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5800x (and other Zen 3 chips) PBO settings/Temperature fix

Mussels

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It's well known that the 5800x has heat issues, because its got the same TDP as the 12 core 5900x, but half the actual die space to dissipate that heat.
This means no matter how big a cooler you slap onto these chips, they just overheat and run close to 80C as the solder AMD used just cant get the heat out fast enough.

One of our forum users GerKNG (The Gherkin King, i assume) shared his custom PBO settings that solved the problem for me and another friend with a 5800x, and some users with 5900x have also said the same numbers worked for them.

This is "stock" PBO settings on custom water: (apologies for the screenshots not lining up fully, focus on the temps alone - same clocks)


GerKNG's settings are as follows:

PPT/TDC/EDC
105/70/95: A little faster than stock, about 70C on my 5800x

95/60/90 As fast as stock but very cool and efficient - this image says it all, to any 5800x owner. This is also with the +200Mhz, so its faster single threaded AND colder without the huge temp spikes





In theory these same numbers should work on any zen 3 chip keeping the temps down, as the 5800x has the "worst" thermal layout with just one CCX, while the others have more to spread the heat easier.

Two more tips follow:
1. Watch out for two seperate PBO settings on some motherboards, on my Asus board i have one in 'Ai Tweaker' and one in advanced. Only the AI tweaker settings work and apply, the Advanced ones are ignored (except for curve optimiser, which is only visible there)

2. Curve optimiser is great, but watch out for random crashes at idle or moderate load situations. Some of my cores go to -30, some will only go to -5 without issues. Be patient, and only test this when you're 100% sure your system is already stable, or you could waste a lot of time with testing it out. I ended up settling on -13 all core, instead of tweaking them all individually.
I m about to follow some advice here and start using core cycler to test out the offsets in an automated way
GitHub - sp00n/corecycler: Stability test script for PBO & Curve Optimizer stability testing on AMD Ryzen processors
 
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on my Asus board i have one in 'Ai Tweaker' and one in advanced. Only the AI tweaker settings work and apply, the Advanced ones are ignored (except for curve optimiser, which is only visible there)
Sweet man!

I just wanted to note that I do my overclocking from the Advanced menu, not AI tweaker.. :fear:

They fixed my board a few flashes ago :rockout:

Edit:

If I use both menus I get a high clock but lower effective by a couple hundred MHz
 
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PPT/TDC/EDC
105/70/95: A little faster than stock, about 70C on my 5800x

This absolutely tanks performance in CB R23.

By default: ~15500, with these settings ~14100.

I've settled on PPT 125W and that's it. Now CB R23 shows ~15100 and I'm OK with that. Temps are lower.

There's a discussion about the best PPT/TDC/EDC settings on Reddit but I've tried their best settings (120/75/110) and they are not very good.
 
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Mussels

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You can simply tune the settings to suit your needs and temp preferences

In my case, i get my full 5.05GHz single core boost, and lost only 75MHz off my multi threaded - this DOES seem to vary board by board, so you gotta adjust.
 
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I think I have told on occasion that PPT has to be 10% higher than EDC which is what you have done.


On r7, the option to decrease edc 10% less than ppt is found to work best.
Previous observations developed the understanding that 10% lower EDC than PPT is a good threshold to start.

Unless you want single threaded performance, you don't need EDC all that much either and even if you are overclocking you should only make PPT 10% higher than EDC, no more. Again, these are best practice measures.

First thing is first, ppt has to be 10% higher than edc.

If you are looking for ST scores you clamp PPT, and otherwise for MT you keep PPT just 10% above EDC.

I suggest decreasing EDC from its 140 default to 130 such that there is a 10% gap from PPT which was a key point in former Ryzen generations.
 
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For fast single core stuff like superpi 32m I use 200/130/130. It will ignore those settings and take what it wants when it comes to multi core. For instance yes 200/130/130 is set, but it will take 215/140/180. Stock is 143/140/90 I think. I might have some of those numbers mixed up tdc and edc always trip me up.
 
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For fast single core stuff like superpi 32m I use 200/130/130. It will ignore those settings and take what it wants when it comes to multi core. For instance yes 200/130/130 is set, but it will take 215/140/180. Stock is 143/140/90 I think. I might have some of those numbers mixed up tdc and edc always trip me up.
It is all correct since you said single thread in the beginning.
 
