needs information to replace aircoolong by watercooling

[Johnt31]

Hello everyone

I wish to replace my bequiet dark rock pro 4 on my 8600k but a would like o/c aboe 4.7Ghz i think 4.9/5.0 ghz if possible i've got Asus z370 strix F gaming .

I would like to have opinions and recommendation on watercooling, i'am looking for a pretty efficient water cooling is quite silent.


I saw more than one model:

1) thermaltake water 3.0 360 argb

2) deepcool castle ex 360 v2

3) coolermaster ml360r

secondly i've got 2*200mm fan on my case h500p

would it be better to replace them with 3 * 140 mm or stay on 2 * 200 mm ?


cordially John

 

[Kapone33]

My recommendation is the Alpahcool Eisbaer 360. That is an expandable loop that you could use with your GPU (if you ever get a water block). In terms of fans you are good with the 2 200MM fans (they produce more air at lower RPMs than the 140s). If you are getting the Eisbaer buy it directly from Alphacool unless you live in the US where Aquatuning is the dealer for Alphacool products. The highlights of the Eisbaaer are:

1. Completely copper radiator and block
2. A fill hole on the block itself
3. A level indicator for your fluid.
4. Be Quiet fans
5. The block is big enough to cover 95% of the TR4 die.
6. It is probably cheaper than any of the ones you referenced

If ARGB is something you are looking for adding these is pretty painless

EZDIY-FAB LED RGB Fan Frame with Individual Addressable RGB Lighting 120mm Fan Mounting (Fan not Included) : Amazon.ca: Electronics

EZDIY-FAB LED RGB Fan Frame with Individual Addressable RGB Lighting 120mm Fan Mounting (Fan not Included) : Amazon.ca: Electronics

www.amazon.ca

 

[John Naylor]

1. I'd be surprised if your OC is temperature limited, more likely voltage will determine when you have to stop.

2. Unless the OC is intended to get your name on a "Best OCs" list at a web site, I would test only with application based stress tests which a) produce far lower taemps and b0 are multitasking type so they catch instabilities that synthetics don't.

3. IF I am not mistaken, all of those you referenced are CLCs with built in science projects on galvanic corrosion due to mixed metals (aluminum rads / copper blocks). You can not add corrosion inhibitors when they reach the end of their useful liffe. Weak pumps and extreme rpm fans.

4. The other type of AIO is a OLC ... which generally have:

-Pump Capacity > 1.0 gpm
-Ability to expand... add extra rads, GFPU blocks, MoBo blocks whatever
- All cooper, no mixed metals

5. The EK and Swiftech models are basically a set of water cooling custom loop components, pre-assembled at the factory. I personally prefer the $165 Swiftech H360 X3 ... the $275 EK MLC Phoenix is the best cooling wise but breaks 50 dbA... The Eisbaer 240 is about as loud as the 360 from Swiftech and and has a rather low flow rate at 0.30 gpm compared to the others. The fill port is not ideally located ... should be at the highest point in the system and be able to serve as a air bleed port and I prefer to have the pump (and the heat it produces) isolated from the CPU block

EK-MLC Phoenix is here! - ekwb.com

EK-MLC Phoenix is a Modular Liquid Cooling line of products and the next generation of improved All-In-One water cooling solutions. It is a new lineup of pre-filled products for liquid cooling, the 2nd generation of improved EK All-In-One products. Created for the market segment of customers who...

www.ekwb.com

Swiftech Drive X3 AIO CPU Coolers

Drive X3 AIO, all-in-one CPU cooler with built-in addressable RGB lighting

www.swiftech.com

Alphacool

Die Alphacool Eisbaer ist eine erweiterbare und wiederbefüllbare CPU All in One Wasserkühlung mit einem Vollkupferradiator.

www.alphacool.com

The advantage / disadvantage of the Swiftech is that the other two include quik-disconnects for adding a GPU block. It makes it easier to install a GPU Block, but is more expensive to get the GPU block w/ disconnects and they bulky so do kinda take away from the aesthetics

 

[Deleted member 185158]

Hello everyone

I wish to replace my bequiet dark rock pro 4 on my 8600k but a would like o/c aboe 4.7Ghz i think 4.9/5.0 ghz if possible i've got Asus z370 strix F gaming .

