Time to change this PSU?

[izy]

Is this PSU giving its last breath? its been like this for a while.

 

[Frick]

Hard to tell without knowing make and model.

 

[izy]

Hard to tell without knowing make and model.

Its an old PSU , Thermaltake Smart SE 550-600w (i think), i just noticed that the voltages are a bit low even under moderate loads.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Hard to tell without knowing make and model.

How is that going to tell you? Cheap no name PSUs can last for years and years. And the best models from the best brands can die after a few weeks.

@izy - According to the ATX Form Factor standard, PSUs must maintain voltage tolerances within ±5% of required specifications.

Acceptable tolerance maximums:

12VDC ±5% = 11.4 to 12.6VDC
5VDC ±5% = 4.75 to 5.25VDC
3.3VDC ±5% = 3.14 to 3.47VDC
​

Your PSU is fine - according to the right side of your screen shot. If you are referring the 11.08V on your GPU rail, that may indicate a regulator issue with the motherboard, or graphics solution.

 

[freeagent]

I would change it.

 

[izy]

Im using it on my AMD system with 5700x + 2060 super and i dont game much.
Yeah goes down to 11v on the GPU on the PCIE and 8 pin and 11.6v on the MB , the 5v doesnt seem stable either but seems that the values are in the ATX standard i see.

 

[GerKNG]

i would throw this thing out even if it would be brand new.

 

[caroline!]

software monitoring is not accurate

 

[izy]

i would throw this thing out even if it would be brand new.

Why? it did its job for a long time without any issue, is Thermaltake bad? I dont think this system takes more than 400W under my loads , mainly CPU loads, but i had a problem lately , my computer was rebooting but seems that the CO on my best cores was a bit too aggressive , went down a notch and seems to work just fine now, not sure why because a month ago was just fine with the older CO values, thought its because of an BIOS update or the PSU but seems that had something to do with the CO.

Edit: I was getting this:
A fatal hardware error has occurred.
Reported by component: Processor Core
Error Source: Machine Check Exception
Error Type: Cache Hierarchy Error
Processor APIC ID: 0 (and 5)

 

[GerKNG]

i don't trust cheap PSUs. and looking at a 300mv vdroop with barely any load reflects why.
rather spend the 50 bucks and get a well made, quality unit for the next 5-10 years before one of the cheap ones blow up and take a GPU, motherboard or something else with it.

 

[P4-630]

CO

CO or you meant OverClock?

 

[izy]

CO or you meant OverClock?

CPU Curve Optimizer.

i don't trust cheap PSUs. and looking at a 300mv vdroop with barely any load reflects why.

Well , yeah .. it did fine back in the day when i was running 280x + 1700x (way higher W, and yeah that old it is), i didnt want to replace anything that was just working because i was thinking to retire this system at some point and upgrade to something like 7800x3d and some newer GPU next year , just not sure what GPU to get with how the prices are atm (and i want NVIDIA), anyway i was just not sure if the reboots were from the PSU (and i have to change it right away) or it was just my aggressive CO (tho it was working just fine till a month ago). - Thermaltake seemed good back then, got it on offer , didnt pay too much attention to the PSUs back then

Edit: Any suggestion on a good PSU at a decent price? I dont need high W , mostly im going to go for 7800x3d + RTX 4070 or something like that in the future , i have a small case (that i like).

 

[Knight47]

It's a Smart PSU, meaning it's was a very smart choice to buy.

Yes, ripple may be higher or even double compared to other units, you can force voltages out of spec since it uses ancient group regulated topology and OPP only works once(it kills the PSU), but people use worse units.

I would use this very smart Thermaltake Smart as long it works, it's rated for 100,000 hrs minimum, ballpark estimate 8 hours a day which should make it good for 34 years!!!

 

[Double-Click]

Any suggestion on a good PSU at a decent price? I dont need high W , mostly im going to go for 7800x3d + RTX 4070 or something like that in the future , i have a small case (that i like).

10-year warranty, no nonsense brand (Seasonic is the OEM), and it's not a large unit.
Wish the ATX 3.0 models were out when I built my system but such is life.

https://www.amazon.com/Seasonic-Full-Modular-Warranty-Application-SSR-750FX3/dp/B0C5B6PXJ7?th=1

 

[Bill_Bright]

Edit: Any suggestion on a good PSU at a decent price?

Why? There's no reason to replace a PSU just because it has a few years on it AS LONG AS it is working fine. No where have you indicated you are having issues with freezes, sudden reboots, or shutdowns - typical symptoms of a failing PSU. You didn't even complain about coil whine or fan bearing noise.

Just make sure the case is clean of heat trapping dust, you have decent air flow through the case and enjoy your computer.

 

[Vya Domus]

I guess the question is do you have any issues ? Those readings are not accurate, if the voltage drops were problematic you'd know by now because it would crash the system all the time.

By the way the GPU readings are from the GPU not the PSU.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Its an old PSU , Thermaltake Smart SE 550-600w (i think), i just noticed that the voltages are a bit low even under moderate loads.

Have you measured them directly with a multimeter? Using software readings can be a less than accurate method of measurement. Also, if you're not hitting max load or overloading, chances are that PSU will be fine.

I guess the question is do you have any issues ? Those readings are not accurate, if the voltage drops were problematic you'd know by know because it would crash the system all the time.

This, and...

By the way the GPU readings are from the GPU not the PSU.

...this.

