Does the GPU start/stop function really wear out the fans?

[Scarly]

I understand that there is some wear and tear, but is it significant enough to pay attention to? Some people say it's really bad, others think it's nothing. I want to hear people's opinions here, because I think your opinion may be more competent. Because with my resolution, monitor hertz and GPU model, my temperatures are often near the start/stop threshold.

Example: one of the lightest games where I notice this is Dark Souls Remastered. Let's say I start the game at 44 degrees GPU, after a while it reaches 55-56 and the fans turn on for about 30 seconds and the temperature drops to ~40. After a while, say 5 minutes, the situation repeats. Should I manually lock the fans for games or leave this function enabled? In terms of wearing it out.

For the heaviest games, such as Cyberpunk 2077 or RDR 2, I manually set the fans and they spin at minimum speed for the entire gaming session (it helps with peak temps and noise). But what to do with lighter games, such as Dark Souls? Thanks.

 

[PierreJG]

People will have different opinions. I had a GTX 1070TI that ran for years with start/stop and had no issues. My mother is using the RX550 that I bought back in 2017. Believe it or not, she has a start-stop function which just doesn't really make sense but anyway and she's running fine. Not even coil whine. I can't comment on new parts though. Personally, I prefer a little spin on my fans myself. Surprisingly I have an RX470 Sapphire Platinum blower-style GPU that for some reason is very quiet in games.

 

[TheinsanegamerN]

IMO its a total nothingburger. It's a DC fan, what matters is total runtime, not start/stop cycles. "starting" it doesnt really wear it out, unless it uses cheap arse bearing in which case you're screwed no matter what.

 

[chrcoluk]

I expect no, by design they stop. I ran my 3080 with it off at idle, and no issues with it.

It will reduce dust on the card and such by letting them stop at idle. I also agree with the insane it might even increase lifespan as the motor is running less.

Usually now (at least on Nvidia) the default curve will prevent flip flopping if your idle temp happens to be close to the threshold, but if it doesnt then make a custom curve so you dont get flapping with the run state.

 

[Scarly]

I expect no, by design they stop. I ran my 3080 with it off at idle, and no issues with it.

It will reduce dust on the card and such by letting them stop at idle. I also agree with the insane it might even increase lifespan as the motor is running less.

Usually now (at least on Nvidia) the default curve will prevent flip flopping if your idle temp happens to be close to the threshold, but if it doesnt then make a custom curve so you dont get flapping with the run state.

I'm fine with them being stopped when idle, that's a great feature. But if they start/stop every 5 minutes in games?

 

[redeye]

I'm fine with them being stopped when idle, that's a great feature. But if they start/stop every 5 minutes in games?

the fans don’t do that in games in my experience. they only stop when idling on the desktop. in games, enough power is drawn that they will spin up. and won’t spin down (but spin slowly,because the temperature of the gpu Heatsink is high enough to deactivate the spin stop.

 

[Assimilator]

I understand that there is some wear and tear, but is it significant enough to pay attention to?

It's going to be more irritating for you, than it is going to be bad for the fans.

Because with my resolution, monitor hertz and GPU model, my temperatures are often near the start/stop threshold.

Example: one of the lightest games where I notice this is Dark Souls Remastered. Let's say I start the game at 44 degrees GPU, after a while it reaches 55-56 and the fans turn on for about 30 seconds and the temperature drops to ~40. After a while, say 5 minutes, the situation repeats. Should I manually lock the fans for games or leave this function enabled? In terms of wearing it out.

For the heaviest games, such as Cyberpunk 2077 or RDR 2, I manually set the fans and they spin at minimum speed for the entire gaming session (it helps with peak temps and noise). But what to do with lighter games, such as Dark Souls? Thanks.

Yeah, I'd just set the fans to come on for all games, it's likely to be less annoying. 55° does seem pretty low though, 60 - 65 is more normal in my experience.

 

[Bill_Bright]

My bold underline added,

I understand that there is some wear and tear, but is it significant enough to pay attention to? Some people say it's really bad, others think it's nothing.

Who say it is really bad? Got a link?

