Help- PC On BootLoop. Fix Upgrade or Buy New?

[dorsetknob]

appearantly i have a short fast beeping(like +20 short constant beeps).

what is the beeps saying?

Continuous short beep ：Power supply unit failed

You answered your own Question
Now you need to verify the answer by testing the System with a compatible Good working PSU
as Recommended by @eidairaman1 (twice)

 

[Hood]

Clean the dust off your motherboard. There is a ball of dust against your Clear CMOS jumper (photo in post #4). It might be shorting the pins. And you should take advice and remove the board to check for shorting to case, and clean thoroughly while it's out. You haven't even tried a known good PSU. It's also possible that your cheap motherboard is fried, it's getting old, and wasn't built with high grade components. It seems like you can't be bothered by doing any actual diagnosis, just writing posts for help and ignoring advice. A brand new EVGA 500w PSU is $35 on Amazon.

 

[EsaT]

Well, it cannot be a total PSU failure or else there would be no power to cause a beep. So it must be a missing rail. I would certainly verify all connections first. And remember, just about all motherboards these days require at least two connections.

Nothing likely missing but working as intended.
As in ripple likely at who knows what level torturing PC's components along with voltages somewhere there.

Majority of Thermaltake PSUs have been from mediocre to bad and designed to fail from the start with use of cheap components.
With age of that CPU and PC it certainly has exceeded its intended operating life...
Which is few years of active use for cheap PSUs.

 

[itsallpoo]

you're running into one of those things that only long experience teaches you to troubleshoot. this could be several things.

1-power supply issues can be really tough to troubleshoot, if you don't have one buy one of those tester things it has lights will show you if the rails are outputting properly. Just because the tester says it's ok doesn't necessarily mean much it could still be failing under load. Black screen can sometimes be the video card is pulling too much or can't get enough juice to run.

2-make the system as simple as possible. Pull the add in video if it has onboard, pull the add in sound if you are using one, if you have multiple sticks of ram put one and only one in the machine and be certain it's installed in slot one (your motherboard should show you this or it's printed on the board). Swap the sticks i.e. try a different one if you've got several changing each time

3-Try a different wall power outlet...yeah don't laugh just do it.

4-some shops only charge a few dollars to bench test your motherboard, memory and cpu might be worth it in terms of your time and sanity.

5-i don't know how techie you are but I think you can still buy POST cards. This gadget plugs into a motherboard slot and has a read out on the side of it, when you try to boot the readout will give a code letters and numbers, from this you should be able to get some clue what's happening they used to be cheap in the old days i'm not even sure if you can easily buy one anymore.

6-Like someone said if it's older tech just dump it and buy ryzen but you'll probably need new memory too and ddr 4 is expensive. We are entering one of those warp speed tech jumps right now with computers those new M2 pcie nvme drives make sata 3 look like it's standing still they are faster than hell 2100 + not much more expensive than ssd drives for same size but faster than hell my new dell has one omg what a difference.

7-you said you pulled the cmos battery but did you replace it? In the old days I had many a non-booting system that fired right up when that damned five dollar battery was replaced.

It's a great learning experience especially if you find it but don't lose your sanity, it's not worth that it just might be fried. I am a loyal gigabyte customer but my am3+ board just took a shit and there never were many boards that supported 9370 I'm not rebuilding that box until thread ripper doesn't necessitate that you take out a 20 year mortgage to build one. Good luck.

 

[eidairaman1]

you're running into one of those things that only long experience teaches you to troubleshoot. this could be several things.

1-power supply issues can be really tough to troubleshoot, if you don't have one buy one of those tester things it has lights will show you if the rails are outputting properly. Just because the tester says it's ok doesn't necessarily mean much it could still be failing under load. Black screen can sometimes be the video card is pulling too much or can't get enough juice to run.

2-make the system as simple as possible. Pull the add in video if it has onboard, pull the add in sound if you are using one, if you have multiple sticks of ram put one and only one in the machine and be certain it's installed in slot one (your motherboard should show you this or it's printed on the board). Swap the sticks i.e. try a different one if you've got several changing each time

3-Try a different wall power outlet...yeah don't laugh just do it.