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:love:

This absolutely tanks performance in CB R23.

By default: ~15500, with these settings ~14100.
weird i have almost your stock 15500 with the 95W "as efficient as possible" Powerlimits.

5800x R23 95W.png
 
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:love:


weird i have almost your stock 15500 with the 95W "as efficient as possible" Powerlimits.

I'm quite sure you didn't just set PPT to 95W, you have a lot more optimizations.
 
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I'm quite sure you didn't just set PPT to 95W, you have a lot more optimizations.
95/60/90 (and +50Mhz which has no influence on the score (it hurted single core))
1X Scalar, no other changes.
the only thing that the user should do is playing with the curve optimizer.
but i did not tweaked anything else.
 
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the only thing that the user should do is playing with the curve optimizer.

This is like crazy important and decides everything and you're glossing over it as if it's nothing.

Again, even with "95/60/90 (and +50Mhz)" the multithreaded benchmarks results will be abysmal and the performance loss will be extreme.
 
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This is like crazy important and decides everything and you're glossing over it as if it's nothing.

Again, even with "95/60/90 (and +50Mhz)" the multithreaded benchmarks results will be abysmal and the performance loss will be extreme.
the curve optimizer is mentioned in mussels post.

but in my case even an unstable -20 across all cores makes a difference of 1-2 percent.

stock vs stock and Curve optimizer vs curve optimizer with these limits results in the same gains.
 
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Honestly most of the time I just run @ stock clocks with -30 set and no pbo. Runs great even with plain old 3200c14. 3D runs at the top of the clock scale, heavy duty stuff drops the clocks a bit but it’s still very productive.
 
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I don't have much issues with CB23..... My first run was in the 19200 range and my 2nd one attached is in the 18800 range. Seems good to me.
I am simply using the "a little faster than stock" settings with a Negative 15 on my PBO Curve Optimizer on all cores. ** I think when I opened and used the Snip & Sketch tool, might have played a role in the drop of my score, but close enough. **
 

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I don't have much issues with CB23..... My first run was in the 19200 range and my 2nd one attached is in the 18800 range. Seems good to me.
I am simply using the "a little faster than stock" settings with a Negative 15 on my PBO Curve Optimizer on all cores. ** I think when I opened and used the Snip & Sketch tool, might have played a role in the drop of my score, but close enough. **

That's quite a bit of a drop for a 5900X, why limit it to 105W? Bone stock 5900X @ 142W is in the 21000 range, MT loads run pretty cool even on a bog standard air cooler. I'm sitting at a hair under 22000, all on air, with a variable per-core CO. It's a bit different for them 5800X owners, but we don't really have their heat problems here on the 12-core, single-thread is what runs hotter at stock.

You don't have to run 10 min worth of CB R23 just to get a score. You can go to File > Advanced Benchmark, turn off minimum test duration.
 
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I can´t really talk much about temp on zen 3 yet. As i have yet to complete my build based on a Ryzen 5 5600X and a Ryzen 9 5950X. Bofh CPU´s are air cooled. So i have only had a little time to test them at stock and with a prime 95 test with the most heat generating test. As said this is with all at stock settings. i have only activated momory XPM profile. Else nothing is touched, so i have yet to fine tune. The below temps are right out of boks with stock voltage.

Cooling setup:
5600X is cooled by a low profile noctua nh-l9x65 se-am4 cooler. With fan a round 1900 RPM it hits 70-71 degress celcius and with the fan at 2500 RPM it comes down to 67 degree celsius with a prime 95 test in the most heat generating test. The little fan is even covered a little by the GPU. Ilde at 45 degree celsius with the fan at 1000 RPM. Some peeple even told me this little cooler, cut not handle a 5600X, But at stock it handles it just fine. All throw this little cooler do limit the overclock potential. But overclock whas never the idea with the 5600X any way.

5950X is cooled by a Noctua NH-D15 chromax black and stock fans has been replaced by Noctua IPPC industrial 3000 RPM fan. One 140 MM and one 120 mm. Here i have so far only testet with the fans a 1600 RPM and not the maximum 3000 RPM. But with a prime 95 test it stabilized around 55 degree celsius and my gues with 3000 RPM temp can get down to around 50 degree celsius. Ilde sits at 35 degree celsius with fans a 1100 RPM.

