Two-pass radiator ( inlet/outlet - mistake )

[FireFox]

Hello everyone.

Today a TPU member ( @Animalpak ) opened a thread and posted/asked a question about a radiator, in two of the answers to his question @Chrispy_ mentioned this:

unless it's a cross-flow radiator where the inlet is on the other end to the outlet.

then @Gruffalo.Soldier mentioned this:

All radiators are at least dual pass.

and that reminded me that i am using 3x Two-pass Rads and therefore i had a curiosity and asked myself, am i using the
correct inlet / outlet of my radiators, and am i using the correct fans orientation?

The answer is no, i made a mistake.
I visited the Hardware Labs website looking for the GTX Rad's manual but the page was down and so i continue Googling till i found a Forum where i confirmed my suspects.

I found this info:
That image below is borrowed from HWLabs, and does a great job telling you about the back to front (or vice versa) style flow in the Nemesis GTX radiators. This then means that you can optimize fan cooling by orienting them as per the recommendations above. This was followed during my own testing as well.

My mistake is that i am using the Scenario 1 but the fans are blowing air in the opposite direction as shown in the picture.

i also found another Forum where they recommend that the best conf is Scenario 2

Now, i would like to ask how much performance loss is there by using my current Conf?

Thanks in advance

 

[Chrispy_]

So the dual-core thing with discrete front and back flow loops just means that the radiator is effectively two thinner radiators folded over.

I lack the effort to draw the loop but rather than being an out-from-the-header-tank and back affair, it does that twice, once on the front and once on the back.

Plenty of thicker radiators use a pair of pipes per channel instead of a single pipe per channel, it looks like all XSPC have done is arrange dividers in the header and end tanks so that water travels four lengths of the radiator through a half-height channel instead of two lengths of the radiator through a full height channel.

As for whether it really matters about which way your air's flowing over the radiator now that it has a front and a back, probably not. Sure there might be measurable differences between two different orientations but unless you are so close to a critical threshold that 0.5C is the difference between stability and bluescreens, then it's likely irrelevant. The heat is still being transferred from the water to the air via the radiators and fans and if it was such a groundbreaking increase over the regular out-and-back radiator design everyone would be doing it. The reality is that the gains likely aren't worth the extra cost/hassle nor the extra flow restriction it causes. I'm sure in certain situations (such as a hypothetical big pump, small radiator scenario) it is the theoretical best solution, but it's like arguing which thermal paste is best - they're all good enough that you should really be worrying about other things unless you've already exhausted all other possible areas to find gains.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I'm not sure how much difference it would make. Are your temps ok? I guess you could switch it and see. Or maybe use push pull?

Basically, this is what the radiator does.

Normal 2 pass

 

[FireFox]

Basically, this is what the radiator does.

Found this: The Black Ice GTX series flow is different from other "Dual Pass

Single vs. dual pass radiators - "Cross-flow"

I'll be putting together a water cooling loop within the next two months and have been pondering about this for a week or so now. Basically, I'll be using a bay mounted res/pump and would love to have a cross flow rad because I could easily hide the first bit of tubing inside the bay and then...

www.overclock.net

Or maybe use push pull?

Would be too expensive

 

[Deleted member 24505]

Found this: The Black Ice GTX series flow is different from other "Dual Pass

Single vs. dual pass radiators - "Cross-flow"

I'll be putting together a water cooling loop within the next two months and have been pondering about this for a week or so now. Basically, I'll be using a bay mounted res/pump and would love to have a cross flow rad because I could easily hide the first bit of tubing inside the bay and then...

www.overclock.net

Would be too expensive

Still not sure it makes so much difference.

 

[joemama]

With this design, the higher the flow rate, the smaller the temperature difference will be, but I bet the actual will be barely noticeable for a computer radiator.

 

[Ferrum Master]

I would not stress over that. At max 2C difference.

 

[FireFox]

I would not stress over that. At max 2C difference.

But what about if with the right conf i can run the fans at lower rpm without hurting performance?

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
I use config 2 also on my gtx rads which I have four of them.
But then again I do intake on all rads no matter.

 

[FireFox]

But then again I do intake on all rads no matter.

In which port you have the inlet/outlet?

 

[ThrashZone]

In which port you have the inlet/outlet?

Hi,
Same as the diagram shows.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

In which port you have the inlet/outlet?

Scenario 2, port B in, A out

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
Other rads like a ek CE series which is my other rad it doesn't matter which port one uses seeing they are designed differently than dual core gtx rads are.

 

[mtcn77]

But what about if with the right conf i can run the fans at lower rpm without hurting performance?

That is how fish gills maximise oxygen extraction from water. It is a good point. Don't reflect on naysayers much. This is not to maximise performance at higher end, it is to avoid flow speed becoming significant. Also, this is why people advocate intake side radiators, thermal extraction is best when the thermal gradient is the most. It is a solid option, just not the best which is not the point. The point is the most compatible daily setup.

 

[FireFox]

Hi,
Same as the diagram shows.

Let's put it this way.
I am using scenario 2 but my inlet tubing is plugged to the outlet port and the outlet tubing is plugged to the inlet port.

 

[ThrashZone]

Let's put it this way.
I am using scenario 2 but my inlet tubing is plugged to the outlet port and the outlet tubing is plugged to the inlet port.

Hi,
Intake air using scenario 1 is what you're using then
Which is backwards but shouldn't make all that much difference if that is the best piping you can do

GTX is high rpm fan rads they optimize it with the diagram but as said difference is only a little.

 

[FireFox]

Hi,
Intake air using scenario 1 is what you're using then
Which is backwards but shouldn't make all that much difference if that is the best piping you can do

Yup, just that i have 2x 480 with the wrong conf.
Btw i don't have any problem redoing the tubing.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I still don't really think it matters, same as loop order does not.

 

[ThrashZone]

Yup, just that i have 2x 480 with the wrong conf.
Btw i don't have any problem redoing the tubing.

Hi,
Well if you ever want to optimize your rads on the next drain/ fluid change then do it

Come to think about it my front gtx rads are the same as yours now
It was my only choice though case is way to small.
But my top gtx rads are good.

 

[FireFox]

But my top gtx rads are good.

Same here.

Hi,
Well if you ever want to optimize your rads on the next drain/ fluid change then do it

I did it the wrong way by mistake.

I really hate myself for how my Loop looks, i have never done such a disgusting work before and therefore i will redo the tubing.

 

[mtcn77]

Same here.

I did it the wrong way by mistake.

I really hate myself for how my Loop looks, i have never done such a disgusting work before and therefore i will redo the tubing.

View attachment 215890

What seems to be the problem, I would rate it good since it won't trap air in the loops.

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
Yeah it happens

Only thing you might also consider is push/ pull fans/ fans on both sides these gtx rads are tight finned tough to get air through them lol

 

[FireFox]

Hi,
Yeah it happens

Only thing you might also consider is push/ pull fans/ fans on both sides these gtx rads are tight finned tough to get air through them lol

Another €200+ for fans it is not in my plans btw i thought many times about the push/ pull config

Edit
Tell me if i am wrong.
Shouldn't be better to use the 2x 480 to cool the CPU?

 

[FireFox]

Quick question Guys.

Inlet and outlet temp difference, how many degrees?

 

[Deleted member 24505]

Quick question Guys.

Inlet and outlet temp difference, how many degrees?

Would it not depend on the radiator size?