I would like to have opinions and recommendation on watercooling, i'am looking for a pretty efficient water cooling is quite silent.


I saw more than one model:

1) thermaltake water 3.0 360 argb

2) deepcool castle ex 360 v2

3) coolermaster ml360r

secondly i've got 2*200mm fan on my case h500p

would it be better to replace them with 3 * 140 mm or stay on 2 * 200 mm ?


cordially John

Half the problem is the stock thermal paste under the IHS plate.
Replacing that will give you a significant drop in temps..... even on your same air cooler.
After that, maybe look into better cooling.
For reference, my 8700K had nearly a 20c drop in temps after replacing the thermal paste under the IHS plate.

 

[Johnt31]

if i understant you recommanded to use delid on my 8600k ?
but waranty intel not work after

 

[Deleted member 185158]

if i understant you recommanded to use delid on my 8600k ?
but waranty intel not work after

Correct.

 

[joemama]

Deliding is a risky method, you could end up with a dead cpu if not careful, so better think twice before deliding the cpu

 

[John Naylor]

I have not hit a thermal wall when OC'ing since the 3700k .... with water cooling, I'm always in the mid to upper 70s when I hit 1.5 volts and I'm not willing to go any higher than that. And if not well up into the 80s, I don't really see the point of delidding.

 

[Deleted member 185158]

I have not hit a thermal wall when OC'ing since the 3700k .... with water cooling, I'm always in the mid to upper 70s when I hit 1.5 volts and I'm not willing to go any higher than that. And if not well up into the 80s, I don't really see the point of delidding.

1.5v a little high on ambient.
Hmm I thinks. 70c range on ambient at ?mhz and ?cpu.

Can we see that screen shot there?

 

[moproblems99]

I would delid first. The cost of a real loop is more than a used processor. If you don't f'up the delid, you save yourself a bunch of money.

 

[Johnt31]

1.5v a little high on ambient.
Hmm I thinks. 70c range on ambient at ?mhz and ?cpu.

Can we see that screen shot there?

i'm using hw info for take all information it's ok for you ?

f I optimize the flow of air there is possibility that it helps amon Dark rock pro 4

for exemple add 2* 200mm on my h500p on top ?

if add 2*200m i'm using in extraction or air in take

 

[Deleted member 185158]

i'm using hw info for take all information it's ok for you ?

f I optimize the flow of air there is possibility that it helps amon Dark rock pro 4

for exemple add 2* 200mm on my h500p on top ?

if add 2*200m i'm using in extraction or air in take

You can use HWInfo is good yes.

Would be nice to judge how hot your cpu is.
De-lid recommendation is a plus. It lowers temps significantly. Google search 8600K de-lid, maybe youtube watch some videos.
They do have a tool for de-lid that makes it pretty safe and easy to do. This will be the best thing you can do to bring temps down at a low cost.

 

[GorbazTheDragon]

You should be able to do 1.35v without a delid on an 8600k without much fuss unless the TIM is a real dud... The power density for the non-HT parts is lower. 1.42v@85c should be treated as the limit for desktop 14nm parts, most CFL chips should do between 4.9 and 5.2GHz daily stable with that voltage.

AIO water coolers will not perform significantly better than high end air coolers, IMO they are not worth the money.

Expandable/custom water cooling performs a lot better but the cost is disproportionate to the clock improvements you will get, it's the better option especially if money isn't an issue though.

 

[Deleted member 185158]

Coffee Lake runs hot.
Here some examples at Guru3D of people's experiences. Many claiming 15c drop in temps, I had the same results and recommend it for those wanting a better temp for a higher overclock.

8700k/8600k owners thread (I know the irony)

Deliding will be happening likely later this month. But I can’t seem to find a delid tool in stock anymore. I agree but I was really surprised with the...

forums.guru3d.com

Not kidding when I say significant temp drop. I can post links to just about every OC site here with similar comments.

