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Achieving the advertised all core boost of the 13700HX

colossalcrungus

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Hi UncleWebb and folks!

Recently got an HP Victus 16-r0xxx with a 13700HX and an RTX 4060. I'm on F.11 BIOS and have found success with using Throttlestop to tweak my core multipliers, PL1/PL2, and battery saving profiles to fit my gaming/productivity needs.

However, I have run into a few problems - I cannot for the life of me get my processor to boost to the advertised all core boost of 4.5ghz. Even if I set the x7/x8 multipliers in Throttlestop and XTU to 4.5ghz, at most the core effective clock will max out at 3.7/3.8ghz as reported by HWInfo64. And it is not due to thermal throttling - at least initially.


Furthermore, I cannot seem to raise my PL1 above 130 watts. If I set it above 130w in Throttlestop, I do not see any max package power above 130w as reported by HWInfo64. I understand that this is probably a board power limit set in the EC, but would that account for the ridiculously low all core boost I am experiencing? Or is there a separate EC setting that is also limiting the max core frequency?

Attaching some screenshots of my main/FIVR/TPL windows for reference.
 

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It's turbo speed depends on how the manufacturer has configured/designed it's speed/thermals/power for this specific laptop.
Also the multiplier is locked on Core i7-13700HX.
 
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OneMoar

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Intel doesn't advertise an 'all core boost'
there is no such thing
all core boost is based on workload/thermals/power
its a laptop this behavior is expected and 130W in a laptop is pretty dam fast
 
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Given that Intel advertises 5GHz at 157W, and your laptop only allows 130W, I don't understand why you would expect to ever see that frequency. I really wish the masjority of people who posted in this subforum would do basic research before buying laptops.

1703870028055.png
 

unclewebb

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Also the multiplier is locked on Core i7-13700HX.
The HX processors have Unlocked multipliers. These are the same as desktop K series CPUs. ThrottleStop confirms this feature.

1703869549818.png


130W in a laptop is pretty dam fast
130W may be fast but it is not enough power to run a 13th Gen mobile processor at its full rated speed. You will get power limit throttling if you cannot pull more than 130W.

@colossalcrungus

Many HP laptops use an embedded controller (EC) to enforce a 130W power limit. Try setting ThrottleStop up properly and turn on the Log File option so I can see what is happening. Set both Long Power PL1 and Short Power PL2 to 200W just to make sure they are not causing any problems. Set the Turbo Time Limit to the default 56 seconds. Clear both Clamp boxes and clear the Sync MMIO box. You do not need to check Sync MMIO when Lock MMIO is checked.

Your screenshot shows a max temperature of 78°C at only 68.8W. Even if there were no power limits, I doubt your cooling is going to be able to handle the CPU running beyond 130W. For comparison, the cooling in the Legion 9i series can take an HX processor up to 180W or 190W.

Run a consistent test like Cinebench for 10 or 15 minutes. Post a log file when you are done testing so I can have a look.

Run HWiNFO and see if it reports that IA-CEP is enabled. This is a current throttling scheme that Intel has dreamed up. ThrottleStop shows that Undervolt Protection is enabled and I will assume that HP does not give you any option in the BIOS to disable this feature. CEP can kill performance when trying to run a CPU at maximum speed and power. I doubt any HP laptop BIOS will ever have the option to disable CEP if it is enabled.

I really wish the majority of people who posted in this subforum would do basic research before buying laptops.
If his HP laptop is using an embedded controller to limit his laptop to only 130W, I am pretty sure that HP never mentioned this limitation anywhere on their sales sheet. Proper research of laptops is next to impossible. Most laptop review sites leave out any important details like hidden throttling schemes that most manufacturers use. Any laptop review site that is 100% honest will not have access to any new laptops to test.
 

colossalcrungus

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Given that Intel advertises 5GHz at 157W, and your laptop only allows 130W, I don't understand why you would expect to ever see that frequency. I really wish the masjority of people who posted in this subforum would do basic research before buying laptops.

View attachment 327365
Over 4000 posts since 2005 and you can’t read an Intel spec sheet correctly? Embarrassing. 5ghz is the max SINGLE core boost.

I am concerned that my max ALL p-core frequency is very nominally low at 3.7ghz.

I don’t know if there’s perfect linear scaling between power limit and boost frequency with this dumb Alder Lake refresh chip but I guess if 130/157 = 82.8% of max TDP, then 3.7/4.5 = 82% of max all core boost potential?
 

