Intel UHD 615 - Constant red "EDP Other" limit under RING column on High GPU load

[CantThinkOfAName]

System
It's a GPD WIN 2 driven by a m3-8100y with a Intel UHD 615 iGPU.
The package power (CPU + GPU) can be easily set up to 15W with Throttlestop or Intel XTU.
I've stable undervolt values of -80mv on CPU and -110mv on iGPU.

Issue
When I run GPU stress tests, the Intel 615 reach 848Mhz with a consumption of 5/6 W with undervolting, and 7/8 W without.
During these tests, Throttlestop (v 8.74) shows a constant blinking red limit "EDP OTHER" under the RING column.
The specs of the Intel 615 show 1050Mhz as top freq but, when included withing a m3-8100y, the max freq is limited to 900Mhz due to the low power profile of the processor.
The limit doesn't show up when I run CPU stress tests.

Did I hit some GPU-specific power limit? can I work around this limit to at least reach the max freq 900Mhz as described in the specifications?
Specifications link: https://ark.intel.com/content/www/u...-8100y-processor-4m-cache-up-to-3-40-ghz.html

What I tried:
- Set Max Performance power-save options for both GPU and CPU.
- Set max package power (15W).
- Increased IccMax values as suggested in another thread.
- Set Intel Power Balance to CPU=0 and GPU=31 (and viceversa). Nothing changed
- Set IGPU=10 and IGPU=2 in the ThrottleStop.ini file and nothing changed.


Thanks in advance for any help

 

[unclewebb]

If you are only seeing EDP OTHER blinking red, that is usually not related to the turbo power limits. Turbo power limit related throttling will show PL1 and PL2 in red, usually combined with RING - EDP OTHER in red.

EDP stands for electrical design point. This is usually related to one of the current limits. Did you increase both IccMax core and cache values to their maximum of 255.75? Did you also increase the PP0 Current Limit to 256? The Intel public documentation is not clear at all about what other things might be included and trigger EDP OTHER to flash red. Usually current limit throttling will show EDP OTHER in red across all 3 domains.

The Intel specs list 900 MHz as the Graphics Max Dynamic Frequency. With a constant load, it might not be able to reach this speed. It is also possible that the manufacturer decided that in a small device like the GPD Win 2, 850 MHz is good enough. It is possible that this limit is set in the Memory Mapped IO or elsewhere.

For testing, try using the GPU-Z built in render test. Does GPU-Z only show 850 MHz during this test? Any throttling?

Post some screenshots that show how you have ThrottleStop setup. Include one so I can see the main screen of ThrottleStop while Limit Reasons shows EDP OTHER in red.

 

[CantThinkOfAName]

I went back to a pristine situation:
- Fresh Windows 10 installation + all windows updates as per today
- Last Intel Graphic Drivers (7985)
- dptf is still enabled
- Intel XTU with which I set: CPU: -88mv, GPU: -100mv; "Turbo Boost Power Max" and "Turbo Boost Short Power Max" to 15W
- ThrottleStop 8.74 with clean .ini and nothing set yet, to be used only to check limit reasons for the moment
- ThrottleStop noticed with no issues the undervolt values and Power Limits set with XTU
- GPU-Z for monitoring and logging GPU values

Test 1: XTU GPU stress test (5 min run):
- Limits: RING EDP OTHER constantly, since the beginning
- PKG Power: 8/9W
- GPU Power: 5.8W constant
- GPU Load: 100% constant
- Temps: <= 72C
- Freq: constant 850Mhz, hit once 900Mhz for ~1 sec
- log file:

Test 2: Ungine Heaven - Full benchmark run (4.5 min):
- Limits: RING EDP OTHER and CORE PL2 constantly. They don't seem to have a particular limiting effect (PKG Power still grows and GPU frequency stays at max)
- PKG Power: 12/13 W (because heaven pushes also the CPU far)
- GPU Power: up to 5.8W
- GPU Load: constant 100%. Drops briefly for 1/2 sec when the scene changes
- CPU & GPU temps: up to ~85C
- Freq: constant 850Mhz, hit twice 900Mhz for ~1 sec
- log file in the attachments

Test 3: GPU-Z Render test (5 min run):
- Limits: Ring EDP OTHER constantly. CORE PL2 kicked in 6 times (almost once a minute) without a visible effect on performances.
- PKG Power: 8/9 W
- GPU Power: constant 4.7W
- GPU Load: constant 90%
- GPU temps: <= 70C
- Freq: mostly 850Mhz, hit 42 TIMES 900Mhz
- log file in the attachments

Phase 2:
- Set IGPU=10 in the ThrottleStop.ini
- Check "Disable and lock Turbo Power Limits" (it shouldn't have an effect but why not)
- Set IccMax - for "CPU Core", "CPU Cache" and "Intel GPU" - to 255.75
- Set "PPO Current Limit" to 256

Test 4: 2nd GPU-Z Render test (5 min run):
- No visible differences with the previous render test. 900Mhz was reached only 3 times more (45). definitively within the error tolerance.
- log file in the attachments



Conclusions:
- The only Power limit observed was PL2 but weirdly was on the core and not on the GPU... and it didn't show any negative effects on performance.
- GPU-Z Render test was quite interesting. A constant GPU load of 90% - instead of 100% - reduced the power of 19% (1.1W) and allowed to reach 900Mhz from time to time.
- I wonder if the GPU would be free to reach 900Mhz more often if I throttle the current process to use max ~90% of GPU


Is there something else that may be worthy to try? "TDP Level Control"? or perhaps there is a PP1 Current Limit as well I can tweak with RWEverything?