This is the exsperience i have had so far with Zen 3. So i really dont have a heat issue. Again i so also have the CPU with the lowest TDP and the CPU with the best binned chiplets and most cores to spread the wattage out on. So that will off cause help on the heat.

Some screenshots and a image of my nearly completed system, to give an idea of what´s going on at how airflow is in my system.

cpu strees test.jpg


Ilde temp.jpg

Prime95 test.jpg

Z314dcL.jpg
 
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I have not played with optimizing each core,but as little as -5 in CO causes system to become unstable. so i have turned it off and set pbo2 to +100mhz. it now boosts to 4.95ghz with 4.9ghz being more common

edit: doesn't like pbo2 either guess i have a bum chip!
 
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Mussels

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I have not played with optimizing each core,but as little as -5 in CO causes system to become unstable. so i have turned it off and set pbo2 to +100mhz. it now boosts to 4.95ghz with 4.9ghz being more common

edit: doesn't like pbo2 either guess i have a bum chip!
dont rule out that it could be something else borderline stable, like SoC voltage, DRAM voltage, and so on.
 
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ok ppt=125,edc=90,tdc=70. pbo2=+50. 4.9ghz stable so far.
pbo2 @ +75mhz yielded 4.95 ghz but unstable in SoTTR.
 
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@Mussels If one is using custom cooling then one of the problems is that most of the water blocks are optimised for cooling hotspot in the middle of the CPU, but on Ryzen 3000/5000 there is an offset due to chiplet design.

One of the solution is to consider this Der8auer offset kit:


There are some blocks like TechN that is specifically designed für Ryzen 5000 taking the chiplet design and offset of hotspot into consideration:

I changed from XSPC RAYSTORM to TechN and I was able to reduce about 4°C in Cinebench on multiple thread when I had 5800X Curve Optimized.

I don't have the CPU now anymore in my computer as I went to 5900X but I am still using TechN bock.
The 5800X will go to my son's computer in a few weeks when I have the other components for building it up. :rolleyes:
 
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Mussels

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@Mussels If one is using custom cooling then one of the problems is that most of the water blocks are optimised for cooling hotspot in the middle of the CPU, but on Ryzen 3000/5000 there is an offset due to chiplet design.

One of the solution is to consider this Der8auer offset kit:


There are some blocks like TechN that is specifically designed für Ryzen 5000 taking the chiplet design and offset of hotspot into consideration:

I changed from XSPC RAYSTORM to TechN and I was able to reduce about 4°C in Cinebench on multiple thread when I had 5800X Curve Optimized.

I don't have the CPU now anymore in my computer as I went to 5900X but I am still using TechN bock.
The 5800X will go to my son's computer in a few weeks when I have the other components for building it up. :rolleyes:
The derbauer kit doesnt fit with modern EK blocks, and i've got one of the modern AM4 exclusives meant to fix that issue

Trust me, i bought it, drained the loop, disassembled everything and then cried when it wouldnt fit (the screwholes are too small)
 
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finally got pbo to work. boost to 4.925ghz. returned all settings to stock except, temp. limit to 80C,VDDP=0.900 and VDDG=0.950,pbo=+75mhz.
the VDDP and VDDG values i got from a thread at guru3d where posters were having random reboots at idle or doing very little when heavy work loads would not crash.
cinebech23 gave me mt=15553 and single thread was about 1600 or so.
 
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ok ppt=125,edc=90
Wrong setup. If you need these settings your cooling is too slow to respond, or you are pushing your limits.
Again, happy to see you found about undervolt limits, but it still delineates the same issue. You are pushing the chip in opposite directions. First of all, you cannot play with pbo and ppt-edc both. One is an overclocker, the others are undervolter settings. One pushes pb settings up which waste what edc is trying to do, the others alternate between p states which don't overboost to the turbo states.
When I had the puny 6800K I couldn't even apply llc, everything had to be within fixed offset for "maximum vdroop" under load to keep temperature down - how can you guys play around so brazenly, I really have to congratulate AMD engineers for hiding the impact of power output. You should have abstained from "all" scalar, LLC what not, but since you didn't you're constantly troubleshooting, imo.
 
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