Legality of TPU Hosting DLSS DLLs

[lexluthermiester]

You seem to be the only one raging though.

Are you sure? You have actually been READING the comments offered in this thread, correct?

For me personally unless it's legally enforceable it's not a true agreement in the first place. I also feel it's dishonest, especially when large companies do it to include agreements that are not legally enforceable. Just seems like posturing and using ones size ( in this case of the company) as a fear tactic. To me it's akin to bully tactics so I won't stand for it.

This, yes!

 

[claes]

You seem to be the only one raging though.

I’m only discussing the licences and how they apply, not placing any moral views on the matter. You seem to think that I’m somehow against file sharing or something, which I have never stated. I also have not taken offence in anything that TPU has done. Online piracy is a term, look it up, I’m not using it in a deflamatory meaning. Also, as stated earlier, users downloading these things from TPU to my understanding fall under fair use and do not constitute as piracy, and I have never called any individual here out for piracy.

I suggest that you too try to look at the matter from a technical point of view and not force your views of TPU or other users onto your posts. You can also just ignore the topic if its contents do not interest you, or causes fits of rage.

Honestly this whole thread is wonky; seems like any major issues are between nvidia and game studios and, if there are damages at all, is likely a reason for nvidia to start packaging dlls in an executable or encrypt them or something that my non-programmer self can’t speak to

 

[stimpy88]

"You seem to be the only one raging though..."

"I suggest that you too try to look at the matter from a technical point of view and not force your views of TPU or other users onto your posts. You can also just ignore the topic if its contents do not interest you, or causes fits of rage..."

No rage here... But nice deflection though!

But I will refuse your invitation of censorship, which is how people like you spread your poison. I will view and comment on anything I like thank you, but if you want to come here and take my rights as a citizen from me, I promise you will meet a very "difficult" situation. I don't sit behind DMCA's...

Now, PROVE your original point, that what TPU is doing is illegal, instead of trolling, name calling (yes you are) and deflecting from other points of views or questions which don't suit your narrative.

 

[Dredi]

I refuse your invitation of censorship. I will view and comment on anything I like.

As you should!

 

[claes]

Are you sure? You have actually been READING the comments offered in this thread, correct?

Show me the precedent daddy!!!

 

[Dredi]

Now, PROVE your original point, that what TPU is doing is illegal

I have never stated that TPU is doing something illegal. I’ve only said that they are violating either the DLSS SDK EULA or a bunch of individual game EULAs. Determining whether that is illegal or not requires both legal action from Nvidia, as well as an actual juring by a court. I cannot be of help in that endeavour, regardless of your pleas.

 

[Mussels]

No rage here... But nice deflection though!

But I will refuse your invitation of censorship, which is how people like you spread your poison. I will view and comment on anything I like thank you, but if you want to come here and take my rights as a citizen from me, I promise you will meet a very "difficult" situation. I don't sit behind DMCA's...

Now, PROVE your original point, that what TPU is doing is illegal, instead of trolling, name calling (yes you are) and deflecting from other points of views or questions which don't suit your narrative.

You threaten another user here, and you're copping a ban. Are we clear on this?

People are fine to discuss this topic, but you're going to be civil about it.

 

[moproblems99]

I can't believe that this thread is still going round in circles after almost 400 posts over a non-issue!

Just enjoy the support that @W1zzard has given us with these DLLs and be done with it.

It's because the total brain processing power of this thread can't make more complex geometric shapes.

You two are outraged at a third parties decision to host a file not made by you,

Your ignorance is showing. There is no outrage. No one is trying to get TPU shutdown. People want clarification on the contracts they signed.

TPU IS NOT GOING TO BE SUED SCHFIFTY FIVE ZILLION MILLION DOLLARS

Everyone is getting butthurt because someone was following up on a legal contract THEY signed. Get over it. There are no victims here.

For me personally unless it's legally enforceable it's not a true agreement in the first place.

