About to order a new pc. How good is my GPU should I Swap to 4070?

[Dragam1337]

My generic advice is never to upgrade from one gen to the next. For GPUs, if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains.

That is indeed very generic (and bad) advice... 2080 ti to 3090 was 80 ish % more performance at 4k, and 3090 to 4090 was 70 ish % more performance at 4k.

 

[dgianstefani]

I for one think you have a relevant argument here. If you're not over budget, QLC is sub optimal in most situations. That said, 'reaching the budget' shouldn't be a goal in and of itself. I think that is the real point where you can't agree on with others.. and it fits the usual line of approach you have where only the 'best things suffice' (which is where the elitist commentary originates ). You cán still save some cash going QLC, and if that is not detrimental to the use case you've got it for... there is no issue. Its not like QLCs die left and right.

Would I personally choose to save 10 bucks on a QLC over a better nand drive? Never. OTOH I also like to save money wherever I can, if the net balance is positive... I can totally imagine stuff isn't black and white for most.

Thanks , some support is nice .

the extra ~$50 to get a good quality, faster and much more reliable drive will still keep the build well within budget.

I'm not suggesting he spends another $800 to meet his original budget though, just a reasonable ~$50 or so.

That is indeed very generic (and bad) advice... 2080 ti to 3090 was 80 ish % more performance at 4k, and 3090 to 4090 was 70 ish % more performance at 4k.

...if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains.

 

[3x0]

My generic advice is never to upgrade from one gen to the next. For GPUs, if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains.

He doesn't have either GPU right now, just hasn't worded it clearly

 

[Dragam1337]

...if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains.

If you are going to do a quote, then do the entire quote...

"My generic advice is never to upgrade from one gen to the next. For GPUs, if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains."

That first part is obviously what i responded to, and it is (as he says himself) very generic advice, and also bad advice... cause there are often where there are huge generational leaps.

 

[bug]

If you are going to do a quote, then do the entire quote...

"My generic advice is never to upgrade from one gen to the next. For GPUs, if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains."

That first part is obviously what i responded to, and it is (as he says himself) very generic advice, and also bad advice... cause there are often where there are huge generational leaps.

There aren't many instances of that. There are exceptions, but I can't recall the last generation when it made sense to break that rule.

 

[Space Lynx]

@Smoo

You may want to look into this board for the price I like it a bit better than the Gigabyte board and that says a lot because I'm typically not that high on Asrock

ASRock B650M-HDV/M.2 Socket AM5 Ryzen 7000 Micro ATX Motherboard - Newegg.com

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I second this board. It's what I would go with if I were doing AM5.

 

[Dragam1337]

There aren't many instances of that. There are exceptions, but I can't recall the last generation when it made sense to break that rule.

Are you unable to read my reply to you, or what ?

 

[dgianstefani]

If you are going to do a quote, then do the entire quote...

"My generic advice is never to upgrade from one gen to the next. For GPUs, if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains."

That first part is obviously what i responded to, and it is (as he says himself) very generic advice, and also bad advice... cause there are often where there are huge generational leaps.

The point I was making is the initial post drew attention to criticising upgrading between generations, with a disclaimer that at least +20% is required, the reply notes that significantly higher improvements have been seen - 70-80% within the same tier with a single generation upgrade.

 

[bug]

Are you unable to read my reply to you, or what ?

Not only am I able to read your reply, I'm also able to read TPU's reviews which say you pull those number from where the sun don't shine.

 

[redeye]

i had/have a i9-9900k with a 1660ti, (watercooled) and was surprised that i could run everything at 1440p. (no raytracing)… cp2077 choked on it, but on the steam deck setting, looked just like the ps5 no RT …)

i have a 6750xt, and it runs gtav everything ultra no msaa at 4k60… whereas a gt1660ti, did that at 33fps on a gsync monitor.
i think you should go for a 7900xt, (and wait a month to find the funds)
but, i did wish there were 6950xt on sale when i bought my 6750xt for 539can. the 6950xt is 869can.

i did not think you should get an nvidia card, wait 18 months if you are, just so nvidia sweats a bit…

…so if you are only going to play at 1440p, then IMO a 6750xt is great.

 

[Dragam1337]

Not only am I able to read your reply, I'm also able to read TPU's reviews which say you pull those number from where the sun don't shine.

Indeed, that's why you imidiately backed up your claims with proof - oh wait, no you didn't, because what is pulled from where the sun don't shine is your reply...

And this is even including titles that are severely cpu bound even at 4k...

 

[bug]

Indeed, that's why you imidiately backed up your claims with proof - oh wait, no you didn't, because what is pulled from where the sun don't shine is your reply...

