Alphacool CORE 1 CPU block - bulging with danger of splitting?

[A Computer Guy]

I am sorry I was not able to measure the thickness of the materiel left under the water channel cut, I bet it is less than half millimeter thick, and it is compromised metal, you are OPENING A CUT, you are creating a desired shape of the base by DEFORMING and STRESSING the metal.

I would like to measure the thickness of the remaining metal somehow...

Perhaps...

Amazon.com

Because I like to draw and getting punchy on a Friday due to the warm weather...

 

[ShrimpBrime]

Perhaps...

Amazon.com

Because I like to draw and getting punchy on a Friday due to the warm weather...

View attachment 346140

That's an awesome drawing!! Professional even!!

I gave guy a formula for mounting pressure. He's thinking the IHS plate warps in the other thread.

This thread the block is bending to the point it splits.

The ink method is showing thousands of an inch at best.

This logical measurement process will likely be ignored as well.

All this on a cheap ass water block.

Why not do some real measurements with a HeatKiller IV or something. Maybe it'll bend, in a 10 ton press .... I dunno.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

Perhaps...

Amazon.com

Because I like to draw and getting punchy on a Friday due to the warm weather...

View attachment 346140

The calipers can do the math for you!

I thought I have no usable material, but I managed to find some thin metal sheet (80 microns)! *** NEVER THROW AWAY ANYTHING ***



The main water channels have between 0,44 and 0,48 mm of metal remaining.

I have problems shoving the sheet in the longitudial cuts, in which I am interested, because there are burrs in the channels, plated over! So far it seems that these cuts are shallower, which would be a good thing, there may be 0,88 mm remaining.

I wonder what is the reason for the teeth bending, you can clearly see 8 rows bent. As I mentioned already, it was like this from the beginning.

 

[FoulOnWhite]

That's an awesome drawing!! Professional even!!

I gave guy a formula for mounting pressure. He's thinking the IHS plate warps in the other thread.

This thread the block is bending to the point it splits.

The ink method is showing thousands of an inch at best.

This logical measurement process will likely be ignored as well.

All this on a cheap ass water block.

Why not do some real measurements with a HeatKiller IV or something. Maybe it'll bend, in a 10 ton press .... I dunno.

I would not call a £90 block cheap ass, there are some cheaper HK ones i reckon. I had both a HK 4 pro, and this block, guess which was better.......The core 1. Not bad for a cheap ass block

 

[BoggledBeagle]

View attachment 345906

Have you noticed that machining boo-boo - circled? What does it tell you?

I must correct myself, I was commenting what I saw in the photo without really checking the block itself, the machining is not that bad, this time the photo and the lighting made it look much worse than it really is.

I just measured it - what appears in the photo to be a huge step between those milling bit tracks is only 0,02 mm high.

 

[Noci]

Did it never come up to you that the Alphacool block performs so good because of it's minimal thickness of the cold plate? Due to the elastic deformation of the soft copper in combination with the right mounting pressure the cold plate actually 'adjusts' itself to the shape of the IHS bulge and that could be the intended effect by the Alphacool engineers as in maximum contact. Minimum thickness gives the best performance (shortest travel distance of heat to the heat transfer medium) and most likely the rubber insert is exactely the thickness it should be to support the cold plate where it needs it. Only design trade off I could see here is a flow reduction, but with the published test results this seems to be neglectible.

English is not my native tonque, but you mentioned compromised metal. I have no idea what you ment with that but, a small bit of plastic deformation (in contradiction of plastic deformation like skiving) does not alter the crystaline structure of the metal and hardly delivers any stress to initiate a crack especially to a metal as copper with its ductile properties. In this case it is a no brainer that we talk about a static situation, not a dynamic one.

I appreciate your curiousity and eagerness in trying to improve a good product, but your assumptions are lacked by any technical substiantation or misinterpretion of physic laws.

Bottom line, if in your case the block doesn't perform up to standard, it is more likely a human error (TIM & mounting) than a design flaw.

I bet the engineers in Alphacool will be jumping up and down and shrieking with joy like apes in the ZOO when they get their bananas, after they find out, that they can improve their product even more...

Once you start realising that you surely owe these guys apologies, as I think this remark is not TPU worthy.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

Did it never come up to you that the Alphacool block performs so good because of it's minimal thickness of the cold plate? Due to the elastic deformation of the soft copper in combination with the right mounting pressure the cold plate actually 'adjusts' itself to the shape of the IHS bulge and that could be the intended effect by the Alphacool engineers as in maximum contact.

I DEMONSTRATED that the block has a poor contact with my CPU, which is bulged out due to the mounting frame, and it has a good contact only when I put a thinner insert in it and make it way flatter. The paste imprints shots are the proof. BTW I produced another set of these shots when I performed the test with a large radiator and they just looked the same as before, so I did not post them.

Once you start realising that you surely owe these guys apologies, as I think this remark is not TPU worthy.

