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AM5 AGESA 1.0.0.7b

  • Thread starter Thread starter Deleted member 232534
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1.02 Vsoc is quite low, tbh. That's peachy for 4800, but if it's not raising up then it wont do 6000 with that

Try 1.20v SoC (aka vsoc) and see if that works, if it does you should try for the FCLK at 2000 as well for better performance
Yep. 1.2V SoC + 1.3V VDDIO-MEM (aka "memory controller" in ASUS BIOS). Should more than enough, If it works. Probably only needs 1.25V for VDDIO-Mem.
 
Yep. 1.2V SoC + 1.3V VDDIO-MEM (aka "memory controller" in ASUS BIOS). Should more than enough, If it works. Probably only needs 1.25V for VDDIO-Mem.
Thanks

@Zanuzz0 definitely use these values from ir_cow, he knows what he's talking about with DDR5
 
You're aware that you haven't enabled the XMP/EXPO profile, right? So right now you're running your RAM at JEDEC 4800 spec.
Yeah! If I turn it on by auto EXPO settings, as I've told u, I can't "cold boot" the system after turn him off, so I decided to use it as stock untill solve this.

Yep. 1.2V SoC + 1.3V VDDIO-MEM (aka "memory controller" in ASUS BIOS). Should more than enough, If it works. Probably only needs 1.25V for VDDIO-Mem.
Then force the memory to work in 6000mhz, right? Or I should activate an EXPO profile and, then, change this values from the ones given by de EXPO profile?

Tbh, i'm a completely dumbass on changing this values at BIOS, so thats why I'm asking this before doing something really wrong ahahah
 
Yeah! If I turn it on by auto EXPO settings, as I've told u, I can't "cold boot" the system after turn him off, so I decided to use it as stock untill solve this.
You have read up on the fact that the memory training takes forever with the new AGESA build, right? On the board I've been playing with, it can take a couple of minutes.
That's why the good old POST80 debug LEDs should be standard on all motherboards, so one knows what's going on.
 
Yeah! If I turn it on by auto EXPO settings, as I've told u, I can't "cold boot" the system after turn him off, so I decided to use it as stock untill solve this.


Then force the memory to work in 6000mhz, right? Or I should activate an EXPO profile and, then, change this values from the ones given by de EXPO profile?

Tbh, i'm a completely dumbass on changing this values at BIOS, so thats why I'm asking this before doing something really wrong ahahah

update to the new bios,

apply expo/xmp

if needed enable new memory training settings and/or apply higher voltage.

1.2v soc is not high. Please write here what motherboard suggest by default. Note the first memory training might take 5 minutes
 
I just read on here, that AMD is bringing 1.0.0.7c already to some boards, which they claim dramatically makes RAM stability better for EXPO profiles and boot times: https://wccftech.com/msi-rolls-out-...os-for-am5-motherboards-improve-ddr5-support/
Wouldn't that be nice. Currently as far as I can tell both XMP and EXPO are the same when it comes to the spd data, just the hex is moved around. So the white paper make it seem like.

Early on I did encounter a few XMP kits that just couldn't boot the XMP profile. Ended up being the tFAW set by the MB was too low and if you set tRFC below 480, it won't boot either. Haven't checked in a while. These are probably the bugs being addressed in each update.
 
update to the new bios,

apply expo/xmp

if needed enable new memory training settings and/or apply higher voltage.

1.2v soc is not high. Please write here what motherboard suggest by default. Note the first memory training might take 5 minutes
Made it and, IT WORKS! Ahahah

Before I update the BIOS, it was all automatic, as u can see in the photos below:
IMG_1633-min.png

IMG_1634-min.png


After update the BIOS, I've activated the EXPO I profile, and that's the changes applied:
IMG_1639-min.png


After this, I've booted the PC a couple times, checked the clocks on CPU-Z, HWInfo and ZenTimings, so thats the results:

cpuz-1.png
cpuz-2.png
cpuz-3.png
cpuz-4.png


zen-timings.png


hwinfo-1.png

hwinfo-2.png
hwinfo-3.png


After this BIOS update, my problems are, till now, solved with the EXPO profiles.

If I return to got problems, I'll be there again.

Thanks all u guys!
 
Yeah! If I turn it on by auto EXPO settings, as I've told u, I can't "cold boot" the system after turn him off, so I decided to use it as stock untill solve this.


Then force the memory to work in 6000mhz, right? Or I should activate an EXPO profile and, then, change this values from the ones given by de EXPO profile?

Tbh, i'm a completely dumbass on changing this values at BIOS, so thats why I'm asking this before doing something really wrong ahahah
Expo first, then change.

