planning for a big upgrade

[hiei27]

hi, i'm planning to upgrade my current build (https://it.pcpartpicker.com/list/wdygFs) because sometimes i feel some random stutters here and there, even on web browsing, and let's be honest, after 11 years of service it's really time to upgrade a bit.

this pc is used 50/50 between watching videos and gaming, sometimes both at the same time, keep in mind that for "gaming" i don't mean anything too much graphic related, like hevily modded minecraft, indie games and mmorpg like path of exile, and very rarely heavy titles like diablo 4

i do have a 700-900€ (euro) budget (i'm in italy) and in my mind i was going to keep the video card and use the kingston ssd as a boot drive in a new board (i got it for free and put it in a pcie adapter to use it for steam library), but i can't even decide if going intel or amd, and considering i'm the type to not upgrade often (as u can see) i'm here to ask for advices.
(keep in mind, for what i'm actually playng the video card seems to perform quite well, i do have a 4k monitor + a 1080p one but i usually game at 1080 resolution)

for the budget obviously the lower the better, but i'm willing to stretch it out if that means getting a massive improve on performance.

thanks for the time u took reading it ^^

 

[Hyderz]

Hey man

How old is that psu?
I would grab a b650 or x670 motherboard, 7600x, as for ram you decide 16 or 32 (i prefer grabbing 32)
since you are the type that holds onto the pc for a very long time, am5 is perfect
as it is supported until 2026 i believe... you can grab another more powerful cpu later on

 

[hiei27]

Hey man

How old is that psu?
I would grab a b650 or x670 motherboard, 7600x, as for ram you decide 16 or 32 (i prefer grabbing 32)
since you are the type that holds onto the pc for a very long time, am5 is perfect
as it is supported until 2026 i believe... you can grab another more powerful cpu later on

i can't recall precisely, but it's before 2016 for sure, it's quite old but it served me well XD

 

[Bobaganoosh]

For that budget, you may be a little limited in what you can get, but you're not looking super high-end, so there are options (everything is just expensive these days).
I put together a budget intel setup here.
A similar AMD setup here.

I tried to keep them similar and go for best bang/buck in the price regions, but there are several other options out there. With both setups there are many more powerful CPUs that can be dropped into the motherboard that won't require a new cooler. there are cheaper coolers out there and neither CPU quite requires that one, but if you buy it now, you wouldn't need a new one in two years if you did want to buy a more powerful CPU to drop into the motherboard. With AMD, it is possible the next gen will also be compatible with these motherboards, but we don't have confirmation of that yet. For the Intel system, you could go as far as 14th gen, but that's definitely the end of the line for that motherboard.
I did not put a new GPU, hard drive, or case on the list, but did include a new power supply. Again, these are not the only options out there, but I wanted to put together something just to show you can get very similar performance from both platforms for a similar price.

As to how those two perform, the 7600X looks like it absolutely wins at 1080p in gaming. The intel will win in Cinebench, but that's not everybody's favorite game lol. I'm sure there are other places the intel competes and maybe wins (3DMark CPU profile test for example), and there are probably some games, but overall, the 7600X will be the better gaming CPU.

 

[Marcus L]

You could probably get a 5600 b550 board 32gb ddr4 and a 6700 xt for your budget which would be a pretty noticeable upgrade on everything you currently have and better than just upgrading your CPU and ram

 

[hiei27]

For that budget, you may be a little limited in what you can get, but you're not looking super high-end, so there are options (everything is just expensive these days).
I put together a budget intel setup here.
A similar AMD setup here.

I tried to keep them similar and go for best bang/buck in the price regions, but there are several other options out there. With both setups there are many more powerful CPUs that can be dropped into the motherboard that won't require a new cooler. there are cheaper coolers out there and neither CPU quite requires that one, but if you buy it now, you wouldn't need a new one in two years if you did want to buy a more powerful CPU to drop into the motherboard. With AMD, it is possible the next gen will also be compatible with these motherboards, but we don't have confirmation of that yet. For the Intel system, you could go as far as 14th gen, but that's definitely the end of the line for that motherboard.
I did not put a new GPU, hard drive, or case on the list, but did include a new power supply. Again, these are not the only options out there, but I wanted to put together something just to show you can get very similar performance from both platforms for a similar price.