 

[Johnt31]

i'm using software Asus for o/c

 

[Vayra86]

if i understant you recommanded to use delid on my 8600k ?
but waranty intel not work after

Shrimp is right, if you're going to invest big into watercooling this (rather light weight) CPU, you will hit a temperature wall unless you delid it first. Which is another way of saying, no delid = wasted money on WC.

If you're happy with a mild-normal OC up to 1.3V~1.35V (1.35 is pushing it!), you can do it on air with no delid, and it won't be noisy either, but the CPU will run at 80C ~ 90C. I'd personally say 85C should be your cap for 24/7 use, that way you'll also survive a hot summer day. Most 8600Ks will hit 5Ghz with that, a weak one might reach 4.7-4.9. If you're OK with that, go air I'd say and save the hassle and risk.

If you want to chase >5Ghz and bench scores, then WC, delid and

Just to be clear about silence. Water cooling adds a pump and pressure fans that may need a higher RPM than an air cooled setup with low RPM 140mm case fans & CPU fan. I literally do not hear my Dark Rock Pro 3 at full load and all fans in the case spin at ~1000 RPM, up to 1300 at load. Air really has more pros to be fair with you, if you WC, do it because you really want to.

 

[Deleted member 185158]

i'm using software Asus for o/c

If the system is stable with your software oc, you should dial those settings into bios.
Then test for stability with fulloads using stress test software.
We want to see the load temp.
Then we can see how hot it gets the way it is now.

 

[BarbaricSoul]

Air really has more pros to be fair with you, if you WC, do it because you really want to.

^this

 

[Johnt31]

i'm testing in game with asus software during 1h30

next stape i'm using parameterss on bios ans testing with octt

 

[Deleted member 185158]

the OCCT temp should be higher than your gaming temps, so do expect that.
Throttle temp is 95c.

 

[Johnt31]

i5 8600k @ 4.8ghz 15 mn testing i'm changing parametrer on bios

temperature are good or Not just core 2 is high i think

edit : 1hour same temperature

 

[John Naylor]

1.5v a little high on ambient.
Hmm I thinks. 70c range on ambient at ?mhz and ?cpu.

Can we see that screen shot there?

Ambient ? You missed a part of the post ".... with water cooling, I'm always in the mid to upper 70s when I hit 1.5 volts ". Typically systems have 5 x 140mm of rad, 10 rad fans and 4-6 case fans w/ dual pumps. BIOS is set at 1.3875 ... it rarely breaks 1.44 under RoG RB until it gets to the part gets to the part with AVX ... it wil "hit" 1.50 - 1.51 volts ... this is no way unusual and quite normal.

It also helps if you don't waste ya time with synthetic stress tests. RoG Real Bench will place a load far higher than your PC will ever experience using a multitasking real word applications scenario... and I have had 24 hour P95 OCs go belly up under RoG RB. The only thing I still use synthetics for is to ramp up CPU temps to 85C after completing the loop ... cycling it up to 85C and back to room temps to 'set' the TIM.

You should be able to do 1.35v without a delid on an 8600k without much fuss .....

AIO water coolers will not perform significantly better than high end air coolers, IMO they are not worth the money.

Expandable/custom water cooling performs a lot better but the cost is disproportionate to the clock improvements you will get, it's the better option especially if money isn't an issue though.

Agreed. tho id say performance of the better air coolers is better than most AIOs thermally and just about all if if you consider perfomance / noise ratio. i don't do custom builds for the temps, but for the sound level. If I can tell the PC is running by using my ears, it's unacceptable.

You should be able to do 1.35v without a delid on an 8600k without much fuss .....

AIO water coolers will not perform significantly better than high end air coolers, IMO they are not worth the money.

Expandable/custom water cooling performs a lot better but the cost is disproportionate to the clock improvements you will get, it's the better option especially if money isn't an issue though.

