Friday, August 15th 2008

Jen-Hsun Huang (NVIDIA): ''We Underestimated RV770''

NVIDIA suffered its first red-quarter in five years. There are several contributors to this, namely an up to US $200M write-off to cover expenses in recalling and restoring faulty mobile graphics processors.

Another factor has been a replenished product lineup from competitor AMD/ATI that is taking on NVIDIA products at mid thru high and enthusiast segments of the market, in essence ATI now has products to counter NVIDIA at every possible segment, with more dressing up to go to office.

Seeking Alpha spoke with CEO Jen-Hsun Huang, he was quoted saying:
We underestimated the price performance of our competitor’s most recent GPU, which led us to mis-position our fall lineup. The first step of our response was to reset our price to reflect competitive realities. Our action put us again in a strong competitive position but we took hard hits with respect to our overall GPU ASPs and ultimately to our gross margins. The price action was particularly difficult since we are just ramping 55-nanometer and the weak market resulted in taking longer than expected to work through our 65-nanometer inventory.
Huang says that with their transit to the 55nm silicon fabrication process, they hope to do better.Source: Seeking Alpha
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92 Comments on Jen-Hsun Huang (NVIDIA): ''We Underestimated RV770''

#1
zithe
Siman0 said:
ROFL :roll: ok come on guys Nvida was riding its butt on the 8000 series hell the 9000 series is a slightly modified 8000 core. Also honestly who didn't see this coming when DAAMIT released the 3000 series or even the 2000 series for that matter. A hint to the guys that say GDDR5 is not as good as GDDR3 ok, first hint: why is the GDDR3 4850 not as good as the GDDR5 4870 hmm maybe the memory bandwidth had something to do with it. don't know could jest be me. second hint: if its a marketing ploy why is Nvida frantically trying to throw it on there next Grfx core the 300 series... third hint: the Bit rate for GDDR3 is much higher than that of GDDR5 yes but then why is the 200 series still getting its rear end handed to it with a 256 bit GDDR5. fourth and final hint: DDR3 is now coming along for CPUs and DDR5 is coming to GPUs the speed of the DDR3 ram modules are much grater than that of DDR2 time change MOVE ON. Ok with that said yes to the guy you can get the same if you widen the buss but higher the with the more cash it costs and unless you want to pay 800 for 1 card...GDDR5 is a cheaper solution than constantly trying to make the buss width bigger.
DDR5 doesn't exist. GDDR5 does.
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#2
Hayder_Master
I think this is desperate talk , we need real work
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#3
hv43082
Hah the constant cat and mouse game.
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#4
Wile E
Power User
Viscarious said:
I cant stop laughing at all of you people!

Buy what you want and shut up. Play your games and be happy. If you want to play the latest games then buy the best card from your favorite company but cut all the bashing and biased remarks. Your not doing anything but raising your blood pressure and starting useless arguments.

Megasty's sig says everything anyone should really give a damn about. "gods are created through gaming not 3dmark..." Who gives a crap about your 22,000 3Dmark score when you go 3 and 22 in Call of Duty 4.

I know this wont stop anything so I'll come back to get another good laugh in. :D
Meh, I'd rather benchmark. lol.
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#5
AsRock
TPU addict
Maybe if game company's got of there asses and supported ATI's design like BIOSHOCK did, ATI would be in a much better place now.

Would it not be harder to support ATI's (shaders)design than nV's ?. Game companys from what i have seen are not upto the task due to costs and time.
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#6
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
Viscarious said:
I cant stop laughing at all of you people!

Buy what you want and shut up. Play your games and be happy. If you want to play the latest games then buy the best card from your favorite company but cut all the bashing and biased remarks. Your not doing anything but raising your blood pressure and starting useless arguments.

Megasty's sig says everything anyone should really give a damn about. "gods are created through gaming not 3dmark..." Who gives a crap about your 22,000 3Dmark score when you go 3 and 22 in Call of Duty 4.

I know this wont stop anything so I'll come back to get another good laugh in. :D
Just as you have gaming competitions, you have OC competitions too (and they are sometimes equally rewarding). So it does sometimes matter what 3DMark score you have. For overclockers, their favourite game is 3DMark :)
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#7
Tatty_One
Senior Moderator
AsRock said:
Maybe if game company's got of there asses and supported ATI's design like BIOSHOCK did, ATI would be in a much better place now.

Would it not be harder to support ATI's (shaders)design than nV's ?. Game companys from what i have seen are not upto the task due to costs and time.
Yes perhaps, but some could argue that NVidia's design is better in as much as they can match or beat ATi's single GPU performance with less than a third of the shaders....IDK, lots of people say understandably that ATi are at an disadvantage when it seems so many game developers support NVidia and it's architecture....they are probably right but hey.....I am sure ATi would do the same if they had both the market share and the money/marketing strategy to do it........it is naive to beleive IMO that NVidia is bad for doing so when ATi would probably like to also jump on the bandwagon I am sure.
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#8
Widjaja
Hmm
Nvidia underestimated the RV770 so they let NGO have the SDK to PhysX so they can implement it into the AMD drivers in hopes more game developers will be inclined to use PhysX instead of havok.
More game devs using PhysX = money for nVidia.
No game devs using HAVOK = AMD leasing HAVOK from Intel being a huge waste of money.