And this is even including titles that are severely cpu bound even at 4k...

It's also cherry picking, you're looking just at the very high end. The rest of the cards in that generation don't show the same improvements.
But ok, if you live at the high end, money no object, then yes, you will probably upgrade every generation. I'll give you that.

 

[Vayra86]

Indeed, that's why you imidiately backed up your claims with proof - oh wait, no you didn't, because what is pulled from where the sun don't shine is your reply...

And this is even including titles that are severely cpu bound even at 4k...

It's also cherry picking, you're looking just at the very high end. The rest of the cards in that generation don't show the same improvements.
But ok, if you live at the high end, money no object, then yes, you will probably upgrade every generation. I'll give you that.

And even then you're not getting +70%, though. You really never do, and we must also not gloss over the fact the 4090 represents the biggest gap ever between x80 and x90. On top of that, the price point of x90 gets higher and higher, and there has been an additional SKU in between the 102 and the 104 since Ampere. So effectively you're trading up, not even just upgrading every gen, but trading UP every gen, and even then you do not get +70%.

You do get +20% FPS.... Then again if you got 5 FPS, getting that 6th isn't going to help. Because that's what you get if you run anything path traced on anything Ada except the 4090 And for everything else, you might as well have stuck with the 3090...

Also note +63% is in fact just '39% faster' than a 3090.

My personal rule of thumb for upgrading is '50% faster, or it is pointless'.

 

[Dragam1337]

And even then you're not getting +70%, though. You really never do, and we must also not gloss over the fact the 4090 represents the biggest gap ever between x80 and x90. On top of that, the price point of x90 gets higher and higher, and there has been an additional SKU in between the 102 and the 104 since Ampere. So effectively you're trading up, not even just upgrading every gen, but trading UP every gen, and even then you do not get +70%.

You do get +20% FPS.... Then again if you got 5 FPS, getting that 6th isn't going to help. Because that's what you get if you run anything path traced on anything Ada except the 4090 And for everything else, you might as well have stuck with the 3090...

View attachment 296155
Also note +63% is in fact just '39% faster' than a 3090.

My personal rule of thumb for upgrading is '50% faster, or it is pointless'.

No, +63% is 63% faster...

What you are talking about is that the 3090 is 39% slower than the 4090... which is looking at it backwards...

And in all the most demanding games, it's a way bigger difference than 70% faster...

 

[Vayra86]

No, +63% is 63% faster...

What you are talking about is that the 3090 is 39% slower than the 4090... which is looking at it backwards...

Yeah, that.
Regardless, there is no +70%, and if there is, its a unicorn.

 

[64K]

also ty for replies Im using the discord to chat with people thanks for the PSU suggestion as well changed it def not cheaping out on a psu thats for sure
i find discord instant and quick responses closing this thread or leaving it now

OP has left the thread.

 

[Dragam1337]

Yeah, that.
Regardless, there is no +70%, and if there is, its a unicorn.

How about you actually look at the post you quoted...

And the examples are countless

Only reason the average isn't nearly 100% faster is due to games that are cpu limited even at 4k.

 

[Vayra86]

How about you actually look at the post you quoted...

That is indeed very generic (and bad) advice... 2080 ti to 3090 was 80 ish % more performance at 4k, and 3090 to 4090 was 70 ish % more performance at 4k.

"My generic advice is never to upgrade from one gen to the next. For GPUs, if you're not seeing +20% fps on average, don't bother. you won't notice any gains."

That first part is obviously what i responded to, and it is (as he says himself) very generic advice, and also bad advice... cause there are often where there are huge generational leaps.

Connect the dots. You can do it.

That +20% FPS is not where you put the emphasis, neither did I. I don't agree with that part either. FPS is ... abstract nonsense, as I point out with the path traced 5 > 6 FPS example. That's 20%. Still unplayable.

Still:

And that's not considering the price nor the fact the xx103 SKU was added since Ampere. Both your examples focus around that change in the stack, making it a trade up, not a gen-gen same tier purchase.

MSRPs:
2080ti: 999,-
3090: 1499,-
4090: 1599,-

Context is everything!

How about you actually look at the post you quoted...

And the examples are countless

Only reason the average isn't nearly 100% faster is due to games that are cpu limited even at 4k.

So we have established the 4090 is indeed a unicorn. But we knew that since the release of the 4080 with a 1200 dollar tag designed to push people to the 1500 dollar tagged 4090.
We have literally proven @bug 's point now, haven't we... If money is no object, you buy the latest greatest every gen. Still doesn't make it sound advice.

 

[Dragam1337]

Connect the dots. You can do it.

