APPLES OPEN SECRET (Project Titan)

[xfia]

http://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-says-its-apple-car-is-an-open-secret-2016-1

Apple is working on a electric car (Project Titan) to give Tesla a run for its money but what does Musk have to say about it..?

"Apple only hires people fired by Tesla"
"We always jokingly call Apple the 'Tesla Graveyard.' If you don't make it at Tesla, you go work at Apple. I'm not kidding,"

 

[Kanan]

Funny jokes, but if Apple really wants it they can. Their management is up to anything I'd say, after all it's Apple, not Paypal.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

Apple wants to compete and so does Google, Ford, GM, Toyota, etc. Thing is, there is no market for electric cars when gasoline is $1.50/gallon and falling. Tesla's stocks are plummeting right now because of this and the fact they are a one trip pony. This storm will eventually pass but, it's pretty ironic that Tesla and Apple are in the same situation right now for different reasons and Apple wants to drag itself deeper into it. Investors are fleaing Apple because some 60% of its business is iPhone and the popularity of the iPhone is wanning. Apple needed to look for some other market to enter in order to slow the fleaing of investors; what they picked, as previously mentioned, is about the worst option they could right now.

I wonder what both of these companies will look like in five years. The oil glut should end in two to three years.


My money is on one of the already-established automakers coming out on top and Apple/Tesla being segregated to the luxury segment.

 

[flmatter]

Unless Tesla has a way to break into the market with cars under 30K they will take a backseat to the masses. There are already enough Hybrid vehicles out there by the established makers to satisfy the people. They will be like McClaren, Bugatti and the such, just a luxury item. You are further ahead buying a Chevy Volt, Honda Civic hybrid or Nissan Leaf. Heck if VW Dieselgate was not so over blown I could recommend some great diesels with awesome mileage that competes with hybrids.

 

[xfia]

Apple wants to compete and so does Google, Ford, GM, Toyota, etc. Thing is, there is no market for electric cars when gasoline is $1.50/gallon and falling. Tesla's stocks are plummeting right now because of this and the fact they are a one trip pony. This storm will eventually pass but, it's pretty ironic that Tesla and Apple are in the same situation right now for different reasons and Apple wants to drag itself deeper into it. Investors are fleaing Apple because some 60% of its business is iPhone and the popularity of the iPhone is wanning. Apple needed to look for some other market to enter in order to slow the fleaing of investors; what they picked, as previously mentioned, is about the worst option they could right now.

I wonder what both of these companies will look like in five years. The oil glut should end in two to three years.


My money is on one of the already-established automakers coming out on top and Apple/Tesla being segregated to the luxury segment.

i think the low gas prices are an attempt to fuel economy at more places than the corner bp or possibly just that there is a shift happening to hybrid and electric cars so they want to give people a reason to not go buy a car that is seriously more efficient.. especially if you drive around a big v8 that cant shut down cylinders.

 

[AsRock]

It's no $1.50 here more like $2.30 and pretty sure it be going up again fairly soon.

I don't see why Apple can not try. they are in the electronic biz with low ass payed wages. Making tons though the government and schools.

Apple did do us a favor though, by loaning a ipad to to one of our kids for school i learned i don't want their crappy limited funtion, walled in garden crap.

 

[xfia]

Some of that expansion is focused on Tesla’s next-generation Model 3 electric car, a car that Tesla CEO Elon Musk promises will sell for a retail price of around $30,000 before incentives, offer the same legendary customer sales and support as Tesla’s other models, and be compatible with Tesla’s network of free-to-use Supercharger DC quick charging stations.
http://electrek.co/2016/02/12/tesla-model-3-mid-luxury-sedan/
https://transportevolved.com/2016/0...ter-official-reveal-1000-secures-reservation/

 

[terroralpha]

no, they don't have what it takes. when steve jobs was running apple, their products carried a premium but their products were top notch quality. apple products were built like tanks and lasted for a long time. the average powerbook and early macbook pro models had life spans of 8 years while the average dell, hp and sony laptops started falling apart right around when the factory warranty expired. now the quality has gone down the crapper but the price tags remain. there are just tons of problems with their laptops due to cheap component selection. there are like 100,000 macbook airs out in the wild with barely working wifi radios and apple hasn't even admitted the problem.

as GM and VW clearly demonstrated, when it comes to cars, you can't bury your head in the sand and pretend there aren't any problems. if there is a serious problem with a car, IIHS will fine you into oblivion. there is no "you're using it wrong" BS when it comes to cars.

and the non up-gradable proprietary/planned obsolescence design (think mac pro) Apple puts on everything now won't fly either.

 

[flmatter]

I can see Tesla/Apple/Google being a luxury item around cities. Yes there are 500+ Superstations with 3K+ super chargers for Tesla but when you are selling cars for 50K+ each you are only catering to the wealthy. There are a lot of hybrid vehicles costing under 25K with twice or 3 times the range of a tesla it leaves a lot to be desired. Heck even the New Jeep Grand Cherokee with the 3.0 V6 Diesel can go 600+ miles and costs around 30K. So all they are selling is luxury items.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

Heck if VW Dieselgate was not so over blown I could recommend some great diesels with awesome mileage that competes with hybrids.