Dirty tactics.
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#9
PCpraiser100
btarunr said:
Just as you have gaming competitions, you have OC competitions too (and they are sometimes equally rewarding). So it does sometimes matter what 3DMark score you have. For overclockers, their favourite game is 3DMark :)
Hes right, I went in a pretty cool competition all about OC. There were over 1000 CPU casualties and my P4 630 bumped to about 4.9GHz with dry ice. Two days later, it died.
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#10
Viscarious
Ehh. Fine, I'll admit that tweaking your PC is fun. However, I still dont think its worth all the time and money for those few extra marks.
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#11
PCpraiser100
Viscarious said:
Ehh. Fine, I'll admit that tweaking your PC is fun. However, I still dont think its worth all the time and money for those few extra marks.
People don't really OC to get better scores in 3DMark. They use OC as the most cheapest way to stay compatible and even get the smallest siblings of the processor family pushed to performance thats very close to the biggest sibling. For example, take a look at this E7200, thanks to its stock fan-cooled OC its performance is very close to the E8400 and Q6600.

http://hothardware.com/Articles/Intel-Core-2-Duo-E7200/?page=6
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#12
newconroer
btarunr said:
Just as you have gaming competitions, you have OC competitions too (and they are sometimes equally rewarding). So it does sometimes matter what 3DMark score you have. For overclockers, their favourite game is 3DMark :)
When you get it in 'writing' that ATi and Nvidia make cards for people to 'compete' with one another in synthetic benchmarks, give me a call.

Until then, I find that laughable.

Oh damn, I laughed... EMO!

PCpraiser100 said:
People don't really OC to get better scores in 3DMark. They use OC as the most cheapest way to stay compatible and even get the smallest siblings of the processor family pushed to performance thats very close to the biggest sibling. For example, take a look at this E7200, thanks to its stock fan-cooled OC its performance is very close to the E8400 and Q6600.

http://hothardware.com/Articles/Intel-Core-2-Duo-E7200/?page=6
Not a fair analogy/comparison. CPUs aren't GPUs...well they have a processor but you know what I mean. Gains from overclocking on GPUs are becoming less and less. More and more you only benefit under acute situations, and most likely those situations are synthetic related.
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#13
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
newconroer said:
When you get it in 'writing' that ATi and Nvidia make cards for people to 'compete' with one another in synthetic benchmarks, give me a call.

Until then, I find that laughable.

Oh damn, I laughed... EMO!
Get it in 'writing' that graphics cards are meant only for gaming then ;)
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#14
Megasty
I knew that silly sig would start some stuff sooner or later. I've been on both sides of that mess, but I have blown up more cards benching than gaming. Only about 25% of binned chips out of any given batch are actually meant for OCing. In NV's camp K|ngp|n gets the best of the best, but he blown up more cards than I ever owned with his own cash b4 he was recognized by NV :rolleyes: Benching with cards is always hit or miss, any kind of unstable OC can blow a normal card. But benchers tend to push their cards higher than gamers, also the majority of gamers out there don't OC at all :p I personally don't game with OC'd cards.

Being part fo a bunch of guys that finally got their dues is great and all but they blew up so much of my wallet its a shame - but they also spent many weeks broke, eating cheeseburgers & drinking cheap beer. Buying non-OC'd cards is just a shot in the dark when it comes to benching while its a sure thing when it comes to daily gaming. I know that's just spliting hairs, but that's just how it. Graphics cards were always meant for gaming. The early goofy perverts like us just turned them over to the dark side of death & destruction, accompanied by glimmers of success, stardom, & dare I say godhood :eek:
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#15
Tatty_One
Senior Moderator
PCpraiser100 said:
People don't really OC to get better scores in 3DMark. They use OC as the most cheapest way to stay compatible and even get the smallest siblings of the processor family pushed to performance thats very close to the biggest sibling. For example, take a look at this E7200, thanks to its stock fan-cooled OC its performance is very close to the E8400 and Q6600.

http://hothardware.com/Articles/Intel-Core-2-Duo-E7200/?page=6
Very true....hence why my baby E8200 does 4.5gig :D
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#16
Tatty_One
Senior Moderator
newconroer said:
When you get it in 'writing' that ATi and Nvidia make cards for people to 'compete' with one another in synthetic benchmarks, give me a call.

Until then, I find that laughable.

Oh damn, I laughed... EMO!





Not a fair analogy/comparison. CPUs aren't GPUs...well they have a processor but you know what I mean. Gains from overclocking on GPUs are becoming less and less. More and more you only benefit under acute situations, and most likely those situations are synthetic related.
Maybe not so much ATi or NVidia.....but certainly their manufacturing partners.....all the leading card companies have "teams" or sponsor individuals, specifically so they can break records with their hardware which promotes it to the enthusiast community.
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#17
Wile E
Power User
Tatty_One said:
Maybe not so much ATi or NVidia.....but certainly their manufacturing partners.....all the leading card companies have "teams" or sponsor individuals, specifically so they can break records with their hardware which promotes it to the enthusiast community.
*cough* Overclocking Team Palit *cough* :D
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#18
Tatty_One
Senior Moderator
Wile E said:
*cough* Overclocking Team Palit *cough* :D
You need to take something for that cough my friend.........:D
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#19
Darkrealms
Glad to see Nvidia is waking up and willing to admit they fell asleep.

