13600k undervolt with B660

[veidas]

I have been trying to undervolt my 13600k with Gigabyte B660M Gaming X for ages. At first nothing would work, because I believe IA CEP is enabled, and even if you disable "Undervolt protection" in bios, nothing changes. As soon as you apply even -0.02 offset, you start loosing performance in cinebench r23. Naturally, undervolting in Windows with XTU or Throttlestop also doesnt work.
Now this is where it gets interesting. I flashed the oldest available bios which supports 13th gen, and "Undervolt protection" setting is gone from bios. Undervolting in bios still results in loss of performance, BUT, strangely, undervolting now works with Throttlestop. I applied -0.1 offset to core and cache and cinebench score actually increased from usual ~23800 to 24100, while consuming 145w instead of 180w. Also I shaved atleast 15c from cpu temperature. So obviously undervolting works perfect now. So Im kinda happy, but instead of autorunning Throttlestop, I would love to just achieve the same using bios. It doesnt make sense to me, if IA CEP (Undervoltage protection) is kicking in and not letting me undervolt in bios, shouldnt it also block undervolt with Throttlestop? Wth is happening here? Appreciate any ideas or explanations

 

[crlogic]

I've worked with a 13600k on a Z790 board from MSI and also had issues with undervolting in the BIOS. It would accept any value I gave it and I wouldn't lose performance but it would only actually offset the voltage down to -0.050mV even if I were to put more.
XTU also did not work at all. Voltage control was greyed out

Ended up using ThrottleStop and it works perfectly.
It's sitting happy at -0.125mV atm but can go even further. Scheduling it on startup also works perfect

My personal computer I use XTU to undervolt and I don't see any disadvantage of doing it in software vs BIOS. More convenient for dialing in your UV in software for sure though

 

[veidas]

I've worked with a 13600k on a Z790 board from MSI and also had issues with undervolting in the BIOS. It would accept any value I gave it and I wouldn't lose performance but it would only actually offset the voltage down to -0.050mV even if I were to put more.
XTU also did not work at all. Voltage control was greyed out

Ended up using ThrottleStop and it works perfectly.
It's sitting happy at -0.125mV atm but can go even further. Scheduling it on startup also works perfect

My personal computer I use XTU to undervolt and I don't see any disadvantage of doing it in software vs BIOS. More convenient for dialing in your UV in software for sure though

Yeah I guess its alright, its just that im very anal about what software autostarts and runs on my pc. I like to keep it clean. Atleast it doesnt seem to use much resources. Still, would love to understand why its happening

 

[Cowboystrekk]

I have been trying to undervolt my 13600k with Gigabyte B660M Gaming X for ages. At first nothing would work, because I believe IA CEP is enabled, and even if you disable "Undervolt protection" in bios, nothing changes. As soon as you apply even -0.02 offset, you start loosing performance in cinebench r23. Naturally, undervolting in Windows with XTU or Throttlestop also doesnt work.
Now this is where it gets interesting. I flashed the oldest available bios which supports 13th gen, and "Undervolt protection" setting is gone from bios. Undervolting in bios still results in loss of performance, BUT, strangely, undervolting now works with Throttlestop. I applied -0.1 offset to core and cache and cinebench score actually increased from usual ~23800 to 24100, while consuming 145w instead of 180w. Also I shaved atleast 15c from cpu temperature. So obviously undervolting works perfect now. So Im kinda happy, but instead of autorunning Throttlestop, I would love to just achieve the same using bios. It doesnt make sense to me, if IA CEP (Undervoltage protection) is kicking in and not letting me undervolt in bios, shouldnt it also block undervolt with Throttlestop? Wth is happening here? Appreciate any ideas or explanations

It seems Intel has restricted UV with ME-updates, but nice that it works with throttlestop On MSI B660-boards you may be able to use the lite load to UV, but Asus and GB is out of luck.

I've worked with a 13600k on a Z790 board from MSI and also had issues with undervolting in the BIOS. It would accept any value I gave it and I wouldn't lose performance but it would only actually offset the voltage down to -0.050mV even if I were to put more.
XTU also did not work at all. Voltage control was greyed out

Ended up using ThrottleStop and it works perfectly.
It's sitting happy at -0.125mV atm but can go even further. Scheduling it on startup also works perfect

My personal computer I use XTU to undervolt and I don't see any disadvantage of doing it in software vs BIOS. More convenient for dialing in your UV in software for sure though

Tip using throttlestop: sometimes cpu cache can be UVed further than core. On my i5 8400 I could run cach -40mv lower, same on my i7 6700HQ, this lower temps a bit more. System agent etc can also be UVed a bit, but stay away if you OC ram

 

[veidas]

It seems Intel has restricted UV with ME-updates, but nice that it works with throttlestop On MSI B660-boards you may be able to use the lite load to UV, but Asus and GB is out of luck.


