Intel Explains Brand Strategy with Core

[Tatty_Two]

I can't believe they'll sell the top i5 as full blown Nehalem... that'll be just robbing. Sorry ass Intel didn't find any other solutions for the price crisis resulted from the fact that high end i5 will be better then low end i7. At least, give us one socket like lga 775 was so there are simple upgrade solutioins available. get you i7 920 while you can...

Well "better" can be relative, for example, will the P55 chipset or whatever it will finally be called support SLi?, will it only provide 8x PCI-E lanes in crossfire? (probably), with the advent of the next generation of cards from both ATi and NVidia I would guess there would be an even greater performance hit from haveing the reduced lanes, couple that with less instruction sets and dual channel memory as well as the physical chipset limitations on SATA/Lan and we are all left to decide if it will be better....... Mhz is not the only deciding factor even if the high end i5's do stock higher than the lower end i7's.

 

[Darknova]

Also, it seems like you guys are basing the possibility that all 3 processors could be designed for different sockets on this statement: "The actual silicon, socket, or architecture used remains abstract to the marker".

Although it says that, I don't think they will jumble things up badly enough as if to sell 1156 i7s and 1366 i3s and such.

The actual silicon, socket, or architecture used remains abstract to the marker. For example, some higher variants of the "Lynnfield" quad-core processor will use the name Core i7, while the bulk of its mainstream lineup remains in Core i5.

That's exactly what it says. Lynnfield is LGA 1156.

 

[lemonadesoda]

Although it says that, I don't think they will jumble things up badly enough as if to sell 1156 i7s and 1366 i3s and such.

But that is EXACTLY what they said they would do (on their blog and PR statements).

http://blogs.intel.com/technology/2009/06/over_the_last_year_or.php
http://www.intel.com/consumer/brand.htm

Watch the video on the second link to realise that Ms. Conrad, the VP and Director of Corporate Marketing gets "excited" about what her team have come up with... but she refers to "fully loaded" CPU's as the right way of describing the performance server feature set of Xeons and i7. Oh dear.

Very worrying indeed. They've got a marketing softie that doesnt understand the technology and probably hasnt ever heard of things like "different sockets"... who wants to get back to the simple days of consumer naivity that brought us branding concepts like "Intel inside".

Oh dear. Watch her try to cover up her lack of knowledge and understanding with uncomfortable laughing and smiles.

She seems like a nice lady, and probably good "at selling", but she should return to an industry that is more suited to her talents, like luxury consumer goods, cosmetics, shoes and handbags. She comes from the school of "Giorgio Armani" and "Emporio Armani", or "Ralph Lauren" and "POLO SPORT". This technology business seems to be a bit out of her comfort zone.

 

[btarunr]

Core i7 920: LGA-1366 (performance segment)
Core i7 820: LGA-1156 (a speculated example, performance segment)

Can't see what's confusing. Without knowing half of what the lineup naming would look like, we can't take a stand. Trying to decipher things to build a strong contention on something right now, is a farce. Intel made it clear that the purpose of "i3" "i5", and "i7" is not to serve as a brand, or discriptor on what socket/core it is based on. On the other hand, a Core i5 2.66 GHz, performing almost on par with a Core i7 2.66 GHz, would have been confusing to the buyer. Hence they're graded by what they are capable of.

 

[lemonadesoda]

Mix in different feature sets, ie SSE, VT, vPro, xD, etc, different speeds MHz, different cores, 2, 4, 6, different HTT settings, different cache sizes, different QPI settings, multipliers, caps, turbo features, different number of memory channels, ...

All those issues are STILL equally issues with or without the "i(n)" moniker. I dont see how i(n) helps. The information is insufficient to make any decision, you have to delve much much deeper, and cross reference the feature sets of any CPU you are considering.

SO, IMO, they need to rationalise the feature set differentiation, making them consistent across each i(n) product line. Otherwise i(n) cannot be useful to anyone in any way EXCEPT to those whose people whose interest and knowledge levels are so low that they DONT even need i(n) but just "intel inside", "bigger, better, harder, faster".

 

[btarunr]

Mix in different feature sets, ie SSE, VT, vPro, xD, etc, different speeds MHz, different cores, 2, 4, 6, different HTT settings, different cache sizes, different QPI settings, multipliers, caps, turbo features, different number of memory channels, ...

Yes, performance and features will both be taken into account when chalking out models. There's so much room to create new models. With Bloomfield alone, you can disable half the L3 cache, disable HTT, and make new models (what they've already done with the Xeon 2P lineup).

 

[Sihastru]

For years BMW sold cars under the Series N moniker, and it still doing it and they are doing just fine. Can you imagine making your mind between the BMW E8600 6M and the BMW Q9400 6M and the i7 920 8M and still wonder is the Audi 955 6M is better for you? I think the BMW QX9770 12M is the fastest of them, since it has an "X" in the name...

Do you think the average BMW customer confuses the Series 3 with the Series 7? And do you think the average BMW customer actually cares about the extras on it's car, as long as it has leather heated seats, AC, cruise control and tinted windows?