4-some shops only charge a few dollars to bench test your motherboard, memory and cpu might be worth it in terms of your time and sanity.

5-i don't know how techie you are but I think you can still buy POST cards. This gadget plugs into a motherboard slot and has a read out on the side of it, when you try to boot the readout will give a code letters and numbers, from this you should be able to get some clue what's happening they used to be cheap in the old days i'm not even sure if you can easily buy one anymore.

6-Like someone said if it's older tech just dump it and buy ryzen but you'll probably need new memory too and ddr 4 is expensive. We are entering one of those warp speed tech jumps right now with computers those new M2 pcie nvme drives make sata 3 look like it's standing still they are faster than hell 2100 + not much more expensive than ssd drives for same size but faster than hell my new dell has one omg what a difference.

7-you said you pulled the cmos battery but did you replace it? In the old days I had many a non-booting system that fired right up when that damned five dollar battery was replaced.

It's a great learning experience especially if you find it but don't lose your sanity, it's not worth that it just might be fried. I am a loyal gigabyte customer but my am3+ board just took a shit and there never were many boards that supported 9370 I'm not rebuilding that box until thread ripper doesn't necessitate that you take out a 20 year mortgage to build one. Good luck.

The beep codes he is experiencing are correlated to a trashed psu.

 

[dark_elf]

eidairaman1
ok if it is a psu, what should i buy?
what you recommend?

i preffer to buy somthing strong that will last for many years and survive my at least 2 next pc upgrades.

itsallpoo thanks for a detailed post.
i set the simplest possible connection: no v.card connected i even disconnected the hard drive and the cd room.
i have also removed the ram.

3-Try a different wall power outlet...yeah don't laugh just do it.

i connected the power cable from the same sink to different pc, the other pc is working.

7-you said you pulled the cmos battery but did you replace it? In the old days I had many a non-booting system that fired right up when that damned five dollar battery was replaced.

i replace the battery about a year ago. so i guess it suppose to be fine.

step 4 and 5: i think ill pass that.
step 6: as eidairaman1 sayed the beeps imply this is a psu issue. but i do want a new proccessor in the near future, so i want the new psu will support it.

 

[eidairaman1]

ok if it is a psu, what should i buy?
what you recommend?

i preffer to buy somthing strong that will last for many years and survive my at least 2 next pc upgrades.

Seasonic, Certain Corsair Units, XFX, Certain Antec Units.

jonny guru is a good site for psu reviews

 

[dark_elf]

dorsetknob
i dont missing anything and reading very carefully every post believe me.
and i know i "answered myself" i just want to make sure i understanding correctly as i far not an expert.

Hood & eidairaman1 & Bill_Bright

i put out the motherboard from the case.
cleaned the dust.
connected the psu 2 cables to the motherboard.
everything but the proccessor and the speaker is unplaged(no ram no drives no fans).
when i powered up(shorting two pins) result the same- continuously short beeps as before.

so i guess it is the PSU ?
if so any other recomandatoins of what psu i should get?

 

[biffzinker]

Seasonic, Certain Corsair Units, XFX, Certain Antec Units.

jonny guru is a good site for psu reviews

What's wrong with EVGA power supplies?

 

[EsaT]

i preffer to buy somthing strong that will last for many years and survive my at least 2 next pc upgrades.

Don't know your local pricing, but Seasonic Focus Plus Gold seems to be very well priced in everywhere.
10 year warranty tells what design goal they had in component selecting.
Quality wise standard Focus Gold serie is same, it just lacks full modularity of cabling.
(Antec Earthwatts Gold Pro is rebranding of it)

In general Seasonic has long been name guaranteeing quality capacitors with 99% certainty.
Despite of brand quality hype cheaper Corsairs all use standard cheap capacitors.

For non-modular cabling Bitfenix Formula has also quality capacitors and good pricing at least in Europe.

