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Battlefield 3 Clubhouse

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I feel like someone here is going to get snipped, if it was a SKS, it was caboose, if it was a 308, then it was Milk.
 
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First of all you are assuming they are using a standard receiver. They make tons of aftermarket receiver covers for that thing. Some even support 1913 rail or that new NATO job. The M14 also mounts to the receiver so is it a crappy sniper rifle also?

The SKS has a top ejection port like a thousand other rifles. How it ejects is up to the extractor. Don't you think a modified sniper variant would also have this modified to have a horizontal ejection much like the M21 variant?

Example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lKFQO6g5uE&feature=related

As for the ballistics of a 7.62x39 vs 30.30 I suggest you pick up a ballistics book or a reloading book. You are WAY off base. First off a 30.30 can go up to 170gr. I used to load mine out at 150gr when hunting Florida white tail. Second according to my books there is only about 100lbf difference between a 7.62x39 and 30.30 at 450 yards with a 150gr load out on the 30.30. If I did 110gr the 7.62x39 come out on top. Anyway thats a MINOR difference when talking ballistics. Even still thats way beyond 300 meters you originally claimed.

Now to your accuracy claim. Thats depends on a million issues that you seem to assume on. Is it a stock barrel? Is the trigger pull stock? etc. You are assuming its just some SKS found in a ditch during the Tet offensive with a Leupold taped on top. What I find funny is you saying knock down power is "irrelevant" and its all about accuracy. Well I hate to break it to you but its a balance. The SKS would not be an ideal LONG RANGE sniper rifle no. But in an urban setting it wouldn't be bad at all. If it was all about shot placement and not stopping power everyone would be using a .220 swift.

Pack a better lunch next time you come at TheMailMan when talking guns.



Pfft. I can do 540 yards open sights on a .308. Not that big a deal. 700+ then Ill be impressed.
How it ejects is actually dependent on the entire bolt assembly.. the extractor just makes it eject :)
 
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Put in my pre-order earlier today before the offer for a free game came out, so I went on Origin chat, and they added the game of my choice to my account. Took a while to wait in line, but they were happy to do it!
 

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who cares about the SKS, you can turn any weapon into anything

i mean for christs sake i just watched a group of guys turn an AK74 into a 1000 yard sniper rifle and it passed all military tests, if the weapon is customized any weapon can become something its originally not.
http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/sons-of-guns-first-1000-yard-ak.html
 

PVTCaboose1337

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First of all you are assuming they are using a standard receiver. They make tons of aftermarket receiver covers for that thing. Some even support 1913 rail or that new NATO job. The M14 also mounts to the receiver so is it a crappy sniper rifle also?
The receiver cover is removable. It is held in by one pin. You and I both know mounting to that is a bad idea. Mounting to the receiver is fine, the cover is not. Every time that cover gets removed you have to rezero.

The SKS has a top ejection port like a thousand other rifles. How it ejects is up to the extractor. Don't you think a modified sniper variant would also have this modified to have a horizontal ejection much like the M21 variant?
The extractor position cannot be changed from where it is due to Op rod sitting above the bolt. I can take picture tomorrow of my SKS to show you what I mean.

As for the ballistics of a 7.62x39 vs 30.30 I suggest you pick up a ballistics book or a reloading book. You are WAY off base. First off a 30.30 can go up to 170gr. I used to load mine out at 150gr when hunting Florida white tail. Second according to my books there is only about 100lbf difference between a 7.62x39 and 30.30 at 450 yards with a 150gr load out on the 30.30. If I did 110gr the 7.62x39 come out on top. Anyway thats a MINOR difference when talking ballistics. Even still thats way beyond 300 meters you originally claimed.
I have many ballistics books. Yes, the 30-30 can go up to a certain weight, but I was trying to compare similar weights in the rounds. Typically x39 when in milsurp is 120-130gr. Weight of the bullet makes a significant difference at longer ranges. Also, if x39 drops VERY fast. 30-30 does as well, but is much flatter. Both rounds are not effective past 300 yards, reason being insane drop, and obviously we have to take into account the weight of the max load of the x39, which is low, which means windage would be a bitch to deal with, cold bore. 30-30 has a higher (not by much) max weight, so it won't be effected as much.


