No Performance Difference Between My Old 5770 and New 6870 - Get My Money Back?

[SkipCameron]

I have been playing fallout 3 on a 6950 2gb and have no issues alost played with a 5850 no issues

Can you give me a ballpark on FPS performance/consistency so I can better grasp what "no issues" means. I think another important question would be whether you use any mods and how many. I am typically running around 50-75 .esp/.esm files in FOMM in my ideal Fallout 3/NV game but the cost of all those mods pushes me from framerate averages of 61 FPS @ no mods and at max settings (1440 x 900) to 25 FPS @ lots of mods and slightly reduced settings (with dips into the low teens when there's a lot going on).

The crux of my whole issue is whether or not there's a way to play heavily modded versions of Fallout 3/NV at a solid 50+ framerate. That is my goal! What hardware do I need to get there, or is it even possible!?

 

[brandonwh64]

Can you give me a ballpark on FPS performance/consistency so I can better grasp what "no issues" means. I think another important question would be whether you use any mods and how many. I am typically running around 50-75 .esp/.esm files in FOMM in my ideal Fallout 3/NV game but the cost of all those mods pushes me from framerate averages of 61 FPS @ no mods and at max settings (1440 x 900) to 25 FPS @ lots of mods and slightly reduced settings (with dips into the low teens when there's a lot going on).

The crux of my whole issue is whether or not there's a way to play heavily modded versions of Fallout 3/NV at a solid 50+ framerate. That is my goal! What hardware do I need to get there, or is it even possible!?

I will take some tests when I get home

 

[D007]

Can you give me a ballpark on FPS performance/consistency so I can better grasp what "no issues" means. I think another important question would be whether you use any mods and how many. I am typically running around 50-75 .esp/.esm files in FOMM in my ideal Fallout 3/NV game but the cost of all those mods pushes me from framerate averages of 61 FPS @ no mods and at max settings (1440 x 900) to 25 FPS @ lots of mods and slightly reduced settings (with dips into the low teens when there's a lot going on).

The crux of my whole issue is whether or not there's a way to play heavily modded versions of Fallout 3/NV at a solid 50+ framerate. That is my goal! What hardware do I need to get there, or is it even possible!?

It may not be possible, can't say for sure on my end.
May be the only way to do that is with a mutil gpu system..
Mods have that effect.
OC the GPU and the CPU and test, that's the only way to know for sure.

Make sure of course you don't have stuff in the background running.
Defrag the system, clean up and remove any unused programs..
do what you can to optimize.
Set your Operating system display to "adjust for best performance" Rather than having all kinds of fading boxes and pretty desktop schemes.
don't have some insanely high def picture as your desktop background either.
As big as it is, is as much memory as you're actively taking, just having it there.
I go with a solid black background.

Try also... And this could be a big one.. If using onboard sound reduce the number of max audio samples your system will allow it's self to process in that game.
usually games like that have a config file you can adjust "Max samples" in. Cut it at least in half and try..
Sometimes it's not video lag you're getting, it's audio lag.
Especially if onboard sound is being used.

Gl..
I lag..

 

[repman244]

Sorry but that's a load of BS.

5850 = 6870
5870 = ~6950

5770 is nowhere near in the same league as 5850 or 6870... 5770 is on average slower by 10fps compared to even HD5830, let alone HD5850...

That wasn't his point, his point was that AMD changed the naming scheme (It doesn't matter if performance is different).

A 6970 has a full blown chip the same way the 5870 has, the 6950 s a bit slower than 6970 hence it's in line with 5850...


To the OP, my guess is the dual core CPU, almost all games today benefit from quads (Some have minor benefits from 6 cores) and also if I remember correctly the i3 has less L3 cache which usually games like.

 

[Dent1]

A 6970 has a full blown chip the same way the 5870 has, the 6950 s a bit slower than 6970 hence it's in line with 5850...

huh? When you say "in line" do you mean performance wise? Because I don't care about all the fancy numbering scheme as far as performance the 6950 is atleast 15-20% faster than the 5850 on a bad day.

Infact, looking back at the old TPU reviews shows the 6950 ahead of the 5870 by a few percentage.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6950/29.html

 

[repman244]

huh? When you say "in line" do you mean performance wise? Because I don't care about all the fancy numbering scheme as far as performance the 6950 atleast 20% faster than the 5850 on a bad day.

I said that it doesn't matter if performance is different, AMD changed the names (I know that if you look at the numbers the things are completely different). Like DannibusX said, the numbering system changed and to my understanding only warned those who thought that the 6870 was the upgrade from 5870 which is not and thus should not expect magical numbers.

 

[Dent1]

only warned those who thought that the 6870 was the upgrade from 5870 which is not and thus should not expect magical numbers.

IMO, I think the 6870 was just a botched card. I feel the performance just didnt deliver, under delivered and then the community of geeks started saying it was a numbering change when infact it was just slower than it's 5870 predecessor for unknown reasons.

 

[repman244]

IMO, I think the 6870 was just a botched card. I feel the performance just didnt deliver, under delivered then the community of geeks started saying it was a numbering change when infact it was just slower than it's 5870 predecessor.

