AMD Unlikely to Fix DX9 Games Bugged by Adrenalin Driver

[MuhammedAbdo]

LOL the miles AMD fanatics go through to justify this dick move is simply mind blowing! Really if AMD went tomorrow or next year or whatever and announced they are dropping DX10 and DX11 games as well they wouldn't even flinch.

 

[lexluthermiester]

buy a older gpu

But the problem isn't the GPU, it's the current release of drivers. The Radeon GPU's themselves are fine.

 

[Aquinus]

But the problem isn't the GPU, it's the current release of drivers. The Radeon GPU's themselves are fine.

In there lies the problem. AMD has some great hardware which is why we see constant performance improvements over time but, on the other hand it makes AMD's driver devs look incompetent. nVidia doesn't have that problem and they arguably get more done with less hardware for this very reason. Drivers aren't AMD's strong suit by any means. AMD going the "mostly open source" route with AMDGPU is a great example of this because they know the community is going to solve problems better than they can but, there are just certain things they don't want to give up the code for but, that's okay because even those things have open source implementations (for things like Vulkan which AMD recent open sourced and OGL 4.5 support,) that arguably are closer to being better implementations.

tl;dr: Hardware is only as good as the drivers.

 

[sprsk]

Also in War of Warships , Black Screen suddenly inside game.
Even with Alt+tab, it's impossible most of the times to fix it. Hard reset, needed, most of the times.

 

[lexluthermiester]

In there lies the problem. AMD has some great hardware which is why we see constant performance improvements over time but, on the other hand it makes AMD's driver devs look incompetent. nVidia doesn't have that problem and they arguably get more done with less hardware for this very reason. Drivers aren't AMD's strong suit by any means. AMD going the "mostly open source" route with AMDGPU is a great example of this because they know the community is going to solve problems better than they can but, there are just certain things they don't want to give up the code for but, that's okay because even those things have open source implementations (for things like Vulkan which AMD recent open sourced and OGL 4.5 support,) that arguably are closer to being better implementations.

tl;dr: Hardware is only as good as the drivers.

Good points. There in we find a clue to the solution, this is apparently a recent development resulting from driver updates, so the solution must be an easy to find and possibly easy to fix problem. As this problem is absent from other tested DX9 games, it may also be possible to release patches directly for affected games.

 

[Aquinus]

Good points. There in we find a clue to the solution, this is apparently a recent development resulting from driver updates, so the solution must be an easy to find and possibly easy to fix problem. As this problem is absent from other tested DX9 games, it may also be possible to release patches directly for affected games.

It's probably a certain feature being used or something being assumed to occur in DX9 where it doesn't in other APIs. With enough stack traces from different games, they'll probably identify what is causing it rather quickly. I suspect that they'll hotfix this (as in, release a fix before the next release. That's what I would do if my code had a problem like this.)

 

[HisDivineOrder]

AMD: "I don't believe it..."
nVidia: "...that is why you fail."

 

[lexluthermiester]

It's probably a certain feature being used or something being assumed to occur in DX9 where it doesn't in other APIs. With enough stack traces from different games, they'll probably identify what is causing it rather quickly. I suspect that they'll hotfix this (as in, release a fix before the next release. That's what I would do if my code had a problem like this.)

AMD releases drivers swiftly enough that they will likely fix it in the next scheduled release, if they fix it.

AMD: "I don't believe it..."
nVidia: "...that is why you fail."

Funny.. But really?

 

[xkm1948]

So according to @OneMoar , AMD fu*cked up their driver, as result I as a consumer should buy another GPU to play games I like? Pretty solid logic.

Mental gymnastics surely is a thing now days.

 

[Prince Valiant]

I've yet to encounter one I could blame on the GPU driver with the exception of some gamebryo games that honestly, were coded horribly from day 1 and there are workarounds available.

Drivers are always going to broken somewhere on both sides. What I don't understand is why AMD felt like announcing that they're going to continue doing what they and Nvidia already do.

