"What went wrong with Gaming"

[DeathtoGnomes]

I ran across this via Reddit and watched it. It is a bit interesting as it explains how players were brainwashed (tricked??) in MMO games into spending huge amounts of $$, for simpleton items like horse armor, and kinda explains the start of Pay2Win in games. P2W with cosmetics is the 'stroke my ego' game.

I think it also explains why my gamin habits tend to keep away from such games or dont play them for any length of meaningful time. Free2Plays games like to call it supporting the developer, and how thats just the first hook to get you to spend more money later on all to justify that "Its a business model" narrative.

Warning: This video might make you mad.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

I agree with your Stance and that video, some game trends need to die but aren't likely to alas.
So I too don't buy in.

 

[P4-630]

I prefer single player games mostly, I'm not into MMO's...

 

[TumbleGeorge]

Never paid in free to play roleplaying games. Only buy few small cheap packs in one online strategy before many years.

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
I tend not to get games that you have to build some sort of dressed character it seems so childish I loose interest before the game even starts so yeah what is this nonsense fortnite lol grow up and get a life

 

[TumbleGeorge]

Hi,
I tend not to get games that you have to build some sort of dressed character it seems so childish I loose interest before the game even starts so yeah what is this nonsense fortnite lol grow up and get a life

All electronic games are BS because we can play games in real live.
I really don't understand how we have been zombified to prefer to hang on the screen of various electronic devices for a large part of our free time? Perhaps indoctrination from the cradle, with supportive suggestion through hypnosis in advertisements?

 

[64K]

Free To Play. There's your red flag right there because there is nothing free in gaming. The development and maintenance of the game and the servers has to be paid for somehow. Sometimes the developer makes the game a grind-fest if you don't spend some money on microtransactions. Sometimes they set the game up where it's Pay To Win and if you don't spend some money on microtransactions then you will lose.

Best to just skip Free To Play games and if you don't then you will surely get milked by the developer with microtransactions.

 

[natr0n]

Answer greed. Money is the root of all evil.

The days of "pre internet" when games were complete and shipped were good times.

 

[thebluebumblebee]

Answer greed. Money is the root of all evil.

Misquote. It's “the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils.”

 

[Sithaer]

Free To Play. There's your red flag right there because there is nothing free in gaming. The development and maintenance of the game and the servers has to be paid for somehow. Sometimes the developer makes the game a grind-fest if you don't spend some money on microtransactions. Sometimes they set the game up where it's Pay To Win and if you don't spend some money on microtransactions then you will lose.

Best to just skip Free To Play games and if you don't then you will surely get milked by the developer with microtransactions.

You can play free to play and not spend a dime on the game, I've been doing that all the time and I had plenty of fun with those games since I liked the game itself.
Its more like ppl not having self controll/having too much money or kids who don't even know whats any of that.

I've played a free2play MMO for ~7 years and I only ever bought some cosmetics in total less than 100$ spent over 7 years everything else I gained/attained in the game on my own so I would say it was well worth it considering how much a triple AAA game cost with 10-25 hours long playthrough on average and with this game I had a lot of fun for years and made some long term friends too. 'a significant one too who is still my friend after ~10 years'
Also playing a mobile gacha/idle game for 2 and half years now casually but on a daily basis and I'm yet to spend any money on it and just started a new mobile gacha game 1+ month ago with the same mindset.

Don't get me wrong I'm also not a fan of this whole cash grab thing but ppl who keep burning a fortune in such games are also to blame partially that more and more games with this business model are relased.

Hi,
I tend not to get games that you have to build some sort of dressed character it seems so childish I loose interest before the game even starts so yeah what is this nonsense fortnite lol grow up and get a life

To me that sounds like an oldschool/uptight way of thinking, at the end of the day its a game and if you have fun playing it and dressing up a character then its not gonna make you a worse person + you can sill lead a perfectly healthy grown up life while playing such games. 'I have married/family friends who play such games and they are non the worse for it'

 

[JATownes]

Loot boxes and pay to win schemes are the reason I quit playing any multiplayer games for the most part. Still enjoy some BF4 with my buddies and kids from time to time, but that is only because it allows private servers still.

I usually stay away from "free to play" games, as I assume they are either pay to win, or full of ads. I do not mind spending money on a good experience, but it seems single player games are what I enjoy now when I have free time. When you have kids, the ability to pause and walk-away becomes pretty critical.

