be quiet! Dark Power PSU Owner Reports Melting of 12VHPWR Connector

[T0@st]

A member of the amusingly named and low populated r/4090Burning subreddit has reported a strange incident where the PSU side of his 12VHPWR connector had melted. Shiftyeyes67k shared his equipment's plight two days ago and included two photos with his story: "Started noticing a smell coming from my PSU (be quiet! Dark Power 13 1000 W) recently that smelled like burnt plastic. Decided to swap it out and noticed that the 12VHPWR cable was burned...From everything I've read this generally happens to the connector on the GPU side so I'm wondering if anyone has seen this yet?" His feedback shows that the relatively new connection standard has ongoing reliability issues, even though most 16-pin connector problem cases have affected beastly GPUs such as NVIDIA's GeForce RTX 4090.

The be quiet! Dark Power 13 1000 W PSU has native support for the 16-pin cable standard, and no type of adapter was used in Shiftyeyes67k's example. Tom's Hardware reported on this sole incident recently, and a be quiet! representative responded to the article's content (updated today): "This is a unique case and we already have reached out to the customer to learn more." The company statement continues: "As our brand is known for highest quality standards, we treat this seriously and have initiated an investigation." be quiet! recommends that any customers experiencing similar issues should contact their support team directly. Tom's Hardware has attempted to get a comment from NVIDIA about the latest problem, but "an Nvidia spokesperson said we may not hear back for a few days due to a company closure."




The article's author, Aaron Klotz, signs off with this reckoning: "This issue couldn't have come at a worse time with more RTX 4090 16-pin connector melting reports still coming in. NVIDIA claims that all of the 16-pin issues are related to user error, with the connector not being seated properly. But it's hard to believe that all of the errors were due to user error since some of these latest reports come from people who claim to be veteran system builders. Hopefully, this power supply issue with the 16-pin power connector does not extend to more users. But if it does, this could become an even more serious problem for the graphics card and power supply industries."

View at TechPowerUp Main Site | Source

 

[john_]

Well, we know one thing for sure.

It's NOT Nvidia's mistake.

User error, be quiet! error, NOT Nvidia design error. NOT PCIe connector design error.

Hope they found an excuse, even a ridiculous one, to replace this connector before the next series of cards get announced.

 

[sephiroth117]

I think we can see that the whole upper layer melted so may be a bad connection, on the second picture we can see the cable being curved btw, as if it was pulled..and pulled exactly where it melted.

Latest reports come from people who claim to be veteran system builders

Previously, the older 8 pins PCI cables had a big margin for errors, so it means nothing to be a "veteran" it's a new standards, everyone has the same experience with it....

The 12 vhpwr cable has a design that forbids any tension or badly unplugged cable, should have been better designed, but nothing proves that those cables "just melt" and that they were perfectly plugged in when it happens, back up your claims...

The only thing that has been proven and reproduced by third parties like GamerNexus, is the badly plugged cable for now.

I'm against this botched standards but people need to stop believing they are experts and did no mistakes, as small as it was, there are more than 100-200K 4090 alone sold.

Best thing to do is design a 12vhpwr V2 which latches on far better, maybe a dual latch design

 

[CosmicWanderer]

Can we just be done with this damned connector?

 

[P4-630]

I hope this connector will turn out as an engineering mistake...
Just make GPU's with 6-8 PIN connectors how it always was, since this is always working properly...
What ain't broke don't fix it..

 

[Vayra86]

LOL 'Veteran' system builders. I see 'veterans' change their BIOS and brick their card, I see 'veterans' disable essential Windows services and then wonder why shit doesn't work as planned, I see them disable page files for no apparent reason.

Give me a break

Connectors need to be foolproof.

 

[ZoneDymo]

and the saga continues

 

[kawice]

Sure the connector has poor design, but rather reddit rants are not really a good source of information.

Might be bequiet issue, might not. In general when connector is correctly seated this should not happen.

Gamers Nexus tried to fry a bunch to these connectors and they have some good conclusions about that.

I'm sure bequiet sold 1000s of these power supplies and we see like 1 report that something's wrong.

 

[damric]

That's hot

 

[R-T-B]

A member of the amusingly named and low populated r/4090Burning subreddit

Tells the whole story really.

 

[mechtech]

Make connectors out of metal so they don’t melt.

 

[Dammeron]

"(...)it's hard to believe that all of the errors were due to user error since some of these latest reports come from people who claim to be veteran system builders."

I consider myself a veteran if it's about PC hardware and even then there are mistakes to be made (eg. once I wrongly assembled the CPU waterblock in a way that I pinched the oring between the base and top of the block, so the whole thing was not sealed properly - during startup I flooded the whole motherboard and directly the CPU and it's socket! Fortunately, managed to rescue everything and then it worked fine for years).

People are considered veterans because they made such mistakes in their life and gained experience from it. The worst thing here is to wash hands and say "hey, it's not my fault, I'm too good for this". Show me a photo of the plug's side and then we'll see wether it was a user error or not.