XFX seems to have mostly disappeared from Europe.
But they're mostly Seasonic's high end platform based ones.
XT again is outsourced cheap built:
http://www.orionpsudb.com/news/the-mystery-of-xfx-budget-xt-line-solved-oem-and-platform-discovered

What's wrong with EVGA power supplies?

Cheaper EVGAs, like BQ serie, are plain standard cheap capacitor PSUs.
Again SuperFlower built Supernovas are good, but no longer price competitive since Seasonic Focus Plus was released.

 

[Bill_Bright]

What's wrong with EVGA power supplies?

Nothing.

It should be noted that every brand makes various lines of power supplies. There is nothing wrong with the BQ series but for better quality power, go with the SuperNova lines.

 

[eidairaman1]

dorsetknob
i dont missing anything and reading very carefully every post believe me.
and i know i "answered myself" i just want to make sure i understanding correctly as i far not an expert.

Hood & eidairaman1 & Bill_Bright

i put out the motherboard from the case.
cleaned the dust.
connected the psu 2 cables to the motherboard.
everything but the proccessor and the speaker is unplaged(no ram no drives no fans).
when i powered up(shorting two pins) result the same- continuously short beeps as before.

so i guess it is the PSU ?
if so any other recomandatoins of what psu i should get?

I specified brands in my last post.

 

[Mr.Scott]

The beep codes he is experiencing are correlated to a trashed psu.

Not entirely correct.
The beep codes he's experiencing are correlating to bad power. Could be PSU (most likely), or could be mobo, or combination of both.
Need to swap in a known good PSU for further diagnosis.

 

[dark_elf]

i took psu to test my pc from a friend.
connected it and all looks ok.

so the issue is the psu only.

i will buy one tomorow or day after.

what you guys saying about UPS?

 

[eidairaman1]

i took psu to test my pc from a friend.
connected it and all looks ok.

so the issue is the psu only.

i will buy one tomorow or day after.

what you guys saying about UPS?

There are certain ones that do provide additional filtering of power to help clean it up and then there are ones are just a battery you want the one that can help clean up the power a little bit the side benefit is that if you have a power outage suddenly or brown out which lights turn off and then turn back on real quick it will switch to keep your system running and also prevent a surge of power from hitting the machine that's protecting the power supply and the rest of the system depending on the size of the UPS you could have maybe about 10 minutes or even a couple hours what they practically allow you to do is to be able to shut down safely

 

[EsaT]

what you guys saying about UPS?

Do you have lots of blackouts/power problems?
If you have those very rarely surge arrestor/protector would achieve pretty much same.
And in case of European mains voltage active-PFC PSUs fail to give damn about smaller brown outs:
They're made to operate down to 100V input voltage as part of active-PFC's standard operation.
With low US mains voltage there's obviously less tolerance.

For very short "transient" outages every ATX specification meeting PSU has ~16ms time it can operate without mains voltage.
(in case of Seasonic Prime they went up to twelve in component sizing and those have "hold up time" of fair 30ms)

The beep codes he's experiencing are correlating to bad power. Could be PSU (most likely), or could be mobo, or combination of both.
Need to swap in a known good PSU for further diagnosis.

While testing different parts is only way to bracket "immediate fault", simple switching of motherboard would be questionable with known to be low quality PSUs which is old:
Without proper testing of PSU would be impossible to know if PSU tortured motherboard dead with excessive ripple.

 

[dark_elf]

i don't have much blackouts.
thanks for the info, so this doesn't sound too important.
from what i heard from friend is with UPS your PSU working much less time(or even rarely working), and therfore lives much longer.
so i guess that is not the case, right?


so this is total PSU list recomanded by you guys:

A brand new EVGA 500w PSU
Corsair Units, XFX, Certain Antec Units.
Seasonic Focus Plus Gold
EVGA PQ SuperNova lines.

what should i chose? can i have some opinions please?
all of the above will be strong enough to survive my next pc upgrade(will go for some i7 proccess new motherboard ram and maybe v.card in a year or so)?

Guys! thank you so much for helping!

 

[EsaT]

PSU is always working when PC is powered, just like car engine when it's running.
Voltage variations inside active-PFC's operating voltage range don't really cause any extra stress.
Main switcher doesn't even see any of that, because being fed voltage regulated by active-PFC.