It will be the same for Intel now. The average customer will have a simple (even STAR RATED) system to make a rough assessment about what would be good for them. The average customer doesn't really buy processors, they buy complete systems. And the new rating scheme will help them. I mean, you want something really fast you get the i7 because of the "7" and because it has a 5-star rating.

Until now, if the average customer would want something really fast, he would ask his friends, surf the net, read reviews... and still be undecided between the QX9770 and the i7 975... God forbid there might be a sneaky little X4 955 in there because of the misleading AMD marketing... The average customer doesn't really do that for a very long time. So instead he'll buy an Apple (still an Intel CPU).

If you have an account on a technology forum, as TPU is, then you're not an average customer. You are already tech savvy and for you, Intel is still listing all the other information you require (complete processor number, socket, frequency, number of cores, cache sizes, HT, virtualization capabilities, speedstep, turbo etc.).

So if you know your tech stuff, ignore the iN's and the stars, and buy whatever you know it's good for you. They will still be listed in the product specs. If you don't know anything at least you have an idea where to start. You look at your budget and then you get the best one you can afford.

If it works for car manufacturers it will work for Intel. Especially if you are an average customer.

 

[devguy]

Well, the main differences between s1156 and s1366 are the support for triple channel memory vs dual channel memory, as well as the quickpath speeds supported, right? Then I suppose you could check what memory controller the processor you buy has and buy a corresponding motherboard.

Although that is kinda lame to have to do that. When I heard about the core iX branding, I assumed that i7 would have only a triple channel controller, i5 would only have a dual channel, and i3 would be the "celeron" version of i5.

What'll complicate things further is with the chipset after p55 that expects an onchip graphics solution. Then try and put a 2009 lynnfield in that motherboard and see what happens...

 

[snakeoil]

Welcome to intel's land of confusion

WELCOME TO INTEL'S LAND OF CONFUSION

 

[toastem2004]

and to add even more confusion, according to an intel rep that visited our store here in texas to brief us on i5 and i3 they will also continue to use Pentium and Celeron as well. he would not tell us socket type or any other tech details other than those brand names will continue along side the Core I "x" series

 

[MilkyWay]

n one would buy a i7 and try stick it in a i5 board

the pins for one are different
secondly there are cpu compatibility lists for NooBs
third anyone would know to see the socket type and what mobo they have

This is assuming that all i7 cpu will be on the same socket, and all i5 will be on the other socket

its now like saying you have this i5 and its midrange and this i7 and its highend, retard idea having separate sockets tho

instead of this e8200 and this q6600 and this qx9400 and this one and that one

 

[mastrdrver]

I can't wait for the posts to start turn up "Why does cpu-z say my i7 is a Lynnfield?"

Intel marketing :shadedshu

 

[btarunr]

I can't wait for the posts to start turn up "Why does cpu-z say my i7 is a Lynnfield?"

Intel marketing :shadedshu

Such people would probably know what Lynnfield and Bloomfield are, and tell them by the socket.

 

[$ReaPeR$]

i cannot understand how god damn dificult it is to have just i3 i5 i7 for the three market segments and one god damn socket so as upgrading to be easy. but no they want 4 sockets 6 names and dozens of combinations in order to sell more. because if you need an upgrade than you have to be extra carefull and that is if you know about pc's, if you dont know then you are screwd.

 

[snakeoil]

boycott intel for abusing consumers!

 

[TheMailMan78]

Where is the i0? I mean we cant relese three different classes in the EU. Everything has to be equal and fair.

Oh I know we will take all the performance from the i7s and give it to the i3s and neglict the i5s completely.

 

[toastem2004]

what i can't get is why there needs to be 2 different sockets for "i7". one version of i7 will have triple-channel memory and QPI on 1366 socket. while another i7 will only have dual-channel memory and be on whatever version of FSB intel has, while being socket 1156. then add in the diffrent core types and it quickly becomes absurd.

on a side note, we finally got the intel rep to "suggest" that the pentium line would be core2 arch (dual-core) and celeron would also be core2 arch (dual-core)

 

[btarunr]

boycott intel for abusing consumers!

Stop senseless propaganda.

 

[TheMailMan78]

Stop senseless propaganda.

Isn't all propaganda senseless? Anyway I agree with you.

 

[btarunr]

Isn't all propaganda senseless?

Yes, you're right. *sips liquid drink*

 

[[I.R.A]_FBi]

boycott intel for abusing consumers!

boycott snakeoil for making me buy ... snakeoil ...

 

[mastrdrver]

Such people would probably know what Lynnfield and Bloomfield are, and tell them by the socket.

Maybe I didn't say it right. People will know what i7 and i5 are and associated numbers for different processors. What they won't understand is why their 9xx i7 isn't fitting in their p55 board since it came with a i7 and they wanted to step up to the better processors.

While AMD has done the same thing with the numbers on the Phenoms 2, at least they are all the same socket, other than the 2 exceptions, while also being backward compatible one socket. Intel, on the other hand, has done a collective flipping off of all pc users, by using 2 sockets and mixing names, as they throw the lube over their shoulder and tell us to get ready.