Tip using throttlestop: sometimes cpu cache can be UVed further than core. On my i5 8400 I could run cach -40mv lower, same on my i7 6700HQ, this lower temps a bit more. System agent etc can also be UVed a bit, but stay away if you OC ram

Lite load is just a name MSI came up for AC/DC Load Line calibration. Every motherboard has it, just named differently. I did undervolt with Lite load at first, bug again, with IA CEP doing its thing, you cant really undervolt much without loosing performance. I could only go down as low as 165w total cpu package power before it started to tank performance. With undervolt, I settled on 130w total cpu package power with no loss of performance at all Honestly after applying -0.125 offset I just dont care anymore, didnt even try to go lower because its already 50w less than stock 180w this cpu used. I consider this a win lol. I am running system agent a bit lower, but my ram is also oced quite a lot, so again, didnt try to go as low as possible.

 

[Cowboystrekk]

Lite load is just a name MSI came up for AC/DC Load Line calibration. Every motherboard has it, just named differently. I did undervolt with Lite load at first, bug again, with IA CEP doing its thing, you cant really undervolt much without loosing performance. I could only go down as low as 165w total cpu package power before it started to tank performance. With undervolt, I settled on 130w total cpu package power with no loss of performance at all Honestly after applying -0.125 offset I just dont care anymore, didnt even try to go lower because its already 50w less than stock 180w this cpu used. I consider this a win lol. I am running system agent a bit lower, but my ram is also oced quite a lot, so again, didnt try to go as low as possible.

Can't find a similar value system in Asus-bios that corresponds to the lite load values, but UV is broken on my 12400F anyways.

 

[veidas]

Can't find a similar value system in Asus-bios that corresponds to the lite load values, but UV is broken on my 12400F anyways.

Its definitely there, Advanced -> CPU Power Configuration maybe? Might be called LLC, Load Line Calibration, something with AC/DC etc
edit: I just did quick search and asus forums are full of people discussing load line calibration on b660 boards, so the setting is 100% there

 

[Ghostlu]

Its definitely there, Advanced -> CPU Power Configuration maybe? Might be called LLC, Load Line Calibration, something with AC/DC etc
edit: I just did quick search and asus forums are full of people discussing load line calibration on b660 boards, so the setting is 100% there

Can you link it please?

I've worked with a 13600k on a Z790 board from MSI and also had issues with undervolting in the BIOS. It would accept any value I gave it and I wouldn't lose performance but it would only actually offset the voltage down to -0.050mV even if I were to put more.
XTU also did not work at all. Voltage control was greyed out

Ended up using ThrottleStop and it works perfectly.
It's sitting happy at -0.125mV atm but can go even further. Scheduling it on startup also works perfect

My personal computer I use XTU to undervolt and I don't see any disadvantage of doing it in software vs BIOS. More convenient for dialing in your UV in software for sure though

Does HwInfo64 see the TS undervolt settings?

 

[veidas]

Yes, but needs to be restarted after every adjustment. HWinfo doesnt see voltage adjustment in real time. If you change offset in TS, restart HWinfo to see if its applied.

 

[Deleted member 185158]

Its definitely there, Advanced -> CPU Power Configuration maybe? Might be called LLC, Load Line Calibration, something with AC/DC etc
edit: I just did quick search and asus forums are full of people discussing load line calibration on b660 boards, so the setting is 100% there

Yes, this is how most people under-volt on B660.
My 13600KF is for sale....

One thing I learned about 13th gen, the cpu D Gaf what you set. 100% performance all the way to 100c. If you're not hitting 100c sustained, there is absolutely no reason to under-volt.

LLC lvl 3 is a stock setting. Should run a bit cooler on lvl 2 loads.

For OP, the LLC allows v-droop at heavy loads. It's effective enough, you won't need to change core v manually. If you do, change actual VRM core voltage, not VID.

 

[veidas]

Yes, this is how most people under-volt on B660.
My 13600KF is for sale....

One thing I learned about 13th gen, the cpu D Gaf what you set. 100% performance all the way to 100c. If you're not hitting 100c sustained, there is absolutely no reason to under-volt.

LLC lvl 3 is a stock setting. Should run a bit cooler on lvl 2 loads.

For OP, the LLC allows v-droop at heavy loads. It's effective enough, you won't need to change core v manually. If you do, change actual VRM core voltage, not VID.

It does not work, you loose performance as I explained before, because IA CEP is kicking in. I managed to undervolt with TS using older bios to 1.1v core under full load. Instead of 180w its using 130w now. Instead of 92c, its max at 68c now. So there is point. I dont need to listen to my cpu cooler running at 100% when playing cyberpunk, and I use way less electricity while rendering.

 

[Cowboystrekk]

Its definitely there, Advanced -> CPU Power Configuration maybe? Might be called LLC, Load Line Calibration, something with AC/DC etc
edit: I just did quick search and asus forums are full of people discussing load line calibration on b660 boards, so the setting is 100% there

I thought it was different settings and that MSI also has LLC.