 

[AsRock]

Answer greed. Money is the root of all evil.

The days of "pre internet" when games were complete and shipped were good times.

Now you have to wait 1-3 years to actually get the full game and not pay $100-$150 for it.

Whats wrong is people think stuff is "free" when it says it is, nothings free as it always cost some thing. Like people bitching about Path Of Exile complaining it's PtW, it is but it isn't as you can play the whole campaign without paying a dime.

Playing further than that is were it's going to get you but if you just spent 30-60hr's playing the campaign maybe you should pay a little for it and if done right you can keep playing with what you got if you did not fall in the trap of cosmetics and just got storage space.

 

[dirtyferret]

It is a bit interesting as it explains how players were brainwashed (tricked??) in MMO games into spending huge amounts of $$

"Old School RPGMMO's" only had monthly subscription fees and use the carrot on a stick model to upgrade your gear

I prefer single player games mostly, I'm not into MMO's...

same but I also play WoW classic and even the current WoW as a single player.

Free To Play. There's your red flag right there because there is nothing free in gaming.

in software, if the product is free...you are the product

Answer greed. Money is the root of all evil.

The days of "pre internet" when games were complete and shipped were good times.

I still have memories have having to call (or worse snail mail) the developer for a patch that would be mailed to me in two weeks or more just so I could get the patch to make the game work

Misquote. It's “the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils.”

100%

Whats wrong is people think stuff is "free" when it says it is, nothings free as it always cost some thing.

I think gaming has changed in many ways in the last 20 years or so like any other industry but a major part of the problem is also the dominance of a handful of publishers buying up all these developers. The stock holders are now the customer as opposed to the gamers. The games I'm interested in each year become less and less.

 

[Pumper]

The boomer billionaires who never played a single game in their lives decided that it's a good avenue to make a buck, that's what happened.

 

[eidairaman1]

I agree with your Stance and that video, some game trends need to die but aren't likely to alas.
So I too don't buy in.

Epic Games of the UT 2004 Era was Great, after UT3 came down being involved with Midway things have only gone down hill with Fortnite...

Now you have to wait 1-3 years to actually get the full game and not pay $100-$150 for it.

Whats wrong is people think stuff is "free" when it says it is, nothings free as it always cost some thing. Like people bitching about Path Of Exile complaining it's PtW, it is but it isn't as you can play the whole campaign without paying a dime.

Playing further than that is were it's going to get you but if you just spent 30-60hr's playing the campaign maybe you should pay a little for it and if done right you can keep playing with what you got if you did not fall in the trap of cosmetics and just got storage space.

I think Only appearance packs should be optional to pay for whether you want it immediately (cash) or if you grind your way (in game currency/points). No performance Enhancements should be able to be paid for, only earned in game. P2W should be banned.

 

[Space Lynx]

Nothing went wrong with gaming, in fact we live in a golden age of gaming. Loads to choose from, now I am off to play some indie games instead of giving anymore time to this nonsensical drivel, if you want to play stupid games that suck you dry of money, well that is your choice, there are loads of other options, or god forbid you know... play backlog or replay old games you enjoyed.

 

[ThrashZone]

Epic Games of the UT 2004 Era was Great, after UT3 came down being involved with Midway things have only gone down hill with Fortnite...


I think Only appearance packs should be optional to pay for whether you want it immediately (cash) or if you grind your way (in game currency/points). No performance Enhancements should be able to be paid for, only earned in game. P2W should be banned.

Hi,
Don't be talking smack about fortnite

 

[Vayra86]

All electronic games are BS because we can play games in real live.
I really don't understand how we have been zombified to prefer to hang on the screen of various electronic devices for a large part of our free time? Perhaps indoctrination from the cradle, with supportive suggestion through hypnosis in advertisements?

Its safe.

Humans love to be safe. Having all the stuff of life under your fingertips and still being safe is for many the ultimate wet dream.

This is why social media are something we cant handle. Now, you give people not just the world at their fingertips but also a megaphone. There is no physical or mental component anymore either that might define you, or could stand for something. You are anonymous. And you can be what you like to be.

In games, this idea works too.

Nothing went wrong with gaming, in fact we live in a golden age of gaming. Loads to choose from, now I am off to play some indie games instead of giving anymore time to this nonsensical drivel, if you want to play stupid games that suck you dry of money, well that is your choice, there are loads of other options, or god forbid you know... play backlog or replay old games you enjoyed.