MOV of line filtering is of course wearing part, if there are lots of voltage transients and having those smoothed elsewhere saves that part.
But actually most UPSes have lower surge energy rated MOVs in input filtering than better surge arresters.
Except for double-conversion/online UPSes their main function is preventing blackouts from shutting down PC.
UPS disconnecting from power because of overvoltage is never truly instant.
So even with UPS good surge arrestor is good for saving MOVs in UPS and having higher surge energy absorpting capability.


And you mised the point.
Price is really quite good consultant for component quality:
Only those more expensive higher end EVGAs use quality components.
And except for discounts all Corsairs cheaper than Seasonic Focus Plus use cheap components.
Only cheaper PSUs with quality components use fixed or semi-modular cables.
Seasonic is only one consistently using high quality components also in their lower efficiency/performance low end models. (so usually not so low end priced)
Same for nearly all XFX models, because of using only no low quality parts in factory Seasonic as OEM.

Antec, Corsair, EVGA and such brands have PSUs made by many various manufacturers...
Too often without even giving new model/serie name when changing insides chasing cheaper OEM price to add brand profit margin.
(don't even remember how many different designs have been sold under Corsair CX naming)

Most manufacturers just aren't as scrupulous as Seasonic about using quality capacitors.
For example while having now very good reputation SuperFlower uses third tier C(r)apXons in Golden Green HX and Platinum King series.

 

[dark_elf]

thanks for the detailed explenation.
i think i will pass the ups.
i want to buy a psu in several hours, still didn't decided which.

i wonder about the watts, all agree 500 is enough after upgrade?

how much watt's would i need for a very strong pc?
Intel® Core™ i9-7900X
Ryzen™ 7 Processors
with a very good g.card

no overclocking.
would 500 still be fine?
would 650 be enough?

 

[eidairaman1]

thanks for the detailed explenation.
i think i will pass the ups.
i want to buy a psu in several hours, still didn't decided which.

i wonder about the watts, all agree 500 is enough after upgrade?

how much watt's would i need for a very strong pc?
Intel® Core™ i9-7900X
Ryzen™ 7 Processors
with a very good g.card

no overclocking.
would 500 still be fine?
would 650 be enough?

Go with a quality 650 and call it a day.

 

[jaggerwild]

After you power on and it sits there, hit the reset(while powered on) it should boot then. This is a known issue with 77 boards..........Your welcome good luck!

 

[dark_elf]

thanks again guys.

i bought the new PSU connected it and all working fine.

but i notice the G.Card fan don't spin.
i dont remember if it should spin or not. (no fan connection on it afaik).
is it ok? or it should spin?

at the moment im trying to put some efforts on the pc in order to check if the fan start spinning.



Edit:
as i was writing it started to spin
so im happy!

thank allot again guys!!!

 

[dark_elf]

after 10 days the pc worked, same issue again.
continues short beeps and boot loop.

here is the flow of what happened:

-last evening the pc screen got "frozed", nothing working(no mouse no keybord ctrl+alt+del nothing)
i reboot
worked ok for about 20min

-again pc got "frozed".
i reboot
this time continues short beeps and bootloop

-i reinstall the ram and recived one short beep(working fine), but the pc got "frozed" on the bios screen.
reboot again:
-one short beep. bios screen appears(keyboard not working) and one short beep every 5 seconds.
i removed the ram and reboot.
again boot loop with continues short beeps.
set back the ram- continues short beeps.
since then the pc at this state no matter what i do.

i tried to unplug and reconnect the connections from PSU -motherbord.
press one min on the power.
reomving the cmos battery.

what can it be? 2 Fail PSU is super unlikely.
the beep code not that clear:
Continuous short beep ：Power supply unit failed 2.AMI BIOS
what does " 2.AMI BIOS" mean?
what i should do?

 

[Sycko]

pull all your memory sticks out reboot with one at a time. you may find that one of your memory sticks is bad shorting the 5volt buss line

 

[eidairaman1]

Bad ram or motherboard is shot