's the point when i don't have slots that has PCIe 4.0. Guess i will just stick with cards that has PCIe 3.0x16.

 

[eazen]

All 11th gen and 12th gen and accordingly 500/600 series mainboard support PCIE 4.0, it’s nothing special and not rare. Also most GPUs don’t saturate PCIE 4.0 so it’s not needed unless GPU only has 8 lanes or less, then it’s needed.

edit: with Ryzen 550/570 mainboards.

 

[Mussels]

What is the point of even buying a video card that uses PCIe 4.0 if people have motherboards that only have PCIe 3.0 slots?
I have multiple gpus, currently using a radeon pro w5500 PCIe 4.0x8 which for the most part does what's needed, no problems with videos or gaming(for the most part, it does have opengl issues, and some games doesn't seem to using its full power/gpu power) (that beta driver that fixes opengl, does fix those opengl issues though).

However , my WX 7100 and RX 570 8GB PCIe 3.0x16 for example so its using its full power/potential and at times soem games run faster than the w5500. And from my understanding Intel motherboards that have pcie 4.0 slots are only what 2 exist?

I was thinking about buying a Radeon Pro W6600 PCIe 4.0x16 but again, what's the point when i don't have slots that has PCIe 4.0. Guess i will just stick with cards that has PCIe 3.0x16.

even my 3090 isn't slowed down on PCI-E 3.0, what exactly is the problem?

 

[Hyderz]

pci-e 4.0 gpu are backwards compatible with pci-e 3.0 slots, you might lose a few fps here and there but nothing to be concerned for ...
also running rtx3090 on pci-e 3.0 x16

 

[RadeonProVega]

pci-e 4.0 gpu are backwards compatible with pci-e 3.0 slots, you might lose a few fps here and there but nothing to be concerned for ...
also running rtx3090 on pci-e 3.0 x16

Guess i will stick with pcie 4.0 x16 instead of x8 instead for my next card.

even my 3090 isn't slowed down on PCI-E 3.0, what exactly is the problem?

I mention this sometime last year, some games have framerate issues. GPU power level doesn't go above 25% or even 50% "unless" i use the relive record button lol. Once i hit it, framerate doubles and the gpu power level goes up to around 75-100%. I have tested every driver and nothing changes. I don't have this issue using my WX 7100 or RX 570 for example, only happens with my W5500. I believe its a bug, but i also read reports about a 5500 XT which shares similar issues due to the cards being PCIE 4.0 x8 or something like that.

All good though, back using my WX 7100, buying a new card sometime next month.

 

[Toothless]

Guess i will stick with pcie 4.0 x16 instead of x8 instead for my next card.


I mention this sometime last year, some games have framerate issues. GPU power level doesn't go above 25% or even 50% "unless" i hate the relive record button lol. Once i hit it, framerate doubles and the gpu power level goes up to around 75-100%. I have tested every driver and nothing changes. I don't have this issue using my WX 7100 or RX 570 for example, only happens with my W5500. I believe its a bug, but i also read reports about a 5500 XT which shares similar issues due to the cards being PCIE 4.0 x8 or something like that.

All good though, back using my WX 7100, buying a new card sometime next month.

K, but your W5500 isn't able to use x16, so it's actually PCI 3.0 8x which is actually PCI 4.0 4x in bandwidth.

PCI 3.0 16x is perfectly fine for PCI 4.0 cards. It's when it's physically not able to fully use all 16x lanes is where issues come in. See RX5500 and RX6500.


Also there are dozens of PCI 4.0 boards for AMD and Intel. Researching before posting sometimes helps.. a lot.

 

[eidairaman1]

K, but your W5500 isn't able to use x16, so it's actually PCI 3.0 8x which is actually PCI 4.0 4x in bandwidth.

PCI 3.0 16x is perfectly fine for PCI 4.0 cards. It's when it's physically not able to fully use all 16x lanes is where issues come in. See RX5500 and RX6500.


Also there are dozens of PCI 4.0 boards for AMD and Intel. Researching before posting sometimes helps.. a lot.

Yeah AMD B550 mobos have PCIE 4 on it even

 

[eazen]

Guess i will stick with pcie 4.0 x16 instead of x8 instead for my next card.