Are they credible or just some anonymous posters in a forum?

It always amazes me how some people - typically with zero professional education or training on the topic - claim to be smarter and more knowledgeable than the true professional designers and developers who have decades genuine experience and entire libraries of empirical data to draw from.

Upon further investigation, it is often revealed their claim is based on some rare extreme, anecdotal exception to the norm - heard possibly through a friend's second-cousin's brother-in-law. "A meteor fell on my friend's cousin's head therefore it is not safe to go outside!"

First, let's look a bit at some common sense. If a fan motor is NOT spinning, are the bearings exposed to fiction, wear, and heat? Nope.

Second, these cooling system fans are designed to cycle on and off. What else does that? Oh, just your car radiator fans, refrigerator fans, furnace fans, AC fans (inside and out), big screen TV fans, space heater fans, and 100s more.

Third, in the case of computer device cooling fans, these are low voltage DC (12VDC max) fans that draw very little current. If the argument is excessive strain while starting, there just isn't that sort of strain. It should also be noted these are relatively "low-speed" fans. Even if spinning at 3000RPM (which is fast - not to mention VERY LOUD - for a computer fan), that is not a "high-speed" fan compared to other cooling fans in many other devices which may spin at 10,000 RPM or even faster.

But if they start/stop every 5 minutes in games?

If they stop/start every 5 minutes - AND the load/demand is staying relatively constant - that would suggest something else is wrong and I first would look at case cooling. Is the interior clean of heat trapping dust? Is there good cable management? Has the user set up case cooling to provide an adequate flow of cool air through the case?

 

[Scarly]

It's going to be more irritating for you, than it is going to be bad for the fans.


Yeah, I'd just set the fans to come on for all games, it's likely to be less annoying. 55° does seem pretty low though, 60 - 65 is more normal in my experience.

Yeah 55 is low temp, but it won't go above in light games after the fans turn on. In heavy games temps are around ~62.

 

[Scarly]

My bold underline added,

Who say it is really bad? Got a link?

Are they credible or just some anonymous posters in a forum?

It always amazes me how some people - typically with zero professional education or training on the topic - claim to be smarter and more knowledgeable than the true professional designers and developers who have decades genuine experience and entire libraries of empirical data to draw from.

Upon further investigation, it is often revealed their claim is based on some rare extreme, anecdotal exception to the norm - heard possibly through a friend's second-cousin's brother-in-law. "A meteor fell on my friend's cousin's head therefore it is not safe to go outside!"

First, let's look a bit at some common sense. If a fan motor is NOT spinning, are the bearings exposed to fiction, wear, and heat? Nope.

Second, these cooling system fans are designed to cycle on and off. What else does that? Oh, just your car radiator fans, refrigerator fans, furnace fans, AC fans (inside and out), big screen TV fans, space heater fans, and 100s more.

Third, in the case of computer device cooling fans, these are low voltage DC (12VDC max) fans that draw very little current. If the argument is excessive strain while starting, there just isn't that sort of strain. It should also be noted these are relatively "low-speed" fans. Even if spinning at 3000RPM (which is fast - not to mention VERY LOUD - for a computer fan), that is not a "high-speed" fan compared to other cooling fans in many other devices which may spin at 10,000 RPM or even faster.


If they stop/start every 5 minutes - AND the load/demand is staying relatively constant - that would suggest something else is wrong and I first would look at case cooling. Is the interior clean of heat trapping dust? Is there good cable management? Has the user set up case cooling to provide an adequate flow of cool air through the case?

Yes, they were talking about the high load when starting the fans. They argue that it is better to have the fans running all the time than to have it start/stop all the time (not idle time), which wears out the fans more and can cause them to fail sooner. It was on Reddit, that's why I decided to contact here.

About why it is happening - I have pretty strong gpu (rtx 4070), while I am playing on 1080p/60hz. So if I played at 1440p, the temperatures and GPU load would be higher, and the fans would spin constantly. And at 1080p, my temperatures are around the start/stop threshold. So everything is fine, it's just that if the games are light enough, like Dark Souls, I encounter this situation.

