• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

The Family of man just got Bigger

Status
Not open for further replies.

infrared

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
May 28, 2005
Messages
4,753 (0.92/day)
Location
Southampton, UK
System Name Box of Distraction
Processor Ryzen 7 1800X
Motherboard Crosshair VI Hero
Cooling 2x 240mm rads, Corsair ML fans, EKWB pump/res and GPU block. XSPC Raystorm pro CPU block
Memory G.Skill TridentZ DDR4-4266 16GB @ 3466MHz CL14 1T
Video Card(s) EVGA 1080Ti FE. WC'd & TDP limit increased to 360W.
Storage Samsung 960 Evo 500GB + Corsair 120GB ssd (linux) + WD Black 2TB storage drive.
Display(s) Asus ROG Swift PG278QR 27" 1440P 165hz Gsync
Case Phanteks Enthoo Pro M
Audio Device(s) Phillips Fidelio X2 headphones / basic Bose speakers
Power Supply EVGA Supernova 750W G3
Mouse Logitech G602
Keyboard Cherry MX Board 6.0 (mx red switches)
Software Win 10 & Linux Mint 18.3
Benchmark Scores https://hwbot.org/user/infrared
I have no intreast in debating god or any other Deity creation myth and have requested thread be clensed/closed
Thank you for sharing your myths ect.

Science is what this sub forum is for take the myths ect to the lounge area.
Thread cleansed :)

Everyone:
As per OP's wishes please stay on topic, this thread is not for religious discussion. Thank you.
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
4,290 (1.04/day)
System Name Virtual Reality / Bioinformatics
Processor Undead CPU
Motherboard Undead TUF X99
Cooling Noctua NH-D15
Memory GSkill 128GB DDR4-3000
Video Card(s) EVGA 2080Ti
Storage Samsung 960 Pro 1TB + 860 EVO 2TB + WD Black 5TB
Display(s) Acer K272HUL, HTC Vive
Case Fractal Design R5
Audio Device(s) BOSE 2.0
Power Supply Seasonic 850watt
Mouse Logitech Master MX
Keyboard Corsair K70 Cherry MX Blue
Software Windows 10 Professional/Linux Mint
Typed up over 20k words to try to explain evolution from the perspective of stochastic genome modeling. In the end realized it is not worth it.

Ahhh f$$k i want my 2hrs back....
 
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
7,165 (4.19/day)
Location
Sunshine Coast
System Name Black Box
Processor Intel Xeon E5-2680 10c/20t 2.8GHz @ 3.0GHz
Motherboard Asrock X79 Extreme 11
Cooling Coolermaster 240 RGB A.I.O.
Memory G. Skill 16Gb (4x4Gb) 2133Mhz
Video Card(s) Nvidia GTX 710
Storage Sandisk X 400 256Gb
Display(s) AOC 22" Freesync 1m.s. 75Hz
Case Corsair 450D High Air Flow.
Audio Device(s) No need.
Power Supply FSP Aurum 650W
Mouse Yes
Keyboard Of course
Software W10 Home Premium 64 bit
As a scientist who currently bucks the trend of the mainstream, I take exception to that statement...
Then my statement was not aimed at you ;)
Every new discovery is like a small piece of a jigsaw puzzle, but i'm convinced there is more than one puzzle laid out that it can fit, but most people only see the one in front of them.
 
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
539 (0.31/day)
Typed up over 20k words to try to explain evolution from the perspective of stochastic genome modeling.
Obviously, this is not the place.
Today in both "camps" 99% of the people are just believers. Even the self-declared "evolutionists" are believers because they believe in something that their intellect cannot understand. They barely finish HS, never had a probability math class at college level... so on and so forth.

To me, as agnostic, nobody could explain the apparition of humans genetically in a convincing way. How one pair of chromosomes got fused in one individual and got transmitted by natural sexual reproduction in the rest of population that had normal, not-fused chromosomes. How come mitochondrial evidence points to a very short "evolution" of humans on timescale, more like an "explosion".

I have read some papers that claim to explain that, but I didn't get convinced. 20-30 years since I have started questioning myself this... then one day I randomly saw the videos of late Llyod Pye linked above. He was the only one that really tried to address the same questions. Coincidence that we tough the same? Not to me.

Until scientists are genuinely try to solve this great mystery, without using dogma and stigma, they are no better than the rest of religious believers.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Apr 18, 2019
Messages
101 (1.44/day)
Location
Western MA, USA
System Name Main (gaming, browsing, light web dev.)
Processor Ryzen 7 1700X @ 3.9Ghz
Motherboard Gigabyte GA-AX370-Gaming K7
Cooling Corsair H60i w/Nidec GentleTyphoon | 4 x Corsair ML120 case fans
Memory 16GB(2x8) G.Skill FlareX DDR4-3200
Video Card(s) Sapphire Vega 64
Storage Samsung 850 EVO 500GB (Boot/OS) | Samsung 860 EVO 1TB (Games) | 3 x WD Spinners 1TB/500GB/64GB (BU)
Display(s) 2 X AOC Q3279VWFD8 - 10bit IPS 1440p @ 75hz FreeSync over DP
Case Corsair Graphite 600T w/mesh side
Audio Device(s) Logitech Z625 2.1 | cheapo gaming headset when mic is needed
Power Supply Corsair HX850i
Mouse Logitech G602
Keyboard Corsair K70 Lux - Blue on Black
Software Windows 10 Pro x64 - Typically has 600-800GB of games installed, primarily from Steam
Benchmark Scores Who cares about benchmark scores. This machine is about bang for the buck!
I can't even comment on some of the garbage I've read in this forum because it so insane I will end up in a rant. Just one question, if you don't believe in evolution why would come to a thread that is so obviously about evolution?
 