It could be so (but like I said 6870 isn't a full blown chip) and personally I think AMD just wanted to trick some people into thinking that a 6870 was a 5870 upgrade (similar to just rebranding old GPU's)

 

[SkipCameron]

Skip can you try this driver for us? I learned last night that the newest drivers make me have FPS tanks and junk. I installed this driver with the help of cadaveca and it works WONDERS!

http://www2.ati.com/drivers/hotfix/catalyst_11.11_hotfixes/amd_catalyst_11.11c_windows_vista_7.exe

*EDIT*

make sure you use driver sweeper after uninstall of AMD drivers

http://phyxion.net/Driver-Sweeper/Driver-Sweeper/Version-3-2-0/Installer.html

I just ran some more tests using FRAPS on 180 second runs through several of my games to see which ones actually show improvement with the 6870 over the 5770. All games had settings maxed (i.e. 8x MSAA, 15x Filtering, etc. @ 1440 x 900). Here's how it shook out:

Fallout New Vegas (Primm/NCR Camp with NMCs Medium Texture mod, URWL lighting mod, EVE mod)
- 5770: Min=37, Max=64, Avg=58.4
- 6870: Min=42, Max=65, Avg=59.3
*(For some reason the hardward autodetect program sets the 6870 to "Low quality" and the 5770 to "Ultra High quality." I've read that this is far from a perfect detection program, but I found that odd.)

Mass Effect 2 (Haestrom)
- 5770: Min=56, Max=62, Avg=59.8
- 6870: Min=57, Max=61, Avg=59.8

Borderlands (New Haven & surround)
- 5770: Min=53, Max=64, Avg=61.8
- 6870: Min=52, Max=64, Avg=61.8

Left 4 Dead 2 (Dead Center Campaign Start)
- 5770: Min=73, Max=206, Avg=127.5
- 6870: Min=69, Max=246, Avg=123.3
*(For some reason I had to specify my Video settings 3 times before they all showed up after switching to the 6870.)

Just Cause 2 (Driving around the city)
- 5770: Min=33, Max=63, Avg=49.6
- 6870: Min=42, Max=63, Avg=58.7

The Witcher 2 (Beginning of Chapter 2 vs. Wraith Kaedweni Soldiers; No Ubersampling)
- 5770: Min=30, Max=53, Avg=40.9
- 6870: Min=11, Max=82, Avg=57.7

So it looks like Just Cause 2 and The Witcher 2 improve with the 6870 by a good 20% and 40%, respectively, but none of the others showed any improvement over my 5770.

HELP***: I want to re-run these tests with the new driver you sent me but I'm unclear how to use the driver sweeper. I installed the driver using "Express Install" in the wizard and then I opened up Driver Sweeper and wasn't sure what to do. I see the "AMD - Display" box and check it and I hit "Analyse" which brought up a list of files I didn't know what to do with, and then I hit "Clean" and it asked me if I was sure I wanted to proceed at which point I chickened out thinking I might wipe the current drivers by accident and not be able to see anything at all. So if you could help me figure out how to utilize this utility correctly I would be very appreciative.

Additionally, I'm hopeful that this new driver may actually unlock some latent performance boosts in some of the other games that didn't respond, now that I'm seeing that for Just Cause 2 and The Witcher 2 there is a very measurable improvement.

Thanks again for your help!

 

[MT Alex]

HELP***: I want to re-run these tests with the new driver you sent me but I'm unclear how to use the driver sweeper.

Follow this guide to the letter. I'm pretty sure that should solve most of your issues.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52502

Don't skimp on any of the steps.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

so your trying to tell us 5770 its the same performance to a 6870, if so i say that a lie, i suggest you do some research the 5770 vs 6870 and then you will see a 6870 is at least 30% faster

uhh yeah. Dannibus your wrong because the 6770 is the rebadged 5770.

 

[pantherx12]

IMO, I think the 6870 was just a botched card. I feel the performance just didnt deliver, under delivered and then the community of geeks started saying it was a numbering change when infact it was just slower than it's 5870 predecessor for unknown reasons.

Then went back to their old naming scheme where x900 is the highest end.

So x800 became the step below that, 6870 was that generations 5770 ( single 6 pin 150w card, the 6870 is much faster than a 5770 when you consider this)

And 6870 was a fine card, both it and the 6850 benefit from over-clocking massively ( the 6850 especially) @1100mhz my 6870 played most things I threw at it fine : ]

 

[20mmrain]

I have owned both of these cards you are talking about.... and there has to be some other circumstance going on here. The HD 6870 should be way faster then the HD5770. By quit a bit..... it should pretty close to the HD 5870 in terms of performance.
Is your CPU overclocked? Which CPU are you using? When was the last time you cleaned your drivers well? When was the last time you reformatted your OS? Are you noticing any other symptoms of problems with the HD 6870?

 

[eidairaman1]

Drivers are normally to blame when switching between different series of boards or even a chip makers.

Its just me- I go from say a Radeon 9800 to a x1950 Pro- Definitely reinstall drivers

or even if say you have a 6770 and go to a 6970

even moving from a 560 to a 7770.

 

[[XC] Oj101]

CPU speed might be a bottleneck, but being a 2c/4t CPU isn't.

I know, I know, it's Toms, but I'm not home with my bookmarks and don't feel for Googling:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-fx-pentium-apu-benchmark,3120-10.html