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[SOLVED] Help with M5000m

vborovic

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I'm looking for answers, so far various other online sources didn't help (however I have a general idea of what should be technically possible). Here's the breakdown: I'm using a HP zBook 17 G2 with a Quadro K5100m dedicated GPU. It works, however it is not compatible with some of the apps I need to use. I've managed to obtain a newer M5000m, which was pulled form a working newer zBook G3, and the card is functioning. The K5100m is the top of the line-up for the G2, and I can't directly install the M5000m since it is not supported on my notebook model. Following some other forums, including DELLs, I've figured out that a "simple" trick is to modify the .inf file which contains vendors, subversions and whatnot, to include a new (or old) card, and thus force the driver installation, however this goes beyond my current understanding of what I need to change to make it happen.

While I'm typing this, the zBook is back to the K5100m, but would really like to be able to use the M5000m. So, any ideas, what is required, what needs to be modified for the current driver (downloaded from the Nvidia site) to be able to start the installation?

The M5000m is detected in my notebook, however it uses the standard Microsoft Basic Display Adapter. The GPU-Z app sees the card as GM204 (which is the chipset, and the Lookup directs to the https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/quadro-m5000m.c2823 link.

Any help will be much appreciated. Photos show the situation.





P.S. The reason why there is no Intel HD card listed in the device manager is that the BIOS setup was to not use the hybrid mode (basically only using the Quadro card). Note to all the others attempting this "upgrade" - pray that you have TeamViewer installed, else you'll have to revert to the previous card, since there will be no image on the screen (as well as any external screens).
 
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vborovic

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what about checking the hardware id
Capture.PNG

and using google to find VID_0603 bla bla bla
you gonna find something there, no matter what it is from another brands
it looks you need to try one by one
 
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The installer explicitly mentions windows version. What is the exact windows 10 build you're using?
 
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I know that for older series (8560w/8760w), if you tried using newer GPUs you would end up with the same issue, since you cannot get the driver from HP and NVIDIA ones do not work.
If I remember correctly the driver had to be modified (I think it was something like you did with inf file), but there was some trick with allowing Windows to install drivers with no signature (it's lost since you modified the driver) and after that it would load the driver.
Sorry I couldn't help you more since it was a long time I was checking this possibility...but try searching for HP 8560w NVIDIA driver modification procedure - it may apply to your card/laptop combo as well.
 

Yoavkeren

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Hi,
The bios has a white list & the M & P cards are not in it, only the K cards.
The easiest way to solve this is by modding the driver as stated before
you can find the instruction here : ( I used the first link )
https://null-src.com/posts/nvidia-notebook-driver-inf-mod/post.php ( unsafe by google for some reason )
or here:
or just write nvidia inf MOD in google .
I've been using a modified driver with zbook 15 g1 & M2000m for about a year.
For the Zbook you need to modify nvblwi.inf .
With windows 10 you will need to disable driver signing & run in test mode for the driver installation but you can get back to normal after it's installed .
Every windows feature update removes the driver & requires a repeated installation .
 
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Modded INF is mandatory if you replaced your notebook GPU with an aftermarket model.

"Both PNP ID and ACPI ID consist of two parts: a Vendor ID, followed by a product identifier. Each manufacturer of these devices must be assigned an industry-unique Vendor ID... The Device Manufacturer is responsible for assigning this identifier to each individual product MODEL. Once an identifier is assigned to a product model, it must not be assigned to any other product model manufactured by the same company (that is, that uses the same Vendor ID)." Source: PNP ID and ACPI ID Registry

Open nvhmi.inf and edit like this

[NVIDIA_Devices.NTamd64.10.0...17098]
%NVIDIA_DEV.13F8% = Section001,PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_13F8
%NVIDIA_DEV.1340.2280.103C% = Section001, PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_1340&SUBSYS_2280103C

[Strings]
DiskID1 = "NVIDIA Windows 10 (64 bit) Driver Library Installation Disk 1"
FLG_ADDREG_KEYONLY = 0x00000010
NVIDIA = "NVIDIA"
NVIDIA_A = "NVIDIA"
NVIDIA_DEV.13F8 = "NVIDIA Quadro M5000M"
NVIDIA_DEV.1340.2280.103C = "NVIDIA GeForce 830M"

Disable driver signatures and install driver via "have disk method" (not to be confused with manual installation).
 

vborovic

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@StefanM - I'll give your method a go first, if it won't work, I'll try @Yoavkeren's . What about the existing K5100 drivers, do I remove them from the device manager before installing the M5000m card, or do I just leave them as is?
 
