AVerMedia CamStream 4K

[Inle]

The AVerMedia CamStream 4K is a video capture card designed for cameras and camcorders. In true plug-and-play fashion, it makes them easily usable on computers and mobile devices. While small, the competent device offers high-quality output options, including uncompressed RGB24 color format support at Full HD.

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[TheLostSwede]

Can you stream using RTMP with this thing? As that's usually an issue with USB devices like this.

 

[Lianna]

Both Elgato and Magewell could not capture 1920x1080p60 RGB24 (~3 Gbps) on USB 3.x Gen 1; reportedly due to insufficient bandwidth (5 Gbps).
CamStream 4K can do it, as well as 1920x1080p60 P010 (~3.7 Gbps); funny, isn't it?

AFAIK, Elgato CamLink 4K does not support more than one device (capturing) at the same time on one PC.
@Inle can you ask AVerMedia:
1. Are 2 or 3 CamStream 4K devices supported at the same time (capturing)?
2. Is CamStream 4K possible to use (capture) at the same time as, e.g. AVerMedia's GC553G2 (Live Gamer ULTRA 2.1)?
3. If I need 2 or 3 captures in 1920x1080p60 RGB24, would its USB 3.2 Gen 1 (5 Gbps) bandwidth limit it, e.g. by requiring use of two USB roots?
4. As above, but would attaching them to USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hub alleviate bandwidth bottlenecks?
5. Would GC553G2 work any better for the above (2 or 3 streams of 1920x1080p60 RGB24) on USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hub?
6. Does CamStream 4K or GC553G2 support other resolutions (like 2560x1600 or 3840x1080) or framerates (e.g. p50 or p90) or both (e.g. 2560x1600p90)?

Thanks in advance, sorry for really specific topic.

 

[TheGoodDave]

Supposing you use an HDMI splitter out of the device you wish to capture so that the signal is sent both to a monitor and to this capture card, is there any reason you couldn't use it to capture game footage? Is its lack of passthrough the only downside for that purpose?

 

[Inle]

Can you stream using RTMP with this thing? As that's usually an issue with USB devices like this.

Not sure why you couldn't, RTMP is a streaming protocol handled by the streaming software. The capture card only feeds video/audio to it. Didn't run into any issues with YouTube/Castr streaming, with this or any other capture card I've tested, using OBS and vMix.

Both Elgato and Magewell could not capture 1920x1080p60 RGB24 (~3 Gbps) on USB 3.x Gen 1; reportedly due to insufficient bandwidth (5 Gbps).
CamStream 4K can do it, as well as 1920x1080p60 P010 (~3.7 Gbps); funny, isn't it?

AFAIK, Elgato CamLink 4K does not support more than one device (capturing) at the same time on one PC.
@Inle can you ask AVerMedia:
1. Are 2 or 3 CamStream 4K devices supported at the same time (capturing)?
2. Is CamStream 4K possible to use (capture) at the same time as, e.g. AVerMedia's GC553G2 (Live Gamer ULTRA 2.1)?
3. If I need 2 or 3 captures in 1920x1080p60 RGB24, would its USB 3.2 Gen 1 (5 Gbps) bandwidth limit it, e.g. by requiring use of two USB roots?
4. As above, but would attaching them to USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hub alleviate bandwidth bottlenecks?
5. Would GC553G2 work any better for the above (2 or 3 streams of 1920x1080p60 RGB24) on USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hub?
6. Does CamStream 4K or GC553G2 support other resolutions (like 2560x1600 or 3840x1080) or framerates (e.g. p50 or p90) or both (e.g. 2560x1600p90)?

Thanks in advance, sorry for really specific topic.

I'll forward your first question to AVerMedia and get back to you, as I only have a single sample of the card on me, so I'm not able to check if two would work. I'm 99% sure it should work with no issues, at least in vMix, which does a great job at handling device paths. The CamStream 4K can definitely work together with the GC553G2.

