B550 Sorta....

[oxrufiioxo]

I found this pretty interesting.

 

[JackCarver]

The B450 did support PCIe Gen 4 in an early BIOS version but AMD wanted this support only for the new X570 chipsets . Remembers me of Intel, "we need a new chipset to provide more power for our new cpus"

 

[oxrufiioxo]

The B450 did support PCIe Gen 4 in an early BIOS version but AMD wanted this support only for the new X570 chipsets . Remembers me of Intel, "we need a new chipset to provide more power for our new cpus"

Yeah it definitely was a dick move.

 

[JackCarver]

Yeah it definitely was a dick move.

Especially as Steve stated, that the remaining overall system, except the PCIe Gen 4 thing, on these new B550A boards is the same as on an B450/X470 mainboard.

Ok, Buildzoid has to look for the VRM, perhaps those new boards have X570 like vrms, but I doubt...

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Especially as Steve stated, that the remaining overall system, except the PCIe Gen 4 thing, on these new B550A boards is the same as on an B450/X470 mainboard.

Ok, Buildzoid has to look for the VRM, perhaps those new boards have X570 like vrms, but I doubt...

The Vrm Actually looked pretty decent to me for a sub $80 board.... Some B450 you're lucky to even get a heatsink in that price range.

 

[IceShroom]

The B450 did support PCIe Gen 4 in an early BIOS version but AMD wanted this support only for the new X570 chipsets . Remembers me of Intel, "we need a new chipset to provide more power for our new cpus"

MB manufacturer didnt even put 32MB BIOS chip when they knew they had to support for three generation, you expect them to make their PCI-e 3.0 tracing PCI-e 4.0 level??

 

[JackCarver]

The Vrm Actually looked pretty decent to me for a sub $80 board

Yeah, the heatsink looks really solid in this vid.

MB manufacturer didnt even put 32MB BIOS chip when they knew they had to supportfor three generation, you expect them to make their PCI-e 3.0 tracing PCI-e 4.0 level??

I think it depends on the manufacturer how solid they build the board. As the first coffee lake cpus came out, they said we need the Z370 chipset to support the higher power they need. But it was possible to run a coffee lake cpu on an Z170/270 mainboard with a few adaptions at the socket.

In my opinion it's mostly a money makig thing for the mainboard manufacturers...

 

[IceShroom]

I think it depends on the manufacturer how solid they build the board. As the first coffee lake cpus came out, they said we need the Z370 chipset to support the higher power they need. But it was possible to run a coffee lake cpu on an Z170/270 mainboard with a few adaptions at the socket.

Those B450 boards are as solid to run PCI-e 3.0 requires. Not more not less. Don't forget the price of B450 boards compare to Z370 board.
Also power delivery system is not the same as PCI-e trace. Power delivery dont have data integrity problem that PCI-e has.

 

[Zach_01]

MB manufacturer didnt even put 32MB BIOS chip when they knew they had to supportfor three generation, you expect them to make their PCI-e 3.0 tracing PCI-e 4.0 level??

Those B450 boards are as solid to to run PCI-e 3.0 requires. Not more not less. Don't forget the price of B450 boards compare to Z370 board.
Also power delivery system is not the same as PCI-e trace. Power delivery dont have data integrity problem that PCI-e has.

I would agree with that and the PCI-E 4.0 tracing. It is special made tracing that needs a more clean signal. Better shielding also. Too much interference if not.

The compatibility part and that is for all...
Its not a vendor obligation to fully support the next and unknown architecture, nor AMDs to reveal what has on plan. AMD promised compatibility and has deliver.
We have seen this before 10 years ago with AM2, AM3, AM3+ CPUs that were all compatible with each other and not only with their dedicated chipsets. But not with all the new features. its the same. Nothing to complain about.
What MB vendors screw up from time to time is to fail to fully support the CPUs are suppose to support. We've seen it with few B450s and 2000 and few X570s and 3000. But I guess some boards are extreme low budget relatively to their line.

 

[eidairaman1]

The B450 did support PCIe Gen 4 in an early BIOS version but AMD wanted this support only for the new X570 chipsets . Remembers me of Intel, "we need a new chipset to provide more power for our new cpus"

Not all were stable with it, AMD couldn't 100% guarantee it

Yeah it definitely was a dick move.

 

[TheLostSwede]

The B450 did support PCIe Gen 4 in an early BIOS version but AMD wanted this support only for the new X570 chipsets . Remembers me of Intel, "we need a new chipset to provide more power for our new cpus"

That's not what happened. AMD would've supported it, IF the motherboards could've meet PCIe 4.0 spec. Unfortunately, the boards weren't able to fully meet the requirements so AMD decided to pull support. This is a case of AMD not wanting to have compatibility issues or law suits when something goes wrong in the future and not a matter of them trying to force people onto the X570 platform.

