Do you also consider it disrespectful not to include the first person mode in AAA games?

[Macro Device]

I understand that lower budget game developers are oftentimes forced to only make one possible but when it comes to higher budget development it feels cursed not to have a proper first person camera. I don't exactly know what is easier to implement but third person camera is a bit more difficult from my understanding so having none first person camera feels weird at best to me.

How do you ensure immersion without allowing players to being able to feel like they are the protagonist and not just an FBI surveillance drone spying on the said protagonist?

 

[JohH]

Yes! Civilization VII needs first-person mode and if they don't add it the developers, publishers, and distributors should be arrested.
/sarcasm

 

[Frick]

Absolutely not. 3rd person is fine if done right. The problem is that often it's not done right IMO and is annoying. I hate over the shoulder with a passion, having the character way off to the left is hellish. I have refunded games because of this.

To take it further the different styles are good for completely different games. Just straight up shooters done in 3rd person is probably the bad choice, but a 3rd person shooter could work if the rest of the game is made as a 3rd person game. Something like Half-Life 2 in 3rd person would not make sense, but games with fighting mehanics, like the Horizon games or any of the Dark Souls games? There 1st person would not make sense.

Plus a lot of weirdos prefer 3rd person when given a choice. Some user on this very forum said it was because then he could play as a female character and watch an ass the entire game, but that dude should not be allowed near electronics and such opinions can be safely disregarded.

 

[Macro Device]

3rd person is fine if done right.

I don't mind 3rd person, I mind not allowing to play first person. Of course some games don't need or are straight up impossible with FPP (that Civilisation example lol) but my point is why abandon 1st person camera completely?

I hate over the shoulder with a passion, having the character way off to the left is hellish. I have refunded games because of this.

And I had very much so annoying "acclimatisation" process whilst revisiting Max Payne 3. I totally forgot it doesn't offer FPP and I also totally forgot how to make use of 3PP.

 

[TumbleGeorge]

I agree, I'd even say it should be first person only. Otherwise, it has the unfair advantage of seeing the battlefield in a way that doesn't exist in real life, where everyone is visually limited and only sees what's in front of their eyes. It's unfair to NPC monsters who get killed before they can even notice you because they "look" the other way.

 

[Macro Device]

It's unfair to NPC monsters

They asked for it anyway.

I'd even say it should be first person only

3PP is very handy sometimes, yet making it the only option sucks.

 

[Dr. Dro]

3PP enjoyers rise

Lack of 3PP in fact is one of the biggest turnoffs in Cyberpunk 2077 to me

 

[Macro Device]

Lack of 3PP in fact is one of the biggest turnoffs in Cyberpunk 2077 to me

This game has so much wrong with it you can basically ignore this issue. This is definitely a foul but it doesn't break the game, unlike... Nah, I won't bother to list it, CDPR made their best to screw it up to put it as mildly as possible.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

To me it just depends on the game... I prefer 3rd person character driven games but enjoy first person stuff as well. I think the developer should decide what perspective better fits their design goals. I doubt I would enjoy games like Uncharted, Tomb Raider, Horizon, Final Fantasy in first person. On the flip side games like Doom, Quake, Halo I don't think 3rd person would work all that well unless the game was designed with that perspective to begin with likely making them drastically different games.

Come to think of it I can't think of a single game genre other than racing games where I equally enjoy both perspectives.

 

[Night]

I would say it's up to the creator, and how they imagined the game, everything else is user preference. I can't imagine playing Max Payne series in first person view.

 

[BMfan80]

No

 

[Sithaer]

To me it just depends on the game... I prefer 3rd person character driven games but enjoy first person stuff as well. I think the developer should decide what perspective better fits their design goals. I doubt I would enjoy games like Uncharted, Tomb Raider, Horizon, Final Fantasy in first person. On the flip side games like Doom, Quake, Halo I don't think 3rd person would work all that well unless the game was designed with that perspective to begin with likely making them drastically different games.

Come to think of it I can't think of a single game genre other than racing games where I equally enjoy both perspectives.

Same here, it really depends on the game for me and like 99% of the time I'm fine with whatever it was designed with.
Witcher for example I could never play in a first person mode but in Cyberpunk the first person did not bother me at all.
Another example is Borderlands and Outriders, both looter shooters just one with first person and the other third person and that I was fine with. 'actually I kind of enjoyed the gameplay/gun play in Outriders'

Dunno, maybe its cause I've always played a variety of games ever since I'm gaming and the different cameras just felt like a normal thing to me. 'I've never once modded a game with a camera mod'

 

[Onasi]

This is one of the most bizarre takes I have seen in a while. Should RTS games offer first person camera? Should side scrolling platformers? Should top/down RPGs? How about fighting games? I am not even going to mention that in many cases the gameplay is straight up not suitable and would be impossible in FPP. Good luck swinging on webs at 200 KPH in Spider-Man, juggling enemies in complex combos in DMC or parkouring around historical cities in AC in first person.
If what you want is just essentially photo mode - fair enough. But otherwise you seem to advocate for turning every game into the same “FPS with stealth and RPG elements” that many games already devolved into and I thought everyone agreed was a terrible development.