 

[Haziza]

User error once again!

 

[P4-630]

Whatever how it happened exactly, is there any evidence of melting with 8-6 PIN issues?

 

[AGlezB]

You can blame users all you wan't but having a power connection that fails if you bend the cable or the connector is 0.5mm out is just bad design. This is Micro-B all over again but with the saving grace that you cannot insert the connector inverted.

They need to remeber that 99.999999% of the people using their products are not engineers and are most likely installing their very expensive GPUs by watching in their smartphones a Youtube video tutorial that was likely created by another person that isn't that experienced or just had to cut important points out of the video to satisfy The Algorithm (tm). That becomes a catch 22 because you either don't need a tutorial or won't be able to tell if the one you're watching is any good since you can't even see the dislikes anymore.

My guess is the connector is here to stay and we'll have to wait years if not decades until something better becomes widely available. Or maybe what's needed is not a different connector but a more reliable locking system for this one; one that even completely inexperienced users can operate without risk.

 

[chrcoluk]

Just roll things back , we dont need nonsensical 600w cables.

 

[evernessince]

Gamers Nexus very clearly pointed out that this issue is the result of both user error AND a poorly designed connector. None of these instances would have happened if the connector was properly designed in the first place. In addition to the poor locking mechanism, the pin design is terrible wherein they separate when applying any horizontal force, thus increasing the likelihood of issues occurring.

It should be noted that the chance of burnt up connectors will only increase as the cards age. Those pins and the connection terminals will wear over time.

Whatever how it happened exactly, is there any evidence of melting with 8-6 PIN issues?

I've seen two reports of it happening in total. In both cases though it was some completely ridiculous situation where the user have a single cable plugged into three PCIe 8 pins while OCing their GPU. DerBauer has pointed out that he's pulled more than double the 8-pin's rated wattage for extended periods of time without issues. That's the difference between the old connectors and the new one, the safety tolerances are vastly greater to the point where you get one melted connector every 10 years or so vs this new connector that gets anywhere from dozens to hundreds a year (and that's not even considering this new connector hasn't saturated the market yet, number of failures will only increase as it does).

This definitely isn't the first melted connector since GN's video on the subject and won't be the last.

 

[STSMiner]

Maybe it's time these manufactures was told to get up to speed and use the correct female pins in their connectors (the cable).

You can clearly see that the female pins used in the OP's post are the wrong type to use here.

OP's connector - female pins with dimples, 12v burnt pins will have these dimples as well.

Intel Readies ATX 12VHPWR Connector Revision to Address Improper-Contact Fire Hazards

Intel is preparing a revision to the design of the 12+4 pin ATX 12VHPWR power connector, specifically its male connector, to improve connector mating and retention; and to minimize a potential fire hazard asiring from improper retention or mating. The male connector design revision will retain...

www.techpowerup.com

(Note to Techpowerup editor - you need to proof read this article and correct it, male / female in wrong places.)

Intel recommends "4 Spring" 12VHPWR power plug instead "3 Dimple" design - VideoCardz.com

Intel wants everyone to use a 4 Spring design of 12VHPWR connector The company has recommendations for the high-wattage power cable for graphics cards. 12VHPWR power cable recommendation by Intel, Source: Intel With the introduction of the GeForce RTX 40 series, one topic took the headlines for...

videocardz.com

 

[remunramu]

I have a 4070ti that I put super glue on the power connector. Sure its not as hot as 600w 4090 but the sudden connector power melting drama got me scared that time.

 

[Chaitanya]

With nGreedia its always user errors esp since the whole fire hazard never went away and their GPUs continue to cause melting power connectors.

 

[STSMiner]

With nGreedia its always user errors esp since the whole fire hazard never went away and their GPUs continue to cause melting power connectors.

Technically it's not Nvidia's fault here, it's the 3rd parties that are not following the specs and using the wrong female pins in the connector.

 

[DrCR]

This is an example of why I’ve never liked modular PSUs. The connector is the real issue, of course.

 

[STSMiner]

This is an example of why I’ve never liked modular PSUs. The connector is the real issue, of course.

Modular PSU's are fine for the most part as long as manufactures comply with the specs and use the correct male / female pins for them and users don't abuse them by trying to draw more power over the connectors / cables than what they can handle.
These female pins with dimples are clearly the wrong ones to use to power these high powered GPU's.

 

[Dave65]

Well, we know one thing for sure.

It's NOT Nvidia's mistake.

User error, be quiet! error, NOT Nvidia design error. NOT PCIe connector design error.

Hope they found an excuse, even a ridiculous one, to replace this connector before the next series of cards get announced.

Nvidia problem since it is their design.

 

[STSMiner]

Nvidia problem since it is their design.

Incorrect !

It's a combo of the PCI SIG consortium, it includes Nvidia and a bunch of other companies that form / agree these specs, Intel being the major one within this group.

Welcome to PCI-SIG | PCI-SIG

pcisig.com

Just to clear that confusion up with the ATX 12VHPWR (12 / 12+4) power connector .....