Have AIOs killed custom loops?

[Assimilator]

I recently purchased an Arctic Liquid Freezer II 420, which cost under £90. I then bought a Threadripper system and, since the LF2 doesn't supper TR (due to its block's coldplate being tiny, which is probably one of the reasons why these coolers are so cheap), had to buy a replacement AIO - the Silverstone ICEGEM 360, which cost £130. The latter has a much larger coldplate but a far smaller rad (360mm @ 30mm thick vs 420mm/40mm for the LF2). This peeved me quite a bit because what I really want is the LF2's radiator, but with the ICEGEM's coldplate. This then led me down the line of considering building my own watercooling loop, which is something I dabbled in once a looong time ago before AIOs became a thing, and then AIOs became a thing and I never really touched custom again because AIOs were Good Enough.

The problem is, watercooling components are really freaking expensive. For example, just the block is £65; the cheapest pump + res combo is £130 and cheapest 420x30mm rad is £80. That's 275 quid before the ancillary-but-necessary bits like tubing and fans - more than I paid for two fully-functional AIOs! Now I know that I can get parts much cheaper - Alphacool seems to be more sanely priced, and Barrow and Bykski are the bargain-basement AliExpress options - but you're still not looking at anything I'd consider "decent value", even considering these parts can be reused across multiple builds over multiple years.

This then got me to wondering, what is the experience of others who have either used, or are using custom watercooling setups. Have you also migrated to AIOs? Have you experienced customer cooling components' prices increasing or decreasing over time? Do you think the custom loop is a dying hobby/art?

And no, I'm not making a poll because I'm not interested in bland yes/no answers - I'm looking for others' experiences. So walls of text away!

 

[AusWolf]

I think custom loops have always been a niche market for extreme overclockers. There has never been any need for a custom loop in a regular home PC, ever.

With that said, pre-builders and PC shops are offering top grade gaming setups with custom loops, which makes them slightly more accessible for the random Joe (not that he needs one, but still).

 

[gurusmi]

You could also use Alphacool parts. They have their AIO's also as single parts. They mostly arrange their lineup to build a AIO. Then it doresn't cost that much you researched. The AIO Pump inkl Reservoir and CPU cooler is around 60€. Choose a desired Radiator from their program and you are fine.

I think custom loops have always been a niche market for extreme overclockers.

At power workstations and servers there are also a water cooling system systems in place. But there different reasons are the base.

 

[Morgoth]

no AIO would be a solution for my gpu liquid cooling methode.. case to small. needs costum water cooling.. to make it fit...

and for the *random Joe* with a AIO he be in a suprise once his pump dies... or gets a leak...

 

[wolar]

I agree, they are too expensive. I always wanted to build my own loop but i can't justify the price to real world benefit, so i won't do it.

 

[Kapone33]

Water cooling is a mixed bag. Where I live if you want to buy from a retailer Corsair is the only real option. Alphacool is still relatively inexpensive but EK are drinking the same koolaid as some of the others. Of course now that that stupid Asetek patent is over we are finally starting to see innovation in the AIO space again. To the OP if you want to handle Threadripper, Noctua could be your friend. When I had X399 the Noctua DH15 was just as good and in some ways better then any AIO.

 

[AusWolf]

I agree, they are too expensive. I always wanted to build my own loop but i can't justify the price to real world benefit, so i won't do it.

This, and the hassle of trying to fit the pipes properly have been the biggest turnoffs for me, not to mention a custom loop has way more chance of leaking than an AIO. Oh, and the maintenance nightmare.

So no, thanks.

 

[GerKNG]

it's a luxury item. Not a useful investment.
if you have money left over AFTER you bought the fastest possible components... sure. spend money on a fancy cases, motherboards, RGB, Custom Loops, expensive SSDs.

 

[dj-electric]

From a consumer perspective:
I'm not entirely sure how many people who buy AIOs today would have other otherwise buy and assemble custom WC. To me, AIOs occupy a large amount of the market that belongs to high end premium air coolers, but for those who like a more publicly acceptable clean build aesthetics.

