How and why did we become so obsessed with graphics?

[wheresmycar]

Kind of agree with this guy opinion.

As much as i love the growth in graphics realism or more importantly the potential going forward, i totally agree with this guy.... its still touch and go and sometimes the inconsistencies or lack of realism in achieving realism is evident. We have to admit we've come a long way from those block-2D or texture-less 3D play screeners. Atleast its something. Yep more work required for captivating and gameplay addictive titles but lucky for me im a simple MP shoot-em-up and strategy gamer and these categories are less story fixated hence WIN WIN here!

 

[Noci]

For me personally I had my second WOW moment in 1996 with the first Tombraider game. Instead of the WSAD (forward, back, left & right) restrictions as in the original Doom, we had more movement options, like going up and down (First wow moment was going from a monochrome monitor to a 14inch SVGA monitor by the way).
It was the period of the Voodoo 3DFX cards (which I couldn't afford), but the graphics of that time were improving rapidly, it was that time I developed an obsession, no an interrest in 3D graphics quality and got a lot of satisfation out of that. From 30FPS up to 60FPS was already a milestone and considered the sweetspot for the human eye.

Ever since I'm astonished by how far and fast graphics realism and their underlaying technology are improving untill we ultimatily will reach the Holy Grail of graphics were nobody can tell the difference between real or computer animated.
Of course this comes with a price, by ever more demanding hardware and investments of players to be able to enjoy this. It's a multi billion dollar business after all.

Today's society to me looks like; mine is bigger than your's and I need the best of the best and I need it now and I need more. This maybe an underlaying reason for all the pointless bitching the OP is referring to, as patience is not a common virtue anymore.
We've come a long way, but still we have some miles to go to reach that ultimate goal of photo realistic graphics without being able of telling what is real or not, What will be next dispute then? Realism of the story line, virtual recreation with escape from reality.... you tell me.

 

[nguyen]

Hm...asking tech enthusiasts why they are so obsessed with graphics is like going to Ferrari showrooms and ask customers why are they so obsessed with fast cars LOL.

The gaming industry is simply going where the money is, i highly doubt the opinions of some individuals even matters

 

[AusWolf]

Hm...asking tech enthusiasts why they are so obsessed with graphics is like going to Ferrari showrooms and ask customers why are they so obsessed with fast cars LOL.

By "obsessed", I don't mean the people who visit Ferrari showrooms. I mean the people who buy the most expensive Ferrari and talk shit about those who buy the cheaper model. Or those who regularly go to track days and talk shit about other sports car owners who don't. In gaming terms, those who keep parroting that you have to use X feature, or you have to play at X resolution to truly enjoy the game, without any consideration for the game's story, or gameplay, or any other essential quality of it whatsoever.

The gaming industry is simply going where the money is, i highly doubt the opinions of some individuals even matters

That doesn't mean we shouldn't talk about it.

Today's society to me looks like; mine is bigger than your's and I need the best of the best and I need it now and I need more. This maybe an underlaying reason for all the pointless bitching the OP is referring to, as patience is not a common virtue anymore.

Exactly my point. How did we come from enjoying better and better graphics to bitching about using X feature vs Y, and making games and technology a never ending penis measuring contest?

 

[Fourstaff]

When I first played Elder Scrolls IV Oblivion 15 years ago, I was blown away by the graphics. Fast forward to 2020 when I finally played Witcher 3 (released in 2016), I was once away blown by the graphics. I could just sit in Touissant watching the weather roll. This year, the best game I have played is Zelda: Breath of the Wild (long overdue) and Tears of the Kingdom. The graphics is obsolete when BOTW was launched in 2017. I don't require games to have good graphics, but it certainly helps if its amazing.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

By "obsessed", I don't mean the people who visit Ferrari showrooms. I mean the people who buy the most expensive Ferrari and talk shit about those who buy the cheaper model. Or those who regularly go to track days and talk shit about other sports car owners who don't. In gaming terms, those who keep parroting that you have to use X feature, or you have to play at X resolution to truly enjoy the game, without any consideration for the game's story, or gameplay, or any other essential quality of it whatsoever.

I kinda see what you're saying it would be like a 4090/7900XTX owner saying well if you don't have this card are you even a pc gamer or if you are not rocking 4k you might as well be on console.

I have cards that are good at all 3 resolutions just for fun really and honestly if all I could afford or choose to afford was my R5 7600/6700XT systems it's more than enjoyable experience I mean there is always gonna be fomo regardless though everyone would have 7800X3D/4090 systems if costed the same as a PS5.

As far as pushing X features vs Y features that's just the nature of games in 2023 it isn't 2005 anymore where all there was was rasterization now there is RT, AI, frame interpolation, UE5 is doing it's thing, that's just where we are now and I'm sure even more technologies will be introduced as time goes on.

Pretty excited to see what the coalition does with UE5 they developed the tech demo portion of the Matrix Awakens.

How happy or unhappy you are with your gaming experience or what features you can or cannot use shouldn't be influenced by others or what others feel is better or more important.