 

[rtwjunkie]

this WHOLE thing is microsofts fault the only reason DX9 hasn't been dead and gone for 10 years is windows xp and the idiots that keep supporting it
it needs to die every legacy api every legacy driver every single line of code needs to go

it is a performance and security disaster ANYTHING affiliated with the era should be burned and buried

DX9 going away is not an answer. There are still games being made in DX9 and a stable of probably at least a thousand still popular DX9 games. It works just fine in W10.

As for XP code needing to go, yeah, I agree completely.

 

[Vayra86]

What?




If you feel my posts are inappropriate, go ahead and report me to the admins, please. I encourage you to do so. I don't mind infractions or bans for saying things like they are.




You'd probably be doing the world a favor.



I tell you what, you can deactivate this account of mine right now, I wouldn't mind at all. While you're at it, remove all my posts too. Peace. TPU is a stupid forum anyways, full of retarded fanboys. I found that out years ago when I first joined here to discuss AMD drivers having a high CPU overhead, and I was told that AMD's drivers don't need any improvements regarding draw calls, and I am stupid for thinking such an issue exists.

You were told, by one of the many random people who visit this forum like you and myself

Forum, and discussion, and threads are there to actually find new information, not convince the world of your truths, even though that is a nice side effect that COULD occur from time to time (given that you're actually right about things and are good at providing evidence to support it).

Its funny because the AMD drivers cpu overhead issue is widely acknowledged, you won't hear or see me deny any of it. And also, how does 'denying that' mix with a supposed 'pro Nvidia' or 'fanboy' stance in this topic? They are perfect opposites...

As you can see, logic wins the day. You'll see yourself out, I trust, or come to terms with this community. Door's open. Taking each other seriously is a two way street y'know

 

[lilunxm12]

Are these issues tied to DX9?
If not, the title may be misleading as it feels like AMD is giving up DX9 support.

 

[altermere]

Only game I'm aware of being incompatible with NVIDIA is Midtown Madness 1. That game started having problems the moment GeForce cards were released, something to do with rendering method (gets flying and flickering polygons all over the screen). It's possible it got fixed since so much time has passed, GPU's changed and there have been a lot of drivers in between. It's possible it fixed itself on its own. Gotta try it one day, but I know it didn't work from day I got GeForce 2...

Oh, that's my favorite game. It's strange for me to hear about this issue because I've played it on Riva TNT2 in 2002, Ti 4200 in 2003 and a 540M in 2011, it always ran fine, and so did Midtown Madness 2 which has the same engine.

AMD just needs to fire entire RTG PR/marketing/pricing/whatever team, throughout 2017 they delivered nothing but fiasco after a fiasco: first Vega misinformation and pricing shenanigans, then RX 560 core nerfing and now this. I'm feeling they don't take PC gaming market seriously anymore, banking on miners instead, just take look at this, now they're branding FE as "Vega Frontier Edition for Blockchain Pioneers" while reference RX Vega along with the AIO version (which is superior to any hybrid cooler on the market) have been quietly discontinued.
https://pro.radeon.com/en/product/radeon-vega-frontier-edition/
https://wccftech.com/amd-stops-shipping-reference-rx-vega-favor-custom-cards/

 

[Aquinus]

There are still games being made in DX9

Hence why an entire code base needs to be maintained. A testament to bad decisions made upon bad decisions. This is the kind of bed you have sleep in when you by a mattress from Microsoft.

 

[OneMoar]

the only way to get rid of the cancer that is DX9 is to cut it out and irradiate the area

if that means a dozen or so crappy games written by people too stupid to use a modern API die

so be it nothing of value was lost

the solution is assuredly not to continue supporting a fundamentally broken and inferior api because, of a few abandoned games and devs that should know better that will just lead right back to this situation down the road

dust off a 750ti or 7870 and get over it or copy the dx dll files needed,pension the game studio to fix there shit or buckle down and write a d3d9 to 11 wrapper

I am sorry it can't stay 2008 forever progress sometimes sucks
edit: dlls are here https://mega.nz/#F!8tlAhDyQ!2AkAQukJKAYuIWEzDTGtFA!IslFkTSL
peace=out

 

[Fluffmeister]

I'm beginning to see why companies prefer using GeForce cards in their data centers.