Now bring on the fighting! I want to see Nvidia fighting back : )
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#20
Megasty
Yeah NV, we need something from you to make the 4870x2 come down in price. AMD must have been sitting on their hands with the initial numbers of those things. They're basically sold out everywhere even at that high price...that boy must be really good or just really hyped up. C'mon AMD I want mine too :D
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#21
X1REME
INSTG8R said:
Well being a long time "Red Team" man(I bought a FX5200 and owned it for about 1/2 an hour and never looked back)In the past year I was firmly convinced my next upgrade would be on the other side. the 4xxx series restored my faith and I hope it continues to do so. Im not for either side, my Laptop has an 8400M in it and I'm very happy with it.
It just nice to see ATI pull it out finally and get back into being competitive.
8400M in laptops are failing fast which where the 200 million charge comes from lol, so i wouldn't be to happy if i got a nvidia card in any of my set ups bcoz even in the desktop they have problems but not being seen to the benefits of larger and cooler heat sinks and bigger fans. but ultimately all chips are defective as they all carry the same same thermal qualities or packaging.
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#22
X1REME
candle_86 said:
I am not a fanboi i am making a statement which is true, clock for clock the HD4850 and 4870 are close the 4870 is slightly faster clock for clock but not much, as said 8% at best and thats above 1680x1050, below that they are rather close, because of the higher latancy associated with GDDR5, this is not my statement this was made in a newspost here on TPU a month or so back. Call me what you want, but im stating facts. The reason the 4870 is faster is its core and mem are clocked higher than the 4850 thats it.
you state facts but yet provide no proof or reviews as the say contrary to what you say. talk about 10/27% as in most reviews not 8%. please do some research b4 typing anything.
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#23
X1REME
Tatty_One said:
I really dont know why some get so antagonised about this gfx card war, it's pretty simple really, one side comes out on top sometimes, the other side other times....thats gotta be good right? good for us consumers at least, so now we find ourselves in a position that ATi has the fastest single card solution and NVidia the 2nd fastest, ATi just about the 3rd with NVidia just about the fourth, so what.....but to say that just because the "other side" to your preference brings a techonolgy to the table that pushes the boundries of performance (AKA GDDR5) that its pointless is TBH, fanboism of the highest order......and thats coming from a fanboi!

Enjoy the technology, enjoy the breakthroughs and enjoy the competative pricing that brings because no doubt, down the line the "other side" will edge in front....and when they do, things get even cheaper! :rockout:
muhahaha, that's funny coz ATi is 1st hd4870x2, 2nd hd4850x2, 3rd hd4870, 4th hd4850 etc performance and price wise. am sure you realize there's new ones just coming (rv730-rc740-rv760 etc) and next year its R800 called little dragon. nvidia is not going no where any time soon coz amd is not playing games anymore as they are applying the Intel tick tock on nvidia with deadly results. now am just waiting for Intel`s turn to get slaughtered.

currently have Intel cpu and nvidia gpu but gonna change to all AMD = motherboard 790fx or 800fx, gpu hd4870 or hd4870x2 , cpu deneb 2.6 to 3.4ghz etc
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#24
Wile E
Power User
X1REME said:
muhahaha, that's funny coz ATi is 1st hd4870x2, 2nd hd4850x2, 3rd hd4870, 4th hd4850 etc performance and price wise. am sure you realize there's new ones just coming (rv730-rc740-rv760 etc) and next year its R800 called little dragon. nvidia is not going no where any time soon coz amd is not playing games anymore as they are applying the Intel tick tock on nvidia with deadly results. now am just waiting for Intel`s turn to get slaughtered.

currently have Intel cpu and nvidia gpu but gonna change to all AMD = motherboard 790fx or 800fx, gpu hd4870 or hd4870x2 , cpu deneb 2.6 to 3.4ghz etc
NV will come back out on top again. It's the way it has happened for years. It wasn't until NV released the 8800 that they took a commanding lead. They never held the performance crown for this long in the past, but neither did ATI. They both went back and forth every few months. I have a feeling this is what we are returning to.
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#25
X1REME
to everybody saying am glad nvidia has learned or that ati has woken up nvidia the beast.

all nvidia has woken upto is a powerpoint slide not fully complete yet, they don't have an answer for anther 8/9 months. look you cant just make new gpu cards from the 8 series architecture in a few months which exactly what it is + name changes for the past 2 years (nobody can OK)

the funny thing is when nvidia does come back after 8 to 9 months min they will get smacked right back down again with the r800 little dragon, nvidia gonna be 4rth for at least 2+ years. amd has finally learned there is no rest for the wicked as you may find your self bankrupt if you don't have the crown e.g cpu`s

nvidia fans make me laugh the things they come out with even when there on the loosing side
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