I mention this sometime last year, some games have framerate issues. GPU power level doesn't go above 25% or even 50% "unless" i hate the relive record button lol. Once i hit it, framerate doubles and the gpu power level goes up to around 75-100%. I have tested every driver and nothing changes. I don't have this issue using my WX 7100 or RX 570 for example, only happens with my W5500. I believe its a bug, but i also read reports about a 5500 XT which shares similar issues due to the cards being PCIE 4.0 x8 or something like that.

All good though, back using my WX 7100, buying a new card sometime next month.

That’s just a bug and has nothing to do with PCIE. I’d report it to AMD.

 

[RadeonProVega]

That’s just a bug and has nothing to do with PCIE. I’d report it to AMD.

I did report it, they refused to do any testing or any investigate because they don't use workstation cards for gaming. Updating bios didn't help, even the one the radeon pro team staff sent me. I assume because I'm not using the card on a PCI 4.0 slot, but who knows. It just seems like the Radeon Pro W5500 isn't using its full power and if its a bug, the radeon pro team won't investigate or any bother to look into it. Overall though, i have no real serious issues with the card, i can game perfectly fine and editing, videos, no issues. Just that GPU power issue with certain games. I'm buying a new card soon anyway.

K, but your W5500 isn't able to use x16, so it's actually PCI 3.0 8x which is actually PCI 4.0 4x in bandwidth.

PCI 3.0 16x is perfectly fine for PCI 4.0 cards. It's when it's physically not able to fully use all 16x lanes is where issues come in. See RX5500 and RX6500.


Also there are dozens of PCI 4.0 boards for AMD and Intel. Researching before posting sometimes helps.. a lot.

Well thanks for the info. I only use Intel, i found something if i wanted PCIE 4.0 slots, i will look into it soon. Thanks.

 

[eazen]

I did report it, they refused to do any testing or any investigate because they don't use workstation cards for gaming. Updating bios didn't help, even the one the radeon pro team staff sent me. I assume because I'm not using the card on a PCI 4.0 slot, but who knows. It just seems like the Radeon Pro W5500 isn't using its full power and if its a bug, the radeon pro team won't investigate or any bother to look into it. Overall though, i have no real serious issues with the card, i can game perfectly fine and editing, videos, no issues. Just that GPU power issue with certain games. I'm buying a new card soon anyway.


Well thanks for the info. I only use Intel, i found something if i wanted PCIE 4.0 slots, i will look into it soon. Thanks.

I meant updating the mainboard bios.

 

[AleXXX666]

Guess i will stick with pcie 4.0 x16 instead of x8 instead for my next card.


I mention this sometime last year, some games have framerate issues. GPU power level doesn't go above 25% or even 50% "unless" i use the relive record button lol. Once i hit it, framerate doubles and the gpu power level goes up to around 75-100%. I have tested every driver and nothing changes. I don't have this issue using my WX 7100 or RX 570 for example, only happens with my W5500. I believe its a bug, but i also read reports about a 5500 XT which shares similar issues due to the cards being PCIE 4.0 x8 or something like that.

All good though, back using my WX 7100, buying a new card sometime next month.

either get 3.0 x16 card or get 4.0 compatible system (cpu+mb). Intel friend, your way is 11 gen cpus with 500 series chipset mb or 12 gen.
there is nothing so fancy in your current E5 2678 v3. my cheap i5-11400F with B560 mb has pci-e 4.0 and beats it ez. (check passmark cpu rating)
I've used RX 5500 XT when I have had PCI-E 3.0 capable CPU. It was pain in a**! The gpu worked MUCH WORSE than advertised here on TPU performace rating. So, using pci-e less than 4.0 is NOT OK IF YOUR GPU ISN'T x16 lanes! "a few fps drops" is complete BS, there was SIGNIFICANT PERFORMANCE LOSS.

so it's better to upgrade your platforma rather than purchase HIGH COST PCI-E 4.0 x16 GPUS.

 

[Cowboystrekk]

PCIe for GPU`s is mostly useless (1% improvement over PCIe 3.0), but for AMD RX 6400, 6500, 6600 and Geforce 3050 which has 4 or 8 lanes PCIe improves performance quite a bit.

 

[Mussels]

Guess i will stick with pcie 4.0 x16 instead of x8 instead for my next card.


