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Intels HEDT Upgrade ?

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I have not been following the latest in terms of hardware release, the recent HEDT offering from intel looks confusing... Im currently using an i7 3930k and would like to upgrade. The prices of the HEDT segment has since increased so much so that the current price from SB-E to the latest seems like a downgrade.

i7 3930k - 40 Pcie Lanes MSRP 500-600
i7 7820x - 28 Pcie Lanes MSRP 500-600
i9 7900x - 44 Pcie Lanes MSRP 999

IO on x299 seems less than previous gens

TLDR :
Do you think going from 3930k -> 7820x is worth it ? I am also aware that AMD is going to release a bunch of new cpus. Do you think intel will counter AMD release for the hedt segment ? Will intel release x399 by the end of 2018 ?
 

qubit

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Intel is running scared of AMD with their competitive new processors. Wait a bit and then consider AMD.
 
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Intel is runninG scared of AMD with their competitive new processors. Wait a bit and then consider AMD.
How are amd drivers ? Last time i had experienced them it wasn't a good one.
 
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How are amd drivers ? Last time i had experienced them it wasn't a good one.

CPUs generally don't have "driver issues" like gpus.
 

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How are amd drivers ? Last time i had experienced them it wasn't a good one.
As @R-T-B said, CPUs don't have driver issues. The reason is that they don't have drivers. Perhaps you're thinking of AMD graphics cards, which do have drivers?
 
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Presentation of nextgen Threadripper CPU in August. IMO next 2-3 months after that will be great discounts for "old" 16 core CPUs and mobos. Just search a bit about BIOS issues and choose trouble free mobo.
 
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As @R-T-B said, CPUs don't have driver issues. The reason is that they don't have drivers. Perhaps you're thinking of AMD graphics cards, which do have drivers?
Regarding the drivers, i was actually referring to the chipset/motherboard bios itself...

Presentation of nextgen Threadripper CPU in August. IMO next 2-3 months after that will be great discounts for "old" 16 core CPUs and mobos. Just search a bit about BIOS issues and choose trouble free mobo.
Do you think Intel will counter ?
 
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1) Buy unlocked Xeon Ivy-E (16x0 v2 series), and wait for 10/7nm chips.
2) Get new Threadripper or older one with discount (if you need many PCI-e).
3) Think about used X99 as an option.
 
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Do you think Intel will counter ?
Last year me heavily biased towards AMD, sorry i don't care for intel response in HEDT and that's why:
1. Even after ryzen/threadriper success for the price of just CPU you can buy whole AMD platform with equal performance - CPU + top mobo + some RAM
2. TIM on intel "products"
3. Quality of mobos for both platforms equal (before Phenom/FX boards for AMD was pure disaster in most cases IMO)

Now about need in HEDT for now:
1. do you need more than 25-30 lanes?
2. do you need more than 64GB RAM?
3. do you need more than 8 cores + SMT?

If all answers is yes, not because you use your PC as a male thing enlargement or have "free" money to buy any Porsche you want, than sure buy HEDT, in other cases i prefer to save money just buying Ryzen 2700 (or i7 8700) and that would be sufficient for next 3-4 years for gaming or prosumer needs (Photoshops and Premiers optimized for most common hardware, they switched from 4 cores optimization for most of tasks just 3 years ago, and now they fully utilize just 8 most of the time).
 
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How are amd drivers ? Last time i had experienced them it wasn't a good one.
Fine for me. Yes there is drivers for a Ryzen/Threadripper since it's a SoC, technically there is no need for a auxiliary chip on the main board.
 
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Benchmark Scores A LOT
Get 8700K, 7820x is not worth it. Need HEDT in 7820x price ? Get 6900K or Threadripper.
 
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I have not been following the latest in terms of hardware release, the recent HEDT offering from intel looks confusing... Im currently using an i7 3930k and would like to upgrade. The prices of the HEDT segment has since increased so much so that the current price from SB-E to the latest seems like a downgrade.

i7 3930k - 40 Pcie Lanes MSRP 500-600
i7 7820x - 28 Pcie Lanes MSRP 500-600
i9 7900x - 44 Pcie Lanes MSRP 999

IO on x299 seems less than previous gens

TLDR :
Do you think going from 3930k -> 7820x is worth it ? I am also aware that AMD is going to release a bunch of new cpus. Do you think intel will counter AMD release for the hedt segment ? Will intel release x399 by the end of 2018 ?