Now to your accuracy claim. Thats depends on a million issues that you seem to assume on. Is it a stock barrel? Is the trigger pull stock? etc. You are assuming its just some SKS found in a ditch during the Tet offensive with a Leupold taped on top. What I find funny is you saying knock down power is "irrelevant" and its all about accuracy. Well I hate to break it to you but its a balance. The SKS would not be an ideal LONG RANGE sniper rifle no. But in an urban setting it wouldn't be bad at all. If it was all about shot placement and not stopping power everyone would be using a .220 swift.
I assumed stock barrel, trigger, yes. The barrel of the SKS is welded to the receiver so modification is much tougher than one screwed on. Trigger is very easy to mess with, as the group is all in one chunk, I'll take a picture tomorrow if someone reminds me. Knock down power is not irrelevant, I agree, but I believe we are talking about shot placement, which comes down to accuracy, which the SKS is not after a certain yardage. Too many variables to take into account. There is a reason why x39 has been shelved, and 5.45x39 is the current replacement. Flat trajectory is important, and the x39 does not provide that.

Pfft. I can do 540 yards open sights on a .308. Not that big a deal. 700+ then Ill be impressed.
.308 is a totally different animal. You have a slightly heavier bullet, with much more powder. It performs fine at distances in excess of 500 yards, where at that point it starts to drop. Open sights, man size is a good bet (never tried myself), but in what position, action of rifle? The longest shot I have ever taken was with a .243 (bolt gun) on irons at roughly 250 yards. The flat trajectory makes it relatively easy to adjust, although windage is a pain when shooting 100gr. Did not make it on the first shot, even after consulting the good (ballistics) book. Can you hit consistently, cold bore with a .308 at 500 yards? Probably so. With x39? Probably not.

Just a small point, when being a marksman it is not about how much lead you put into the air but consistent shot placement, and with a rifle designed to be an all around battle rifle, the SKS does not really have the ability to be consistent at shot placement.

I enjoy talking to you about these subjects Mailman, and I know everyone has different opinions on guns from their wide variety of experiences, so let's try to keep this a back and forth and not a flame war. Also, I can't help but feel my troll senses tingling on some of what you say above.
 
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Ah yes, the .308, my favorite round to shoot out of a rifle. Fell in love after handling my friend's HK91. As for handguns...must go with my friend's grandfather's Colt M1911. The .45 will make her holla!
 
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CDdude55

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Ya well my favorite gun is that one that can hurt people.
 
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I'm tempted to pre-order this LOL
 
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twitter.com/L_Twin: "Just experienced some awesome Conquest action - #BF3 is getting ready for #gamescom!"

Gamescom 2011 is from August 17 to August 21. Sounds like they will have a Conquest map ready for the beta...:)
 

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I like that BF3 Steel Bookcase, wonder if anywhere in the US will have that.
 
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New Battleblog: Battlefield: Battleblog #5: Years worth of unlocks and rewards in Battlefield 3


Battlefield 3 will be the deepest shooter in DICE history. Read on for the full story on how we will reward skill and dedication, and how our flexible unlock and customisation system allows you to tailor the game for your personal play style.

"Battlefield players are among the most loyal out there. Our games are literally played for years by our hardcore fans, and we want to actively support that. There should always be something left to achieve in Battlefield 3."

Valerian Noghin and Fredrik Thylander are Persistence Designers on Battlefield 3. They’re the guys making sure you will have as much fun with the game in 2013 as on launch day.

Back in 2005, Battlefield 2 was one of the first shooters to introduce a deep persistence system to add that extra layer of tasty rewards and unlocks to keep players returning to the battlefield for hundreds of hours. With Battlefield 3, we are pulling all the stops. Compared to Battlefield: Bad Company 2, Battlefield 3 will have more than 10 times the hardware unlocks spread over weapons, weapons attachments, gadgets, and a huge unlock tree for vehicles alone.

Skill And Dedication Equal Rewards
On top of these ingame hardware items, players will also be richly rewarded with medals, ribbons and service stars displaying their skill, commitment, and teamplay prowess. You will be rewarded handsomely in Battlefield 3 for exemplary skill, such as capturing X amount of bases in one round. Excellent teamplayers who keep the team’s vehicles in mint condition and revive fallen comrades will not go unnoticed either. These type of skill-driven rewards are typically handed out in the form of ribbons, and good players can often get more than one ribbon in a single round.


From top left to bottom right: Assault Rifle Ribbon (7 assault rifle kills in a round), Nemesis Ribbon (2 nemesis kills), MVP Ribbon (be the best player in a round), Ace Squad Ribbon (be part of the best squad in a round), Medical Efficiency Ribbon (5 revives in a round), and finally the Air Warfare Ribbon (6 air kills in a round).