As to how those two perform, the 7600X looks like it absolutely wins at 1080p in gaming. The intel will win in Cinebench, but that's not everybody's favorite game lol. I'm sure there are other places the intel competes and maybe wins (3DMark CPU profile test for example), and there are probably some games, but overall, the 7600X will be the better gaming CPU.

thanks a lot man, the amd setup seems the more future proof path and since i don't usually play with benchmarks that part is irrelevant to me XD

You could probably get a 5600 b550 board 32gb ddr4 and a 6700 xt for your budget which would be a pretty noticeable upgrade on everything you currently have and better than just upgrading your CPU and ram

yeah but will this kind of system last me as long as the one bobaganoosh pointed? i was already planning on upgrading the gpu somewhere around next year (rtx 4xxx super series maybe?) since it's still serving me well, i'm wrong about waiting?

 

[Bobaganoosh]

i was already planning on upgrading the gpu somewhere around next year (rtx 4xxx super series maybe?) since it's still serving me well, i'm wrong about waiting?

Hard to say. Generally speaking, there's always new stuff "around the corner" so the time to buy is when you have the money and need the upgrade. There are of course exceptions about buying within a few weeks of something new coming out usually being a bad idea because prices will adjust after that. The current trend is GPU pricing going up for the high-end. If you're purchasing mid-range, it probably doesn't matter when you buy. Do you know what "super" you'd be interested in? Or are you just hoping for a trickle-down of pricing from that launch? Honestly, I don't think we'll see much reduction of other prices if that's what you're hoping for. I could be wrong, but most leaks indicates Nvidia will just be raising prices of things if anything (discontinuing replaced products, not adding more price segmentation). I guess it's possible that it causes AMD prices to go down slightly, but that's not really clear either. It doesn't seem like it really changes the competition anywhere, honestly. If you don't care most about RT, 7900XT/XTX are really good cards. If you do care about RT, you'll regret not getting an Nvidia card. the AMD cards still do RT, but about as good as last gen Nvidia...which is certainly passable. So it's not even like they can't do it.

That's a lot of rambling about not much, sorry, but we are in a bit of a time period where we don't know much about what the market is going to do and there are no new generations of GPUs "just around the corner" right now. If now is not the time to buy that, I'd wait until you have money saved for it and reassess then.

Also, I didn't get into cases, because there are tons of them in every price range. I really like be quiet! products, but Fractal, Lian Li, Corsair, Hyte, and a few others have been putting out really compelling cases lately at a range of prices. Just figure out what size you want, what will fit the parts you want (like if you had a long GPU in mind for the future, be careful about what case you pick lol) and then read some reviews or watch some review videos, especially if they build in the case and you can see how/where things fit. That's always helpful.

 

[hiei27]

well i was hoping for a 4060 super, maybe even 4070 super depending on how much money i can scrape meanwhile. For the games i play RT is not really a thing, so that's not a thing i consider while factoring in all the variables, but i do like the fact that nvidia supports quite a lot of older cards with new drives, that gives me a sort of assurance since i tend to keep my rig for a long time XD

that's also the reason while i'm hesitant to build something with ddr4, sure it's cheaper, but i dunno if it will last as long as going directly with the "next" tech segment

let's hope for some good discounts XD

 

[Bobaganoosh]

As far as I'm aware (which is just based on the "leaks" I've read...not that those can be 100% trusted anyway), there isn't a 4060 super planned. Allegedly, there will be a 4070 Super sometime in the next month or two, but that's the lowest "Super" model that's leaked out. That's why I had discussed higher-end GPUs above (sorry!). The 7800XT outperforms the RTX4070 for much cheaper, by the way. I'm betting the 4070 Super is intended to outperform that, but not for the same price. I know you're in Italy, but just to give a comparison of what's available today:
7800 XT: $559
RTX 4070: $659

If that was my price range, I'd buy the 7800XT, no doubt. It looks like a notable upgrade to go to 4070ti or 7900XT, but those are of course much more expensive. I just mention it because if the 4070 Super costs more than the 4070 above, you're getting closer to 7900XT territory, which is going to be a much better card. Those have been in the $720-800 range here. I'm not sure where all those prices compare where you are though, so I just wanted to spell this out as a bang/buck comparison based on the numbers I have here.

