Regarding fan noise

[Bill_Bright]

Hate to tell but you are killing your hardware

Not even close.

You are worrying too much...
60C is nothing for the chipsets

Agreed.

I see two things here, mclaren85.

1. There's a 2-part lack of understanding on your part over what's acceptable temps,​

and,​

2. You have an unnecessary (perhaps a bit unhealthy ) obsession over these temps.​

The above are meant as observations, not criticisms.

1A. Chipsets tend to run very warm (I did not say "hot") when pushed for a number of reasons. These include the fact there's a lot going on there in a tiny space. Designers and engineers are fully aware of this - and have been since the beginning of time.

"IF" those temps were a technical issue, it would be simple and relatively inexpensive for designers to mount heatsinks to the chipset ICs. But they don't. Why? Because it is not needed. In normal use, these chips get warm, but not hot.

Old-timers around here may remember way back in the day when early chipsets did include a tiny 40mm fan and heatsink assembly. They were all pieces of shi... err... "moose muffins" as Lex likes to say. Those fans whined and rattled all the time. Then two things happened. First, the fans seized and our systems kept running along fine, or we got fed up with the noise, removed the fans and our systems still kept running along fine. And second, cases started supporting more than just a single, rear 80mm case fan.

1B. Cooler temps does NOT automatically mean better. Yes, it is absolutely critical to keep our electronics properly cooled. But it is NOT necessary to keep it as cool as possible. AS LONG AS the temperature is maintained comfortably within its normal operating range, there is NO TECHNICAL REASON running cooler will allow it to perform better, be more stable, or have a longer life expectancy. This applies to CPUs, GPUs, and chipsets too.

And for sure, 60°C for chipset ICs is well within that "comfortable" range. Research shows a "normal" maximum operating temp for many chipsets is 95°C with some able to support up to 125°C! So 60°C is just warm, not even very warm.

Consider this - the computer electronics under the hood of our cars are typically exposed to temps well above 120°C and even up to 150°C (302°F)!!! That's hot! And those systems easily last 10, 15 years and longer. I am not saying all electronics can withstand those temps - just that motherboard designers and engineers are fully aware and have such technology at their disposal for motherboard devices that are exposed to and subject to very high temps. VRMs are probably another example of devices capable of withstanding such temps without harm.

2. Your temps are fine. Stop obsessing over them. Keep the interior of your case clean of heat trapping dust, and simply monitor your temps. If they start to rise and stay at elevated temps, it is probably time to clean out the dust again.

 

[mclaren85]

Not even close.

Agreed.

I see two things here, mclaren85.

1. There's a 2-part lack of understanding on your part over what's acceptable temps,​

and,​

2. You have an unnecessary (perhaps a bit unhealthy ) obsession over these temps.​

The above are meant as observations, not criticisms.

1A. Chipsets tend to run very warm (I did not say "hot") when pushed for a number of reasons. These include the fact there's a lot going on there in a tiny space. Designers and engineers are fully aware of this - and have been since the beginning of time.

"IF" those temps were a technical issue, it would be simple and relatively inexpensive for designers to mount heatsinks to the chipset ICs. But they don't. Why? Because it is not needed. In normal use, these chips get warm, but not hot.

Old-timers around here may remember way back in the day when early chipsets did include a tiny 40mm fan and heatsink assembly. They were all pieces of shi... err... "moose muffins" as Lex likes to say. Those fans whined and rattled all the time. Then two things happened. First, the fans seized and our systems kept running along fine, or we got fed up with the noise, removed the fans and our systems still kept running along fine. And second, cases started supporting more than just a single, rear 80mm case fan.

1B. Cooler temps does NOT automatically mean better. Yes, it is absolutely critical to keep our electronics properly cooled. But it is NOT necessary to keep it as cool as possible. AS LONG AS the temperature is maintained comfortably within its normal operating range, there is NO TECHNICAL REASON running cooler will allow it to perform better, be more stable, or have a longer life expectancy. This applies to CPUs, GPUs, and chipsets too.

And for sure, 60°C for chipset ICs is well within that "comfortable" range. Research shows a "normal" maximum operating temp for many chipsets is 95°C with some able to support up to 125°C! So 60°C is just warm, not even very warm.

Consider this - the computer electronics under the hood of our cars are typically exposed to temps well above 120°C and even up to 150°C (302°F)!!! That's hot! And those systems easily last 10, 15 years and longer. I am not saying all electronics can withstand those temps - just that motherboard designers and engineers are fully aware and have such technology at their disposal for motherboard devices that are exposed to and subject to very high temps. VRMs are probably another example of devices capable of withstanding such temps without harm.