MB manufacturer didnt even put 32MB BIOS chip when they knew they had to support for three generation, you expect them to make their PCI-e 3.0 tracing PCI-e 4.0 level??

And the motherboard makers were supposed to predict the increase in size of AMD's AGESA? Right...
Btw, can you give me next weeks lottery numbers?

 

[IceShroom]

And the motherboard makers were supposed to predict the increase in size of AMD's AGESA? Right...
Btw, can you give me next weeks lottery numbers?

MB maufacturer cannot predict the size of AGESA, but they can predict PCI-e 4???

 

[mbeeston]

MB maufacturer cannot predict the size of AGESA, but they can predict PCI-e 4???

PCI Express - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

what prediction? the spec was started in 2011...

 

[eidairaman1]

PCI Express - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

what prediction? the spec was started in 2011...

Dont feed the coronatroll

 

[Countryside]

Good vid, anyway talking about the bios rom size is there an AM4 motherboard that supports all AM4 cpus or is the rom size still to small.

 

[TheLostSwede]

MB maufacturer cannot predict the size of AGESA, but they can predict PCI-e 4???

Eh? I never said they could predict either. Hence why the X470/B450 boards don't support it. In fact, even if they could've predicted it, at the time, there were no PCIe 4.0 compatible components, like re-drivers to fit to those boards. It's really quite hard to predict the future, but maybe your magic 8-ball does a good job?

 

[IceShroom]

Eh? I never said they could predict either. Hence why the X470/B450 boards don't support it. In fact, even if they could've predicted it, at the time, there were no PCIe 4.0 compatible components, like re-drivers to fit to those boards. It's really quite hard to predict the future, but maybe your magic 8-ball does a good job?

Who is bitchng about not having PCI-e 4 on X470/B450?? Certainly not me.

 

[eidairaman1]

Good vid, anyway talking about the bios rom size is there an AM4 motherboard that supports all AM4 cpus or is the rom size still to small.

iirc it was msi with the romsize trouble.

 

[bug]

Yeah it definitely was a dick move.

It wasn't. PCIe4 was a crapshoot, depending on your mobo's wiring.
While some manufacturers felt confident enough to enable PCIe4 on some of their mobos, AMD felt having some mobos supporting PCIe4 and some not supporting it (while using the same chipset) would probably result in an uproar and chose to play it safe.

The real dick move (imho) is that between X470 and X570, the biggest difference is not the chipset at all, it's the motherboard wiring.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

It wasn't. PCIe4 was a crapshoot, depending on your mobo's wiring.
While some manufacturers felt confident enough to enable PCIe4 on some of their mobos, AMD felt having some mobos supporting PCIe4 and some not supporting it (while using the same chipset) would probably result in an uproar and chose to play it safe.

The real dick move (imho) is that between X470 and X570, the biggest difference is not the chipset at all, it's the motherboard wiring.

I mostly meant they should have never pushed a bios that supported it... Giving past b450/x470 users hope of support.

 

[Chomiq]

Some of you are confusing facts. Nobody promised that the boards will support three generations of cpus. AMD only said that "AM4 will remain relevant until 2020".

I mostly meant they should have never pushed a bios that supported it... Giving past b450/x470 users hope of support.

Wasn't it Asus that released that bios? AMD was against this because these boards were never validated by them for gen 4 specs.

 

[bug]

I mostly meant they should have never pushed a bios that supported it... Giving past b450/x470 users hope of support.

But AMD never pushed those BIOSes (it couldn't). They just released an updated AGESA version to block the feature because mobo manufacturers jumped the gun.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

But AMD never pushed those BIOSes (it couldn't). They just released an updated AGESA version to block the feature because mobo manufacturers jumped the gun.

Whether it was the mobo manufacturers or AMD it still a dick move.


I believe Asus validated multiple boards that supported it and it was even tested as working properly on their B450 Tuf before AMD was like cool story bro.

 

[bug]

Whether it was the mobo manufacturers or AMD it still a dick move.

It may have been, but who are you blaming and with what? I think that's an important distinction to make.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

It may have been, but who are you blaming and with what? I think that's an important distinction to make.

Does it really matter what I think personally it would just be an opinion and as they say just like assholes everyone has one.

I like/support AMD a lot but between this the navi drivers and the 5600XT bios fiasco they really haven't done themselves many favors over the last 7 months regardless of who's at fault none of it looks good.