Winning a round for the team should always be the priority, so we are making sure that even when players are chasing their personal achievements, they are contributing to the overall battle. You will also be rewarded for true dedication and commitment, such as playing x amount of hours as a U.S. soldier. These honours come in the form of the much harder to get medals. They are typically given at specific milestones in your career.
There are a large number of ranks in Battlefield 3, similar to Battlefield: Bad Company 2. Your rank badge is a quick measure of your overall progress in the game. And even if you hit the max rank, there is always more glory to strive for with the new concept of Service Stars that we are introducing in Battlefield 3.

Service Stars Challenge The Hardcore
Even getting your first Service Star would be a major achievement. But keep playing, and you will be eligible for even further promotion by getting Service Stars added to your weapon skill badge, your vehicle, your kit, and your overall rank. Anytime your kill card is displayed, everyone will see exactly how experienced you are with your current equipment. The ultimate bragging right would be for a player to be awarded the rank of Colonel with 100 Service Stars attached, and to have 100 stars in all weapons, kits, and vehicles. Getting there will be a massive task - consider that a challenge!

The design philosophy behind the unlocks in Battlefield 3 is pretty sweet. We basically give you more hardware to play with for doing what you love to do. Case in point: Using gun X will give you more upgrades specifically for that gun. Playing with a kit and vehicle earns more upgrades for that kit and that vehicle. In addition, all XP gained also goes towards your overall rank, which in turn unlocks new weapons, specialisations, and camouflages usable by any class.


From left to right: Marksman Medal (obtain the Marksman Ribbon 50 times), Maintenance Medal (Obtain the Maintenance Ribbon 50 times), and the U.S. Marines Service Medal (spend 100 hours in the U.S. Marines.)

Play Battlefield 3 your way
The mantra we keep coming back to when designing Battlefield 3 is "play it your way". What that means is there’s an unprecedented flexibility in how you tailor your kits. The playable classes are not rigidly defined in what they are supposed to play like. While all four classes in Battlefield 3 (Assault, Engineer, Support, Recon) start out with everything they need to be an efficient soldier in the field, it is totally up to you and your personal preferences how you want to tailor them.

Take the Assault class, for example. As you may know by now, this is now the class that has the ability to equip both a defibrillator and medkit for frontline medic abilities. But if you would prefer to switch your add-ons to, say, an underslung grenade launcher with 40mm grenades, go ahead! That will give you an Assault soldier with a more offensive set of capabilities than the player who opts for the default medic approach.

Tactical unlocks force you to choose the right loadout for you
That’s the way all of the unlocks and upgrades work. They are specifically designed to be tactical in nature, forcing you to choose loadout based on the map and situation. Do you go for the heavy barrel for your assault rifle? It gives added accuracy for single shots, but at the cost of stronger recoil in burst fire/full auto mode. A standard assault rifle can be modified into a long range accurate weapon or for close quarter, almost SMG-like, combat. For jets, do you go with Maverick ATG missiles to take out tanks or AA missiles to dogfight airborne threats? With your Engineer, do you bring your anti-tank or your anti-air RPG launcher?

In short, we think there has never been a better time to be a Battlefield gamer, no matter your play style.
 
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The receiver cover is removable. It is held in by one pin. You and I both know mounting to that is a bad idea. Mounting to the receiver is fine, the cover is not. Every time that cover gets removed you have to rezero..
How often do you have to remove the cover? I mean honestly.



The extractor position cannot be changed from where it is due to Op rod sitting above the bolt. I can take picture tomorrow of my SKS to show you what I mean.
The extractor position shouldnt need to be changed. Adjusting the spring (tension) is enough to adjust the ejection angle. I don't own an SKS but thats how it is on most weapons.

I have many ballistics books. Yes, the 30-30 can go up to a certain weight, but I was trying to compare similar weights in the rounds. Typically x39 when in milsurp is 120-130gr. Weight of the bullet makes a significant difference at longer ranges. Also, if x39 drops VERY fast. 30-30 does as well, but is much flatter. Both rounds are not effective past 300 yards, reason being insane drop, and obviously we have to take into account the weight of the max load of the x39, which is low, which means windage would be a bitch to deal with, cold bore. 30-30 has a higher (not by much) max weight, so it won't be effected as much. .
I call bullshit on major drop at 300 yards. 500 yards is max effective range. Which is just fine for an urban combat senerio.

I assumed stock barrel, trigger, yes. The barrel of the SKS is welded to the receiver so modification is much tougher than one screwed on. Trigger is very easy to mess with, as the group is all in one chunk, I'll take a picture tomorrow if someone reminds me. Knock down power is not irrelevant, I agree, but I believe we are talking about shot placement, which comes down to accuracy, which the SKS is not after a certain yardage. Too many variables to take into account. There is a reason why x39 has been shelved, and 5.45x39 is the current replacement. Flat trajectory is important, and the x39 does not provide that..
Just because something is replaced doesnt mean what its being replaced with is a better round. Not saying this is the case with the x39 but just because something is being shelved doesnt mean its bad. The .45 is a prime example. The shelved the 1911 for the "Superior" M9. Well guess what most SF are going back to? M1911.