As for the USB interface bandwidth, a single 1080p60 RGB24 stream requires around 3 Gbps of bandwidth, so having two run concurrently is a borderline case that I wouldn't bother pushing. 3 at once aren't feasible at all. If I wanted to run two such streams via USB, I'd definitely split them between two USB controlers.

USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hubs could work with two 5 Gbps capture cards connected to them, assuming they're equipped with true 40 Gbps controllers. However, due to various factors (handshake issues, quirky USB bandwidth balancing in Windows), this is never done in "mission-critical" scenarios (my capture card background is less in gaming and more in live event streaming). If two USB capture cards must be connected to a single PC (which is also something we try to avoid in live production), then the aim is to connect them to different USB controllers.

The GC553G2 has a higher-bandwidth output (10 Gbps) but you're still facing all the same issues at 1920x1080p60 RGB24; everything mentioned above applies.

As for a comperhensive list of all supported resolutions and frame rates, please check the first page of my review (for the CamStream 4K), and this page for the GC553G2.

Supposing you use an HDMI splitter out of the device you wish to capture so that the signal is sent both to a monitor and to this capture card, is there any reason you couldn't use it to capture game footage? Is its lack of passthrough the only downside for that purpose?

That would work, with occasional handshake issues (sometimes you'd have to reconnect the cables on the splitter), significant input lag on the monitor, and potential audio/video sync issues. It's not something I'd advise, but if you decide to try your luck, make sure to get a decent powered HDMI splitter. Roline powered HDMI splitters are a good and reliable option for tighter budgets, I've been using them for ages, even on large live streaming gigs, including those that take place in cinemas, where I'm connecting to DCP projectors (which comes with its own stack of challenges). Not sure if Roline is available outside of Europe though. Either way, don't go for the cheapest passive Aliexpress option.

 

[TheLostSwede]

Not sure why you couldn't, RTMP is a streaming protocol handled by the streaming software. The capture card only feeds video/audio to it. Didn't run into any issues with YouTube/Castr streaming, with this or any other capture card I've tested, using OBS and vMix.

It used to be an issue that hardware encoded video couldn't be used with the RTMP protocol, which was a big issue when these types of devices started to appear in the market if you wanted to do a live stream. Just curious if that has changed.
I was actually trying to bring something like this to market over a decade ago, but due to a bunch of limitations at the time, it wasn't possible.

 

[Lianna]

I'll forward your first question to AVerMedia and get back to you, as I only have a single sample of the card on me, so I'm not able to check if two would work.

Thanks. I'd still ask you to forward all of them.

I'm 99% sure it should work with no issues, at least in vMix, which does a great job at handling device paths. The CamStream 4K can definitely work together with the GC553G2.

As for the USB interface bandwidth, a single 1080p60 RGB24 stream requires around 3 Gbps of bandwidth, so having two run concurrently is a borderline case that I wouldn't bother pushing. 3 at once aren't feasible at all. If I wanted to run two such streams via USB, I'd definitely split them between two USB controlers.

USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hubs could work with two 5 Gbps capture cards connected to them, assuming they're equipped with true 40 Gbps controllers. However, due to various factors (handshake issues, quirky USB bandwidth balancing in Windows), this is never done in "mission-critical" scenarios (my capture card background is less in gaming and more in live event streaming). If two USB capture cards must be connected to a single PC (which is also something we try to avoid in live production), then the aim is to connect them to different USB controllers.

The GC553G2 has a higher-bandwidth output (10 Gbps) but you're still facing all the same issues at 1920x1080p60 RGB24; everything mentioned above applies.

Well I know the theory ("it should work with enough bandwidth") and have enough experience to ask if it works in practice.
Could not find any info on running more than one capture device on AVerMedia's site (maybe I searched wrong).
Elgato's site says their USB capture devices do not work together due to some conflicting (same) IDs unless on two root hubs, not because of bandwidth.
GC553G2 would not be facing "the same issues" at said resolution as two of them would have enough bandwidth on USB 3.x Gen 2 hub; but I'm not sure the bandwidth is the only problem.

As for a comperhensive list of all supported resolutions and frame rates, please check the first page of my review (for the CamStream 4K), and this page for the GC553G2.