How do you know it's not legally enforceable until you get to court? Are you willing to challenge that many things on the daily? Remember, in jury trials, you have to count on them finding 12 intelligent people. Judging this thread, the stats aren't in your favor.

 

[Mussels]

One of the big deals with digital piracy, is that you had to have broken a security measure.
Around here in Au, you cant charge someone for theft if you left your car doors unlocked and the keys in the ignition, and this is the digital version of that.

If you want me to believe these dll files can be modified hacked or altered in any way other than being put where they belong - in an Nvidia game with DLSS support that requires you to agree to their EULA, with an Nvidia GPU that you purchased and used Nvidia drivers with.

Someone. Anyone. I cant even find anything about anyone ever having achieved this. You can use a fake dll file with a legit looking name and try to trick a program or operating system into running it. You can make malicious code that uses dll files... but you cant reverse engineer someone elses dll file and modify it. The program loading it is just gunna damn well crash if it's not a legit, supported file as we've seen when people tried DLSS 2.x files on DLSS 1.x games.

So... what copy protection is being broken, and how is it being used for an unintended purpose?

 

[qubit]

Around here in Au, you cant charge someone for theft if you left your car doors unlocked and the keys in the ignition, and this is the digital version of that.

I'm surprised at that. Theft is normally defined as taking something without authorisation and with the intention of not returning it. The lack of security shouldn't make a difference to this.

 

[moproblems99]

but you cant reverse engineer someone elses dll file and modify it

You sir, need to read the internet more. First search result in DuckDuckGo....not even google. Took 5 seconds.

https://www.wikihow.com/Edit-DLL-Files

I got one with pictures for you since I know your reading isnt the best.

 

[stimpy88]

"...I’ve only said that they are violating either the DLSS SDK EULA or a bunch of individual game EULAs. Determining whether that is illegal or not requires both legal action from Nvidia, as well as an actual juring by a court..."

And you have stated this... And many others disagree, but you are completely right when you say "Determining whether that is illegal or not requires both legal action from Nvidia, as well as an actual juring by a court." Then until this happens, lets all refrain from name calling, and insinuations of piracy, lack of morals etc. It really is up to nVidia to decide if it's legal or not.

If I can come back here in a month or two, and the site, and the files are still up, then we know that what TPU is doing is not against the law, as nVidia literally have all the money they could ever need to use to crush this site, as after all, it has been reported to them, so they do know about it. Another option open to nVidia would be locking specific versions of DLSS DLLs to specific games, this would be another way to recognise that nVidia does not like what TPU is doing. Only time will tell.

 

[Dredi]

One of the big deals with digital piracy, is that you had to have broken a security measure.
Around here in Au, you cant charge someone for theft if you left your car doors unlocked and the keys in the ignition, and this is the digital version of that.

That may be the case in Au (i have no idea), but not for example in EU, nor in the States.

 

[moproblems99]

If I can come back here in a month or two, and the site, and the files are still up, then we know that what TPU is doing is not against the law, as nVidia literally have all the money they could ever need to use to crush this site, as after all, it has been reported to them, so they do know about it. Another option open to nVidia would be locking specific versions of DLSS DLLs to specific games, this would be another way to recognise that nVidia does not like what TPU is doing. Only time will tell.

Glad you figured it out after 17 pages and foaming at the mouth. It's a non issue.

 

[stimpy88]

You threaten another user here, and you're copping a ban. Are we clear on this?

People are fine to discuss this topic, but you're going to be civil about it.

I apologise for my comment, to you, to Dredi, and the rest of the forum users.

 

[Dredi]

If I can come back here in a month or two, and the site, and the files are still up, then we know that what TPU is doing is not against the law

No, in that case we still would not know. Determining whether something truly is illegal or not requires juring by a court. Nvidia may simply not care, which is not the same thing. And if they do care, I feel that TPU will simply fold and not go to court over a few DLLs.

 

[stimpy88]

Glad you figured it out after 17 pages and foaming at the mouth. It's a non issue.

Grow up.