Whats missing now is the collective idea of it. The high variety and fragmentation of playerbases made everything pretty much interchangeable. When we destroyed vanilla WoW or when the whole school was playing UT99, that was 'the thing'. You did the thing, and defined yourself by maybe a team color, or a class with a certain tier of acquired gear. Your skill/dedication showed through it.

Maybe similar applies to Fortnite today; and there you have it: we dont like that. Fragmentation! And now, you get matchmaking with similar skill. The relevance of skill was changed with fashion. Again circling back to social media: Fortnite = Instagram

The boomer billionaires who never played a single game in their lives decided that it's a good avenue to make a buck, that's what happened.

And a new generation of gamers (gen Z) is going full tilt on that slot machine. Who's worse? Apparently the boomers failed at general values in raising kids somewhere, or it got lost along the way between millenials?

Maybe the true engine is the internet Thats the one defining feature of all these generations: gen Z doesnt know the world without it, the boomer gets the real world best, the milennials tried it all and were left in doubt.

"Old School RPGMMO's" only had monthly subscription fees and use the carrot on a stick model to upgrade your gear

same but I also play WoW classic and even the current WoW as a single player.

in software, if the product is free...you are the product

I still have memories have having to call (or worse snail mail) the developer for a patch that would be mailed to me in two weeks or more just so I could get the patch to make the game work

100%

I think gaming has changed in many ways in the last 20 years or so like any other industry but a major part of the problem is also the dominance of a handful of publishers buying up all these developers. The stock holders are now the customer as opposed to the gamers. The games I'm interested in each year become less and less.

The customer still pays and shareholders still play the market. No input is no profit. Educate and kill input of that money and we will be seeing good games again. Simple!

Except for the fact we are easy to manipulate see story above Best weapons we have: education. Wisdom. Experience. Spreading the word and recognizing how you yourself gets manipulated every single day...

 

[Space Lynx]

Its safe.

Humans love to be safe. Having all the stuff of life under your fingertips and still being safe is for many the ultimate wet dream.

This is why social media are something we cant handle. Now, you give people not just the world at their fingertips but also a megaphone. There is no physical or mental component anymore either that might define you, or could stand for something. You are anonymous. And you can be what you like to be.

In games, this idea works too.


Whats missing now is the collective idea of it. The high variety and fragmentation of playerbases made everything pretty much interchangeable. When we destroyed vanilla WoW or when the whole school was playing UT99, that was 'the thing'. You did the thing, and defined yourself by maybe a team color, or a class with a certain tier of acquired gear. Your skill/dedication showed through it.

Maybe similar applies to Fortnite today; and there you have it: we dont like that. Fragmentation! And now, you get matchmaking with similar skill. The relevance of skill was changed with fashion. Again circling back to social media: Fortnite = Instagram


And a new generation of gamers (gen Z) is going full tilt on that slot machine. Who's worse? Apparently the boomers failed at general values in raising kids somewhere, or it got lost along the way between millenials?

Maybe the true engine is the internet Thats the one defining feature of all these generations: gen Z doesnt know the world without it, the boomer gets the real world best, the milennials tried it all and were left in doubt.


The customer still pays and shareholders still play the market. No input is no profit. Educate and kill input of that money and we will be seeing good games again. Simple!

Except for the fact we are easy to manipulate see story above

I mostly only play single player games outside of Magic the Gathering, even my original Playstation 2 catalog was mostly single player games. I know what you are saying though.

For me personally, I still think it is a golden age of gaming, I legit have like 500+ games I really want to play, I won't get to all of them, lol

 

[Vayra86]

I mostly only play single player games outside of Magic the Gathering, even my original Playstation 2 catalog was mostly single player games. I know what you are saying though.

For me personally, I still think it is a golden age of gaming, I legit have like 500+ games I really want to play, I won't get to all of them, lol

Yeah there is SO MUCH content. I agree. People who complain about the state of gaming play the wrong stuff, and pay for the wrong stuff. The yearly CoD or Fifa still exists because of that and they breed followers and new addicts to nonsense.

All things that are under the radar are good. If it gets popular, it gets eaten by commercial BS. The problem arises when we then keep feeding that beast hoping the old glory might return - it NEVER does. If you want that, play the original.

 

[dirtyferret]

The customer still pays and shareholders still play the market.