Seriously though, entertaining thread. 10 out of 10.

 

[xkm1948]

I'm beginning to see why companies prefer using GeForce cards in their data centers.

Seriously though, entertaining thread. 10 out of 10.

Not just industry, academia as well. No sane researcher in public or private biology/medical research would bother with AMD's offering. I was stupid enough to try to get some genome assembler working on AMD's OpenCL compiler, worst 2 months of my coding experience. 0 technical support from AMD.

 

[cdawall]

Mining is going that route as well. Nvidia cards are so much user friendly.

 

[arbiter]

this WHOLE thing is microsofts fault the only reason DX9 hasn't been dead and gone for 10 years is windows xp and the idiots that keep supporting it
it needs to die every legacy api every legacy driver every single line of code needs to go

it is a performance and security disaster ANYTHING affiliated with the era should be burned and buried

game developers where told that DX9 was depreciated 12 years ago they choose not to act well now there games don't work anymore so sad too bad

Dx9 is far from dead, Take a look at Steam game library of indie games added over last year. You will find a ton that STILL made using DX9. Even one the most popular games right now League of Legends is a DX9 game. Just cause you think its dead and gone is far from the fact ton's of people use it cause its easy to use and tons of documentation for it makes it easy for them to code games for. Lets not also forget games like DOTA and CS:GO that still use it.

 

[xkm1948]

Mining is going that route as well. Nvidia cards are so much user friendly.

Huh, didn't know about that.

 

[crazyeyesreaper]

whats hilarious is for the longest time AMD gpus actually played a LOT of games Nvidia GPUs would not that were far older. Examples being Shogun Total War the original. Until it was remastered only AMD gpus could still play that game. Its still a fun and extremely engaging RTS. For systems running older games I usually used AMD gpus. looks like i can cross them off now lol.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Dx9 is far from dead, Take a look at Steam game library of indie games added over last year. You will find a ton that STILL made using DX9. Even one the most popular games right now League of Legends is a DX9 game. Just cause you think its dead and gone is far from the fact ton's of people use it cause its easy to use and tons of documentation for it makes it easy for them to code games for. Lets not also forget games like DOTA and CS:GO that still use it.

Exactly right. Software is not obsolete just because it's older. If it's useful, well understood, effective and easy to use, it's still valid and relevant. This problem is not DirectX9, or Microsoft's, fault(a rare occasion). This was a driver problem unintentionally introduced by an advancement AMD made. This has happened to NVidia and Intel after graphics drivers update in the past also.

whats hilarious is for the longest time AMD gpus actually played a LOT of games Nvidia GPUs would not that were far older. Examples being Shogun Total War the original. Until it was remastered only AMD gpus could still play that game. Its still a fun and extremely engaging RTS. For systems running older games I usually used AMD gpus. looks like i can cross them off now lol.

I wouldn't do that just yet. This is an issue that does not affect all games and AMD will likely get it fixed anyway.

 

[mtcn77]

I love Kane's Wrath, such a complete gaming experience. It runs on any current hardware, anyway. It always were optimisation friendly.

 

[crazyeyesreaper]

Exactly right. Software is not obsolete just because it's older. If it's useful, well understood, effective and easy to use, it's still valid and relevant. This problem is not DirectX9, or Microsoft's, fault(a rare occasion). This was a driver problem unintentionally introduced by an advancement AMD made. This has happened to NVidia and Intel after graphics drivers update in the past also.

I wouldn't do that just yet. This is an issue that does not affect all games and AMD will likely get it fixed anyway.

Exactly right. Software is not obsolete just because it's older. If it's useful, well understood, effective and easy to use, it's still valid and relevant. This problem is not DirectX9, or Microsoft's, fault(a rare occasion). This was a driver problem unintentionally introduced by an advancement AMD made. This has happened to NVidia and Intel after graphics drivers update in the past also.

I wouldn't do that just yet. This is an issue that does not affect all games and AMD will likely get it fixed anyway.

The Witcher will likely be fixed by CD Projeckt due to their GoG platform etc. The other games tho are unlikely to see a Developer fix cause well its EA lol. Generally speaking this is expected but still disheartening.