I don't mind them constantly starting/stopping, and there's no noise either. I just want to know if I should leave it as is or lock the fans to run manually while gaming.

 

[Ferrum Master]

Don't over complicate, just the product without thinking much...

 

[dirtyferret]

I understand that there is some wear and tear, but is it significant enough to pay attention to?

Similar to semi passive cooling on a PSU, it increases the lifespan of the fan. In terms of failure rate the fan would be the number one priority on a video card so why would the board partners want to include a feature that increases that?

 

[Scarly]

Similar to semi passive cooling on a PSU, it increases the lifespan of the fan. In terms of failure rate the fan would be the number one priority on a video card so why would the board partners want to include a feature that increases that?

What you're talking about is more appropriate for idle, when this feature only helps! I'm asking about my specific situation during gaming. I'm not saying that the function ITSELF is bad. On the contrary, I'm happy that it exists, because it significantly reduces the amount of dust.

 

[dirtyferret]

I'm asking about my specific situation DURING gaming.

your temps are on the very cool side so the fans are working as they should but once again what makes you think starting and stopping every five minutes will wear them out as opposed to continuously working during that time?

 

[Bill_Bright]

Yes, they were talking about the high load when starting the fans. They argue that it is better to have the fans running all the time than to have it start/stop all the time (not idle time), which wears out the fans more and can cause them to fail sooner. It was on Reddit, that's why I decided to contact here.

I ask again, who are "they"? Got a link?

50+ years ago, it was true that, for most electronics, there was a general consensus that keeping power applied to electronics 24/7 was better for the longevity of the devices than constantly turning them on and off multiple times every day. The thought was the constant and (more or less) consistent operating temperature of the powered on equipment minimized the expansion/contraction effects on matter as it heated up and cooled - thus minimizing the potential of "fatigue" and microfractures and eventual failure.

But there have been HUGE advances in the technologies since then. In devices where there are HUGE swings (of many 100s or even 1000s of degrees), this may still be an issue. But in low voltage, digital electronics, the effects of such swings in operating temperatures are negligible and insignificant.

 

[Onasi]

The wear on the fans or, to be more specific - the fan bearing, only really occurs when they are actually spinning, hence manufacturers citing expected MTBF based on that. There is nothing to suggest that intermittent work cycle would be more strenuous than running perpetually. In fact, it’s probably actually prolongs the lifespan, as was already mentioned.

 

[dirtyferret]

50+ years ago, it was true that, for most electronics, there was a general consensus that keeping power applied to electronics 24/7 was better for the longevity of the devices than constantly turning them on and off multiple times every day

100% but we are talking about most likely a sleeve bearing fan so

They argue that it is better to have the fans running all the time than to have it start/stop all the time (not idle time), which wears out the fans more and can cause them to fail sooner.

these people have no clue to that they are talking about, they think the fan operates like an older car engine & brakes.

 

[Deleted member 229121]

The wear on the fans or, to be more specific - the fan bearing, only really occurs when they are actually spinning, hence manufacturers citing expected MTBF based on that. There is nothing to suggest that intermittent work cycle would be more strenuous than running perpetually. In fact, it’s probably actually prolongs the lifespan, as was already mentioned.

This. The less the fan is powered on the longer it's theoretical life cycle should be.

100% but we are talking about most likely a sleeve bearing fan so


these people have no clue to that they are talking about, they think the fan operates like an older car engine & brakes.

I was literally just about to say it's a fan, not an alternator lol.

 

[Zach_01]

What you're talking about is more appropriate for idle, when this feature only helps! I'm asking about my specific situation during gaming. I'm not saying that the function ITSELF is bad. On the contrary, I'm happy that it exists, because it significantly reduces the amount of dust.

Just forget about it and enjoy your gpu.

It’s nothing to be concerned about. Start/Stop fan function on GPUs was one the best thoughts ever. Fan gets far less work hours and your GPU cooler stays dust free way way longer.

There are times when GPU load is low and my GPUs fans are starting/stoping every couple of minutes. I never cared about this.
These are fans with very low load, starting at low speed with no high starting current. It’s not like starting a compressor.