There was nothing "overblown" about it. VW willfully committed fraud. That improved milage came at the expense of air quality--VW should be looked upon as a smoker in a non-smoking room. There's a lot of great diesel engines out there but VW's aren't among them.

i think the low gas prices are an attempt to fuel economy at more places than the corner bp or possibly just that there is a shift happening to hybrid and electric cars so they want to give people a reason to not go buy a car that is seriously more efficient.. especially if you drive around a big v8 that cant shut down cylinders.

The price of oil has nothing to do with the USA and everything to do with the political and economic structure of the Middle East collapsing. In five years, I highly doubt Saudi Arabia will still have a monarchy. 90% of their population works for the government and the government is some 80% funded by oil. What's happen to oil now is a global event.

I can see Tesla/Apple/Google being a luxury item around cities. Yes there are 500+ Superstations with 3K+ super chargers for Tesla but when you are selling cars for 50K+ each you are only catering to the wealthy. There are a lot of hybrid vehicles costing under 25K with twice or 3 times the range of a tesla it leaves a lot to be desired. Heck even the New Jeep Grand Cherokee with the 3.0 V6 Diesel can go 600+ miles and costs around 30K. So all they are selling is luxury items.

Your average pickup in the USA sells for over $50K and they're the #1 selling vehicles in the country. Thing is, pickups are a lot more practical for most buyers than electric cars...

I can't name any unmodified hybrid pickups off the top of my head. Diesels are pouring in though (RAM already put one out, GM has been working with VM Motori to create a baby Durmax, Ford has a I-5 diesel available in the full size Transit that is likely to find its way into the F-150, I believe Nissan is planning on installing a baby Cummins into its new Titan, and so on). That should tell you something about the market.

 

[xfia]

I can see Tesla/Apple/Google being a luxury item around cities. Yes there are 500+ Superstations with 3K+ super chargers for Tesla but when you are selling cars for 50K+ each you are only catering to the wealthy. There are a lot of hybrid vehicles costing under 25K with twice or 3 times the range of a tesla it leaves a lot to be desired. Heck even the New Jeep Grand Cherokee with the 3.0 V6 Diesel can go 600+ miles and costs around 30K. So all they are selling is luxury items.

i want the new ford gt with the v6 ecoboost that puts out over 800hp but thats a dream. new tesla is coming in at 30k.. i think i might be able to swing that.

 

[xfia]

There was nothing "overblown" about it. VW willfully committed fraud. That improved milage came at the expense of air quality--VW should be looked upon as a smoker in a non-smoking room. There's a lot of great diesel engines out there but VW's aren't among them.


The price of oil has nothing to do with the USA and everything to do with the political and economic structure of the Middle East collapsing. In five years, I highly doubt Saudi Arabia will still have a monarchy. 90% of their population works for the government and the government is some 80% funded by oil. What's happen to oil now is a global event.


Your average pickup in the USA sells for over $50K and they're the #1 selling vehicles in the country. Thing is, pickups are a lot more practical for most buyers than electric cars...

I can't name any unmodified hybrid pickups off the top of my head. Diesels are pouring in though (RAM already put one out, GM has been working with VM Motori to create a baby Durmax, Ford has a I-5 diesel available in the full size Transit that is likely to find its way into the F-150, I believe Nissan is planning on installing a baby Cummins into its new Titan, and so on). That should tell you something about the market.

know how much the us and un care about the middle east? 0 here we fixed another city for you for free.. dont shit on all of it at the same time. we dont have shit for money to help out idiot peasants anymore that cant respect anything. there is good people there and they are running away.. russia, asia, us, uk i dont think the people even care where they end up.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

The entire world cares a lot. Notice the global stockmarkets? Down, and down, and down since the beginning of this year. Russia even went to war in the Middle East because of it and countries around the world are having to take in refugees.

The price of oil isn't going to recover until the situation in the Middle East cools down. Electric vehicles aren't attractive until that happens. Tesla lost about 40% of its value in the last three months where Apple has lost about 20% of its value in the same period. For comparison, Microsoft lost about 10%.

 

[xfia]

over exaggeration by me

ya they care but its just the same damn holy war that goes back as far as anyone can recall.
putin said i will rain fire from the sky on isis.. so he does and now look at how they fire back.
using the situation as a advantage to them and brain washing refugees to hate practically the whole world.
everyone is just fed up with it and obama is on tv saying please dont think every refugee is a radical terrorist.

i live right near chicago and people are arming themselves and ready to take down anyone trying some bs.. its even obama's new plan of action for the american people.
he says we cant just call 911 and do nothing while 10 people get killed while swat is gearing up.