.308 is a totally different animal. You have a slightly heavier bullet, with much more powder. It performs fine at distances in excess of 500 yards, where at that point it starts to drop. Open sights, man size is a good bet (never tried myself), but in what position, action of rifle? The longest shot I have ever taken was with a .243 (bolt gun) on irons at roughly 250 yards. The flat trajectory makes it relatively easy to adjust, although windage is a pain when shooting 100gr. Did not make it on the first shot, even after consulting the good (ballistics) book. Can you hit consistently, cold bore with a .308 at 500 yards? Probably so. With x39? Probably not..
Ive hit moving targets at 400+ yards with a .308 man. Its not THAT big a deal.

How it ejects is actually dependent on the entire bolt assembly.. the extractor just makes it eject :)
True to an extent. Extractor spring tension makes a big difference also.
 

PVTCaboose1337

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How often do you have to remove the cover? I mean honestly.
Anytime you want to clean the rifle you have to take off the cover. I remove it after every time shooting to clean it. There is a reason the rear sights are not located on that cover.

I call bullshit on major drop at 300 yards. 500 yards is max effective range. Which is just fine for an urban combat senerio.
The drop happens even at 200 yards. At that range it drops about a foot. When at 300 yards that is magnified to around 3 feet. Try hitting consistently at that range with x39, not going to be an easy task.

Just because something is replaced doesnt mean what its being replaced with is a better round. Not saying this is the case with the x39 but just because something is being shelved doesnt mean its bad. The .45 is a prime example. The shelved the 1911 for the "Superior" M9. Well guess what most SF are going back to? M1911.
The x39 was shelved for a better round, pure and simple. 5.45 AK pattern rifles are more reliable under adverse conditions. 5.45 is flatter, more accurate, and has less recoil. This is open to discussion however.

Regarding the M9 vs the M1911: Modern loadings on both rounds make them very similar to each other, to the point where they both kill well. I think the M9 gets a ton of crap because of the magazine problems early on in US adoption of the weapon. We also adopted 9mm to standardize with the current NATO handgun load. If you look at the 1970s pistol trials conducted by the Army, you will see that the M9 comes out on top for what they are looking for in a handgun. The M1911 was shelved because of not meeting the requirements of the military at the time. Nobody is arguing it is a bad handgun or caliber, but the M9 fulfills a wider variety of roles than the M1911, which is why it is currently the pick.
 

Abe504

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Put in my pre-order earlier today before the offer for a free game came out, so I went on Origin chat, and they added the game of my choice to my account. Took a while to wait in line, but they were happy to do it!
Did you have to pay the full amount or are they billing when it comes out?
 

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Cleaning a rifle takes a full break down period! Dirt and carbon will ruin a good rifle *EVEN A AK47*. I clean my AK about once a month and keep it oiled and wrapped in my gun case. Another point of the rifle people forget is the magazines! They need took apart and cleaned as well. Keeping a magazine loaded 24/7 will wear the spring out very quickly.

Determining bullet drop and FPS will go back to what ammunition you use. Things like Boat Tail, Grain amount, and type of lead/powder used will help in long range marksmanship. Match grade ammo is a term tended to be used with long range shooting. It matches the specs I mentioned above to type of rifle, distance, and surroundings. These can be customized by loading your own rounds to desired specs.

*All of info above came from teachings of the McMillan Sniper Course *
 
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Anytime you want to clean the rifle you have to take off the cover. I remove it after every time shooting to clean it. There is a reason the rear sights are not located on that cover. .
I don't own an SKS so Ill bow to your better judgement. I thought removing the cover would only be for "deep" cleaning. Not something you would have to do under normal wear and tear.



The drop happens even at 200 yards. At that range it drops about a foot. When at 300 yards that is magnified to around 3 feet. Try hitting consistently at that range with x39, not going to be an easy task..
3 feet at 300 yards is bullshit man. Bullshit. You know it.