EXPO changes some bios settings invisibly, including SoC voltage and RAM timings - so you need to manually set them after enabling it

Looks like 1.24v set in BIOS (via zentimings) and 1.264 SoC 'live' voltage in that final HWinfo image, which is in the safe range but relatively high up - you may find it stable at a lower voltage, and save ~5 watts of heat in the CPU (within a PBO limit, that 5W goes into the CPU clocks as a small performance boost)

Obviously you run a chance of failed boots and crashes as you test lower, so save your good BIOS settings to a user profile in the BIOS first, and do small steps down over time. 1.22v tested over a week, then 1.20v for a week and so on since the instability tends to show at cold boots and low load, its hard to quickly find out.
 
Are you enabling "remember last training" on bios to reduce the boot times after the initial training and/or OC adjustment?
DDR5 OC in AMD is a PITA because the importance of aaaalll those secondary timings and right now I'm not in the mood to readjust them all again TBO :D. But 2-3 minutes less in boot times would be much appreciated.

If there was an AGESA update for that IHS behemoth... The mortrage of AM5 is AM4 cooler "compatibility"* :/


*Check for cooler compatibility in the compatibility for compatibility AM4 to AM5 compatibility list.
 
do you mean seconds? training should just happen one time.
People keep mistaking failed boot loops for memory training

Just because your system spends 10 minutes then finally boots doesnt mean it was memory training - it could just be that one boot had finally warmed up the board and PSU enough that the voltages were a tiny bit higher and it finally posted.

It's like my AX370-Gaming 5 that fails to cold boot every single time at 3200 and resets the BIOS, but works fine at 3133 or 3266 - it just loads the wrong automatic settings for the hardware and has a fit.

Edit: LLC and voltages like SoC are a good way to reduce this problem.
My x370 Gamingt 5 will boot at 3200 with it's 3700x run benchmarks for hours stable, never crash and then on a cold boot would outright reset RAM and IF settings to JEDEC, without telling me or altering any other BIOS settings. So not a true reset, but a safe mode that deleted what i had entered and assumed was running.



This happened on my x570, playing with memory tuning with advice from @ir_cow and @GerKNG a few months ago
On a cold boot, the system would do the 'training' (failed boots) and eventually load but the NB clock/IF was at 950 instead of 1900 - note how the RAM stayed at the correct speed and this was not a full BIOS reset.

The only clue was a longer boot time, and after 3-5 failed attempts a 'safe mode' option was kicked in by the board without any notice to the user
wrong IF.png
3800 tuned 2.png


Restarting the PC would then load the correct IF, because the system was warmed up, voltages were higher? or whatever invisible criteria was met.
Cold boot, it came back again. Those settings did error out eventually in testmem5 and when i locked in fully stable settings and SoC voltages the problem left entirely.
 
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Are you enabling "remember last training" on bios to reduce the boot times after the initial training and/or OC adjustment?
Don't enable that. Just will cause a headache. There is a reason why it trains the memory everytime.
 
Hah, randomly found this totally relevant nugget @ir_cow

AMD Ryzen 5 1400 review - Overclocking The Ryzen 5 processors (guru3d.com)

Did you get stuck at 2133 or 2400 MHz with faster capable memory?​

I recommend that in order to get that Ryzen running properly you do the following:

  1. Clear CMOS, fully power drain the system
  2. Load optimized defaults, save & exit and reboot (DO NOT CHANGE ANYTHING ELSE at this point).
  3. Enter BIOS again and apply the recommended, say, 2933 MHz setting (16-18-18-18-36 and 1.35V), save & exit.
We have seen numerous cases where boards can refuse to run properly following a component change, clear CMOS or memory training fail (i.e. too high clock was applied). The “trick” is the step #2. Normally at that point you’d just go and apply the settings you want to use but for some reason an extra reboot is needed to properly load those defaults.

Seems like the optimised defaults trick has indeed been around since the dawn of AM4, with CPU changes.
Some hidden away settings must stick from previous CPUs, possibly even memory training related information.
 
@Mussels This is Zen1 all over again with DDR5 instead. Give it another generation and I'm sure all these oddites will dry up.

AMD isn't as nice to me when I swap ram without disabling XMP/EXPO first. Usually it will refuse to boot ever again unless I clear the CMOS. Kinda a hassle for me since I'm swapping things daily. Intel doesn't seem to care what I swap to. Either it will try the XMP1 profile or default to JEDEC, either way it boots regardless.
 
Hah, randomly found this totally relevant nugget @ir_cow

AMD Ryzen 5 1400 review - Overclocking The Ryzen 5 processors (guru3d.com)



Seems like the optimised defaults trick has indeed been around since the dawn of AM4, with CPU changes.
Some hidden away settings must stick from previous CPUs, possibly even memory training related information.
I just did this as I've never done it (never even thought about having to do this) since I swapped to the 7800X3D. No changes. It looks like everything is fine with my board and AGESA 1.0.0.7a. :)
 
@Mussels This is Zen1 all over again with DDR5 instead. Give it another generation and I'm sure all these oddites will dry up.

