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Apple Launches the Mac Pro

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#1
Apple today announced its new Intel-based line of desktop computers. Called the Mac Pro, Apple's new desktops have been a long wait for many. The new computers are what many consider to be the catalyst that will boost development of Apple x86 software to a whole new level. Many of the world's top designers and artists develop their work on Apple's desktops and with the new technology that's inside these machines, the performance of Apple's desktops will leap to a new level.

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#2
Heh...the Xeon 5100 series is architectually identical to the Core 2s, so them not using Core 2 isn't a big deal since the 5100 series is just as good and allows dual processors.
 
V

v-zero

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#3
Powerful, yes. Beautiful, yes. Monetarily viable, No.

This is the way of Power Mac's, or in this incarnation; "Mac Pro's"
 
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#4
v-zero said:
Powerful, yes. Beautiful, yes. Monetarily viable, No.

This is the way of Power Mac's, or in this incarnation; "Mac Pro's"

Monetarily viablo? why not? os x.. plus included apps makes a great price for a dual proc pc really.. esp considering it also runs windows... :)
 
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#5
Dippyskoodlez said:
Monetarily viablo? why not? os x.. plus included apps makes a great price for a dual proc pc really.. esp considering it also runs windows... :)
Don't be silly, building a PC faster than that for $1500 is not a problem... I do love Mac's though...
 
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#6
v-zero said:
Don't be silly, building a PC faster than that for $1500 is not a problem... I do love Mac's though...

Not with a dual CPU setup you aren't going to. Xeon's arent cheap.

These are WOODCRESTS, not conroes.
 
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#8
quad proc xeons. remember? 2 cores/chip x 2chips.

plus it runs windows.
 
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#9
v-zero said:
No, not with Xeons... But why would I choose Xeons anyway?

Because in order to be "comparable" to a hand built system you need 2 actual CPU's as this is a DUAL CPU computer, not just a dual CORE.

4x CPU's. FBdimms.

This is actually a Damn fine price even for a server.

go apple.

Quality hardware, Fast hardware, GREAT support. :)

Noone in their right mind builds their own server ;)
 
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#11
To directly compare you would have to go with something like a Dell Precision Workstation since the Mac Pro is meant to be a workstation, not a desktop, which is capable of dual Woodcrest Xeons. However, it is still hard to directly compare since the Precisions do not offer any graphics cards that are not Workstation class cards, however when you do configure them to be similar in specs(using the FX4500 because it is the only card both have in common) the Precision is comparable to the Mac Pro in price.
 
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#12
newtekie1 said:
To directly compare you would have to go with something like a Dell Precision Workstation since the Mac Pro is meant to be a workstation, not a desktop, which is capable of dual Woodcrest Xeons. However, it is still hard to directly compare since the Precisions do not offer any graphics cards that are not Workstation class cards, however when you do configure them to be similar in specs(using the FX4500 because it is the only card both have in common) the Precision is comparable to the Mac Pro in price.

"workstation" aside, the dual woodcrest mobo... isnt cheap. Plus add in FBdimms, and CPU cost... PSU...

It'll add up VERY quickly... can't cheap out on PSU with a dual CPU mobo ;)
 

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#13
Dippyskoodlez said:
"workstation" aside, the dual woodcrest mobo... isnt cheap. Plus add in FBdimms, and CPU cost... PSU...

It'll add up VERY quickly... can't cheap out on PSU with a dual CPU mobo ;)

I use a Codegen 450W, they don't come much cheaper. Works flawlessly though. My server runs on a 350 Watt one with 2 2.8's @ 1.2 and 6 hard drives.
 

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#14
Dippyskoodlez said:
"workstation" aside, the dual woodcrest mobo... isnt cheap. Plus add in FBdimms, and CPU cost... PSU...

It'll add up VERY quickly... can't cheap out on PSU with a dual CPU mobo ;)

A dual 771 Tyan board is about $350.
2 2.66GHz Woodcrests go for about $760 a piece so $1520.
1 GB FB-Dimm memory goes for about $100.
You can get a decent PSU that is more then capable for $100.
Throw in a Dual Layer burner $40.
A 250GB SATA Hard Drive $70.
A 7300 $55.
A case $50-100(depending on your tastes).

Add that all up and you get $2285 w/o an OS. The biggest thing is the CPU cost, the Woodcrests are expensive. So it would be cheaper to build it yourself, but only slightly and you still have to take into consideration warranties and all that stuff. So even building it yourself the price is comparable.

The Mac Pro isn't a great deal by any means, but it isn't a rip off either.
 
