Need RTX 40 series (Ada Lovelace) to work in Windows 10 1507 LTSB

[dabvflov_243]

Just, again, be reminded that no drivers for Ada Lovelace were ever written for earlier versions of Windows, so you cannot use this method with any RTX 40 series GPU.

RTX 40 series are not supported by this driver branch and hard requires Windows 10 version 1809 or newer as a baseline OS as the earliest driver that supports these cards is the r535 branch

I think it is possible if someone in the forum knows how drivers work and how to unload nvlddmkm.sys to bypass OS detection by changing some of the hex values. One of my workplace computers is running LTSB 2016 and the modded driver for the 40 series works without altering the .sys file however the CNC program does not work in this version. If the driver works with Windows 1607 works I'm sure it should work in 1507 as well for the 40 series.

 

[Solaris17]

I think it is possible if someone in the forum knows how drivers work and how to unload nvlddmkm.sys to bypass OS detection

It doesnt matter. This isnt a solution. This is a bypass that will eventually stop working. You are just creating a ton of technical debt. This is not the way forward and if you are in IT you should not think like this.

Do your resume and the company a favor and spend the time architecting an actual fix. Instead of running a work around you got in a forum in production.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I think it is possible if someone in the forum knows how drivers work and how to unload nvlddmkm.sys to bypass OS detection by changing some of the hex values. One of my workplace computers is running LTSB 2016 and the modded driver for the 40 series works without altering the .sys file however the CNC program does not work in this version. If the driver works with Windows 1607 works I'm sure it should work in 1507 as well for the 40 series.

The problem with doing such a thing is that you introduce instabilities and potential data corruption problems. It might also just not work.

You need to impress upon your employer that the RTX4000 series cards do not and can not work with LTSB 1507. They need to either get an RTX2000 series card or update the OS. It is that simple.

 

[P4-630]

Our workplace has recently upgraded its GPUS

They upgraded to gaming intended GPU's, try Nvidia Quadro.

BTW for writing CNC programmes doesn't require a GPU as far as I know, only if you want to simulate the whole milling process.

 

[dabvflov_243]

You need to impress upon your employer that the RTX4000 series cards do not and can not work with LTSB 1507. They need to either get an RTX2000 series card or update the OS. It is that simple.

My workplace has already installed over 50+ of the 40 series cards (as of now) so it's too late for me and the workplace to return and replace them because it's already installed in most of the workstation computers. Almost all workplace computers are running LTSB 1507 and using the "Microsoft Basic Display Adapter" until a solution is found.

 

[lexluthermiester]

BTW for writing CNC programmes doesn't require a GPU as far as I know, only if you want to simulate the whole milling process.

That depends on the CNC machine. With some of them, the interface has very detailed 3D modeling. While a Quadro card would work, a Geforce card would work the same.

My workplace has already installed over 50+ of the 40 series cards (as of now) so it's too late for me and the workplace to return and replace them because it's already installed in most of the workstation computers. Almost all workplace computers are running LTSB 1507 and using the "Microsoft Basic Display Adapter" until a solution is found.

I'm not saying return them. I'm saying for that one machine you buy a compatible card. Otherwise your workplace needs to find a legitimate, viable and workable solution.

 

[dabvflov_243]

This is a bypass that will eventually stop working.

The problem with doing such a thing is that you introduce instabilities and potential data corruption problems. It might also just not work.

My employer told me that they're willing to take the risk, also it is possible to bypass the 30 series on Windows 8/8.1 by changing some of the hex values

Bypassing Windows 8.1 restriction on Windows 7 drivers ?

Hello ! This may sound like .inf modding although it's definetely a bit more complicated. But as some of you know, Windows 8.1 has it's RTX 3000...

forums.guru3d.com

 

[Onasi]

I'm not saying return them. I'm saying for that one machine you buy a compatible card.

And for all the other machines - upgrade to a newer version of LTSC. There is a 21H2 build, no reason not to run it if one can.

 

[P4-630]

While a Quadro card would work, a Geforce card would work the same.

Better support perhaps..