 

[hiei27]

aha don't feel sorry, there's nothing wrong in what u said, considering i'm rocking a 1070 feels like even a 7600 feels like an upgrade, but i think i might wait 2-3 months and go for a 7800 (that's around 600€ here), i'm not in a real rush so i can wait and see if there will be any discount during christmas

EDIT: one more thing, beside planning for a 850w power supply (just in case for the future) could u suggest me one (or more) cards from past generations? like rtx 3xxx and amd 6xxx please? i might consider loosing a bit if i find them for a cheap enough price XD

 

[Bobaganoosh]

6950xt is a great card. 3080 12GB and 3080ti are still good cards as well, so worth comparing reviews if you find those available at a good price.

For an 850W, I'd look at Seasonic, be quiet, Corsair, and Super Flower supplies. Something newer...the newer graphics cards (especially 3000 series nvidia) have higher current spikes than older generations and the psu companies all put out new supplies to accommodate.

Edit: I took a quick look on partpicker and set up a comparison of a few good options at 850W. Corsair has a couple 1000W supplies in the same price range that are reviewed pretty well. SeaSonic and be quiet! both have good platinum supplies in that price range too. I have the 1200W version of the be quiet! supply and it's awesome. Only the SeaSonic on that list doesn't have any of the new 12VHPWR connectors (the RM1000e doesn't, but comes with an adaptor cable). There's a lot of people who have had bad experiences with those, but until they come out with something better, I'd rather have a power supply with a dedicated cable than rely on any cumbersome adaptors if you end up with a video card that uses it. There are other options available, but I just thought I'd try to find 4 that compete well in that price range. One other one is the new SeaSonic Vertex GX-850, they've been well reviewed and have the new cables, but that and the Straight Power 12 start getting expensive. If you need to go cheaper, I'd try to find reviews on the be quiet! Pure Power 12 M 850W and the Corsair RM850e maybe. I haven't read reviews on those yet, but might be good budget options. It is important not to go too cheap on the power supply though, especially if you're considering a higher powered GPU.

 

[hiei27]

6950xt is a great card. 3080 12GB and 3080ti are still good cards as well, so worth comparing reviews if you find those available at a good price.

For an 850W, I'd look at Seasonic, be quiet, Corsair, and Super Flower supplies. Something newer...the newer graphics cards (especially 3000 series nvidia) have higher current spikes than older generations and the psu companies all put out new supplies to accommodate.

Edit: I took a quick look on partpicker and set up a comparison of a few good options at 850W. Corsair has a couple 1000W supplies in the same price range that are reviewed pretty well. SeaSonic and be quiet! both have good platinum supplies in that price range too. I have the 1200W version of the be quiet! supply and it's awesome. Only the SeaSonic on that list doesn't have any of the new 12VHPWR connectors (the RM1000e doesn't, but comes with an adaptor cable). There's a lot of people who have had bad experiences with those, but until they come out with something better, I'd rather have a power supply with a dedicated cable than rely on any cumbersome adaptors if you end up with a video card that uses it. There are other options available, but I just thought I'd try to find 4 that compete well in that price range. One other one is the new SeaSonic Vertex GX-850, they've been well reviewed and have the new cables, but that and the Straight Power 12 start getting expensive. If you need to go cheaper, I'd try to find reviews on the be quiet! Pure Power 12 M 850W and the Corsair RM850e maybe. I haven't read reviews on those yet, but might be good budget options. It is important not to go too cheap on the power supply though, especially if you're considering a higher powered GPU.