If you ask about it technically:
As long as desktop chips are becoming more and more thermally dense, I feel like the effectiveness of any cooling beyond high end air cooling significantly lowers its value, since most of the thermal bottle neck today is between the dies and the IHS, and then from the IHS to the bottom of coolers.

A lot of today's cooling effectiveness is measured by how much wattage they can let the CPU consume while running at a throttle point.

I am an air cooling user, despite currently having a 13900K in my system that will throttle on particularly heavy continuous loads. The very little extra i can get by moving to any other cooling solution is just not worth my time and effort. I have had custom cooling solutions since Thermaltake's kits existed in 07' and the landscape has definitely changed in this regard.

The world of custom WC becoming more expensive on one end is just the nature of today's economy - but I will have to mention that in some aspects it is still fairly approachable if one is willing to do research and go with some other gear vendors, such as bykski, Borrow, which do offer decent quality equipment. EK's European design and manufacturing is something people pay for.

 

[BoggledBeagle]

... I then bought a Threadripper system and ... had to buy a replacement AIO - the Silverstone ICEGEM 360 ...

Well and how does this AIO perform, what temps at what power draw are you getting?

BTW if you got a say 3°C drop in water temperature from the radiator on this AIO, would that mean that if you replaced it with radiator with double effective area, you could get only up to 6°C drop?

Is not the benefit of custom loop in comparison with AIO just single digit °C improvement in CPU temp?

IMO a real benefit of custom loop is its variability and an option to cool GPUs as well.

If you want to cool jut the CPU alone ... .. .

 

[Assimilator]

They have their AIO's also as single parts. They mostly arrange their lineup to build a AIO. Then it doresn't cost that much you researched. The AIO Pump inkl Reservoir and CPU cooler is around 60€. Choose a desired Radiator from their program and you are fine.

Presumably you are talking about their "water cooling internal sets"? If not, can you link to the relevant page?

and for the *random Joe* with a AIO he be in a suprise once his pump dies... or gets a leak...

This doesn't happen.

To the OP if you want to handle Threadripper, Noctua could be your friend. When I had X399 the Noctua DH15 was just as good and in some ways better then any AIO.

I don't want to use air coolers. Not because of any rational factor, it's simply a personal preference.

Well and how does this AIO perform, what temps at what power draw are you getting?

BTW if you got a say 3°C drop in water temperature from the radiator on this AIO, would that mean that if you replaced it with radiator with double effective area, you could get only up to 6°C drop?

Is not the benefit of custom loop in comparison with AIO just single digit °C improvement in CPU temp?

IMO a real benefit of custom loop is its variability and an option to cool GPUs as well.

If you want to cool jut the CPU alone ... .. .

I'm not disappointed with the ICEGEM 360 in any way shape or form, it's merely that I had the thought chain "hey I wish I could combine the best part of the Arctic AIO with the best part of the Silverstone one, oh wait I could if I were using a custom loop, hmmm let me see what a custom loop that's basically the combination of these two AIOs would cost, HOLY CRAP that's expensive" and then I created a forum thread off that.

 

[Vario]

This doesn't happen.

Happened to me 2x. One leak and one pump fail, respectively.

 

[masterdeejay]

Building custom is fun. And there is a lot of cheaper used parts. Easy to repair, and upgradable. Some CPU can only be cooled with custom loop. (500w+ TDP)
AIO can be very bad quality. I have picked up a few AIO from trash, dead pump, dead fan control, disgusting mess in the block...(few Corsair H series, Akasa) AIO can die because by default you don't need/cant maintenance it (5y+). Some of them are maintanaceable. (changing the fluid, cleaning the block) I don't remember any leaks from AIO.

 

[gurusmi]

Presumably you are talking about their "water cooling internal sets"? If not, can you link to the relevant page?