2. Your temps are fine. Stop obsessing over them. Keep the interior of your case clean of heat trapping dust, and simply monitor your temps. If they start to rise and stay at elevated temps, it is probably time to clean out the dust again.

Hi Bill, I very welcome your observations/criticisms.

And I totally agree with you about the temperature. It is the cooling/heating cycles that kills the hardware. What I don't get is, Why do the manufacturers almost always overlook high temperature of pch? I mean in every brand, when the GPU hits 60C, the fans start to spin up. When CPU hits 60, the fan speed rises accordingly. But this never applies to pch temp, it is always being ignored nowadays. (That was not the case before.)

My another fault is, I think I've picked the wrong chipset. I should've bought b550 or inferior one. They run much cooler than x570 models. To me, having x570 is no difference than having b550, which I realized much later.

Thanks everyone for your valuable inputs.

 

[leonavis]

Look at my temps and RPMs for example.

Like that, it's slightly audible right now. Mostly because of the front intake fans, which are turned up higher than the radiator (top) outtake and the rear outtake fan.

The chipset always hovers around 60°C. I have enabled, in UEFI, the "boost" profile for its fan. That means that that fan is starting faster than usually, since usually it only starts at around 66-67°C. Because the manufacterer thinks that's enough. Is it? Probably. I have enabled boost so the mainboard will last as long as it can. It's over 5 years old and going well.

As you can see, the fans do ramp up quite heavily when the CPU gets stressed. In idle however, with low temps, they have little RPM. And it's completely enough, I'm actually thinking about getting rid of the rear-fan and lower the RPM of the front-fans.

So yeah. Get into your UEFI and adapt your fan curves. And stop worrying about the chipset-temps.

 

[Bill_Bright]

It is the cooling/heating cycles that kills the hardware.

You are still obsessing over this. You really need to let it go.

"Kills" is an extreme exaggeration - and very outdated/obsolete too, almost to the point of insignificance with modern electronics. 50 - 60+ years ago (and I first became a certified electronics tech 52 years ago), some theorized keeping our electronics "on" 24/7, thus at a relatively constant temperature would reduce "aging" thus extend the lifespan of the equipment. But reality proved otherwise. Concrete empirical evidence collected over decades showed no significant life expectancy differences between electronics that was left on 24/7 and electronics that was turned on and off several times daily.

Yes, the number of heating/cooling cycles affects aging. But that number is way up into the many 10s of 1000s of cycles. In other words, many years!

Are there exceptions? Of course. If your PCH temp regularly exceeds the maximum allowed, then under those extreme conditions, rapid aging may occur that may cause premature failure. Note I said "may", not "will".

But is it even possible to exceed the maximum temp allowed? Assuming the motherboard is functioning properly, NO! Why? See below.

What I don't get is, Why do the manufacturers almost always overlook high temperature of pch?

And what I don't get is why you are not listening to what others are saying - now to the point you are accusing manufacturers of overlooking high temps. Nonsense! Once again, 60° is not high. Even 80°C is still fine.

HOWEVER, should some rare, extreme event happen, the designers and engineers account for that by designing in various thermal protection features to shutdown the system BEFORE damage occurs. This proves they have NOT overlooked the possibility a high/hot temperature event could happen.

If this were the problem your imagination has you obsessing over, don't you think there would be 100s of millions of users complaining about unstable/crashing computers all the time? Where are they?

Seriously, dude! You need to let it go. Otherwise, lower the ambient temp of your room to 50°F (10°C), then remove the side panel of your case, and blast a serious fan in there. And use earplugs.

 

[freeagent]

Maybe MSI just kinda sucks for their cooling solutions? I let my system run overnight with the fans on granny mode, played some games too.. chipsets never really made it past 50..

fans

 

[mclaren85]

Maybe MSI just kinda sucks for their cooling solutions? I let my system run overnight with the fans on granny mode, played some games too.. chipsets never really made it past 50..

View attachment 395382

fans

View attachment 395383

Did you mount your GPU vertically?
These numbers are perfect for sure

 

[freeagent]

Did you mount your GPU vertically?
These numbers are perfect for sure

My profile pic is my current config, I did not buy a cable yet so have not tried to vertical mount it.

Thanks!

It is still 18c down here, 16c outside

 

[mclaren85]

My profile pic is my current config, I did not buy a cable yet so have not tried to vertical mount it.

Thanks!

It is still 18c down here, 16c outside

A very optimal temperature for using pc. Not sure about how you feel though
Have fun with your setup

 

[freeagent]

A very optimal temperature for using pc. Not sure about how you feel though
Have fun with your setup

I work with a bunch of new comers to Canada, and I am outside in my tshirt while they are jacketed up

Once it starts hitting like 20c down here then the AC comes on, because upstairs it will be a few C warmer..