 

[claes]

I have never stated that TPU is doing something illegal. I’ve only said that they are violating either the DLSS SDK EULA or a bunch of individual game EULAs. Determining whether that is illegal or not requires both legal action from Nvidia, as well as an actual juring by a court. I cannot be of help in that endeavour, regardless of your pleas.

It’s so confusing having not read nvidia’e EULA outside of excerpts posted here because I don’t give a shit; it seems like the end user is either the studio/developer, who could be liable for exposing IP that might negatively impact performance of DLSS, or it’s the end-user who can fuck around for fair-use-sakes without any real consequence.

I think Aquinas is right in my non-professional/unsolicited opinion, though — just use the SDK’s EULA in an installer and TPU can distribute away (wow how annoying would maintaining that script/library of games and their DLSS capabilities be?)

You threaten another user here, and you're copping a ban. Are we clear on this?

People are fine to discuss this topic, but you're going to be civil about it.

With all respect, some users, like @lexluthermiester have been comfortably allowed to threaten violence and “citizen’s arrest” for years... why the sudden double-standard?*

*Not that I agree with that user, sounds trash to me, but principles should be principled

One of the big deals with digital piracy, is that you had to have broken a security measure.
Around here in Au, you cant charge someone for theft if you left your car doors unlocked and the keys in the ignition, and this is the digital version of that.

That’s not how it works in the US at all I’d be surprised if this was the case AU

If you want me to believe these dll files can be modified hacked or altered in any way other than being put where they belong - in an Nvidia game with DLSS support that requires you to agree to their EULA, with an Nvidia GPU that you purchased and used Nvidia drivers with.

Someone. Anyone. I cant even find anything about anyone ever having achieved this. You can use a fake dll file with a legit looking name and try to trick a program or operating system into running it. You can make malicious code that uses dll files... but you cant reverse engineer someone elses dll file and modify it. The program loading it is just gunna damn well crash if it's not a legit, supported file as we've seen when people tried DLSS 2.x files on DLSS 1.x games.

So... what copy protection is being broken, and how is it being used for an unintended purpose?

The real issue, in my drunk at 8am/non-professional opinion is TPU as distributor. It’s one thing for an individual to copy-paste files between games that they legally purchased, it’s another to host those files derived from an SDK on a website with the intention of altering of other copyrighted material :shrug:

(still, said user still likely owns the games and hardware in question so whatever god I have to get to work soon lol)

 

[stimpy88]

No, in that case we still would not know.

Inaction is action.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I'm surprised at that. Theft is normally defined as taking something without authorisation and with the intention of not returning it. The lack of security shouldn't make a difference to this.

You're in the UK. Laws are different there than down under. Even here stateside, the laws vary from area to area, even within the same state. For example, where I live, if you leave your car unlocked and someone takes anything which might be in it, that's your fault for not securing your vehicle. However, even if you leave the keys in that very same car, driving off with a car not registered or owned by you without permission is still grand-theft-auto and you will go to prison for it. So effectively, you can take keys to the car if one finds it unlocked, but you can't take the car itself.

 

[Dredi]

Inaction is action.

But not a legal precident.

 

[stimpy88]

But not a legal precident.

No, but if a company with the morals, size and money of nVidia take no action, then that speaks volumes. But it this stage, it's too early to know anything.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Grow up.

Oh, I'll second THAT.

Does that mean the snowflake unblocked you? Are we celebrating today?

No, you both are still on my ignore list. It just means that someone let me know what was said I decided to respond.

How do you know it's not legally enforceable until you get to court?

It's called understanding the law, case law as it applies to certain situations and ones own personal rights. Some people have an advantage in this area as they have had experience with these things, either out of curiosity, necessity or because of professional requirements.

 

[Dredi]

No, but if a company with the morals, size and money of nVidia take no action, then that speaks volumes. But it this stage, it's too early to know anything.

And if they take action, W1z will just fold and take the files down. Even that means nothing as far as legality goes.

 

[DrCR]

But not a legal precident.

Actually, it most definitely can be. I'm seeing a lot of absolute statements being made here that are simply not true.