3080ti 925€
3080 12gb LHS 974€
4070 650€
4060ti (16gb) 490€

6700xt 350€
6800xt 519€
6950xt 700€

7700xt 510€
7800xt 564€/589€
7900xt 850€

that's an impromptu list of the various gpus, comparing price/performance what's the best bang for the buck? (all brand new, i'm not too fond of used gpus after seeing too many random cards used for mining and being sold as "barely used")

 

[Bobaganoosh]

3080ti 925€
3080 12gb LHS 974€
4070 650€
4060ti (16gb) 490€

6700xt 350€
6800xt 519€
6950xt 700€

7700xt 510€
7800xt 564€/589€
7900xt 850€

that's an impromptu list of the various gpus, comparing price/performance what's the best bang for the buck? (all brand new, i'm not too fond of used gpus after seeing too many random cards used for mining and being sold as "barely used")

Well for those prices I wouldn't touch the Nvidia 3000 series. Those prices are crazy. They would only make sense if they were less than $600.

From that list, I would rank best bang/buck as:
7900XT
7800XT
6950XT
and I don't think you could convince me to buy the others at those prices. That said, my list is heavily weighted on what performance levels I find acceptable (info below)

If you look at a TPU review of the 7700XT, it shows this order for Relative Performance at 4k (I'm keeping your values):
7900xt 850€ 155% .18235 75.3
3090 (closest they have to 3080ti) 925€ 138% .149 68.4
6950xt 700€ (they list 6900XT @ 125%, so 6950XT would be even higher) .17857 61.8
7800xt 564€/589€ 121% .215 59.5
3080 12gb LHS 974€ (they list 10GB @ 119%, so 12GB could be slightly higher) .122 59.8
6800xt 519€ 117% .225 57.7
4070 650€ 114% .175 57.2
7700xt 510€ 100% .196 49.6
4060ti (16gb) 490€ 84% .171 39.3
6700xt 350€ 78% .223 39.3

I also included a ratio of %/€ for your values and the minimum average FPS@4k during their review. As for my weighting, I factor in what levels I want to play at and what's worth spending money on. I figure if I'm going to spend hundreds of dollars, I want to get a real upgrade for that. The higher end starts giving you less FPS/$, hence why I end up skewing the weighting a bit. I look at those performance numbers and see you get really close performance to the 3080ti from the 6950XT for much less money, so that's on the list. 7900XT is the best performer on the list and better value than over half the list so it's top for me being too close to the other pricing while being a top performer. Performance below 4070 starts to drop off pretty hard and the price of the 4070 is just too much for what you get. The 7000-series is going to do any RT better than 6000 series and if they also do whatever AMD's frame-generation is better than there are other features that push them higher than they originally look as well. So all that considered, it becomes a question for me of "is the 7800XT or 7900XT in the budget?" 6950XT had really good performance (in everything but RT), but there are not many left out there so they're still priced a little high.

 

[hiei27]

so 7800xt it is then XD

https://it.pcpartpicker.com/list/CD6yt7

that's how the build is supposed to look like (i've to check clearance for the video card since the one in the build is 323mm, but there's a 267mm one that sacrificies a bit of boost clock)
sure, that's over budget for now, but i think i can keep my 1070 for 3-4 months untill i scrape enough money to get it or maybe ill get some christmas discount somewhere that might make things possible.

Am i forgetting anything? XD (or better,with that kind of a budget the build is sound or is possible to do better, price/performance wise?)

EDIT: there's the ryzen 7900x on sale @395€.....frick my budget seems to inflate like a baloon every time i watch the list, gotta go rob a bank or something Oo

https://it.pcpartpicker.com/list/BD4GbL

i feel like this will never end if i keep watching it ><

 

[Bobaganoosh]

If you're just gaming, the 7800X3D is 406€. for 11 euros I'd go with the 7800X3D because it's better at gaming. Also worth considering, in TPU's reviews, the 7600X performs almost the same on average as the 7900X. So if you have non-gaming tasks that will benefit from the extra threads, that'd be the only reason to look at the 7900X. The 7800X3D is faster at 1080p, but if you go to 4k, you're completely GPU limited, so it won't really matter.