I was going more down the line that games are becoming less niche and less unique to attract the widest audience possible, very similar to the modern big budget movie industry. Assassins Creed needs to be more "RPG" like because look at what the witcher III did in sales but not too cRPG because that's a niche audience. Dragon Age needs to be more "console friendly" than its inspiration Baldurs Gate because that audience is too niche...oh wait people like MMOs? Let's make Dragon Age III more MMO like.

 

[Space Lynx]

I was going more down the line that games are becoming less niche and less unique to attract the widest audience possible, very similar to the modern big budget movie industry. Assassins Creed needs to be more "RPG" like because look at what the witcher III did in sales but not too cRPG because that's a niche audience. Dragon Age needs to be more "console friendly" than its inspiration Baldurs Gate because that audience is too niche...oh wait people like MMOs? Let's make Dragon Age III more MMO like.

I get what you are saying, for example I am playing God of War/God of War Ragnarok and having a blast. Next up is Imposter Factory to finish off the To The Moon series, and I need to beat the expansions of X-Morph Defense still. Like I said, golden age. All my bases are covered. I can keep going, I legit have a massive backlog.

I did finish 3 games this month and had fun though, gaming is about fun and/or interesting storytelling/art/music. If the games you are playing are exploiting you as a human being, then play something else.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

Yeah there is SO MUCH content. I agree. People who complain about the state of gaming play the wrong stuff, and pay for the wrong stuff. The yearly CoD or Fifa still exists because of that and they breed followers and new addicts to nonsense.

All things that are under the radar are good. If it gets popular, it gets eaten by commercial BS. The problem arises when we then keep feeding that beast hoping the old glory might return - it NEVER does. If you want that, play the original.

Aww come on, COD is alrighty surely and FIFA 98 isn't on pc

,<Mooches off to find an emulator.

 

[Space Lynx]

Aww come on, COD is alrighty surely and FIFA 98 isn't on pc

,<Mooches off to find an emulator.

I played Call of Duty Infinite Warfare campaign a month ago, only took about 7 to 8 hours to beat it, but it was some of the most fun I have had in ages. I won't be playing any multi of it, and it is an older CoD, but man that team did space combat so well, it was honestly a lot of fun. I feel bad for people who only ever played multi and skipped over that campaign, truly a hidden gem.

Recommend playing at high refresh, 125 fps is the cap for single player campaign, the space combat is insanely fun in the campaign.

I also agree with emulators being cool too though, lots of fun to be had there.

edit: I have no interest in playing any other CoD's, it was a one off for me cause I was in the mood for sci-fi combat.

 

[Kapone33]

The only MMO I ever spent any real time on was Defiance. That was the TV show connected to the Game. It made for cool Saturday morning Alien drop Missions with hundreds of PVE enemies and bosses that needed 360 degree coverage to deal with. The allure of skins and pay2 to win for me was Marvel Superheroes. To me that was better than the Avengers Game they released and way more interesting. As both of those Games are no longer playable (Haven't tried with Defiance). It's not all bad though MMOs are one part of the experience.

I am not in anyway involved with Humble but using Choice for a year will guarantee that you will enjoy Gaming on your PC and love the Games you had no idea about that are that good. If you download Ubisoft Connect and own any Assassins Creed they will give you any of the previous one when a new one releases. GOG is a nostalgia giant and as maligned as Epic is if you got Death Stranding for free and actually played it you don't mind at all.

Let's talk about Racing Games with modern Graphics and when you play Redout2 in street view you won't lament it. Let's talk about Action RPGs that if you don't want to pay, Path of Exile and if you want to pay Grim Dawn if you want to play less Torclight. If you are into Warhammer you should be over the moon with Action Rpgs, Strategy, FPS and RTS all covered.

There is also the fact that regardless of the box that we are put in for the narrative of what people play that the 50 Games that are reviewed are more nuanced that it seems. I am looking directly at TWWH and will put my 2000- hours of Gameplay to give an informed opinion on performance vs the Benchmark run that reviewers use. The benchmark for TWWH is not even close to the reality of Gameplay. If you want to Gauge the performance of TWWH you need to load a late Game 4x4 20 stack, largest unit count, have wizards with at least 2 different spell classes and flying units battle that are all controlled in real time. Thankfully they have slowed down spell casting as that is some serious organized chaos and can bring your PC to it's knees but the 3070 is faster than the 6800 in benchmarks until I put my 6500XT against my laptop 3060 and was surprised by the difference raw clock speed can make when actually playing the Game.