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What about the existing K5100 drivers, do I remove them from the device manager before installing the M5000m card, or do I just leave them as is?
As the old driver doesn't work anymore, i would uninstall it.
Here is a nice tool to get rid of old drivers:
 

vborovic

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@StefanM - Well, I'm off for another round of dismantling and assembly, if I'm not back by tomorrow evening, something blew up ... :roll:

Well, I'm happy to report that I'm now running the M5000m in my zBook 17 G2. The guide from @StefanM was point on. A few more screens to show the current state (I've used the latest NVIDIA drivers, 452.39).

What I had before:


What I have now:




In case anyone is wondering why the new card has much less options in the NVIDIA Control panel listed - I'm currently running the setup in hybrid mode (Intel HD and NVIDIA), and my understanding is that the panel won't show more options unless the card is used in dedicated mode - hybrid turned off). Now, off to do some testing. I did a quick run with Unigine's Heaven, just to put the card through a quick stress test and see how the cooling holds on, the max was 84°C, settings and the benchmark result as shown below:









EDIT:
Would just like to add that my old Quadro K5100M card is now an extra, and I've listed it on eBay (don't know if this is in line with the forum rules, so I won't be directly linking/advertising), but you can easily find the listing with the search feature and entering the card model name.
 
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vborovic

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EDIT 2: Sadly, I'm back to the K5100m (I hope only temporarily). I need to use Adobe Premiere Pro, and of course, it forces the use of the Intel HD as a primary GPU while doing encoding. The M5000m was being used (Task Manager Performance monitor showed so), although much less. The issue was that the encoding was always halting, probably due to the Intel HD being used. Previously on the K5100m, I've only used it in dedicated mode (hybrid turned off, and the Intel HD was not present in the device manager - although the graphics part of the CPU was probably doing something).

To test the Premiere Pro encoding with only the M5000m in dedicated mode (hybrid turned off in BIOS), I've once again ran into the starting problem - no image on the screen, only TeamViewer. It seems the BIOS won't accept the M5000m (OK, makes sense), however, when booting into the Windows 10, I would expect that the M5000m drivers would load, but apparently that isn't so. GPU-Z once again properly detects the card, and I've tried installing the video drivers once again (signature check disabled through the Group Policy, since I can't access the Testing mode without seeing what's displayed), however, something happens during the driver installation and I get no screen (only the cursor), making the remote session unusable, and the driver never gets installed.

So, what can I do now? I need to use the Premiere Pro - would it help to have a hybrid mode (Intel HD + M5000m, and then disable the Intel HD via the Device manager), would Premiere Pro only see the dedicated card then? The issue with Premiere Pro is that the K5100m is not compatible (the K5000m and K5200m are, as luck would have it, but none of those are compatible with the zBook G2, only the x100m Quadro series -> x = 2,3,4 & 5), and I've tried getting a newer card, however things aren't simple. The interesting thing is that, even though Premiere shows an issue with the unsupported card, it was actually being used to encode things, roughly 15% at most.

P.S. I've tried most of the known tricks or bypasses to force the Premiere Pro to use the dedicated card (Nvidia Panel, Windows custom graphics settings, running te program with the selected GPU ... nothing helped).
 
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Yoavkeren

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Hi,
I've never used Adobe Premiere Pro .
I thinks that the GPU support list from adobe website only mentions desktop GPU. there was never a k5100 for desktop.
None of the models specified there has an M at the end .
From looking on Adobe forums I think your problem might be driver related.
 

vborovic

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So, did some more testing and computer dismantling, and here are my findings (bear with me, this might be a long post).

First things first, if you're swapping the unsupported graphics card in your computer, never disable the hybrid mode, which uses both the CPU's and GPU's graphics controllers (i.e. Intel HD and Quadro in my case). HP calls it hybrid mode, other manufacturers might have their own names for such a feature. Basically, in case the dedicated card fails (or gets swapped like what I'm doing), you'll lose the screen output, and you'll have to swap for a working (and BIOS compatible) graphics card. Once again, hybrid mode has t be on to allow for the CPUs graphics to work in case your dedicated card fails.