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The HX processors have Unlocked multipliers. These are the same as desktop K series CPUs. ThrottleStop confirms this feature.

According to TPU:

The multiplier is locked on Core i7-13700HX, which limits its overclocking potential.

 
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unclewebb

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I am concerned that my max ALL p-core frequency is very nominally low at 3.7ghz.
Can you post a ThrottleStop log file that shows this? Some monitoring software including the in game MHz being reported is not very accurate when a CPU is power limit throttling or thermal throttling.
 

dc_IV

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I have an Alienware m16 R1 with the same i7-13700HX. I also have the same issue where I can't get this CPU past ~130w. I know the m16 R1 is capable of hitting 165w for the CPU so I am not sure what is limiting my Max. Here are my settings, and a logfile.
Screenshot 2023-12-30 214029.pngScreenshot 2023-12-30 214115.pngScreenshot 2023-12-30 214209.pngScreenshot 2023-12-30 214233.pngScreenshot 2023-12-30 214259.png
 

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dc_IV

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Look at the log file. Your CPU is hitting 100C and is constantly thermal throttling. It is impossible to get maximum performance out of a CPU when it is overheating.
The unfortunate issue is that P-Cores 3 & 5 are about 6C to 14C higher temp than the other P-Cores according to HWINFO64 so it's throttling because of a couple of misfits!
 

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its a Hp be thankful it doesn't throttle at 95w lol

could do lquid metal
 
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I have an Alienware m16 R1 with the same i7-13700HX. I also have the same issue where I can't get this CPU past ~130w. I know the m16 R1 is capable of hitting 165w for the CPU so I am not sure what is limiting my Max. Here are my settings, and a logfile.
View attachment 327593View attachment 327594View attachment 327595View attachment 327596View attachment 327597
What was running while writing the log file?

Are you using full speed fan mode (fn+f1) and using a support to raise the base to improve fresh air entry into the system?

Alienware M16 can sustain +165W when at full load on the CPU alone, but for that it needs a good thermal compound well applied.

Unfortunately, the quality of the factory thermal paste application varies a lot and in your case it is only sustaining ~110W.
 

dc_IV

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What was running while writing the log file?

Are you using full speed fan mode (fn+f1) and using a support to raise the base to improve fresh air entry into the system?

Alienware M16 can sustain +165W when at full load on the CPU alone, but for that it needs a good thermal compound well applied.

Unfortunately, the quality of the factory thermal paste application varies a lot and in your case it is only sustaining ~110W.
Q. What was running while writing the log file?
A. It was TS Bench running 960M

Q. Are you using full speed fan mode (fn+f1) and using a support to raise the base to improve fresh air entry into the system?
A1. I have the front propped up about 1.5cm. I use the front to not block any of the vents in the rear.
A2. FN + F1 does not doing anything, but I do have Ultra Performance set in Thermal Management in the Power screen.
I fully uninstalled AWCC and Intel XTU based on some warnings they would overwrite my undervolt protection disabled setting.
I used smokeless_UMAF to disable the protection since I am running a BIOS that hid all the fun settings.


Q. Alienware M16 can sustain +165W when at full load on the CPU alone, but for that it needs a good thermal compound well applied.
A. I am seeing some comments over on Reddit, so I was not happy to see my results. Example below with the best stable UV I can do. I used Excel's Filter to focus just on the 100C. I see now that there's up to a 24C difference in P-core temps! Sheesh... :mad:

Edited to add chart and chart methodology.

P-core 0 [°C]P-core 1 [°C]P-core 2 [°C]P-core 3 [°C]P-core 4 [°C]P-core 5 [°C]P-core 6 [°C]P-core 7 [°C]
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Last edited:
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Q. What was running while writing the log file?
A. It was TS Bench running 960M

Q. Are you using full speed fan mode (fn+f1) and using a support to raise the base to improve fresh air entry into the system?
A1. I have the front propped up about 1.5cm. I use the front to not block any of the vents in the rear.
A2. FN + F1 does not doing anything, but I do have Ultra Performance set in Thermal Management in the Power screen.
I fully uninstalled AWCC and Intel XTU based on some warnings they would overwrite my undervolt protection disabled setting.
I used smokeless_UMAF to disable the protection since I am running a BIOS that hid all the fun settings.