I couldn't care less if someone likes a feature I don't good for them it makes 0 difference to my gaming experience or how I want to use my hardware.

There's always going to be a debate over what best and that's a good thing we are not robots who all think the same our views on hardware are our own it doesn't mean someone can't be excited about a new feature their particular hardware offers though.

Also this has been a pretty poor generation in general so nothing better to talk about I guess than features lol.

Bottom line improvement is good and we definitely need all these companies to do well and stay competitive on hardware, features etc it's not good when one is way ahead and it never will be.

While I'm excited about where things will be 10 years from now I do wonder if it'll get to the point where nobody can afford it. First world problem I guess.

 

[AusWolf]

I kinda see what you're saying it would be like a 4090/7900XTX owner saying well if you don't have this card are you even a pc gamer or if you are not rocking 4k you might as well be on console.

Exactly. Or someone saying that you have to use DLSS/FSR/RT/whatever, or you have to have 100 FPS minimum, otherwise, you're missing out on something huge. In my opinion, we're playing the same game and are enjoying the same story and atmosphere regardless of these technicalities, so no one is really missing out on anything. If I want to play at 1080p low with 30 FPS on an iGPU (I don't, but let's say that I do just as an example), then why do some people feel entitled to tell me that I'm wrong?

 

[Hyderz]

Exactly. Or someone saying that you have to use DLSS/FSR/RT/whatever, or you have to have 100 FPS minimum, otherwise, you're missing out on something huge. In my opinion, we're playing the same game and are enjoying the same story and atmosphere regardless of these technicalities, so no one is really missing out on anything. If I want to play at 1080p low with 30 FPS on an iGPU (I don't, but let's say that I do just as an example), then why do some people feel entitled to tell me that I'm wrong?

Guess some people have more money than sense, just as a different context there are people who look down on people who drives different cars… ie someone who drives a brand new Mercedes looks down on people who own older japanese brands…

 

[Vayra86]

Exactly. Or someone saying that you have to use DLSS/FSR/RT/whatever, or you have to have 100 FPS minimum, otherwise, you're missing out on something huge. In my opinion, we're playing the same game and are enjoying the same story and atmosphere regardless of these technicalities, so no one is really missing out on anything. If I want to play at 1080p low with 30 FPS on an iGPU (I don't, but let's say that I do just as an example), then why do some people feel entitled to tell me that I'm wrong?

Well about that. Its not 'have to have', but there are sweet spots in performance/budget/IQ. The reason DLSS is such a hit is because it makes that sweet spot a lot larger - we have many more ways now to get in that area, basically, without losing a lot of IQ or going way out on budget. That is however what we have today - but already we're regressing into these techs becoming a crutch for poor optimization (Starfield) and making them integral to game development.

Also notice how game graphics are practically 'tightening up' around a more fixed level of IQ. This is part of the reason RT is getting pushed out. Raster is easy to deliver, still hard to master (for developers, getting a well looking game to run smoothly that is), but all GPUs can do it.

Another big aspect in the game of perception of graphics/perf in gaming is that ignorance is bliss. The more we've seen, the more we tend to get a taste for improvements, especially when there are metrics plastered over every game we play (overlays, reviews, etc). I think for a substantial group of PC gamers the performance is part of the game, or has even become the game, more so than what they're playing. And really, that is also a way to have fun with hardware and software. Its just not gaming. Its more of a deep dive into performance and tech. Nothing wrong with that IMHO, especially on a tech forum, which is primarily tech and not primarily gaming focused. I think @nguyen made a good point there, the target audience is rather specific

 

[95Viper]

Keep the discussion on topic.
Thank You

 

[freeagent]

Looking at where we came from, and where we are now.. how far do you think this will go?

Will games be photorealistic in a decade? No more animation, you play a movie type thing?

 

[AusWolf]

Looking at where we came from, and where we are now.. how far do you think this will go?

Will games be photorealistic in a decade? No more animation, you play a movie type thing?

They might find ways to incorporate AI/DL into the graphics rendering process, so it's not entirely unimaginable.

 

[wNotyarD]

Will games be photorealistic in a decade? No more animation, you play a movie type thing?

Isn't Quantic Dream already doing it?
I'm not against photorealism in graphics, but if I wanted a movie, I'd go see a movie. Let games be games.

 

[nguyen]

Looking at where we came from, and where we are now.. how far do you think this will go?

Will games be photorealistic in a decade? No more animation, you play a movie type thing?

Why stop at anything LOL, let go way past photorealistic .
These days CGI in movies look awful, so idk about movie type games.

Maybe we can jack ourselves into Sword Art Online type of game and play at higher fidelity than what our eyes can see

 

[Noci]

Looking at where we came from, and where we are now.. how far do you think this will go?

Will games be photorealistic in a decade? No more animation, you play a movie type thing?

Who knows, maybe games turn into a photo realistic interactive virtual world, heavily leaning on AI were you create your own storyline within the game outlines.