 

[unclewebb]

Open up the FIVR window and see what is being reported in the monitoring table for Speed Shift EPP. I am not sure if your device gives you access to the Windows High Performance power profile. The Windows Best Performance slider might not be available either.

An EPP value of 0 is necessary for maximum performance. 80 or 84 is like the traditional Windows Balanced profile and is usually OK too. If the FIVR table shows that your CPU is using an EPP setting of 128 or greater, this can limit your maximum performance.

I will have more time tomorrow to look at your data.

 

[CantThinkOfAName]

Thank you for your time and help!

By default, Win10 comes with a balanced power profile with the Windows Best Performance slider that I can set to Best Performance.
FIVR Window shows a Speed Shift EPP of 84 and this what I used for my tests

However, I could easily create a high performance power profile with the dedicated wizard. I made sure of setting max performance for CPU and GPU on battery in the advanced options.
FIVR Window shows a Speed Shift EPP of 0. Running the GPU-Z render test with this profile, I get a 100% load for 5 min, never hitting 900Mhz.

The m3-8100Y has a single core freq of 3.4Ghz and double core freq of 2.7Ghz. In fact, FIVR shows x34 multiplier on core 1 and x27 on core 2.
I then noticed from ThrottleStop that, from time to time, all thread gets over the limits reaching 2.76Ghz.
With the high performance profile - for some reasons I am not complaining about xD - all thread can reach 3Ghz even for a consistent amount of time without changing the multipliers with ThrottleStop.
I then had a suspect and set the multiplier to x26 for all cores and... the PL2 limit disappeared...

More and more, the 850Mhz max freq looks just like a physical limitation of the machine :/

 

[unclewebb]

More and more, the 850 MHz max freq looks just like a physical limitation of the machine

Just as Intel CPUs are limited to different multipliers depending on how many cores are loaded, it seems like your iGPU is also limited depending on how much it is loaded.

Windows 10 often times hides the High Performance power profile to prevent users from easily selecting it. Usually it is still available, it is just hidden. To access it you just need to open a command window and type in:

powercfg /s SCHEME_MIN

To go back to the Balanced power profile you can enter this command:

powercfg /s SCHEME_BALANCED

FIVR shows x34 multiplier on core 1 and x27 on core 2

When lightly loaded, the CPU will constantly alternate between the 27 multiplier and the 34 multiplier depending on how many cores are active. If one core is active, it uses the 34 multiplier and as soon as the second core becomes active, both cores use the same 27 multiplier. ThrottleStop is one of the few monitoring tools that can correctly and accurately show what your CPU is doing. The more background tasks you can eliminate, the more time your CPU will be able to spend at the higher multiplier. Here is an example of a lean system. People complain about Windows 10 but it is very lean when setup properly. Telemetry should be the first stuff to go.

Edit - Almost forgot. For the EDP OTHER constantly red, for testing purposes, try reducing the Min and Max Cache ratio to their lowest values and see if this throttling flag goes away.

Intel CPUs used to have a PP1 Current Limit in MSR 0x602. This seems to be rarely used or unavailable on any recent Intel CPUs. Bits [12:0] is where this limit used to be.

 

[CantThinkOfAName]

Windows 10 often times hides the High Performance power profile to prevent users from easily selecting it. Usually it is still available, it is just hidden. To access it you just need to open a command window and type in:

powercfg /s SCHEME_MIN

It wasn't really hidden for me, I just needed to create a High performance profile and call it "High Performance" to obtain the same result of powercfg /s SCHEME_MIN.
In fact, If i now run that command, Windows switches to that exact profile

Here is an example of a lean system. People complain about Windows 10 but it is very lean when setup properly. Telemetry should be the first stuff to go.

On Windows fresh installs, I usually run this debloater script that, among the other things, disable Telemetry

Edit - Almost forgot. For the EDP OTHER constantly red, for testing purposes, try reducing the Min and Max Cache ratio to their lowest values and see if this throttling flag goes away.

Changing Min and Max Cache ratio to 1 from the FIVR Window doesn't remove the EDP OTHER flag

Intel CPUs used to have a PP1 Current Limit in MSR 0x602. This seems to be rarely used or unavailable on any recent Intel CPUs. Bits [12:0] is where this limit used to be.

I've tried to access this registry but the system crashes. So, not a viable way for me :/


O.T. How can I reference a user when I add a QUOTE block in a reply?

 

[unclewebb]

I've tried to access this registry but the system crashes.

RWEverything likes to BSOD if you start looking at or adjusting the wrong stuff. Try using the Dump program which was written by Dufus on Notebook Review.

Dump.zip

drive.google.com

It will create a list of all of the MSR registers. MSR 0x602 likely does not exist for your CPU.

O.T. How can I reference a user when I add a QUOTE block in a reply?

You just need to left mouse click on and high light the text that the user wrote. You should see a pop up menu which says +Quote or Reply. This makes it easy to notify the person that you are responding to.

 

[CantThinkOfAName]

It will create a list of all of the MSR registers. MSR 0x602 likely does not exist for your CPU.

As you suspected, the registry doesn't exist.

I suppose the journey ends here, doesn't it?