If you're not having power problems, you don't need to replace it. That PSU is a good quality unit and it isn't THAT old.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Those readings are not accurate, if the voltage drops were problematic you'd know by know because it would crash the system all the time.

We don't know if accurate or not. Since the readings ARE within allowed tolerances and since the OP has not indicated there are problems with crashing, that would suggest they are fairly accurate.

And for the record, software monitoring of voltages "IS" accurate. All the software is doing is reading a number value provided by the sensor. It is just like you or me seeing the number 837659 on a meter. Unless we are blind, we can assume we are accurately reading 837659.

The issue is the sensors. Is the very low-tech sensor accurately reading the actual voltage? We don't know unless we put a known to be accurate voltmeter on test points.

 

[izy]

Conflicting opinions , let me see how it goes after i adjusted the CO , seems to be fine now, i pref to keep it than just replacing it for now as its a hell to replace it in this case in the first place.

Have you measured them directly with a multimeter? Using software readings can be a less than accurate method of measurement. Also, if you're not hitting max load or overloading, chances are that PSU will be fine.

I didnt , only saw this in HWINFO.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I didnt , only saw this in HWINFO.

Definitely get a mutlimeter and measure those voltages directly. When you do, keep in mind that variations of 5% are considered within spec. So the 5V rail measuring 5.25V or 4.75V is fine and is not an indication of a problem with the PSU. Likewise, the 12V can read 12.6V or 11.4V and still be within spec.

EDIT:
Also keep in mind that when the system is under full load, voltage droop of another 5% is normal and very common. Again, not an indication of PSU failure.

 

[izy]

Definitely get a mutlimeter and measure those voltages directly. When you do, keep in mind that variations of 5% are considered within spec. So the 5V rail measuring 5.25V or 4.75V is fine and is not an indication of a problem with the PSU. Likewise, the 12V can read 12.6V or 11.4V and still be within spec.

EDIT:
Also keep in mind that when the system is under full load, voltage droop of another 5% is normal and very common. Again, not an indication of PSU failure.

Good to know , thanks, only worried because i had those reboots, seems fine for the moment .. probably CPU got worse or the bios changed something.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Good to know , thanks, only worried because i had those reboots, seems fine for the moment .. probably CPU got worse or the bios changed something.

Maybe. Without getting directly hands-on, none of us can give you a definitive answer, but based on what you've stated and the screenshot above, that PSU seems solid. In that screenshot, the system seems under a good load and at that load, the voltages seems very reasonable.

 

[Why_Me]

CPU Curve Optimizer.

Well , yeah .. it did fine back in the day when i was running 280x + 1700x (way higher W, and yeah that old it is), i didnt want to replace anything that was just working because i was thinking to retire this system at some point and upgrade to something like 7800x3d and some newer GPU next year , just not sure what GPU to get with how the prices are atm (and i want NVIDIA), anyway i was just not sure if the reboots were from the PSU (and i have to change it right away) or it was just my aggressive CO (tho it was working just fine till a month ago). - Thermaltake seemed good back then, got it on offer , didnt pay too much attention to the PSUs back then

Edit: Any suggestion on a good PSU at a decent price? I dont need high W , mostly im going to go for 7800x3d + RTX 4070 or something like that in the future , i have a small case (that i like).

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/zF...lly-modular-atx-power-supply-mag-a850gl-pcie5
MSI MAG A850GL PCIE5 850W 80+ Gold $89.99

MAG A850GL PCIE5 | Power Supply | Overflow With Power

The MAG A850GL PCIE5 power supply is designed to be ready for GeForce RTX^TM 4070 Ti and other graphics cards thanks to its ATX 3.0 and PCIe 5.0 support.

www.msi.com

 

[Panther_Seraphin]

How is that going to tell you? Cheap no name PSUs can last for years and years. And the best models from the best brands can die after a few weeks.

@izy - According to the ATX Form Factor standard, PSUs must maintain voltage tolerances within ±5% of required specifications.

Acceptable tolerance maximums:

​

12VDC ±5% = 11.4 to 12.6VDC​

5VDC ±5% = 4.75 to 5.25VDC​

3.3VDC ±5% = 3.14 to 3.47VDC​

​

Your PSU is fine - according to the right side of your screen shot. If you are referring the 11.08V on your GPU rail, that may indicate a regulator issue with the motherboard, or graphics solution.

12v is only ±5% in ATX12VO standard and looks like recenty ATX 2.3x+ standards

ATX 3.0 is actually +5% to -7% for some reason and older ATX2.x power supplies had a ±10% on the 12v rail under peak load but ±5% under other conditions.

 

[Bill_Bright]

ATX 3.0 is actually +5% to -7% for some reason

According to the official Design Guide the change to -7% is,

to allow for the power excursion requirements now described in Section Section 3.1.

It goes on to say the nominal "could" be changed to 12.1 or 12.2 to compensate. But "could" does not mean "will". So that leaves it up to the manufacturers.

older ATX2.x power supplies had a ±10%

True, but that was much older. It has been ±5% for many years now.

Another significant change (IMO) is the Hold-up Time requirement has been eased up - which frankly I am not happy with. It used to be required PSUs maintain output, with maximum loads, a minimum of 17ms - something sadly, many PSUs (including otherwise excellent rated PSUs) failed to do.

Now it is only 12ms at 100% load and "recommended" 17ms at 80% load. Fortunately, most "good" UPS with AVR are able to react and cutover over to battery backup in 10ms or less.