 

[Deleted member 185158]

It does not work, you loose performance as I explained before, because IA CEP is kicking in. I managed to undervolt with TS using older bios to 1.1v core under full load. Instead of 180w its using 130w now. Instead of 92c, its max at 68c now. So there is point. I dont need to listen to my cpu cooler running at 100% when playing cyberpunk, and I use way less electricity while rendering.

Well thats an interesting conundrum!! Cause I was running 5.5 to 5.6ghz, dropped LLC to 3 instead of 4 ( oc setting) and seemed to perform just fine. But then my board has an external clock generator, our goals are obviously different!!

Any how, I got the bios walk through for OP. He'll have to experiment, but like I said there's no point in under volt to save 5 bucks from 365 days of full load use....

 

[veidas]

Well thats an interesting conundrum!! Cause I was running 5.5 to 5.6ghz, dropped LLC to 3 instead of 4 ( oc setting) and seemed to perform just fine. But then my board has an external clock generator, our goals are obviously different!!

Any how, I got the bios walk through for OP. He'll have to experiment, but like I said there's no point in under volt to save 5 bucks from 365 days of full load use....

Well yes, it does work fine if I stay with 165-170w total power usage. If I drop llc more, so total cpu package power drops to like 155w, i loose performance. With undervolt, I dont loose any performance, and can go way lower. Cpu being silent is huge plus also

 

[Deleted member 185158]

Well yes, it does work fine if I stay with 165-170w total power usage. If I drop llc more, so total cpu package power drops to like 155w, i loose performance. With undervolt, I dont loose any performance, and can go way lower. Cpu being silent is huge plus also

Nice.
It's weird the performance drops, but the frequency seems to stay the same. My theory on this is that a lot of transistors decide to stop working because of the low voltage. Experimenting at the same frequency, a higher LLC sometimes seems to boost the performance.

 

[veidas]

Nice.
It's weird the performance drops, but the frequency seems to stay the same. My theory on this is that a lot of transistors decide to stop working because of the low voltage. Experimenting at the same frequency, a higher LLC sometimes seems to boost the performance.

Its called clock stretching. Usually thats the result of IA CEP (Undervoltage protection)

 

[Deleted member 185158]

Its called clock stretching. Usually thats the result of IA CEP (Undervoltage protection)

Yes, but there should be an adjustment for CEP in bios, but I am unfamiliar with the Gigabyte boards. Right? Disable to prevent throttling.

 

[veidas]

Yes, but there should be an adjustment for CEP in bios, but I am unfamiliar with the Gigabyte boards. Right? Disable to prevent throttling.

Thats the thing. Its blocked on most B series motherboards. Can only disable it for sure on Z series motherboards.

 

[Deleted member 185158]

Thats the thing. Its blocked on most B series motherboards. Can only disable it for sure on Z series motherboards.

Ah, gotcha. This is true.

 

[crlogic]

Does HwInfo64 see the TS undervolt settings?

Yes it does

 

[Cowboystrekk]

Too bad Intel keeps locking more and more settings :/ Disabling UV proctection does nothing on my Asus B660m K neither. If I UV more than -10mv performance starts to drop. This is BS and makes me wanna go AMD next time even though performance is slightly worse. Atleadt everything is unlocked.

 

[veidas]

Too bad Intel keeps locking more and more settings :/ Disabling UV proctection does nothing on my Asus B660m K neither. If I UV more than -10mv performance starts to drop. This is BS and makes me wanna go AMD next time even though performance is slightly worse. Atleadt everything is unlocked.

UV protection and IA CEP should be 2 different settings. UV protection is the new intel setting that disables real time undervolt/overclock, meaning it doesnt work in windows environment(xtu, throttlestop). IA CEP is the setting that should allow undervolting in bios without loosing performance. Problem is that some vendors dont include this setting on B series motherboards. Well, most of them actually. If you flash oldest bios that supports 13th gen on your motherboard, undervolting with Throttlestop should work

 

[Cowboystrekk]

UV protection and IA CEP should be 2 different settings. UV protection is the new intel setting that disables real time undervolt/overclock, meaning it doesnt work in windows environment(xtu, throttlestop). IA CEP is the setting that should allow undervolting in bios without loosing performance. Problem is that some vendors dont include this setting on B series motherboards. Well, most of them actually. If you flash oldest bios that supports 13th gen on your motherboard, undervolting with Throttlestop should work

I use 12400F, I think I found both settings in my bios, but they don't work. Throttlestop has greyed out sliders :/

 

[veidas]

I use 12400F, I think I found both settings in my bios, but they don't work. Throttlestop has greyed out sliders :/

All virtualization settings in bios and windows should also be disabled if you are using windows 11. Also, memory integrity setting. You can install XTU, open it, and on the first page, it should say undervolt protection: yes/no.

 

[Cowboystrekk]

All virtualization settings in bios and windows should also be disabled if you are using windows 11. Also, memory integrity setting. You can install XTU, open it, and on the first page, it should say undervolt protection: yes/no.

I use Win10. Xtu does not work, refuses to start due to my cpu.