Q. Alienware M16 can sustain +165W when at full load on the CPU alone, but for that it needs a good thermal compound well applied.
A. I am seeing some comments over on Reddit, so I was not happy to see my results. Example below with the best stable UV I can do. I used Excel's Filter to focus just on the 100C. I see now that there's up to a 24C difference in P-core temps! Sheesh... :mad:

Edited to add chart and chart methodology.

P-core 0 [°C]P-core 1 [°C]P-core 2 [°C]P-core 3 [°C]P-core 4 [°C]P-core 5 [°C]P-core 6 [°C]P-core 7 [°C]
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M16 with i7-13700HX uses conventional thermal paste and its application is horrible.

At full load there is 1 P-core at 70°C, 4 P-core at 80°C, 1 P-core at 90°C and 2 P-core permanently at 100°C.

A temperature difference is normal, but its gradient shows poor application.

Change the thermal paste to PTM 7950 and you will be able to increase your thermal headroom to +160W.

Without AWCC and in Ultra Performance I don't know if the fans reach 100%.

As for using a support to move the air intake the important thing is to move it away from the back, precisely where the air intake is positioned.
 
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@ dc_IV

Why are you so careful about undervolting? For your CPU: CPU Core -140 mV and CPU P Cache -120 mV, that's pretty much the norm.
 

unclewebb

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The TS Bench has never been tested in Windows 11 or on a 13th Gen CPU. One user showed that the tasks it creates were not being properly scheduled on the P cores. I recommend using Cinebench which should equally load all of the cores.

You probably still have a thermal paste issue but it might not be as bad as your temperature data indicates.
 

dc_IV

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@ dc_IV

Why are you so careful about undervolting? For your CPU: CPU Core -140 mV and CPU P Cache -120 mV, that's pretty much the norm.
Unfortunately my P Cache locks the system upon applying more than -84 mV, and Cinebench locks up at completion when it is -82.1 mV, so I trust -80.1 mV
 

unclewebb

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my P Cache locks the system
Have you tried using the mV Boost feature in the FIVR window? This can help cover up some light load instability which can give you more room to undervolt. Try setting this to 100.

Lowering the AC DC load line can also help fix crashes when going from full load to light load. Your BIOS might not give you access to this setting.
 

dc_IV

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Have you tried using the mV Boost feature in the FIVR window? This can help cover up some light load instability which can give you more room to undervolt. Try setting this to 100.

Lowering the AC DC load line can also help fix crashes when going from full load to light load. Your BIOS might not give you access to this setting.
THANK YOU! Stable at -115.2 mV on both CPU Core and CPU P Cache with 100 mv Boost. Cinebench increased from 1279 to 1293 (~1%) but my baseline is 1174, so still heading in a nice direction on the CPU Multi score. Another log file snippet, showing I think is some correlation to running TS Bench. I haven't looked yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if P-cores 3, 5, and 7 are located near each other, or the paste has a path where there is less near those P-core's die locations.



P-core 0 [°C]P-core 1 [°C]P-core 2 [°C]P-core 3 [°C]P-core 4 [°C]P-core 5 [°C]P-core 6 [°C]P-core 7 [°C]
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Intel doesn't advertise an 'all core boost'
there is no such thing
all core boost is based on workload/thermals/power
its a laptop this behavior is expected and 130W in a laptop is pretty dam fast
130w in a laptop is very good, I tested a Asus g16 with a i9 13980hx earlier this year and that went upto 143w with fans at full throttle, about 130w with normal fans.
 
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130w in a laptop is very good, I tested a Asus g16 with a i9 13980hx earlier this year and that went upto 143w with fans at full throttle, about 130w with normal fans.
On the G16 with the same CPU, I have on the Turbo in the PL1 170 W and on the PL2 175 W.
And the physical power consumption of Cinebench R23 is 170W.
 
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On the G16 with the same CPU, I have on the Turbo in the PL1 170 W and on the PL2 175 W.
And the physical power consumption of Cinebench R23 is 170W.
I got into those territories for a few seconds, goes down to 130-140w range after the heatsink is saturated. Still very good, I will replace my current laptop with that when soon.

On the G16 with the same CPU, I have on the Turbo in the PL1 170 W and on the PL2 175 W.
And the physical power consumption of Cinebench R23 is 170W.
Does throttlestop work on that laptop, if you know?
 
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