Agreed. tho id say performance of the better air coolers is better than most AIOs thermally and just about all if if you consider perfomance / noise ratio. i don't do custom builds for the temps, but for the sound level. If I can tell the PC is running by using my ears, it's unacceptable.

Just to be clear about silence. Water cooling adds a pump and pressure fans that may need a higher RPM than an air cooled setup with low RPM 140mm case fans & CPU fan. I literally do not hear my Dark Rock Pro 3 at full load and all fans in the case spin at ~1000 RPM, up to 1300 at load. Air really has more pros to be fair with you, if you WC, do it because you really want to.

CLC type AIOs do need higher RPM fans do to their inefficient aluminum radiators which often also have hi FPIs. The Corsair H100i for example routinely hit 60 dbA. For custom loops, we use 1200-1250 tpm fans ... the same size speed found on the better water coolers. (Noc NH-D15, Scyther Fuma, etc). However, those fans never stop ... and they often rise to max speed. On the custom builds, most of the time they are off and the system cools passively ... when a demanding game is going ... they might hit 550 - 650 rpm ..... even with stress test, they won't break 825 or so and are never audible ...The better 140 mm fans don't become audible until they break 875 rpm or so,

 

[Deleted member 185158]

Ambient ? You missed a part of the post ".... with water cooling, I'm always in the mid to upper 70s when I hit 1.5 volts ". Typically systems have 5 x 140mm of rad, 10 rad fans and 4-6 case fans w/ dual pumps. BIOS is set at 1.3875 ... it rarely breaks 1.44 under RoG RB until it gets to the part gets to the part with AVX ... it wil "hit" 1.50 - 1.51 volts ... this is no way unusual and quite normal.

It also helps if you don't waste ya time with synthetic stress tests. RoG Real Bench will place a load far higher than your PC will ever experience using a multitasking real word applications scenario... and I have had 24 hour P95 OCs go belly up under RoG RB. The only thing I still use synthetics for is to ramp up CPU temps to 85C after completing the loop ... cycling it up to 85C and back to room temps to 'set' the TIM.

Yea, Ambient = end cooling result of your water loop. Ambient air temps are what's use to cool the liquid inside the radiator.
Otherwise it would be "chilled" - Radiator in a bucket of ice water, or a de-humidifier with the rad placed in front of the evap.... or considered below ambient cooling, much like my geothermal loop.

I never said 1.5v was unusual. That's the voltage I use at 5400mhz...... with sub ambient water delta.... I never see 80c. Heck lucky to break 70c to be honest. It does take AVX instruction to reach temps this high.

Synthetic stress tests are made exactly for .... stress testing your Cpu. And reallyu gets hot with AVX or AVX2 instructions which some people do utilize therefor implemented into the stress test.
Stress test without AVX uses quite a bit less Cpu cache. Once you start loading CPU cache, add 10c..... Wait you've already demonstrated that so I suppose I'm not really telling you anything you don't already know??

Burn in is required by some pastes. This is a good thing to look out for.
I find that the first 24 hours after a waterblock installation, the TIM has pushed out nicely. Or "set up" like how you said it. I then re-torque my mounting studs (custom mounting) just to be sure from the push out I didn't loosed up, which if does is only an inch pound or two at most. But I always like to double check my mounts a day or two later.

Any rate, I was only exclaiming that 1.5v would be kinda high for a 2/4/7 overclock, that's all.....

i5 8600k @ 4.8ghz 15 mn testing i'm changing parametrer on bios

temperature are good or Not just core 2 is high i think

edit : 1hour same temperature

That's about as hot as you want to get it. Pushing more is asking for trouble.

Ideally you want to stay 80c or less, your every day use, this should be no problem.

 

[Vario]

My advice is to not delid, and to stick with the aircooler, and to just run less voltage and/or lower clock because the reality is you won't notice a difference in real world performance except to your wallet.

 

[Deleted member 185158]

My advice is to not delid, and to stick with the aircooler, and to just run less voltage and/or lower clock because the reality is you won't notice a difference in real world performance except to your wallet.

You're right.
He should send it to someone to de-lid it for him. Good idea!