Voltage Droop Enough to be Concerned With?

[erek]

Is this enough to be concerned with under CS:GO Loads?

Is this enough to be concerned with under CS:GO Loads?

longer time frame:

 

[GerKNG]

both 3.3 and 5v is below the acceptable range. 12V is fine by itself but we only talk about very light load on the CPU.
i bet with cinebench or something similar it will drop much more.
is that really a AX1200?

 

[ArdWar]

Your reading overall looks lower than normal. Are you sure the voltage metering is actually properly calibrated?

 

[erek]

both 3.3 and 5v is below the acceptable range. 12V is fine by itself but we only talk about very light load on the CPU.
i bet with cinebench or something similar it will drop much more.
is that really a AX1200?
View attachment 215782

Your reading overall looks lower than normal. Are you sure the voltage metering is actually properly calibrated?

it's a real Corsair AX1200 (from 2011), and i'm using hwmonitor utility to get that output and not a physical device

 

[GerKNG]

it's a real Corsair AX1200 (from 2011), and i'm using hwmonitor utility to get that output and not a physical device

Okay that explains a lot.
2011 is pretty old.

i'd buy a new one (just for good measure) and keep this one for troubleshooting in the future.
but as long as you don't have real problems like shutdowns or RAM/CPU/GPU stability, SSD/HDD dropouts/errors you should be fine

 

[lexluthermiester]

Is this enough to be concerned with

both 3.3 and 5v is below the acceptable range. 12V is fine by itself but we only talk about very light load on the CPU.
i bet with cinebench or something similar it will drop much more.
is that really a AX1200?
View attachment 215782

This. Also remember that thermal sensors in the CPU and on other components operate within certain margins of error, and...

longer time frame:

View attachment 215781

...these readings are within those margins of error as well as being within ATX specs shown by GerKNG.

You're fine. No need to worry.

2011 is pretty old.

i'd buy a new one and keep this one for troubleshooting in the future.

Not going to agree with this however. Old does not mean worn out. If the PSU is giving signs of failing then yes, it's time to upgrade. However, the load that system is putting on that PSU is nowhere near it's max load potential.

 

[erek]

so majorly conflicting reports,

be worried or not? ^^^

 

[GerKNG]

so majorly conflicting reports,

be worried or not? ^^^

no need to worry about damaging stuff with these voltages.
need to worry about stability and maybe a random PSU death (since it's over a decade old)

 

[lexluthermiester]

so majorly conflicting reports,

be worried or not? ^^^

Not. Keep an eye on those voltages. If they continue to GET WORSE and droop further than they are now, then yes, it's time to buy a replacement. However, if the voltages are steady and don't jump around any more than they are now, you're fine.

 

[erek]

yeah, currently diagnosing random reboots

yeah, currently diagnosing random reboots

"
The previous system shutdown at 11:23:08 PM on ‎9/‎5/‎2021 was unexpected.




[11:33 PM]
Dump file creation failed due to error during dump creation.




[11:33 PM]
The system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first. This error could be caused if the system stopped responding, crashed, or lost power unexpectedly.




[11:33 PM]
Audit events have been dropped by the transport. 0
"

 

[lexluthermiester]

no need to worry about damaging stuff.

This. That PSU will not kill anything if it happens to die.

yeah, currently diagnosing random reboots


View attachment 215784

"
The previous system shutdown at 11:23:08 PM on ‎9/‎5/‎2021 was unexpected.




[11:33 PM]
Dump file creation failed due to error during dump creation.




[11:33 PM]
The system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first. This error could be caused if the system stopped responding, crashed, or lost power unexpectedly.




[11:33 PM]
Audit events have been dropped by the transport. 0
"

How many times has this happened?

 

[erek]

This. That PSU will not kill anything if it happens to die.


How many times has this happened?

happens pretty often with Watch_dogs Legion


but recently been happening with cs:go after a new nvidia driver update, the latest


currently diagnosing now

 

[ArdWar]

it's a real Corsair AX1200 (from 2011), and i'm using hwmonitor utility to get that output and not a physical device

BIOS/ACPI voltage measurement is done thru chipset voltage reference, so there's non-zero chance that the reference is off (or conversely, PSU's reference is off).