You can say that they need to do the research before they buy, but like nVidia's name game, unless you've been paying attention the whole time, it might be kind of confusing figure out which processor goes with which socket and what socket they already might have, if they have a dell, hp, etc. Most of the problems will come from those who want to upgrade their cpu without having to get a new system. Why spend 500 on a new average system when I can spend 300 on a cpu and get better performance? This is the way a lot of people, who know enough to be dangerous, think whether they know the difference or not.

 

[Wile E]

For years BMW sold cars under the Series N moniker, and it still doing it and they are doing just fine. Can you imagine making your mind between the BMW E8600 6M and the BMW Q9400 6M and the i7 920 8M and still wonder is the Audi 955 6M is better for you? I think the BMW QX9770 12M is the fastest of them, since it has an "X" in the name...

Do you think the average BMW customer confuses the Series 3 with the Series 7? And do you think the average BMW customer actually cares about the extras on it's car, as long as it has leather heated seats, AC, cruise control and tinted windows?

It will be the same for Intel now. The average customer will have a simple (even STAR RATED) system to make a rough assessment about what would be good for them. The average customer doesn't really buy processors, they buy complete systems. And the new rating scheme will help them. I mean, you want something really fast you get the i7 because of the "7" and because it has a 5-star rating.

Until now, if the average customer would want something really fast, he would ask his friends, surf the net, read reviews... and still be undecided between the QX9770 and the i7 975... God forbid there might be a sneaky little X4 955 in there because of the misleading AMD marketing... The average customer doesn't really do that for a very long time. So instead he'll buy an Apple (still an Intel CPU).

If you have an account on a technology forum, as TPU is, then you're not an average customer. You are already tech savvy and for you, Intel is still listing all the other information you require (complete processor number, socket, frequency, number of cores, cache sizes, HT, virtualization capabilities, speedstep, turbo etc.).

So if you know your tech stuff, ignore the iN's and the stars, and buy whatever you know it's good for you. They will still be listed in the product specs. If you don't know anything at least you have an idea where to start. You look at your budget and then you get the best one you can afford.

If it works for car manufacturers it will work for Intel. Especially if you are an average customer.

Yeah, but this naming scheme opens up the possibility of calling a car built on the 3 series platform, a 7 series.

And I still say this is a marketing blunder. No cpu on the 1156 socket should be i7. I think i7 should be for triple-channel and QPI only.

 

[btarunr]

Maybe I didn't say it right. People will know what i7 and i5 are and associated numbers for different processors. What they won't understand is why their 9xx i7 isn't fitting in their p55 board since it came with a i7 and they wanted to step up to the better processors.

They don't know that. Intel never officially said Lynnfield would be confined to i5, Bloomfield to i7, and Arrandale to i3. Now it's clear that the markers only tell you how fast and capable your processor is. Again, wait for a number scheme to surface. A Core i7 Lynnfield will not confuse anyone if it has a different number scheme. On the other hand, if you want something that AMD has done to confuse its buyers, is to release AM2+ and AM3 variants of the Deneb core, with too similar a number scheme. It ends up that you can't use a Phenom II 940 on a DDR3 board, when a 945 can. Isn't that confusing (to the same class of people who get easily confused, like mushrooms, and don't bother doing a 10 minute research before spending hundreds of dollars)?

And I still say this is a marketing blunder. No cpu on the 1156 socket should be i7. I think i7 should be for triple-channel and QPI only.

Do you happen to think that Lynnfield doesn't use QPI as a system interconnect?

 

[jessicafae]

Yeah, but this naming scheme opens up the possibility of calling a car built on the 3 series platform, a 7 series.

And I still say this is a marketing blunder. No cpu on the 1156 socket should be i7. I think i7 should be for triple-channel and QPI only.

I agree. With intel announcing they will pull the i7 920, it really opens the door for the possibility for an i7 93- which is LGA-1156 trying to "run on the coat-tails" of the i7 buzz. Followed by more i7 which are not really i7.

I think this i3/5/7 naming means we are going to see more good products being pulled from the market (like the i7 920) as they release new product and shift the "border" of what is i5 and i7. In a way IF this happens (LGA-1156 i7), it will be worse than nvidia renaming the GTX9800+ to GTS250. At least the GTS250 was trying to breath new life into an older product which is still good.

I do think this i3/5/7 is primarily aimed at the BestBuy family PC buyer, or buying PC for the kids going away for college, the same people who are more likely to have a PS3 or XBox360 for gaming. Average consumer. I am guessing this marketing is trying to get people to ungrade their PC again. Trying to create an Apple-like system for PCs and using the intel i3/5/7 branding to unify this grading across manufacturers (hp, dell, toshiba...). This is why this is being marketed more like a Gucci or BWM and less like a PC.

I think it really comes down to the fact that even a 5 year old PC is good enough for web browsing, email, managing MP3 music, and watching DVDs. The average consumer is not upgrading and has no need to. So for many upgrading the PC is a luxury purchase.