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#15
newtekie1 said:
A dual 771 Tyan board is about $350.
2 2.66GHz Woodcrests go for about $760 a piece so $1520.
1 GB FB-Dimm memory goes for about $100.
You can get a decent PSU that is more then capable for $100.
Throw in a Dual Layer burner $40.
A 250GB SATA Hard Drive $70.
A 7300 $55.
A case $50-100(depending on your tastes).

Add that all up and you get $2285 w/o an OS. The biggest thing is the CPU cost, the Woodcrests are expensive. So it would be cheaper to build it yourself, but only slightly and you still have to take into consideration warranties and all that stuff. So even building it yourself the price is comparable.

The Mac Pro isn't a great deal by any means, but it isn't a rip off either.
But don't care to mention OS X at ~$200 value, Ilife06 @ ~$60..


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820146584
$147 for the cheapest newegg has...

Your prices are just a bit conservative... Then you can factor in warranty, beautiful steel case, and OS... Its quite a good deal! Anyone that has run OS X as a server.... knows just how nice it is..

And last I checked, a lot of dual CPU mobos arent... ATX... $350 is the lowest end tyan mobo...
 

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#16
Dippyskoodlez said:
But don't care to mention OS X at ~$200 value, Ilife06 @ ~$60..
Actually OSX is only $129...and it comes with Ilife. It moves the price slightly closer, but certainly doesn't make it "a great value".

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820134084
$104 actually.

Your prices are just a bit conservative... Then you can factor in warranty, beautiful steel case, and OS... Its quite a good deal! Anyone that has run OS X as a server.... knows just how nice it is..

And last I checked, a lot of dual CPU mobos arent... ATX... $350 is the lowest end tyan mobo...
All the individual parts will almost certainly have warranties. You can find most of them with at least 3 year warranties(the max Apple offers the last I checked) and some wil even have lifetime warranties. Overall you would probably get better warranty protection if you build yourself over buying from Apple. Remember you have to pay an extra $250 to get even a 3 year warranty with Apple, the standard is only 1 year, so add that into the already high $2500 price tag.

The case is a matter of taste, I think it looks like complete crap. Though I don't really care much about looks as long as it isn't too ugly. As long as it works. Extended ATX cases are not that expensive, you can find them for $50-75.

The low end Tyan board is more then capable of doing everything that the Mac Pro is capable of, so what does it matter if it is the low end board...do you really think Apple puts anything better then what came from the lowest bidder?
 
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#17
have you used a mac before?
 

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#18
randomperson21 said:
have you used a mac before?
Yes I have, in fact I own a one, but what does that have to do with hardware prices and the Mac Pro being a good deal or not?

If you try to say "well any Mac user would know that the extra premium is because Macs <insert moronic stereotype here>" don't.
 
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#19
macs are macs. and if i have to pay a bit of a premium to get a mac, i'm going to.

and i'm too tired to form this into a coherent argument.
 
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#20
randomperson21 said:
macs are macs. and if i have to pay a bit of a premium to get a mac, i'm going to.

and i'm too tired to form this into a coherent argument.

Indeed.

You pay for the experience.
You pay for the reliability.
You pay for the OS.
You pay for the DESIGN.

Macs are a work of art- if you're happy with a dell, by all means go buy the crappy dell that'll fall apart in a few months.

Very few people truely appreciate how DURABLE, RELIABLE and just plain well designed macs are.

The case looks nice, it performs well, and the prices are now very competative with dell.
 

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#21
The ignorance in that statement is insane.

Macs are not any more reliable then Dells or any other PC. The reliability of the computer mustly comes down to how it is treated by the user. The actual computers will last just as long in the hands of the same user. I have laptops that are over 5 years old that still work just like the day I got them(with the exception of the batteries).

Using a Mac isn't an "experience" is isn't any better then using a PC and if you think it is then you need to stop taking the acid before you use your PC.

I am paying for the OS when I buy the cheaper Dell too. And you know what I would take Windows XP over OSX any day because XP allows me to do more then OSX does.

Screw the design, I just want it to work, besides the fact that my current PC looks miles better then the Mac Pro which again looks ugly to me, as do most of the other Macs.

Apples are not any more durable or reliable then a Dell or any other PC(need I bring up the overheat issues on the Macbook/Pros? or how about the discoloring macbooks? Or the swelling batteries?) To try and say that Macs are any more reliable or durable is complete BS, they are not different then a PC in either of those respects, and both of those issues really comes down to how the user treats the machine, NOT how it was made or who made it.

The cases look like shit, they perform the similarly, and they are price similarly. That doesn't make it a good deal by any means.