 

[Kanan]

You people are missing the point. Apple IS a luxury brand and cars are a good way of staying luxurious. I'm somewhat doubtful if they can pull it off, but what else can they do? They need a new market, a new big product.

 

[Caring1]

You people are missing the point. Apple IS a luxury brand............

That is subjective, personally I think they are an over priced brand that wants to be seen as better.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

Yeah, I'm not exactly sure what Apple knows about suspension, drivetrains, seude leather, steering calibration, and so on. Vehicles are a completely different animal from tech products, there are a ton of risks involved, and there is a lot of competition out there. I think Apple is making a terrible mistake at the worst possible time. It reminds me of AMD in 2006. If Apple was smart, they'd put the brakes on this project for a few years.

 

[xfia]

that 06 amd rusts like a 90's stang haha

really tho.. what do they know about about cars? rather a better question would be who are these engineers they hired and what are they bringing to the table.

 

[remixedcat]

Hybrids are a joke, my mom's gas only honda civic gets more mpg!!!

 

[xfia]

Hybrids are a joke, my mom's gas only honda civic gets more mpg!!!

haha its true.. some of the small 4 cylinders get some really nice gas mileage. i had a 07 focus that would cost 25 dollars at the most to fill up when gas was at least 1 dollar more per gallon as it is now and it would easily get 300 miles per tank. more like 400 miles per tank going 70mph on the highway or just slow riding in town.

 

[Frick]

They have what it takes. Mountains of money. The last quarter they almost had the same revenu as Sweden's yearly budget.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

It takes more than money. They need suppliers, they need massive factories, they need service centers, and so on. They can't ship that all to China because taxes make it prohibitively expensive to bring the finished product back to the USA (and other markets). They no doubt have the capital to set it in motion but, again, it's a massive risk. It took Tesla well over a decade to get where it is today. I'm fairly confident new cars are going to be quite different from what they are today a decade from now. I'm not convinced it will be electric either.

 

[silentbogo]

Tesla is as significant in EV market, as Ferrari is in a mainstream automotive market (or as red caviar for average daily diet in Somalia). It's entry level car, Model S 70D RWD, costs over $70,000 in US (a lot more elsewhere in the world if you can find it), making 99.999% of the planet's population incapable of purchasing such car.

The proper question is, whether Apple is capable of competing with Nissan.

 

[remixedcat]

haha its true.. some of the small 4 cylinders get some really nice gas mileage. i had a 07 focus that would cost 25 dollars at the most to fill up when gas was at least 1 dollar more per gallon as it is now and it would easily get 300 miles per tank. more like 400 miles per tank going 70mph on the highway or just slow riding in town.

Hers is a '12 civic.

 

[Vayra86]

Apple is branching out in a few different directions, and I have a feeling they are getting a bit overzealous with it, and it's just a prelude to them cutting off all sorts of business in the near future because it wasn't working. The automotive ideas are part of what's not going to work, but I also consider the Apple Watch, ApplePay to be failing initiatives.

There are many investments being made today, but I really don't see much of a point to many of them. And it is all just because mobile phone is no longer a cash cow and social media are having trouble extracting money out of their users. This is why Facebook is into oculus rift, it is why Apple branches out into Watch, Pay and now cars, etc. etc. etc.

The problem with all those little innovations and services is that none of them are as groundbreaking as the previous developments with regards to tech and internet: search/connectivity (Google), the mobile phone, the 'hardware/software marriage OS' (OSX) and the adaptable OS (Windows), those are the big advancements and we are STILL looking at those and the same companies that now try new things are STILL floating on that one big success. It makes sense to look for the next big success, but I doubt it can still be had. We are just looking at small incremental innovations now on the big tech advances of the past decades, and that's not something the whole world will jump onto like they did on the Internet or the mobile phone. All markets are saturated.

Apple is just jumping on the bandwagon and that won't net them any success. Place their position in automotive today, next to the position they had back in their early days when they launched the Macs. Cars *already* use the Apple design philosophy because they have to - everything in a car needs to work flawlessly. Apple won't be special. They can't be special. If anyone is in a position in automotive like Apple was back in the day with the first consumer OS'es, it is Tesla and Google. Tesla for the engine tech, Google for autonomous drive. All the rest will be following or expanding upon its solid position in the market, Apple is the odd one out.

About the price of oil, this is temporary and finite and we all know it, as do Tesla and Apple. The only reason the price is low now is nót because of the unrest in Middle East, it is because Russia is pumping like a madman to keep its economy afloat. And they will only stop when they find a new source of income, which they really haven't got. With the rise of the electric car, oil prices will remain low because the demand will dwindle in the long term. For the medium term, nobody is expecting the trouble in the Middle East to end anytime soon, there is no single investor in the world betting on that to ever happen in their lifetime. The only reason oil prices will go up is because governments will be pushing towards electric or hydrogen at some point, helped by a massive lobbying from the automotive industry, or when we finally run out.