As for what are you forgetting, I'd say a case and hard drives, but I figured you were planning to reuse what you have. If you drop to the 7600X, you can spend the savings on a case lol

 

[hiei27]

If you're just gaming, the 7800X3D is 406€. for 11 euros I'd go with the 7800X3D because it's better at gaming. Also worth considering, in TPU's reviews, the 7600X performs almost the same on average as the 7900X. So if you have non-gaming tasks that will benefit from the extra threads, that'd be the only reason to look at the 7900X. The 7800X3D is faster at 1080p, but if you go to 4k, you're completely GPU limited, so it won't really matter.

As for what are you forgetting, I'd say a case and hard drives, but I figured you were planning to reuse what you have. If you drop to the 7600X, you can spend the savings on a case lol

well the most multitasking i do on the machine is hosting a minecraft server while simultaneously playng on it (i also used to stream the entire thing with intel quicksync tech), i don't know if that could be considered "extreme multi thread" but i think it doesn't even come close.
For hard drives i should already be fine, the case should be good, i just need to get a front panel addon for a usb C XD

mmhhh i might manage to get back into streaming with the new setup....
is a build with the 7600x capable or i should look for something with a 14600k/13700k to make full use of intel quicksync codec?

 

[dgianstefani]

13600K/14700K+DDR5+Z790 now

4070 Super + new PSU later.

 

[hiei27]

13600K/14700K+DDR5+Z790 now

4070 Super + new PSU later.

what if i wanted to get everything now fitting it into a 1500€ (italian) budget? (there's an option that i can get someone to pay for a part of it, but i must use the chance now XD)

 

[Bobaganoosh]

I hope someone else can chime in with some advise there. I don't do any streaming or quicksync so I don't know what your best option is there or what the alternatives are to consider.

Just swapping motherboard and CPU: https://it.pcpartpicker.com/list/DX9XJy. Alternative motherboard: https://it.pcpartpicker.com/list/nmfRYN.

 

[hiei27]

it could also be possible to go amd cpu and use an nvidia card for their hardware encoder, but being out of touch with the streaming for about 4 years now i'll wait for suggestion on the best thing to do XD

 

[dgianstefani]

For streaming having E cores is great.

6+8 vs 6 core is no contest.

 

[hiei27]

For streaming having E cores is great.

6+8 vs 6 core is no contest.

so u're suggesting a 13700(k)/14700(k) with an nvidia card, looking at your previous post, but if i can't manage to get that can i go for a 13600(k)/146008k) with what kind of present video card? or it's smarter to wait with my current 1070 untill the 4070super (that i don't know if i will be able to affort when it will get released tho XD)?

 

[Bobaganoosh]

I think it's a valid point on the CPU if streaming is you're use-case. I will say the 7800XT has AV1, as well as H264 and H265 capabilities, so you would still be able to do what you're trying to do with that card (the card also being an encoding option beyond quicksync). From what I could find, Nvidia's encoding is better quality than AMD's, but I would point back to the price difference. You'd lose performance but have better quality encoding while paying an extra 100+Euros. Is that worth it? Also how much better, I can't say. If I were you, I'd try to find some youtube comparisons and examples of how the 7800XT does streaming and compare that to quicksync and any other encoding options out there and then you can decide which one is worth the money.

 

[dgianstefani]

so u're suggesting a 13700(k)/14700(k) with an nvidia card, looking at your previous post, but if i can't manage to get that can i go for a 13600(k)/146008k) with what kind of present video card? or it's smarter to wait with my current 1070 untill the 4070super (that i don't know if i will be able to affort when it will get released tho XD)?

Waiting for 4070 Super is your best option.

13600K is 6/8, 14700K is 8/12, 14600K is just extra MHz.

 

[Bobaganoosh]

Waiting for 4070 Super is your best option.

13600K is 6/8, 14700K is 8/12, 14600K is just extra MHz.

13600k and 14600k are the same price for them. 14700k adds another 130Euros. The GPU you suggested also will likely cost over 100 Euros more than what OP picked and provide...the same-ish (...we don't know yet) gaming performance to the 7800 XT. I agreed with you on the intel CPU with e-cores if they're going to be streaming, but if we're just ignoring their requests to stay in a certain price range I'm surprised you didn't just recommend a 14900k and 4090 lol