Further on the line,.....Scotty beam me up to the holodeck.

 

[Vayra86]

Who knows, maybe games turn into a photo realistic interactive virtual world, heavily leaning on AI were you create your own storyline within the game outlines.

Further on the line,.....Scotty beam me up to the holodeck.

Well that VR thing and metaverse are both flopping hard so maybe one day... but not this wave ...

 

[BSim500]

Looking at where we came from, and where we are now.. how far do you think this will go? Will games be photorealistic in a decade? No more animation, you play a movie type thing?

There'll always be some games "pushing the curve" for photo-realism, but if all there was is photo-realism, then in general people will rapidly get burned out seeing the same art style. As was seen with Bioshock, Borderlands, Cuphead, Dishonored, Firewatch, Limbo / Inside, The Witness, The Pedestrian, Paradise Killer, Return of the Obra Dinn, Superhot, The Darkside Detective, etc, being different = interesting, eye catching, unusual. If everything looked like "Crysis 7", nothing would stand out anymore.

These days CGI in movies look awful, so idk about movie type games.

Half the reason for that isn't even looks (textures), its behaviour. Eg, Terminator 2 is still way more realistic than many 20-30 year newer CGI films because the way the T1000 moves is actually believable / realistic looking. Half the CGI'd stuff today tries to go so "xtreme" that objects end up having no sense of mass, friction or inertia. It's "cartoon physics with 'real' textures painted on top" and for many of us, just looks ridiculous rather than "even more realistic than yesterday's movies".

 

[gffermari]

It will not be about photorealism in a decade (more like 15-20 years for me). It will be about artistry and theme.
After you have achieved movie like graphics, no one would care about textures and lighting and shadows anymore.
It will only be about the content. And that's good or better than now.
Crysis, for example, all of them were at best mediocre titles but they sold very well because of their graphics and tech.
But the actual games were a joke for me.

 

[AusWolf]

It will not be about photorealism in a decade (more like 15-20 years for me). It will be about artistry and theme.
After you have achieved movie like graphics, no one would care about textures and lighting and shadows anymore.
It will only be about the content. And that's good or better than now.
Crysis, for example, all of them were at best mediocre titles but they sold very well because of their graphics and tech.
But the actual games were a joke for me.

The first Crysis was nice, imo, just the first part of it where you're only fighting nameless Asian soldiers and making your way through the jungle is way too long, and many people got bored before the game had a chance to get interesting (I don't blame anyone, just saying). Other than that, I hope you're right.

 

[Belfaborac]

Well that VR thing and metaverse are both flopping hard so maybe one day... but not this wave ...

The moment I can jack into the metaverse through a socket in my neck I'll be jumping on the bandwagon!

 

[Noci]

The moment I can jack into the metaverse through a socket in my neck I'll be jumping on the bandwagon!

Oke Neo, lay down on that table and we hook you up to the matrix....

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

The moment I can jack into the metaverse through a socket in my neck I'll be jumping on the bandwagon!

That's where I would draw the line, I am not,,"merging with tech" I'll leave that , Ty, not a big metaverse fan though either.

 

[freeagent]

I only mentioned it because of AI being incorporated into some GPUs. I figured with advanced AI it would make game creation a lot easier.. but really, I don't know anything

 

[Dahita]

Firstly, this is not an AMD vs Nvidia thread.
Secondly, this is not an FSR vs DLSS thread.
Thirdly, this is not an "RT is sooo awesome, woaoah!" thread.

Now that the (to me) obvious is out of the way, let me continue with some observations.

• A lot of (especially AAA) games are being marketed by their graphics these days, like there's not a lot behind it (and a lot of times there really isn't).
• A lot of (even not so old) games are being remade with slightly upgraded graphics, and they seem to be popular for some reason.
• There's way too much fighting in the online community over which graphical feature is important, and what one should or shouldn't use. Some people really seem to make it a crusade for some reason.

The question is simple: why?
Why are we so obsessed with graphics that we pay huge amounts of money for pretty, but soulless games and remakes of the same game that we already own?
Why do we jump at each other's throats when someone appears to have different preferences when it comes to graphical features? Why is it so hard to peacefully coexist?
Also: when did it all start and how?

To me, it all started with the release of the Voodoo 3DFX. Until then, quality never mattered much (Wolfenstein, Duke Nukem). But the day this card came out, and I saw a demo of Unreal playing at 60 FPS on it, I became fascinated with how beautiful the scenery was. From there on, I changed my computer religiously every summer using my summer job money to get the best GC possible (Nvidia Xentor 16, Nvidia TNT 32, Geforce GTS etc). Oh, good memories!

 

[nguyen]

Why would anyone not be obsessed over graphics is my question

I'm staring at how nicely modelled Shadowheart in BG3 is for hours, it easily added more 20 hours to my play time just dressing up characters. Heck I would definitely play BG3 again when a remake come out in 5 years perhaps.

And yeah I replayed Witcher 3 when RTGI patch came out