I stand by my statement that the product can be still improved (and that engineers should be striving to improve their products):

1) A version which is flat for people with flat or bulging out CPUs can be made, with less mechanical strain on the base of the block.
2) I am convinced that the water flow inside the block can be improved, including the cuts
3) I have no idea why are the screws so loose in the aluminum top
4) I have no idea why are 8 rows of the teeth inside the block bent

BTW I am sorry if the scene I envisioned when I was thinking about a way to illustrate an extreme joy and excitement does not satisfy you, but I am not a Nobel price winner in literature, you know...

 

[Noci]

I DEMONSTRATED that the block has a poor contact with my CPU, which is bulged out due to the mounting frame, and it has a good contact only when I put a thinner insert in it and make it way flatter. The paste imprints shots are the proof. BTW I produced another set of these shots when I performed the test with a large radiator and they just looked the same as before, so I did not post them.


I stand by my statement that the product can be still improved (and that engineers should be striving to improve their products):

1) A version which is flat for people with flat or bulging out CPUs can be made, with less mechanical strain on the base of the block.
2) I am convinced that the water flow inside the block can be improved, including the cuts
3) I have no idea why are the screws so loose in the aluminum top
4) I have no idea why are 8 rows of the teeth inside the block bent

BTW I am sorry if the scene I envisioned when I was thinking about a way to illustrate an extreme joy and excitement does not satisfy you, but I am not a Nobel price winner in literature, you know...

I’m sorry you see things that way and common sense has no chance of penetrating your mental armor.

In my personal vision you only demonstrated a doubtful and uncontrolled executed test method with some visual indicators. The paste imprints in my opinion are completely useless because there are way too many variables of which you have no control or at least shown that you use reproducible and measured parameters for each test.
Your observations are translated in at least remarkable bold statements, which makes one wonder on the decision-making process inside your mind.
Due to your lack of empathy towards technological processes, physic laws and how things work you have a developed a rather amusing way of looking at things and forming of conclusions. This has not gone unnoticed in this and your ink thread.
Not a bad thing, as we need humor every day, but I (and many with me I suspect) wonder if you will ever see the light .

I would take this opportunity to just warn newbies, in threads like this just read for amusement, don’t believe everything you see on a tech site as truth. It could cost you dearly on hardware failures that can be prevented.

The fact that you are firmly convinced of your opinion being the only right one and your interpretations are some kind of proof, do make me wonder about the remark of another forum member (what I considered a joke) the Dunning-Kruger effect in action may actually be justified.

The only proof you delivered is that you stand out of the mass and have a unique way of things......

 

[ShrimpBrime]

I would not call a £90 block cheap ass, there are some cheaper HK ones i reckon. I had both a HK 4 pro, and this block, guess which was better.......The core 1. Not bad for a cheap ass block

I was being more of a smart ass there. Like saying an HKIV would bend and break as well, deaming it cheap. Shitty. Weak. Bendable and breakable.

Dudes last post has nothing to do with the block bending. He derails his own topic.

Page 1 question 1
Block danger of splitting?
Answer 1 - No.

End of thread. Not sure how hard that is to figure out for this guy.....

 

[Chrispy_]

I found a plastic blister pack for RAM kit and cut an insert from it. It is 0,37 mm thick, the original rubber sheet is 0,64 mm.

The horrible bulge is gone. It seems that the middle of the base has now sufficient support (SUFFICIENT IN COMPARISON TO COMPLETELY REMOVING THE INSERT, as I did before), you can see a tiny amount of bulging still left there. I hope I will be able to build the loop again to compare the performance and paste imprints over the weekend.

View attachment 345261

If you're happy with that, then fine.

You seem to be worried about the structural stiffness of the base which doesn't actually need structural stiffness, it's not a load-bearing part. If this DIY change puts your mind at ease then it was effort well spent.

As for the block being a bomb, your tubing and compression-fitting O-ring seals will fail at an order of magnitude (or two) lower pressure. Unless you're going to make a hardline loop and solder every joint, the block will never be the weakest part of your loop; Not even close.

Reported incidents on the internet of someone exploding their CPU block: 0
Reported incidents of O-rings failing in loops that have overheated and boiled: 0h ho ho, plenty of good reads on OC forums and reddit if you have time to kill....

 

[maxfly]

At the least, OP does a great job of keeping the forum entertained with his engineering catastrophies and conspiracy theories.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

... The paste imprints in my opinion are completely useless ...

People check this way how their cooler/block sits on the CPU, there is really no other commonly available way. So what you said is as far from reality as can be.

I carefully photographed the imprints in similar lighting conditions and everybody can draw their own conclusions from them.

 

[A Computer Guy]

The calipers can do the math for you!

I thought I have no usable material, but I managed to find some thin metal sheet (80 microns)! *** NEVER THROW AWAY ANYTHING ***

View attachment 346205

The main water channels have between 0,44 and 0,48 mm of metal remaining.

I have problems shoving the sheet in the longitudial cuts, in which I am interested, because there are burrs in the channels, plated over! So far it seems that these cuts are shallower, which would be a good thing, there may be 0,88 mm remaining.