Regarding the M9 vs the M1911: Modern loadings on both rounds make them very similar to each other, to the point where they both kill well. I think the M9 gets a ton of crap because of the magazine problems early on in US adoption of the weapon. We also adopted 9mm to standardize with the current NATO handgun load. If you look at the 1970s pistol trials conducted by the Army, you will see that the M9 comes out on top for what they are looking for in a handgun. The M1911 was shelved because of not meeting the requirements of the military at the time. Nobody is arguing it is a bad handgun or caliber, but the M9 fulfills a wider variety of roles than the M1911, which is why it is currently the pick.
The M9 was adopted for political reasons. Not because it was a better round or weapon (M9). I've shot IDPA for years and have seen both in action. I don't care WHAT load you put a 9mm in its not even in the same ballpark as the ACP .45. Its a physical impossibility. I have seen 9mm have less then 1" penetration on bone and 2" in gel. .45 has FAR more consistent energy dispersal. Damn I wish you lived closer. We could hit the range. Hell I would even pick up some dies and load you out some wildcats for the piece of shit SKS you got. :laugh:

Cleaning a rifle takes a full break down period! Dirt and carbon will ruin a good rifle *EVEN A AK47*. I clean my AK about once a month and keep it oiled and wrapped in my gun case. Another point of the rifle people forget is the magazines! They need took apart and cleaned as well. Keeping a magazine loaded 24/7 will wear the spring out very quickly.

Determining bullet drop and FPS will go back to what ammunition you use. Things like Boat Tail, Grain amount, and type of lead/powder used will help in long range marksmanship. Match grade ammo is a term tended to be used with long range shooting. It matches the specs I mentioned above to type of rifle, distance, and surroundings. These can be customized by loading your own rounds to desired specs.

*All of info above came from teachings of the McMillan Sniper Course *
They use a design for thier stocks my grandfather invented years ago. McMillan has the best stocks in the world IMO.



Thats loosely the concept. I dont think his had the lip on the front.
 

brandonwh64

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Bullet drop is not set in stone occurrence. Its determined on set perimeters like temp, wind, ammunition, twist, exc

Use this calculator, it will help

http://www.handloads.com/calc/

*EDIT*

More info, there are some manauls on the mcmillan sniper school's new website

http://www.sniperschool.com/
 
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I don't own an SKS so Ill bow to your better judgement. I thought removing the cover would only be for "deep" cleaning. Not something you would have to do under normal wear and tear.



3 feet at 300 yards is bullshit man. Bullshit. You know it.



The M9 was adopted for political reasons. Not because it was a better round or weapon (M9). I've shot IDPA for years and have seen both in action. I don't care WHAT load you put a 9mm in its not even in the same ballpark as the ACP .45. Its a physical impossibility. I have seen 9mm have less then 1" penetration on bone and 2" in gel. .45 has FAR more consistent energy dispersal. Damn I wish you lived closer. We could hit the range. Hell I would even pick up some dies and load you out some wildcats for the piece of shit SKS you got. :laugh:



They use a design for thier stocks my grandfather invented years ago. McMillan has the best stocks in the world IMO.

https://www.volquartsen.com/pictures/900x600/174-mcmillan-thumbhole-stock.jpg

Thats loosely the concept. I dont think his had the lip on the front.

I have a Mosin Nagant that i have NEVER cleaned as i Dont Know how. ^_^ it's range is epic and accurate to a T if you have it zeroed that is. And i don't know how to use those sites either. The manual is in Russian.

Here is the specs on the rounds: 7.62x54r 185.8 grain
http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinAmmo022.htm
 
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I have a Mosin Nagant that i have NEVER cleaned as i Dont Know how. ^_^ it's range is epic and accurate to a T if you have it zeroed that is. And i don't know how to use those sites either. The manual is in Russian.
Please watch for barrel pitting with a florescent plastic hook and a flash light. This will ruin your rifling in the barrel making it dangerous to shoot. Otis makes good cleaning kits for 7.62!

http://shop.captaindaves.com/p-1386-otis-30-caliber-cleaning-kit-for-308-762mm-rifles.aspx

Also do you have the HEX receiver or the round? HEX is the more rarer one.
 
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Honestly I don't know why you guys shoot those shit Russian rounds anyway.
 
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Please watch for barrel pitting with a florescent plastic hook and a flash light. This will ruin your rifling in the barrel making it dangerous to shoot. Otis makes good cleaning kits for 7.62!

http://shop.captaindaves.com/p-1386-otis-30-caliber-cleaning-kit-for-308-762mm-rifles.aspx

Also do you have the HEX receiver or the round? HEX is the more rarer one.
Not sure, been a bit since I looked at it. Ive fired it twice in the almost 2 yrs i ve owned it.

1891/30

http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinAmmo022.htm

I think it is a Tula model from the receiver markings and if i remember right, i think it is a HEX.
 
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Honestly I don't know why you guys shoot those shit Russian rounds anyway.
Cause they last forever and are generally reliable and dirt cheap to boot:toast:
 

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