 

[KedsDead]

What really funny about this now is, they bought 50 of these cards, did they upgrade any other part of the computers? Are we slapping that 40 series cards into pcie2.0 slots? I just dont get the reason for upgrading all of them. It started with just 1 machine on a CNC machine. Now it seems the entire company is running old hardware and just wants to upgrade the GPU.

What country do you work for? Or, What scam call center? I am joking btw, its just doesnt make since from a business point of view.

The CNC machine, yeah we all here could probably help you. As mentioned before, you can run a recent enterprise OS on the CNC computer, then create a VM for the CNC machine to connect to. That would get your up on your 40 series card. But, 50 cards, on 50 different machines, all that can not upgrade past 1507? Seems more like you need a Server Machine and everyone connects via portals and loads up VM for each person so you can stay on that version of OS for what software you cant get away from.

 

[lexluthermiester]

My employer told me that they're willing to take the risk

Wait, they're willing to take the risk of instabilities and data corruption but they are NOT will to "risk" using an older card? That seems backward, silly and foolish to me.

I'm beginning to agree with the statement @bug made. The decision makers for that company seem to have their priorities wrong. Using hacked drivers for production level heavy machinery isn't just foolish, it's potentially unsafe and irresponsible. Help them understand that.

I'm going to say this once more and bow out:
Buy a compatible card model for the OS in question or do without.

 

[dabvflov_243]

I'm saying for that one machine you buy a compatible card

And for all the other machines

It's not only one machine, we have over 10+ machines & 15+ workstations in one department.

 

[lexluthermiester]

It's not only one machine, we have over 10+ machines & 15+ workstations in one department.

Then someone didn't do their homework before buying cards for said machines. Using hacked drivers for production machines is NOT the correct solution.

 

[KedsDead]

Then someone didn't do their homework before buying cards for said machines. Using hacked drivers for production machines is NOT the correct solution.

Agreed. If your not going to do it right.......

 

[Panther_Seraphin]

It's not only one machine, we have over 10+ machines & 15+ workstations in one department.

Do the CNC controlling machines actually need GPUs? I thought most of them just ran the GCode etc that was produced by the CNC program.

 

[Onasi]

It's not only one machine, we have over 10+ machines & 15+ workstations in one department.

Then this is even worse. You are telling me that an organization bought an en-masse GPU upgrade for their mission-critical workstations without checking if those GPUs are compatible with the, frankly, old version of the OS these machines are forced to run because of a poorly written software? No one bothered to check?
I am sorry, but this is a clownshow. You NEED, I stress, NEED to get this into your decision makers heads. NOT look for a hack to force the unforceable. This is an issue at the root and no amount of searching for help on internet forums will alleviate that.

 

[dabvflov_243]

Wait, they're willing to take the risk of instabilities and data corruption

My employer told me that there willing to take the risk in 1 or 2 workstations and see how well it works. They're going to test it in a few days or weeks. If it causes data corruption it's not going to be a big thing because it's only 2 computers, my employer told me.

 

[Panther_Seraphin]

My employer told me that there willing to take the risk in 1 or 2 workstations and see how well it works. They're going to test it in a few days or weeks. If it causes data corruption it's not going to be a big thing because it's only 2 computers, my employer told me.

Yeah thats not how testing works.

They are far better off moving to a later LTSC version on machines that do not require it as a function of their job (I suspect that will be a LOT of the fleet). Moving onto the 21H2 LTSC also gives you support up until 2031 so that should be something your company should be looking at while they plan the CNC replacement in the near future.

 

[P4-630]

Do the CNC controlling machines actually need GPUs? I thought most of them just ran the GCode etc that was produced by the CNC program.

They write the programmes/simulation on windows workstations.

 

[Dr. Dro]

I think it is possible if someone in the forum knows how drivers work and how to unload nvlddmkm.sys to bypass OS detection by changing some of the hex values. One of my workplace computers is running LTSB 2016 and the modded driver for the 40 series works without altering the .sys file however the CNC program does not work in this version. If the driver works with Windows 1607 works I'm sure it should work in 1507 as well for the 40 series.

It's quite unfeasible IMHO - especially considering that this driver was not written for this version of Windows. There's a very small chance it will work by forcibly modifying it so it's loadable by this version of the kernel but if this KMD calls ANY kernel function that's unsupported, it's very likely you'll have a full blown system crash, and not the type that's easily overcome.