In order to give you a proper answer, need to know what this system is going to be used for?

Different tasks / workflows require different hardware configurations. Also need to know if you have any plan to populate those PCI-e lanes as well.
 

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If you need a bunch of cores for some kind of professional workload, it's probably better to grab Threadripper at this point.
 
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In order to give you a proper answer, need to know what this system is going to be used for?

Different tasks / workflows require different hardware configurations. Also need to know if you have any plan to populate those PCI-e lanes as well.

This is the part i don't understand about how many PCIE lanes i need or if it will be enough. I plan to run 2 M2-nvme drives and i will transfer 6 drives ( 3 sata ssd + 3 sata hdd ) from my current machine to this build. I might plan to get a 10GB nic and a sound card. Will only have 1 GPU.

Gigabyte website has this PCIE Lane tool but im still bummed out : https://www.gigabyte.com/FileUpload/global/MicroSite/473/x299.html

This build will be an upgrade over my previous workstation.
 
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4 lanes per M2 ssd + 4 lanes for 10GbE + 8 lanes for GPU (even 4 is sufficient unless you doing very very special calculations in scientific applications or custom software)
USB/SATA or any general purpose interfaces (including onboard sound) all connected via dedicated lanes from platform hub

modern consumer CPUs NB have x16 lanes (can be configured as 2x8, for GPU + 10GbE/RAID card/etc) + 1-2 dedicated x4 for M2 + 2-4 for any purpose + link for PCH
and PCH have all traditional interfaces + 4-6 lanes for other hardware like external sound/wifi/nic/etc




Gigabyte website has this PCIE Lane tool but im still bummed out : https://www.gigabyte.com/FileUpload/global/MicroSite/473/x299.html
this mini site shows that you never utilize even half of lanes provided by 7820x
 
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x299's pricing is the reason why I moved from my 5930k to a 6900k, until socket 2066 is where it should be I wont be budging from x99. I've debated on moving to the CoffeeLake "Refresh" if it carries the promise of a low power (lower than 6900k at least) 8c/16t that I can affordably/easily build in a watercooled sff (of course affordable and SFF contradict each other lol)
 
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I hate to answer this question until I know what specifically is being done with the PC. Many folks want the best and equate that with pricing, cores or some other variable which all too often as no impact on that they are doing. While you must always evaluate your hardware choices based upon what softwarere you use, I'll assume Premiere pro Workstation in this example. Here we recommend:

Worsksatation Rendering, Video Editing, etc):
Intel still holds the title here and has been price competitive. Looking here for example for Premiere Pro we see that the cheaper 7800x edged out Ryzen in the sub $400 segment

https://www.pugetsystems.com/pic_disp.php?id=42852&width=800&height=800
https://www.pugetsystems.com/pic_disp.php?id=43667&width=800&height=800
https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/a...PU-Comparison-Skylake-X-vs-Threadripper-1012/

In the last link, we see the 16 core Threadripper totalling 451. Intel's flagship 12 core 7920 X scored a slight win at 454 in the 4 tests but it was the 10 core 7900x that tool the in at 465. While the 7900x and Threadripper cost $1,000, the $600 7800x scored 447. The $1000 16 core from AMD was only 0.9% faster than the $600 6 core 7800x proving once again that the focus on cores is misplaced.

Again, this assumes a Video editing workstation with Premier Pro as the central app of concern ... comparisons for other software should be made as and when appropriate.

Gaming Box - Here again, more than 4 cores is meaningless in and of itself. i7's generally perform better, passing stricter testing and if ya turn off HT, you can often squeeze an extra 0.1 to 0.2 Ghz out of ya OC, But the i5 still does quite fine. As it says in every TPU review on Ryzen ... "Gaming performance lower than competing Intel Core i5 chips / Limited overclocking potential / Memory still a bit more problematic than on Intel"