Since I'm using the Adobe Premiere Pro 2020, the main reason for the M5000m upgrade over the factory fitted K5100m was that Premiere was always complaining that the card isn't supported, and the encoding speed was slow (how slow, I don't know, nothing to compare it to, the performance on the zBook G2 was better than on my previous Elitebook w8770). In any case, I decided to go back to basics, and boy did I found some interesting things out (feeling stupid that I haven't tried them before to know what I'm up against).

I was running the default configuration in non-hybrid mode (only the dedicated card) and never found anything really wrong with it. Until today. After turning on the hybrid mode (Intel HD 4600 + K5100m), I started Premiere. The error shown is as follows:



As you can see, there are two cards that are unsupported. When I was running in the hybrid mode off (only the dedicated), the error message never mentioned the Intel HD (since it was "turned off"). So, I decided to pick a video clip for reference and start encoding with the different setups. The clip is 1 GB, 25fps, .mp4, 1920x1080. Used for all of the benchmarking that follows. Disk transfer rate irrelevant (it could be better, just know that I'm pulling the data from a network hard drive, which is connected to the 1Gbps LAN, so roughly 70-90 MB/s read rate). But I'm focusing only on the graphics part of the equation at this time. Default renderer: Mercury Playback Engine GPU Acceleration (CUDA). The "timings" were done manually, from hitting the "Export" button, until the Export pop-up screen disappears from the screen after completing the encoding. I've even tried using the Adobe Media Enoder (encoding queues), no increase in performance (no faster encoding speeds).

The general hardware specs are (they could be better, not the best setup for video encoding):
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4810MQ CPU @ 2.80GHz
32 GB DDR3 Micron PC3-14200 (889 MHz)
Intel HD 4600
Nvidia Quadro M5000m, 8GB DDR5

Encoding times for K5100m (no Intel HD, hybrid mode off), H.264, preset "High Quality 720p HD" (estimated file size 315 MB):
#1: 2 min 16 sec
#2: 2 min 19 sec
#3: 2 min 19 sec

... the CPU load was at 100%, the K5100m at 15-20% (as reported by the Task Manager).

Encoding times for Intel HD + K5100m (hybrid mode on), H.264, preset "High Quality 720p HD" (estimated file size 315 MB):
#1: 1 min 27 sec
#2: 1 min 29 sec
#3: 1 min 43 sec

Encoding times for Intel HD + K5100m (hybrid mode on), H.265 (HEVC), preset "HD 720p" (estimated file size 127 MB):
#1: 2 min 18 sec
#2: 2 min 18 sec
#3: 2 min 22 sec

... you can easily see the decrease in time needed to complete the export. Now, the task manager showed the Intel HD as well, and the loads were CPU 100%, Intel HD roughly 40%, K5100m 5-10%. In any case, the main bottleneck seems to be the CPU, but that is also not what we're looking for here.

Now, the moment of truth, as I install the M5000m (for which I had hopes will at least somewhat improve my video encoding performance), using it in hybrid mode on (as the only possible choice), Premiere reports this error message:



So, what @Yoavkeren asked about, it would seem that the M5000m (even though it is "m" for mobile, not a regular PC card) actually is compatible with Premiere Pro.

Encoding times for Intel HD + M5000m (hybrid mode on), H.264, preset "High Quality 720p HD" (estimated file size 315 MB):
#1: 1 min 28 sec
#2: 1 min 29 sec
#3: 1 min 30 sec

The H.265 encoding is also the same as with the previous setup, no gains as well.

Basically, the card swap didn't help one bit with regard of the encoding time. During the encoding, I see that the CPU is at 100% load, the Intel HD is at 40-50%, while the M5000m is at 10-15%, or even less. Meaning I didn't gain anything with the card swap regarding the Adobe Premiere Pro. I still have some other things to test out, however, if the program architecture is such that it won't be using more of the dedicated GPU, the whole procedure goes down the drain. However, it would be interesting to benchmark the HP zBook G3 with the M5000m and similar specs, and see if the Intel HD is being reported as unsupported (I assume it would be), and if the encoding times would be better or not compared to my current modified setup.

I'm off to do some more experimentation, but for now, those are the hard-facts. To anyone who would attempt a similar swap, it might not give you anything beneficial in the end.
 
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