 

[Shihab]

No.
Not all games are Call of Duties.

Camera position has little to do with immersion, as long as it fits the game. People waste hours, days and weeks on Witchers, DotA's, Souls games, or even chess.

 

[Onasi]

Actually, while I am at it, I would say that “immersion” being equal to “the player is the protagonist” is a fallacy in and of itself. Because in many games this is not the case and is so very much on purpose. The player is not Lara Croft, Raziel, Ezio, Jin Kazama, Cleopatra, Reimu Hakurei or whatever other character of whatever genre of game we can name. The games where the player creates a persona and is in fact encouraged to “self insert” are, in absolute terms, a minority. And even there the lines are often blurred. I can create a character in, say, Baldurs Gate that has no relation to me in any way and I just thought that they would be a fun idea to place in this world and go through this story. This has never hurt my immersion or investment in the game since those stem from other things, like engaging gameplay, a lived-in world, interesting story and so on.
Hell, people get immersed in well written books, don’t they? Is Lord of the Rings not immersive? Is Dune? War and Peace?
Now yes, there are games where the whole conceit is that “you are you” and they often have quite interesting 4th wall breaking ideas and a narrative centered around the relationship between the game and the player. This is obviously its own thing and usually something that much lower budget, experimental games do. Your Doki Doki Literature Clubs and Uplinks and Gnosias. I can’t really recall when was the last time a AAA game tried to pull something like that. Bioshock, somewhat, although that was less “you are you” and more a commentary on the nature of games. MGS5, kinda, in a very meta way. That’s it, in the recent memory (he says about a 8 and 15 year old games).

 

[delshay]

This thread has reminded me I have WWZ. I have yet to pay/upgrade to get first person mode.

 

[Dr. Dro]

This thread has reminded me I have WWZ. I have yet to pay/upgrade to get first person mode.

Same LOL, I have not gotten their "definitive edition" thing. It'll be free on EGS one day I guess, just like the "base game"

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Assassins Creed, Witcher, Gears of War, and Tomb Raider in first person? No thanks.

 

[Vayra86]

To me it just depends on the game... I prefer 3rd person character driven games but enjoy first person stuff as well. I think the developer should decide what perspective better fits their design goals. I doubt I would enjoy games like Uncharted, Tomb Raider, Horizon, Final Fantasy in first person. On the flip side games like Doom, Quake, Halo I don't think 3rd person would work all that well unless the game was designed with that perspective to begin with likely making them drastically different games.

Come to think of it I can't think of a single game genre other than racing games where I equally enjoy both perspectives.

I do

GTA. Third person for most driving because otherwise you cant see shit. First person for immersion. Far Cry is similar; driving I always do in 3PP.

 

[Hyderz]

I will play the way the developers think its best suited for their game...
if its fist person or third person then so be it...

 

[AusWolf]

Every game is different. Any attempt to unify them in any way is disrespectful and counter-intuitive towards artistic freedom.

 

[KrazyT]

Assassins Creed, Witcher, Gears of War, and Tomb Raider in first person? No thanks.

In some ways, Mirror's Edge was a Tomb Raider in FP ... and it was great !

To answer the question, i don't care, i'll take the game as they are ...
Maybe it's where VR comes into play ?

 

[oxrufiioxo]

I do

GTA. Third person for most driving because otherwise you cant see shit. First person for immersion. Far Cry is similar; driving I always do in 3PP.

I've never tried gta in first person so couldn't say.

I agree on games with driving segments or that have driving as part of the gameplay loop 3rd person is nice. Halo has third person segments but the majority of the game is first person so I consider it a fps.

I'm not the biggest fan of fpp to begin with though and prefer 3pp. My wife is the same way has hated every fpp game she's tried other than Cyberpunk randomly.

 

[de.das.dude]

i think OP has the answer haha.

personally never cared. Even if it doesnt have first person, the devs make sure it isnt a hindrance.

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
Think most games have list of features/ disclosures so if it says 3rd person and does not list 1st person it's tough to be anything but mistaken in buying the game.
Disrespected is pretty much out of place here.

Cheap developer yes.