Pump, Reservoir, CPU Cooler (Highest Price below 85 €):

• Alphacool Eisbaer (Solo) - 2600rpm - Black
• Alphacool Eisbaer LT (Solo) - Black
• Alphacool Eisbaer Aurora (Solo) - Digital RGB
• Alphacool Eisbaer Pro Aurora (Solo) - Digital RGB
• Alphacool Eisbaer Aurora LT Solo - Black
• Alphacool Eisbaer Pro ES (Solo) Full Black

I didn't talk about full sets. When you add an appropriate radiator of any size, the tubes and liquid you are far below 250€.

 

[Vario]

While I have been using aircooling since my H100i died, If I did go watercooling at some point, I'd like to get a giant 1080 radiator such as a Mo-Ra. Might as well go all the way.

 

[AusWolf]

I don't want to use air coolers. Not because of any rational factor, it's simply a personal preference.

I had the exact same opinion until I bought my 7800X3D, which throttled to heck under my be quiet! Silent Loop 2 280 mm at 4.4-ish GHz and 50 W. Now, I'm running it with a Dark Rock 4 which costs a third of that AIO, and lets the CPU run around 10 °C below throttling temp at 4.8 GHz and 80-90 W with even less noise. Some CPUs don't like some cold plates, and there's no rule, especially on AMD's side.

 

[Vya Domus]

Custom loops seem way more popular now than 10-15 years ago, it used to be a very obscure hobby, look how many different products have come to the market in the least few years, it's something that has for sure grown not shrank even as AIOs became popular.

I didn't go custom for performance reasons and I knew it's way more expensive. AIOs can't kill custom loops because there is no real overlap between the consumers who buy them, AIOs are a practical and cost effective solution for people who do not care about anything else, anyone building a custom loop does not care about either of those things, one is a necessity the other is an extravagant hobby.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

I wouldnt slap an 89$ AIO on my 500$ cpu with a board that cost 600$ and a ram set that could cost 300$.

AIO is entry level cooling for liquid.
Hyper 212 is entry level cooling for air.
So forth.
Custom loop is a high end cooling apparatus and should be viewed as such. Of course it's a 65$ wasblock. It's copper weight is as much as the entire AIO system in some cases.

 

[maxfly]

AIO cooling has no bearing on wcing. Folks using wcing know what it entails. Folks using aio use it specifically for its ease of use and relatively low cost.

If a users only concern is cooling the CPU the aio/air route is clearly the cheaper, easier choice. If top notch cooling for both the CPU and GPU are your goal then wcing is the obvious choice. Cost is subjective.

Wcing has never been easier to do or more popular than it is today. With preconfigured loops and how to guides at every diyers fingertips. A noob can have their loop up and running in a day if they know what forums to ask questions at, which YouTuber to follow or which manufacturer to buy from.

 

[Vario]

AIO is also convenient for shipping prebuilt computers.

 

[KedsDead]

I agree that the start up costs of custom loops are expensive. Once you have the parts and you keep the same case, (depends on Rad sizes) you only need to replace the CPU Block and GPU block.

I look at computers as a hobby. So I dont complain that I need to clean the loop from time to time, just like cleaning the Air coolers or AIOs, but if I want to squeeze every ounce of performance out of my PC and have it running whisper quiet, open loop is the way to go.

 

[taka]

Yeah no more search for Aquarium pumps and all like in the old days. AIO killed the fun.

This was my best friend back then.

 

[Kapone33]

Alphacool's Esibaer AIO is not a real AIO in the sense. All they did was take watercooling parts and make an AIO that is completely expandable and exchangeable. It is real Water Cooling. I for myself happen to love the Quick connect tubing as it allows me to change parts on the whim without having to drain my loop. They also have copper on both rad and block. The head has a fill port and it is all G1/4.

 

[dgianstefani]

Not even close. The only "AIOs" to come close to killing custom loops are ones that are basically prebuilt custom loops already.

AIOs will always have weaker pumps, crappier materials and lower cooling performance than true custom loops, less longevity too.

 

[freeagent]

From what I have seen with my hardware is that an AIO is as good as high end air, depending on who made each, because not all AIO and not all air coolers are created equal.