I can understand how a person on the Mac side can think it is a great deal. How they could be saying "Holy crap, a Mac that isn't grossly overpriced but is instead priced competitively with the rest of the market...This is a great deal!" However, coming from somone that lives in both worlds, Apple finally releasing something that is half way competitively priced, is NOT a great deal. It is a great deal compared to other Apples, but compared to the rest of the competition it is nothing more then another alternative with similar price.
 
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#22
newtekie1 said:
The ignorance in that statement is insane.
Yes, I'm sure you've helped manage a system of over 400 macs for over 4 years and can counterclaim everything I say? :rolleyes:

Macs are not any more reliable then Dells or any other PC. The reliability of the computer mustly comes down to how it is treated by the user. The actual computers will last just as long in the hands of the same user. I have laptops that are over 5 years old that still work just like the day I got them(with the exception of the batteries).
I'm sitting here on a 6 year old powerbook and the battery still holds 90% charge.
I've helped manage a SCHOOL DISTRICT of macs. over 470 actually. we have maybe 2-3 dead ones a year.

After working at Whirlpool helping reinstall all of their pc's, we had 10+ dead compaq's and a few doa brand NEW dell's.

Never a doa mac.

Using a Mac isn't an "experience" is isn't any better then using a PC and if you think it is then you need to stop taking the acid before you use your PC.
Yes, because windows provides the better using experience. Oh how I love the BSOD!
Take a random person on the street, give them a PC to use for a week, then give them a mac to use.

I will bet $20 to anyone they will prefer the mac to any dell. no spyware, no bluescreens, no driver hassles. It just works.

I am paying for the OS when I buy the cheaper Dell too. And you know what I would take Windows XP over OSX any day because XP allows me to do more then OSX does.
Oh yes, windows sure does allow more. What can't a mac do?

Unlike windows, os X has a USEFUL terminal.

Wait.. I can do MORE THAN windows with my.. TERMINAL? no way!

Only an ignorant fool would say you can do more in windows than on a unix based OS.

Screw the design, I just want it to work, besides the fact that my current PC looks miles better then the Mac Pro which again looks ugly to me, as do most of the other Macs.
Macs not only work, but look better than a PC doing it.
Apples are not any more durable or reliable then a Dell or any other PC
Lets see.. This powerbook was dropped down a flight of stairs and still works perfectly aside from the broken hinges that were a result of the fall. and its 6 years old?

Try that with an inspiron. Good luck.

(need I bring up the overheat issues on the Macbook/Pros? or how about the discoloring macbooks? Or the swelling batteries?)
Need I bring up the EXPLODING DELLs?
Batterys seem to be an issue effecting everyone right now. Atleast apple has recalled their stuff.
The "heat issues" with the macbook pro are simply because it is HOT when used.

Aluminum case.. what do you expect? I have run a macbook pro for a few days, and it really isnt THAT bad of a problem if you've used windows laptops...

However, coming from somone that lives in both worlds, Apple finally releasing something that is half way competitively priced, is NOT a great deal.
However, coming from both an Avid and skilled overclocker, and a MAC ADMINISTRATOR, I would think our opinions would atleast be considered against blind anti-mac fanboi-ism.

I have torn apart "dell workstations" and Io have torn apart Dual G5's.

The quality in just EVERYTHING when it comes to hardware is no contest.

Go tear apart a G5 next to a dell optiplex and you will see what I mean. :rolleyes:
 
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#23
Good point about the school district.

I do most of the tech work for my highschool. We have about 200 dell desktops, 150 "struts" (Shit p2/3 systems with 128mb ram), and a lab of 20 macs.

Last year, we had most likely 75 dead struts (and by dead, i mean i cannot revive them by any means possible. Capacitor blow off the mobo? not a problem, just send it in and get a new capacator. when i mean dead, i mean truely, truely, dead.), most likely 40 dells died just like the struts did.

the mac lab????


not a single system.
 
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#24
You also have to think about support. People will say that the warrenty program with apple is horrible but least you talk to an american that you can understand over some buddy from india.
 
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Case Antec P180B
Audio Device(s) Built in. 5.1Ch Logitech Z-5500 500w soundsystem, digital Coax connection
Power Supply Spire 500W
Software Windows Vista Ultimate
#25
agreed. and i personally think that the warantee is pretty damn good. especially if you walk into an apple store with a problem. I had a buddy with an older powerbook g4, dropped it, and fried the hdd. Obviously the notebook was out of warrantee. But the apple guys replaced it for free for him!

now do you see dell doing any of this stuff??????