"https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/Ryzen_5_2600/20.html

Workstation / Gaming Box - This is where I like Ryzen. If you are using Premiere in a production environment, you are not going to be looking at this price segment. But if as a hobbyist, and ya not using w/ premier more than say 25 - 30% of the time... while Ryzen does not present a "best of both worlds" approach, while it won't "capture a title" on either side, it does do pretty darn well tho the 1800x (446) didn't quite catch up to the 8700k's 491 score

Moving forward unfortunately, Pugent Sound has not done a review with the new Ryzens and we have not yet seen the new Intel CPUs. Techspot did the new Ryzens but not the whole suite of tests ... they showed that the 2700x OC'd (390) beat (3.6% / 5.8 % faster) but both the 7802X (404) and the OC'd 8700k (413) with "export to youtube". The 8700k OC'd took the title in Warp Stabilize test with a 106 (28% faster) to the OC's 2700x score of 136

https://www.techspot.com/review/1613-amd-ryzen-2700x-2600x/page3.html

Again... there are certainly many tasks in which Ryzen performs better.... if ya spend your day zipping files, than the 2700x is for you. Handbrake favors Intel, Corona / V-Ray favors Ryzen, Blender favors 8700k. Gaming was a win for the 8700k across the board.

So again, w/o knowing the apps in play, I hesitate to recommend one over the other.
 
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Don't forget the optimizations that Adobe has input in Premier lately benefiting the Intel iGPU for those using Mainstream CPUs. Also I had heard of stability issues within Premier with Ryzen, guessing that was a bug that has been fixed as well.
 
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If your not doing any massive workloads or want a future upgrade then I'd recommend taking a look at cex if your in the UK like me. They sell a tested and fully working 7740x for a stupidly low £125 posted - This cpu is virtually a higher bin 7700k and you can grab a good x299 board and when the i9's drop in price you can grab a excellent cheap upgrade. The 7740x has insane single core performance with some chips hitting 5.3ghz stable - strong cpu and I'm yet to get my x299 board.
 
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This is the part i don't understand about how many PCIE lanes i need or if it will be enough. I plan to run 2 M2-nvme drives and i will transfer 6 drives ( 3 sata ssd + 3 sata hdd ) from my current machine to this build. I might plan to get a 10GB nic and a sound card. Will only have 1 GPU.

Gigabyte website has this PCIE Lane tool but im still bummed out : https://www.gigabyte.com/FileUpload/global/MicroSite/473/x299.html

This build will be an upgrade over my previous workstation.

What will be the workflow on your workstation?
Which softwares you are using and for what are you going to use those softwares ( 3d modelling, render, simulation etc.) ?
When you determine a CPU, you can easily find a motherboard with built in 10G ethernet port. This might also leave you space for future upgrades.

2 M.2 NVME drives can easily be used with all new high end motherboards.
 
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Processor 10.5 thousand 4.2G 1.1v
Motherboard Zee 490 Aorus Elite
Cooling Noctua D15S
Memory 16GB 4133 CL16-16-16-31 Viper Steel
Video Card(s) RTX 2070 Super Gaming X Trio
Storage SU900 128,8200Pro 1TB,850 Pro 512+256+256,860 Evo 500,XPG950 480, Skyhawk 2TB
Display(s) Acer XB241YU+Dell S2716DG
Case P600S Silent w. Alpenfohn wing boost 3 ARGBT+ fans
Audio Device(s) K612 Pro w. FiiO E10k DAC,W830BT wireless
Power Supply Superflower Leadex Gold 850W
Mouse G903 lightspeed+powerplay,G403 wireless + Steelseries DeX + Roccat rest
Keyboard HyperX Alloy SilverSpeed (w.HyperX wrist rest),Razer Deathstalker
Software Windows 10
Benchmark Scores A LOT
2x m.2 nvme + 6x sata + gpu + sound + nic = you're better off with hedt. On z370 you will have to run all this off pch, and there's bounds to be problems. Most m.2 slots share bandwidth with two sata ports, if you use two m.2 drives on z370 you're basically rendering four sata ports useless. Like on Z370 K6

M2_1, SATA3_0 and SATA3_1 share lanes. If either one of them is in use, the others will be disabled.
M2_2, SATA3_4 and SATA3_5 share lanes. If either one of them is in use, the others will be disabled.