That +20% FPS is not where you put the emphasis, neither did I. I don't agree with that part either. FPS is ... abstract nonsense, as I point out with the path traced 5 > 6 FPS example. That's 20%. Still unplayable.

Still:
View attachment 296156
And that's not considering the price nor the fact the xx103 SKU was added since Ampere. Both your examples focus around that change in the stack, making it a trade up, not a gen-gen same tier purchase.

MSRPs:
2080ti: 999,-
3090: 1499,-
4090: 1599,-

Context is everything!

Jeez, talk about trying to avoid admitting you were wrong...

You wrote "Regardless, there is no +70%, and if there is, its a unicorn." which OBVIOUSLY wrong.

As for the 2080 ti, 3090 and 4090 not being the equivelant gpu's of each their gens, is just a massive /facepalm. They are all based on the big chip of each their generation - naming of said chip is irrelevant, unless there was a bigger one released... which, guess what, there wasn't...

 

[Vayra86]

Jeez, talk about trying to avoid admitting you were wrong...

You wrote "Regardless, there is no +70%, and if there is, its a unicorn." which OBVIOUSLY wrong.

Oh this is a battle about who's right and wrong to you? Or is it about getting the right understanding of what was 'good generic advice'?

Seeing as we were specific about what was quoted

 

[Dragam1337]

Oh this is a battle about who's right and wrong to you? Or is it about getting the right understanding of what was 'good generic advice'?

Seeing as we were specific about what was quoted

When people post factually incorrect BS, then yes.

 

[Vayra86]

When people post factually incorrect BS, then yes.

Eh? Its not factually incorrect if you found one exception to a rule, especially one called 'generic advice'. Thát is the whole point.

Honestly 99% of gamers doesn't have the wallet to give a single fuck about x90 to begin with, it does not stand example for ANYTHING in the market, it only does that for when money is no object.

And this is a disease in gamer's land: that silly focus on the biggest most expensive hardware money can buy, and using it as a basis for comparison. Its a basis that is no basis for anyone except perhaps 1-3% of the target audience. Its also a great way to get knee deep in a commercial nonsense story that you need to upgrade every time something gets released. Again: the agenda of people for whom money is no object. The people who never cared about advice to begin with.

 

[Dragam1337]

Eh? Its not factually incorrect if you found one exception to a rule, especially one called 'generic advice'. Thát is the whole point.

Honestly 99% of gamers doesn't have the wallet to give a single fuck about x90 to begin with, it does not stand example for ANYTHING in the market, it only does that for when money is no object.

And this is a disease in gamer's land: that silly focus on the biggest most expensive hardware money can buy, and using it as a basis for comparison. Its a basis that is no basis for anyone except perhaps 1-3% of the target audience. Its also a great way to get knee deep in a commercial nonsense story that you need to upgrade every time something gets released. Again: the agenda of people for whom money is no object. The people who never cared about advice to begin with.

3090 to 4090 is 70+ % faster in none-cpu bottlenecked scenarios

2080 ti to 3090 is 70+ % faster in none-cpu bottlenecked scenarios

980 ti to 1080 ti is 70+ % faster in none-cpu bottlenecked scenarios

580 to titan / 780 is 70+ % faster in none-cpu bottlenecked scenarios

7900 gtx to 8800 gtx is more than 100% faster in none-cpu bottlenecked scenarios


But no, it has never happened before, the 4090 is simply a unicorn...

As for the whole "it's too expensive!!!!11" argument... i don't really care, and it's entirely besides the point. There has been a few gens you wanted to skip (namely the 2000) due to lackluster improvements, but otherwise there has been SIGNIFICANT gains with almost every gen.

 

[Vayra86]

As for the 2080 ti, 3090 and 4090 not being the equivelant gpu's of each their gens, is just a massive /facepalm. They are all based on the big chip of each their generation - naming of said chip is irrelevant, unless there was a bigger one released... which, guess what, there wasn't...

Obviously it is not, if you get the point that is being made, because you can buy 1,5x a 2080ti for the 3090's money, and the 4090 adds another 100 bucks on top.

Take a look at cards x60 through x80, which is where generic advice generally gets aimed at.

Good point though about more examples (just noticed the 580 > 780ti, both top Geforce SKU is even +90%! But.... that's TWO generations away, and the 680 was abysmal: +23% = 104 SKU, not a 110) but as you can see, they all happened at the very top end, where every time a premium price gets asked.

 

[Dragam1337]

Obviously it is not, if you get the point that is being made, because you can buy 1,5x a 2080ti for the 3090's money, and the 4090 adds another 100 bucks on top.

Take a look at cards x60 through x80, which is where generic advice generally gets aimed at.

Yes, prices has increased over time - what a shocker. Heard about the concept of inflation ?