I mention this sometime last year, some games have framerate issues. GPU power level doesn't go above 25% or even 50% "unless" i use the relive record button lol. Once i hit it, framerate doubles and the gpu power level goes up to around 75-100%. I have tested every driver and nothing changes. I don't have this issue using my WX 7100 or RX 570 for example, only happens with my W5500. I believe its a bug, but i also read reports about a 5500 XT which shares similar issues due to the cards being PCIE 4.0 x8 or something like that.

All good though, back using my WX 7100, buying a new card sometime next month.

You have a bug with a workstation card, NOT a problem with PCI-E

 

[RadeonProVega]

You have a bug with a workstation card, NOT a problem with PCI-E

I understand that. I was saying i assume that because i read reports about 5500 cards and that was the only assumption at the time. But as i said i did mention to the radeon pro team about the issue and they clearly told me, they have no plans to do any type of testing or investigation because they don't use workstation cards for gaming. So i left it alone. Honestly if i was part of the team, i would investigate and do some testing, but that's just me.

I meant updating the mainboard bios.

I tried everything, updating bios, changing slots, tried pretty much every adrenalin driver and enterprise driver, reinstall windows , tried the card in my second computer, even had two w5500s at some point, tried the other one, updating mainboard bios, etc. Nothing change. That's why "at the time", i assume it was because the card isn't running on its full power pcie 4.0. Because i don't have this issue with my RX 570 or WX 7100 or WX5100, so i guess because its using 8x. So will keep in mind to always use x16 cards.

either get 3.0 x16 card or get 4.0 compatible system (cpu+mb). Intel friend, your way is 11 gen cpus with 500 series chipset mb or 12 gen.
there is nothing so fancy in your current E5 2678 v3. my cheap i5-11400F with B560 mb has pci-e 4.0 and beats it ez. (check passmark cpu rating)
I've used RX 5500 XT when I have had PCI-E 3.0 capable CPU. It was pain in a**! The gpu worked MUCH WORSE than advertised here on TPU performace rating. So, using pci-e less than 4.0 is NOT OK IF YOUR GPU ISN'T x16 lanes! "a few fps drops" is complete BS, there was SIGNIFICANT PERFORMANCE LOSS.

so it's better to upgrade your platforma rather than purchase HIGH COST PCI-E 4.0 x16 GPUS.

Yes i am. I'm looking into some stuff soon. Thanks.

 

[eazen]

I tried everything, updating bios, changing slots, tried pretty much every adrenalin driver and enterprise driver, reinstall windows , tried the card in my second computer, even had two w5500s at some point, tried the other one, updating mainboard bios, etc. Nothing change. That's why "at the time", i assume it was because the card isn't running on its full power pcie 4.0. Because i don't have this issue with my RX 570 or WX 7100 or WX5100, so i guess because its using 8x. So will keep in mind to always use x16 cards.

I bet this problem is solved as soon as you upgrade your platform to one with PCIE 4.0 support.

 

[Toothless]

I understand that. I was saying i assume that because i read reports about 5500 cards and that was the only assumption at the time. But as i said i did mention to the radeon pro team about the issue and they clearly told me, they have no plans to do any type of testing or investigation because they don't use workstation cards for gaming. So i left it alone. Honestly if i was part of the team, i would investigate and do some testing, but that's just me.

I tried everything, updating bios, changing slots, tried pretty much every adrenalin driver and enterprise driver, reinstall windows , tried the card in my second computer, even had two w5500s at some point, tried the other one, updating mainboard bios, etc. Nothing change. That's why "at the time", i assume it was because the card isn't running on its full power pcie 4.0. Because i don't have this issue with my RX 570 or WX 7100 or WX5100, so i guess because its using 8x. So will keep in mind to always use x16 cards.

Yes i am. I'm looking into some stuff soon. Thanks.

Workstation cards are for workstation purposes.. yes. Water makes things wet. Having a team test a card that's used for compute and production on games and getting a "no" should've been obvious.

Don't use workstation for games, plain and simple.

 

[RadeonProVega]

I bet this problem is solved as soon as you upgrade your platform to one with PCIE 4.0 support.

Yes as i mention I'm upgrading soon. Thanks.

Workstation cards are for workstation purposes.. yes. Water makes things wet. Having a team test a card that's used for compute and production on games and getting a "no" should've been obvious.

Don't use workstation for games, plain and simple.

