Legality of TPU Hosting DLSS DLLs

[Steevo]

This is great, watching people with no reason figure out ways to argue. I remember when anything performance related was fair game, in fact that was the point.

I cannot comprehend why anyone is concerned that Nvidia may or might or not do something about a thing on a tech site that they seem to value run by a person with technical skills and connections to ensure its probably OK.


But keep going, it's entertaining!!

 

[Soul_]

Well, then you're getting into intended purpose.

How does uploading it to techpowerup change the intended purpose or use of the file? The file and its purpose are still the same. Sorry, I am just trying to understand how any of the agreements that you mentioned here apply to techpowerup.

 

[DicehunterTPU]

Holy crap there are some twitter level Karens in here, Yikes.

On a side note thanks for this TPU, Will be interesting to see if replacing the DLSS2 DLL's in other games will make a difference.

 

[Dredi]

that feel when you're so desperate to win an internet argument you run to a corporation's lawyers

Isn’t that the only way to verify which one of you is right (or #winning)? Why are you against it?

edit: and this is quite clearly just redistiribution of a part of a copyrighted game, which to my knowledge is illegal in the same capcity as redistributing the whole game without the copyright holders permission.

Whether nvidia cares is a different question, I’ll give it 50/50.

 

[RH92]

This "problem" if it exists is between TPU and Nvidia and we speculating about it is useless. If there comes up any conflict, we are also useless.
I´ll now go on and eat my pizza.

Pretty much my take aswell, i don't get why peoples are looosing their mind over legal obligations about something doesn't concern them at all ..... If there is a conflict it's between TPU and Nvidia so yeah , pointless discussion .

 

[spnidel]

Isn’t that the only way to verify which one of you is right (or #winning)? Why are you against it?

there must be something wrong with you if you think reaching out to lawyers over a fucking internet argument is time well spent
to clarify: no, I don't mean you in particular. I'm talking in a broad sense

 

[Dredi]

there must be something wrong with you if you think reaching out to lawyers over a fucking internet argument is time well spent
to clarify: no, I don't mean you in particular. I'm talking in a broad sense

Why argue, if you can’t even make a case for your point of view? If clear thought process does not make a mark on someones (incorrect) view, the only way forward is sadly to get an authoritative take on the subject in question.

Also, I don’t see the problem in reaching out to a lawyers. Regardless of how shitty you think nvidia to be as a company, it is still fair to them to inform that their rights are being broken.
Plus, it’s just wasting their time if you are correct in your view. And wasting the time of a shitty corporations lawyers should be good way to spend time on the internet.

 

[DicehunterTPU]

I don’t see the problem in reaching out to a lawyers. Regardless of how shitty you think nvidia to be as a company, it is still fair to them to inform that their rights are being broken.

There's a good word that describes someone like this, Jobsworth.

 

[cvaldes]

This is great, watching people with no reason figure out ways to argue. I remember when anything performance related was fair game, in fact that was the point.

I cannot comprehend why anyone is concerned that Nvidia may or might or not do something about a thing on a tech site that they seem to value run by a person with technical skills and connections to ensure its probably OK.


But keep going, it's entertaining!!

You are right.

This is far more entertaining that watching millionaire professional footballers faking injuries.

Anyhow TPU is not the first mainstream technology site to have posted these files. Based on the fact that neither Nvidia nor AMD have ordered DMCA takedowns of the various BIOSes on this site, it is unlikely that Nvidia will ask TPU to remove these DLSS dlls.

 

[ZoneDymo]

emotions surrounding image upscaling are facinating

 

[Dredi]

There's a good word that describes someone like this, Jobsworth.

Or maybe just anal?

Seeing how nvidia is just a shitty corporation, I don’t really care about their rights. It’s still entertaining to see whether they will respond. If the question was about some small companys SW informing them of such thing would be something even I’d do.

 

[DicehunterTPU]

Or maybe just anal?

Seeing how nvidia is just a shitty corporation, I don’t really care about their rights. It’s still entertaining to see whether they will respond. If the question was about some small companys SW informing them of such thing would be something even I’d do.

I'd say pathetic neckbeard that needs to get out more, Like a lot more, Would be a more apt description of any individual that is emotionally distraught by this, And that person should definitely book a therapist session while they're out.

 

[Dredi]

I'd say pathetic neckbeard that needs to get out more, Like a lot more, Would be a more apt description of any individual that is emotionally distraught by this, And that person should definitely book a therapist session while they're out.

Exactly

 

[qubit]

@Aquinus From the looks of the rules that you've quoted, you're technically right, it's piracy on the high seas! However, in practice, I don't think it's a problem, because NVIDIA won't mind as it simply helps them to increase their market share that little bit with enthusiasts and shut AMD out. On top of that, from a user perspective, TPU is once again providing a cool service to help the community - thanks @W1zzard

This situation reminds me of all those cheap Windows and Office keys being sold everywhere. Sure, they're not strictly legit, despite the claims, but Microsoft knows that it helps them to keep that grip on marketshare, so they look the other way and even well established sites like TPU can advertise these sellers, like we see on here frequently, without fear of getting sued.