I'd do this

get a 7820x (or 6900k), get an adapter for two nvme drives (some x299 boards come with those). plug the adapter with two drives into a pci-e that uses cpu lanes directly if you're usng a 28 lane cpu. That way the board will split the ttransfer 16x for the gpu and 8x for the drives,which is perfect.

everything else will run off pch, should be no problem.

I honestly advise you to get a 6900k over 7820x and 6950x over 7900x. They're better cpus.

And another thing, what is the point of keeping 6x sata devices. I have 3x ssd + 2x hdd myself, and I would really,really rather have 1x big ssd + 1x big hdd. Especially if yours are small ones. Just get a 1TB SSD + 3TB HDD. Only reason that's keeping me from selling my 850 Pro's is their insanely long warranty, they still have 7-8 years left, while new drives have 5 years at most.
 
Last edited:
Joined
May 27, 2012
Messages
329 (0.08/day)
Location
Malaysia
System Name Elmo
Processor i9 7900x
Motherboard MSI x299 gaming pro ac
Cooling Noctua NH D-14
Memory 32GB DDR4 3600 Mhz
Video Card(s) Zotac AMP Extreme RTX 2070 Super
Storage 1TB Samsung 860 Evo, Samsung 970 Evo Plus 500GB, 1 & 2TB Barracuda, Hyperx 120GB, WD Green 500GB
Display(s) Samsung 23" led 1080p X 3
Case Nzxt Switch 810
Power Supply Corsair HX 750W
Software Windows 10 Pro
2x m.2 nvme + 6x sata + gpu + sound + nic = you're better off with hedt. On z370 you will have to run all this off pch, and there's bounds to be problems. Most m.2 slots share bandwidth with two sata ports, if you use two m.2 drives on z370 you're basically rendering four sata ports useless. Like on Z370 K6



I'd do this

get a 7820x (or 6900k), get an adapter for two nvme drives (some x299 boards come with those). plug the adapter with two drives into a pci-e that uses cpu lanes directly if you're usng a 28 lane cpu. That way the board will split the ttransfer 16x for the gpu and 8x for the drives,which is perfect.

everything else will run off pch, should be no problem.

I honestly advise you to get a 6900k over 7820x and 6950x over 7900x. They're better cpus.

And another thing, what is the point of keeping 6x sata devices. I have 3x ssd + 2x hdd myself, and I would really,really rather have 1x big ssd + 1x big hdd. Especially if yours are small ones. Just get a 1TB SSD + 3TB HDD. Only reason that's keeping me from selling my 850 Pro's is their insanely long warranty, they still have 7-8 years left, while new drives have 5 years at most.
TBH your advice is really good. I did alot of number crunching and just gave in to the 7900x. The 6950x is definitely better value... but i could not find any reliable local retailers selling that and the x99 boards. I have already placed an order for a 7900x :\
 
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Deleted member 178884

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TBH your advice is really good. I did alot of number crunching and just gave in to the 7900x. The 6950x is definitely better value... but i could not find any reliable local retailers selling that and the x99 boards. I have already placed an order for a 7900x :\
I recommend the x299 i9 xe for a motherboard - excellent reviews and I'm getting one for my 7740x when I get the cash.
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2017
Messages
7,412 (3.02/day)
Location
Poland
System Name Purple rain
Processor 10.5 thousand 4.2G 1.1v
Motherboard Zee 490 Aorus Elite
Cooling Noctua D15S
Memory 16GB 4133 CL16-16-16-31 Viper Steel
Video Card(s) RTX 2070 Super Gaming X Trio
Storage SU900 128,8200Pro 1TB,850 Pro 512+256+256,860 Evo 500,XPG950 480, Skyhawk 2TB
Display(s) Acer XB241YU+Dell S2716DG
Case P600S Silent w. Alpenfohn wing boost 3 ARGBT+ fans
Audio Device(s) K612 Pro w. FiiO E10k DAC,W830BT wireless
Power Supply Superflower Leadex Gold 850W
Mouse G903 lightspeed+powerplay,G403 wireless + Steelseries DeX + Roccat rest
Keyboard HyperX Alloy SilverSpeed (w.HyperX wrist rest),Razer Deathstalker
Software Windows 10
Benchmark Scores A LOT
Can't go wrong with fatali1ty i7/i9 series, prolly the best intel mobos out there. Pricey though.
 
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