I wonder what is the reason for the teeth bending, you can clearly see 8 rows bent. As I mentioned already, it was like this from the beginning.

Nice. It's a comforting thought to know my diagram was effective. Thanks for giving it a try.

 

[thesmokingman]

Stop feeding this delusion.

 

[A Computer Guy]

Stop feeding this delusion.

Maybe I misunderstand your comment but the OP should now realize though practical measurement the metal in a CPU block isn't in danger of splitting or exploding and never was.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

Yeah, I calmed down a bit when I found that it is not as thin as I feared.

 

[thesmokingman]

Maybe I misunderstand your comment but the OP should now realize though practical measurement the metal in a CPU block isn't in danger of splitting or exploding and never was.

Has he? This thread has gone on for four pages man. Shit like this is just made up in his mind, that's high levels of delusion.

 

[A Computer Guy]

Has he? This thread has gone on for four pages man. Shit like this is just made up in his mind, that's high levels of delusion.

All I can say is I can draw no diagram that answers that question.

 

[Noci]

I think I’ll do a final attempt to give some direct answers on your basic questions from my point of view without technical explanations, hoping you will be open to be educated.



Alphacool CORE 1 CPU block - bulging with danger of splitting?

Absolutely not, as already explained for various reasons by numerous forum members with a plethora of knowledge on this subject (unless Elvis is still alive ).



Regarding the thermal paste imprint fetish, this only matters if you experience cooling problems than it could be an influencing factor. If so, 99.9% of the cases it’s due to improper TIM application and mounting pressure or a combination thereof, which is the human factor not a design flaw.

So checking thermal paste imprints just for finding a problem if there isn’t any, seems like a waste of time which you could better use to study the basics of thermal dynamics as well as how and why the pro’s test the way they do it.
Get the helicopter view to understand a cooling system as a whole, instead of zooming in on a small aspect with marginal impact on the heat transfer capacity and efficiency and treating it as a world changing dilemma.

With this you’ll mature your knowledge on the subject and may gain credibility in future posts, instead of posting embarrassing conclusions which will haunt you until the end of days.


If you by experimenting improve one of the best performing cooling blocks, cudo’s and you’re in title to show off the results.
But please, refrain from insulting design engineers, they could most likely do even much better than you but are bound to companies commercial interests and liabilities before finalizing a product for launch.

 

[Assimilator]

do make me wonder about the remark of another forum member (what I considered a joke) the Dunning-Kruger effect in action may actually be justified.

It was not a joke, nor intended as such. I do not suffer fools gladly, as my frequent suspensions from this forum attest to.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

If you by experimenting improve one of the best performing cooling blocks, cudo’s and you’re in title to show off the results.
But please, refrain from insulting design engineers

I never insulted anybody.

Improving products is not my job.

I as an owner of the product am free to inspect the product, express opinions about it a test it how I want.

It would be much better if you stopped discussing my person, but instead offered help and constructive information, for example:

I already mentioned that testing different slots without proper matching water guides is problematic. Can you make such guides and send them to me?

I have difficulty finding plastic sheets of different thickness and cutting them. Can you provide information about what plastic or rubber material is good for this purpose, where to get it and how to cut it?

 

[FoulOnWhite]

I never insulted anybody.

Improving products is not my job.

I as an owner of the product am free to inspect the product, express opinions about it a test it how I want.

It would be much better if you stopped discussing my person, but instead offered help and constructive information, for example:

I already mentioned that testing different slots without proper matching water guides is problematic. Can you make such guides and send them to me?

I have difficulty finding plastic sheets of different thickness and cutting them. Can you provide information about what plastic or rubber material is good for this purpose, where to get it and how to cut it?

When i first got mine, it had the same thick black seal in it, i mentioned it on the forum, and got sent a new one, which is white.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

When i first got mine, it had the same thick black seal in it, i mentioned it on the forum, and got sent a new one, which is white.
View attachment 346325View attachment 346326

That is interesting, and is this insert less thick than the black rubber one?

I asked Alphacool, if they have less thick inserts and got answer:

"I am sorry but we don´t offer any customized products in such low quantity." (Tim L. Alphacool)

Perhaps they stopped offering any extra inserts?

 

[FoulOnWhite]

That is interesting, and is this insert less thick than the black rubber one?

I asked Alphacool, if they have less thick inserts and got answer, that

"I am sorry but we don´t offer any customized products in such low quantity." (Tim L. Alphacool)

Perhaps they stopped offering any extra inserts?

I don't think it was extra, mine was i think a rev 1 and the black rubber seal was not imo very good, it was too stretchy and was not easy to refit after a strip/clean. i think all new core 1 will come with this white/clear seal now.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

That is weird, I got the block with the black insert directly from Alphacool at the end of march, how can I tell what version of the block did I get?

My package looks like this:




I got the mark caused by removed sticker on the box, bubbles under the protection foil on the block, scuffs on the back plate and bent teeth inside the block.

Before I thought I might have gotten a lemon, now it seems I even got an old version of the lemon.