I disagree, but people like what they like. I have been gaming with workstation gpus for a long time, years now. Never had any issues at all, minor issues at best. Gaming, editing, videos, barely any problems. I just prefer to use workstation games for everything/gaming instead of consumer gpus.
Have a nice day.

 

[eazen]

Yes as i mention I'm upgrading soon. Thanks.

I disagree, but people like what they like. I have been gaming with workstation gpus for a long time, years now. Never had any issues at all, minor issues at best. Gaming, editing, videos, barely any problems. I just prefer to use workstation games for everything/gaming instead of consumer gpus.
Have a nice day.

If you don’t need WS cards for what they are for I don’t recommend you to buy them, you get less performance and a louder card, as they aren’t optimized for gaming usage. The other upside of a WS card is the support, it’s also questionable if you need that. They are also too expensive if you don’t make use of all the upsides or mainly use it for normal stuff like gaming and editing.

 

[RadeonProVega]

If you don’t need WS cards for what they are for I don’t recommend you to buy them, you get less performance and a louder card, as they aren’t optimized for gaming usage. The other upside of a WS card is the support, it’s also questionable if you need that. They are also too expensive if you don’t make use of all the upsides or mainly use it for normal stuff like gaming and editing.

My WX 7100 outperforms my RX 570(OC/Phantom Edition) I play games perfectly fine at 60fps 1080p or 1440p, so what's the issue? or performance difference that i can't do vs a consumer card?
I have no problems playing any games at 60fps with workstation cards. See people assume you can't or workstation cards can't game well, that's a myth because nobody bothers to use them to test them out on games. I notice more people doing it now though, in fact alot of amd users are using Enterprise drivers for their consumer cards. If i can play my games at 60fps at 1080p or 1440, I'm not complaining.

But again, cheers.

 

[eazen]

My WX 7100 outperforms my RX 570(OC/Phantom Edition) I play games perfectly fine at 60fps 1080p or 1440p, so what's the issue? or performance difference that i can't do vs a consumer card?
I have no problems playing any games at 60fps with workstation cards. See people assume you can't or workstation cards can't game well, that's a myth because nobody bothers to use them to test them out on games. I notice more people doing it now though, in fact alot of amd users are using Enterprise drivers for their consumer cards. If i can play my games at 60fps at 1080p or 1440, I'm not complaining.

But again, cheers.

I didn’t say you can’t play with it, I just said gaming cards are better for gaming and that’s pretty obvious. Also you’re comparing what essentially is a RX 580 (full chip) to a cut down variant (570), so no wonder it’s faster, but I bet they are comparable, with the lower clocks WS cards have.
Either way I’m just here to give a few tips, you can do whatever you want of course. Normally the 5500 should only lose a small bit of performance working on PCIE 3.0 instead of 4.0, this is kinda odd to me tbh.

 

[Toothless]

I didn’t say you can’t play with it, I just said gaming cards are better for gaming and that’s pretty obvious. Also you’re comparing what essentially is a RX 580 (full chip) to a cut down variant (570), so no wonder it’s faster, but I bet they are comparable, with the lower clocks WS cards have.
Either way I’m just here to give a few tips, you can do whatever you want of course. Normally the 5500 should only lose a small bit of performance working on PCIE 3.0 instead of 4.0, this is kinda odd to me tbh.

Refer to RX5500 and RX6500 PCIe reviews. It's the same.

 

[eazen]

Refer to RX5500 and RX6500 PCIe reviews. It's the same.

Nah, 6500 is far worse with just 4 lanes, essentially the card is fully strangled with PCIE 3.0, while the 5500 has 8 lanes and just loses 5% worst case.

 

[Toothless]

Nah, 6500 is far worse with just 4 lanes, essentially the card is fully strangled with PCIE 3.0, while the 5500 has 8 lanes and just loses 5% worst case.

It depends on which 5500. The 8GB had less issues than the 4GB.

 

[eazen]

It depends on which 5500. The 8GB had less issues than the 4GB.

That’s true. The 4GB variant was fully dependent on 4.0 or lower settings

 

[Toothless]

That’s true. The 4GB variant was fully dependent on 4.0 or lower settings

Still PCIe 4.0 8x, which is what the OP's 5500 workstation card is. I'd bet money if properly stuck in a 4.0 board it would work fine and be the fastest of the three cards they have.