If I found that information there (I checked both after main page news about CamStream), I wouldn't ask. Elgato's CamLink 4K says 1920x1080p60, but works with e.g. 1920x1080p50. One of my USB capture cards worked with 1680x1050p60 signal, despite not having it mentioned in the spec sheet, but it's always a lottery. This is why I ask.

That would work, with occasional handshake issues (sometimes you'd have to reconnect the cables on the splitter), significant input lag on the monitor, and potential audio/video sync issues. It's not something I'd advise, but if you decide to try your luck, make sure to get a decent powered HDMI splitter. Roline powered HDMI splitters are a good and reliable option for tighter budgets, I've been using them for ages, even on large live streaming gigs, including those that take place in cinemas, where I'm connecting to DCP projectors (which comes with its own stack of challenges). Not sure if Roline is available outside of Europe though. Either way, don't go for the cheapest passive Aliexpress option.

I'm not sure where the "significant input lag on the monitor" or "audio/video sync issues" would come from, as most splitters are too cheap to have enough memory buffer to create any measureable lag. This is regardless of the handshake issues on some splitters and why "zero-lag" pass-through capture devices exist. Splitter with EDID selector switch recommended anyway.
I just had a remote live demo with HDMI splitter on an industrial PC's monitor output and a CamLink 4K connected to a laptop outside to handle the connection and can't recall any problems of this kind.

 

[TheGoodDave]

I'm not sure where the "significant input lag on the monitor" or "audio/video sync issues" would come from, as most splitters are too cheap to have enough memory buffer to create any measureable lag. This is regardless of the handshake issues on some splitters and why "zero-lag" pass-through capture devices exist. Splitter with EDID selector switch recommended anyway.
I just had a remote live demo with HDMI splitter on an industrial PC's monitor output and a CamLink 4K connected to a laptop outside to handle the connection and can't recall any problems of this kind.

I, too, wasn't aware that simple splitters could introduce lag. I usually buy Orei brand splitters and such, since as far as I can tell they seem to be a great compromise between cost and build quality. I don't know if you have any experience with that brand and have any brand recommendations in general. All I know is I have an ASUS CU4K30 capture card and it gives me handshake headaches every time I try to use it and I'd love to get a decent capture card that Just Works.

 

[Inle]

Thanks. I'd still ask you to forward all of them.

One of AVerMedia engineers was kind enough to answer your questions. Please find their answers below!

1. Are 2 or 3 CamStream 4K devices supported at the same time (capturing)?
Yes, they can be used simultaneously, but performance will depend on the PC's capabilities. We recommend connecting 2 to 3 BU113G2 (CamStream 4K) devices on a desktop PC for better stability.

2. Is CamStream 4K possible to use (capture) at the same time as, e.g. AVerMedia's GC553G2 (Live Gamer ULTRA 2.1)?
Yes, both devices can be used together without issue.

3. If I need 2 or 3 captures in 1920x1080p60 RGB24, would its USB 3.2 Gen 1 (5 Gbps) bandwidth limit it, e.g. by requiring use of two USB roots?
Yes, bandwidth could be a limiting factor. In this case, we recommend connecting each device to a separate USB root.

4. As above, but would attaching them to USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hub alleviate bandwidth bottlenecks?

5. Would GC553G2 work any better for the above (2 or 3 streams of 1920x1080p60 RGB24) on USB 3.2 Gen 2 or USB4 hub?
Possibly, but this depends on the platform(PC) and system architecture, so results may vary. Generally For multiple high-bandwidth devices like 1080p60 RGB capture cards, we recommend connecting them directly to separate USB ports on the motherboard, ideally from different controllers if available.

6. Does CamStream 4K or GC553G2 support other resolutions (like 2560x1600 or 3840x1080) or framerates (e.g. p50 or p90) or both (e.g. 2560x1600p90)?
No, 2560x1600, 3840x1080, and 90p are not supported. On the other hand, both CamStream 4K and GC553G2 support standard formats such as 1920x1080p50 and 3840x2160p50.

 

[Lianna]

Thank you!