AMD isn't as nice to me when I swap ram without disabling XMP/EXPO first. Usually it will refuse to boot ever again unless I clear the CMOS. Kinda a hassle for me since I'm swapping things daily. Intel doesn't seem to care what I swap to. Either it will try the XMP1 profile or default to JEDEC, either way it boots regardless.
Interesting.

Are you draining the PSU before the swap? There are times i've been lazy and swapped ram with the system off and PSU still connected completely safely and had no issues, and other times i've needed to drain the PSU entirely (PSU switch off, hit power button, lights go out, then PSU on and she's all good)

I just did this as I've never done it (never even thought about having to do this) since I swapped to the 7800X3D. No changes. It looks like everything is fine with my board and AGESA 1.0.0.7a. :)
Good to know, it may be something to keep in mind as you do bios updates in the future
 
Are you draining the PSU before the swap? There are times i've been lazy and swapped ram with the system off and PSU still connected completely safely and had no issues, and other times i've needed to drain the PSU entirely (PSU switch off, hit power button, lights go out, then PSU on and she's all good)
Maybe that is my problem. It's on my test benchmark so unless I do a MB or CPU swap, I'm not turning off the power. However, when it stops posting, I will turn off the power as a troubleshooting step. Only thing that gets me out of that no-post is a CMOS. Even putting the old ram back is doesn't work. So I probably pissed off the MB when swapping ram without turning off the PSU first.
 
Maybe that is my problem. It's on my test benchmark so unless I do a MB or CPU swap, I'm not turning off the power. However, when it stops posting, I will turn off the power as a troubleshooting step. Only thing that gets me out of that no-post is a CMOS. Even putting the old ram back is doesn't work. So I probably pissed off the MB when swapping ram without turning off the PSU first.
My educated guess is that it's the firmware equivalent of fast boot.
POST info must be stored info somewhere - be it in the CPU or RAM itself, and we know the systems have basic standby power. The more complex a system gets, the more pieces have their own basic memories.
Much like how DDR4/5 ram can be set to X RGB lighting in software and it sticks there until it fully loses power before going back to it's hardware memory, one part is expecting another to have information it no longer does


'last boot was successful, use the settings stored in xyz123' - only that space is blank cause the ram was removed and it lost power.
 
Have a question to some of you here having a Asrock board. I saw this test review, where it seems Asrock somehow uses some way slower RAM timings, even if you use the same RAM kits, resulting in a 10% performance loss in gaming compared to other boards from MSI or Gigabyte. How can that be? Anyone can confirm that? Maybe thats also the reason Asrock boards seem to be more "stable" when it comes to "boot or not to boot" with 6000+ kits.

The article says:

"The Asrock boards were hit and miss, oddly the Riptide was good at the 6000 speed, but the Lightning and Pro RS both failed, forcing us to run at 5600. The Lightning and Pro RS were both tested with the BIOS version "1.11.AS03" which was the latest version, the Riptide though has seen two more updates and the latest 1.14.AS15 worked just fine with DDR5-6000. So presumably Asrock will eventually provide that BIOS revision to the rest of their B650 lineup, solving the memory issues."

So not sure if that is still true, for latest AGESA or not.


I was thinking of getting a ASRock B650M PRO RS WIFI board with a G.Skill Flare EXPO X5 DDR5-6000CL32-38-38-96 kit for a new Ryzen 7800X3D build.
 
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Is the article saying it's 10% lower performance at the same memory frequency or because the memory is running at a lower frequency?

Budget MBs like A620 and B650 may have a hard time with faster memory when It comes to plug and play. 5600 is more or less guarantee to work.
 
@ir_cow They showed these RAM timings in the article, and it seems Asrock uses "less aggressive" timings for a lot of RAM settings, which are outside of the Expo profile, even if you use the Expo profile, the Asrock here ran at 3000MHz:

IMFW4U6.png

qfaAhhR.png

1NX8y5T.png

1gJD9rO.png


That is beyond any of my knowledge, which of these settings may result in a 10% FPS loss in games compared to the other boards and if you could tweak them manually maybe. So not sure what that gap of 175 and 185 is causing, if theyre all using 3000MHz clock ram.
 
@ir_cow They showed these RAM timings in the article, and it seems Asrock uses "less aggressive" timings for a lot of RAM settings, which are outside of the Expo profile, even if you use the Expo profile, the Asrock here ran at 3000MHz:

IMFW4U6.png

qfaAhhR.png

1NX8y5T.png

1gJD9rO.png


That is beyond any of my knowledge, which of these settings may result in a 10% FPS loss in games compared to the other boards and if you could tweak them manually maybe. So not sure what that gap of 175 and 185 is causing, if theyre all using 3000MHz clock ram.
Yeah, what's 162 and 163 next to the MSi boards? I have one of those, so it would be very interesting to know.
 
what's 162 and 163 next to the MSi boards?
Thats also what I noticed and questioned, the article doesnt say anything about that. I thought maybe a bios version but that doesnt seem to be the case.
 
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