As mentioned before there are all kinds of fans everywhere starting and stopping dozens of times every hour all day long that most people are unaware of.

Most like those who claim that frequent start/stop is bad for those fans is clueless about today tech and they stuck 20-30years ago.
Things today are dynamic, adaptive… as it should.

 

[Bill_Bright]

100% but we are talking about most likely a sleeve bearing fan so

Doesn't matter!

While sleeve bearing fans are not typically considered top-tier quality when compared to precision ball, fluid or magnetic bearing fans, there are high-quality sleeve bearing fans too. And my 50+ year comments about HUGE improvements in that time apply to sleeve bearings too. Manufacturing techniques have significantly improved in that time so that the bearings (and channels they run in) are manufactured to much greater (as in tighter) tolerances greatly and significantly reducing friction. Additionally, there have been HUGE advances in the lubricants used in motors to reduce that friction (thus wear) even more.

Bottom line, it doesn't matter. The same issues/variables apply, concerning "on and off" vs "always on", regardless the bearing type.

 

[Shrek]

Wear on start might be significant as the sleeve bearing moves from boundary to hydrodynamic lubrication.

Stribeck curve - Wikipedia

 

[Bill_Bright]

If these fans sat idle for weeks and weeks in the cold, that might be a factor. That is, if the lubricant has time to settle (due to gravity) in the bottom of the bearing channel, then thicken due to the cold, that might be a factor. But then it would be a once in several weeks factor, so hardly a factor at all.

Computer fans tend to sit in environments where we humans are comfortable, and spin up, at least for a second or two, whenever the computer boots or comes out of sleep mode. Plus, the designers know these fans are low voltage, low current devices so they are not going to use super thick, axel grease as a lubricant. Nor are these fans typically going to be exposed to very high temperatures as might be found in wheel bearings and u-joints. That is, they won't be used in temps where the lubricants essentially melt and become so thin as to be ineffective until the spinning motor redistributes it again.

Yes, technically, at least in theory, the Stribeck curve is a factor. But I suspect it is so tiny, it is tucked into the margin of error for the manufacturing tolerances (deviation from published specs) of the various parts making up the motors.

 

[lilhasselhoffer]

So...there's a lot of crazy above...and after reading into it a little I'm 100% I don't give any concern to most of it.

Let's look at this anecdotally, then realistically. The anecdote is simple...why does something like a window box fan go from Off-High-Med-Low on its settings? Well, it's because the initial kick-off to get a motor spinning takes a lot of power. If you start on high the fan spins, then you decrease speed so that none of the component experience undue wear. Note, undue...not no wear.

You've then got a competing source of wear beyond transferring power, and that's friction. The thing is, groups like FAG have had that in-check for decades. Seriously, they have idiot resistant calculators that tell you what you need to buy for everything from hostile environment to no maintenance. FAG bearing calculator


The thing is that most of your bearings are going to spin millions of times before they die...and much more than that if you have a decently specified setup. The amount of times a motor can be started might range in the thousands to hundreds of thousands...if they're buying cheap. Note then that at about 4 hours usage a day, start-stopping 4 times an hour, 16*5*52= 4160 start-stops a year...and with the average GPU lasting at most about 5 years 20,000/100,000 start-stops is basically a bad mathematical joke about an increased failure rate....even as the bearings themselves spinning constantly have an order of magnitude longer lives.




So....keep calm. The math works out to you burning the fan faster...but unless you're buying a GPU for being constantly on, cycled constantly, and lasting a decade it's probably one of those things you'll never deal with until somebody has a bad batch of fans that is outside regular performance.

 

[Rafael.luc]

Fan stop is to reduce dust. I believe that in most cases a Fan will be damaged because the oil/fluid has degraded, regardless of whether the Fan is activated.

 

[Zach_01]

...why does something like a window box fan go from Off-High-Med-Low on its settings? Well, it's because the initial kick-off to get a motor spinning takes a lot of power.

I guess that is why a computer fan starts at high speed and then drops speed...

Have you ever had a manual (I mean turning a knob) fan speed controller with a simple resistor?
The fan can start at its bear minimum operating speed without sweating