Finally, put it this way: if megacorps NVIDIA and Microsoft don't care, then why should we? The fact that it's technically a kind of soft piracy is rendered moot and merely a talking point.

 

[R-T-B]

We're not distributing code.

I mean you are... but presumably these dlls are literally redistributables or they wouldn't be packaged like this, meaning nvidia probably doesn't care.

I hate to say it, but this is a blatant violation of nVidia's terms.

It appears to be yes, but then again, we have greymarket key sites. advertised here... TPU has always conducted itself this way, for better or worse. If they don't get sued and it helps gamers, I honestly don't mind (in this instance).

This is similar TechPowerUp hosting BIOS files. The BIOS is property of nVidia provided to manufacturers under strict Agreements and Conditions. However, extracting a BIOS from a GPU that you purchase, and posting file does not in turn hold you accountable, as you did not agree to BIOS terms and conditions.

Actually, it does. Even bios files are legally grey. But thing is, NVIDIA has posted them openly itself at times, so it's pretty aparent it does not care.

Here? We'll see I guess. Hope w1zzard did his research.

 

[Dredi]

presumably these dlls are literally redistributables or they wouldn't be packaged like this, meaning nvidia probably doesn't care.

They are distributed like this, so that not a single line of the actual DLSS code needs to exit nvidias premises. Legally whether something is a dll or not has zero merit.

 

[milewski1015]

Jesus, why all the damn hate? All TPU is trying to do is provide a risk-free place for people to download the DLLs that they would find other places anyway. That's commendable in my opinion

 

[stimpy88]

There's a good word that describes someone like this, Jobsworth.

I think its the same guy. They at least share the same skewed view of their own self importance, and need to influence their "power" over others.

The whole "I don't agree with you, so i'm going to (tell my dad) the Police so they can give you a good telling off" is the stuff of the schoolyard... or the Twitter mob.

 

[DicehunterTPU]

I think its the same guy. They at least share the same skewed view of their own self importance, and need to influence their "power" over others.

I just find it really sad and pathetic, How empty and meaningless does someones life have to be to make a non existent mole hill into mount Everest over graphical DLL's on a tech site.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

the DLSS libraries, which are usually located in the game's installation folders,

So the dlls are distributed via game installations? I see this as purely coincidental, that the same files as in the SDK. I also take it to mean the files in the SDK are redistributable, or they wouldnt be installed within game folders.

 

[qubit]

Jesus, why all the damn hate? All TPU is trying to do is provide a risk-free place for people to download the DLLs that they would find other places anyway. That's commendable in my opinion

Duh! Exactly. Let no good deed go unpunished.

 

[cvaldes]

So the dlls are distributed via game installations? I see this as purely coincidental, that the same files as in the SDK. I also take it to mean the files in the SDK are redistributable, or they wouldnt be installed within game folders.

The game developers put them there deliberately for titles that support DLSS. It makes zero sense to have the end user install software that doesn't do anything. The game developers qual a certain version of DLSS to work with a certain version of the game. That's why various games have different versions of DLSS.

Remember that DLSS needs game-specific profiles (calculated by Nvidia's supercomputers) to work. I can't just drop these dlls into a game like, oh, let's say Minesweeper and expect them to work automagically. It doesn't work like that.

 

[Aquinus]

Jesus, why all the damn hate? All TPU is trying to do is provide a risk-free place for people to download the DLLs that they would find other places anyway. That's commendable in my opinion

I'm not disputing that. All I'm saying is that redistributing it may not be legal given the wording of the license. I don't want @W1zzard getting grief and I don't want nVidia's software license being thrown to the wind because of what that implies for other software licenses. It's an absolutely terrible precedent to set.

Remember that DLSS needs game-specific profiles (calculated by Nvidia's supercomputers) to work. I can't just drop these dlls into a game like, oh, let's say Minesweeper and expect them to work automagically. It doesn't work like that.

Well... technically you can if API compatibility isn't broken. That depends on nVidia's diligence to not break backwards compatibility. If a game uses DLSS and a newer DLL doesn't break backwards compatibility with the APIs, it might work. It also might not, it's a gamble. It also assumes that it doesn't depend on code changes to other DLLs either.

 

[R-T-B]

They are distributed like this, so that not a single line of the actual DLSS code needs to exit nvidias premises. Legally whether something is a dll or not has zero merit.

I wasn't speaking legally. I was speaking to intended use.

 

[Aquinus]

I wasn't speaking legally. I was speaking to intended use.

When I manage dependencies in projects, I specify exact versions. Newer versions of deps can cause issues if the code hasn't been updated to handle the changes if there is a breaking change, intentional or not. For intended use, sure, but I think there is an argument to be had that you're playing with fire by just updating a single dependency without understanding the full dep graph. That's aside from the legality issues. I wouldn't just go swapping out DLLs. At best, it works. In reality, it might not. At worst, it works and it triggers anti-cheat or something dumb like that.

Either way...