Anyway looking at your PSU age, I agree that most likely your PSU starting to fail. Most likely the voltage actually dipped far below what the ACPI is reporting. Voltage dip at transient load seems about right behavior for a failing caps, which is about right at 10 years for highly stressed caps.

BTW use HWINFO or something else, lol. HWMonitor is/was known to report whacky voltage, although it seems to be not the case here.

 

[erek]

any recommendations for my particular system as a path forward other than going straight to a Corsair AX1600i?

 

[lexluthermiester]

any recommendations for my particular system as a path forward other than going straight to a Corsair AX1600i?

What area of the world are you located?

The reason I ask is if you're stateside you have a ton of options. Your system doesn't need a 1600w PSU. Even under max load your system will pull 650w to 700w at most. A 1000w will be more than enough.

https://www.amazon.com/EVGA-Modular-Warranty-Supply-210-GQ-1000-V1/dp/B017ICWP82

https://www.amazon.com/CORSAIR-RM1000x-Certified-Modular-Supply/dp/B015YEI7LK

 

[erek]

What area of the world are you located?

[US]

this is with cinebench r23

 

[lexluthermiester]

[US]

this is with cinebench r23

View attachment 215797

I'm just not seeing a serious problem there. Those dips are within acceptable load-line tolerances. Something to note is your RAM voltages. IF the PSU was the problem, those voltages would dip by an equal percentage as all the other voltages. But that's not happening. The RAM voltages are staying steady. This is a strong indication that PSU is not suspect.

 

[ArdWar]

Something to note is your RAM voltages. IF the PSU was the problem, those voltages would dip by an equal percentage as all the other voltages.

Huh, is that how it usually works? I thought that each POL VRM got their own regulator and not simply a ratiometric buck converter.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Huh, is that how it usually works? I thought that each POL VRM got their own regulator and not simply a ratiometric buck converter.

RAM power regulation is handled on/by the motherboard, just like all other component power regulation. So if the PSU power delivery is fluctuating, it will fluctuate equally across all power lines, including RAM. The lack of fluctuation in the RAM voltages directly indicates the PSU is not at fault for the problems the OP is having. The problem is likely with another part in the system.

 

[ArdWar]

RAM power regulation is handled on/by the motherboard, just like all other component power regulation.

Even if it is handled by motherboard, wouldn't the VRM still have regulation? So even if the input voltage varies, output voltage shouldn't.

Otherwise an unregulated VRM output voltage will also vary depends on load...

 

[lexluthermiester]

Even if it is handled by motherboard, wouldn't the VRM still have regulation? So even if the input voltage varies, output voltage shouldn't.

Otherwise an unregulated VRM output voltage will also vary depends on load...

I think you might be misunderstanding how power is supplied through parts in a PC. IF a PSU is failing, VDroop will take place equally across all system components. But the readings that OP has supplied show the opposite occurring. 12v/5v/3.3v are all taking a larger dip than the RAM voltage. This means the the VDroop is happening only with components under load. This behaviour effectively rules out the PSU is the culprit for the problems being displayed.

 

[erek]

 

[lexluthermiester]

View attachment 215823

Check "Don't show this warning again" and continue. HWinfo throws that warning out but very rarely causes problems..

 

[ArdWar]

I think you might be misunderstanding how power is supplied through parts in a PC. IF a PSU is failing, VDroop will take place equally across all system components. But the readings that OP has supplied show the opposite occurring. 12v/5v/3.3v are all taking a larger dip than the RAM voltage. This means the the VDroop is happening only with components under load. This behaviour effectively rules out the PSU is the culprit for the problems being displayed.

If the power architecture is done in a way resembling this one here:

then even if the input voltage fluctuates (within certain range) the output voltage should not track the input voltage, or even changing at all. This example is for FPGA, but I guess the general scheme is similar apart for the voltages and which rails the voltages are derived from.

Anyway I never actually measure the behavior of consumer motherboard VRMs. That would be a nice little project to do. It just seems so unintuitive and contrary to common electronic design practices to have VRM output that tracks input voltage outside of certain specific designs.

 

[erek]