The r470 driver branch's trick for 8.1 and perhaps early 10 works because the r470 driver was already written for this OS to begin with. It was an artificial decision by NVIDIA to block Ampere cards on this OS level.

 

[lexluthermiester]

My employer told me that there willing to take the risk in 1 or 2 workstations and see how well it works. They're going to test it in a few days or weeks. If it causes data corruption it's not going to be a big thing because it's only 2 computers, my employer told me.

While we've been discussing, I've been looking into this. Hacking the current driver to work with 1507 will not work and will likely result in a corrupt Windows install. The driver code is not compatible with the driver model employed with 1507. The hardware being employed didn't exist when 1507 was in mainstream support.

 

[bug]

That does not apply to Enterprise LTSB as that version of the OS is on a completely different support channel.
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us...-support/f34d466b-b60c-4966-8bc0-2593a6a4311a

That said, I have installed RTX2000 series cards on LTSB 1507. Driver version 442.50 is known to support 1507 with the RTX 2000 series cards. A newer version of the driver might also, but this version is the one I have used.

Driver Details | NVIDIA

Download the <dd~LanguageName> <dd~Name> for <dd~OSName> systems. Released <dd~ReleaseDateTime>

www.nvidia.com

Welcome to being a business the real world.

There is nothing wrong with the machine, only it's OS support.

No offense there, but you have no idea how expensive CNC machines are, nor how costly they are to remove, replace and install. Just because it's older DOES NOT mean it's useless.

Well, if they're so expensive, perhaps someone didn't do their due diligence wrt support when buying?

I mean, if I have 1 piece of expensive hardware (CNC machine) that depends on another piece of hardware, I'd better stock up on replacement parts. I know, hindsight is always 20/20, but still... Hacking drivers for a 9yo Windows version? Good luck with that.

 

[Assimilator]

Okay since you apparently are incapable of understanding when things are explained nicely, let me try differently.

Your employer is a dumbass.
They are a dumbass because they are on a version of Windows 10 that's nearly a decade old.
They are a dumbass because, knowing full well the above, they decided to bulk buy newer GPUs without checking if said GPUs are compatible with their ancient-ass Windows version.
They are a dumbass because, after finding out the incompatibility the hard way, they sent a random employee (yourself) to do Internet searches on how to make those GPUs work by hacking the drivers, instead of doing the sane thing like returning the GPUs.
They are a dumbass because Windows 10 2015 LTSB support ends in less than 2 years' time and they have no plan for getting their CNC software incompatibility addressed before then.

Your employer is such a dumbass that they do not deserve to be in business, and likely will cease to be once your Windows version goes out of support and they immediately get hacked by the friendly neighborhood script kiddie. @Solaris17 has already explained what needs to be done to fix this mess, which is hire someone with the expertise to fix it properly, not continue down this path of compounding stupidity with yet more stupidity. Will it cost money? Probably. But the stupid tax is what you pay when you don't do things right to begin with.

 

[bug]

Okay since you apparently are incapable of understanding when things are explained nicely, let me try differently.

Your employer is a dumbass.
They are a dumbass because they are on a version of Windows 10 that's nearly a decade old.
They are a dumbass because, knowing full well the above, they decided to bulk buy newer GPUs without checking if said GPUs are compatible with their ancient-ass Windows version.
They are a dumbass because, after finding out the incompatibility the hard way, they sent a random employee (yourself) to do Internet searches on how to make those GPUs work by hacking the drivers, instead of doing the sane thing like returning the GPUs.
They are a dumbass because Windows 10 2015 LTSB support ends in less than 2 years' time and they have no plan for getting their CNC software incompatibility addressed before then.

Your employer is such a dumbass that they do not deserve to be in business, and likely will cease to be once your Windows version goes out of support and they immediately get hacked by the friendly neighbourhood script kiddie. @Solaris17 has already explained what needs to be done to fix this mess, which is hire someone with the expertise to fix it properly, not continue down this path of compounding stupidity with yet more stupidity. Will it cost money? Probably. But the stupid tax is what you pay when you don't do things right to begin with.

No need to sugar-coat it

 

[KedsDead]

Tell him how your really feel.