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
539 (0.31/day)
Why not? The purpose of a forum is to have discussions, not to be a "safe space" echo chamber. Per your logic, if you don't believe in creation, why do you comment about creation?

Is it though about "evolution"? Who says that those fossils are from what we evolved from? Actually, even per evolution dogma, most of the humanoid fossils are not in our evolution path.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Dec 14, 2009
Messages
7,296 (2.10/day)
Location
Glasgow - home of formal profanity
System Name New Ho'Ryzen
Processor Ryzen 1700X @ 3.82Ghz
Motherboard Asus Crosshair VI Hero
Cooling TR Le Grand Macho & custom GPU loop
Memory 16Gb G.Skill 3200 RGB
Video Card(s) RTX 2080ti MSI Duke @2Ghz ish
Storage Samsumg 960 Pro m2. 512Gb
Display(s) LG 32" 165Hz 1440p GSYNC
Case Lian Li PC-V33WX
Audio Device(s) On Board
Power Supply Seasonic Prime TItanium 850
Software W10
Benchmark Scores Look, it's a Ryzen on air........ What's the point?
As an archaeology student, I can tell you there is no missing link. That term is used by idiots and the astoundingly ignorant.

The tree of life concept is enough of an illustration to guide. Branches of evolution flourish, then fail. Few make it through.

The great thing about a true science is that we don't know the truth until it's infallible. Mainstream science guides us through logical thought but it is ALWAYS open to critique and change. Unlike other ideological dead ends.
 
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
539 (0.31/day)
Circa 150-200kya the humans appeared suddenly in Africa and then slowly moved out, in phases (60-80 kya).
Before that we have ape-like hominids. There is nothing "in between".

We are not descendants of the Neanderthal or Homo Erectus. We might inbreed with them (2-3%) later, before we drove them off...
Archeology got more interesting today: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeogenetics
 
Last edited:

dorsetknob

"YOUR RMA REQUEST IS CON-REFUSED"
Joined
Mar 17, 2005
Messages
8,139 (1.56/day)
Location
Dorset where else eh? >>> Thats ENGLAND<<<
The little old lady that lives near you and the old man oppose your mum are actively practicing Evolution
in their case its called Gardening where they breed crops/plants for colour /size of fruit
95% of what modern people eat is directly resulted from evolution
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
11,233 (2.59/day)
System Name Pioneer
Processor Intel i9 9900k
Motherboard ASRock Z390 Taichi
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 @ DDR4-3400 14-14-14-34-2T
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1080 FTW2
Storage HGST UltraStar 7K6000 3.5" HDD 2TB 7200 RPM (w/128MBs of Cache)
Display(s) LG 32GK850G-B 1440p 32" AMVA Panel G-Sync 144hz Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) Onboard Toslink to Schiit Modi Multibit to Asgard 2 Amp to AKG K7XX Ruby Red Massdrop Headphones
Power Supply Seasonic PRIME 750W 80Plus Titanium
Mouse ROCCAT Kone EMP
Keyboard WASD CODE 104-Key w/ Cherry MX Green Keyswitches, Doubleshot Vortex PBT White Transluscent Keycaps
Software Windows 10 x64
more like an "explosion".
Yes, and that had happened before, historically, in the fossil record. It's not unheard of. The Cambrian Explosion is the best known example. I would reccomend reading this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambrian_explosion#Possible_Causes

It's an excellent (but incomplete) list of possible ways an organisms development may be supercharged.

As for chromosomes fusing, and all that, it's sort of weird to think about, but interspecies breeding is showing increasing evidence as having both happened and had an impact on a lot of the evolutionary tree (yes, even late humans). The weirdness you get from that in even humanity's brief experiments with interbreeding animals may explain all sorts of abnormalities. It certainly does weird things to the chromosomes when you get viable offspring.

Relevant article:

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2006/05/did-ancestral-humans-chimps-interbreed/

And yes, I am fully aware the monkeysex angle makes this even less appetizing to religious types. That shouldn't matter to science if the theory holds any credibilility.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
539 (0.31/day)
The little old lady that lives near you and the old man oppose your mum are actively practicing Evolution
in their case its called Gardening where they breed crops/plants for colour /size of fruit
That's Selection, not evolution. If you have a genome fund, and you selectively eliminate some of the genes from it, you are not evolving that population into a different species. A tomato didn't evolve from a cactus.
Only recently we found out how to genetically engineer them. And that makes my point of creative evolution versus random one.

Like I said before, people don't know what they don't know. But they always BELIEVE strongly in what they don't understand.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Feb 2, 2015
Messages
2,707 (1.69/day)
Location
On The Highway To Hell \m/
Being human sucks ass. That's all I know. Not a single good thing about it, other than the fact that it eventually ends.
 
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
539 (0.31/day)
The Cambrian Explosion is the best known example.
And that doesn't raise questions? How those "empty" ecological niches got filled so sudden by random mutations that usually take millions of years to develop?

Random mutations need much, much longer times. Here certainly looks like creative engineered processes. God, Aliens... any civilization that could do that, at that point in time, are certainly indistinguishable from God to us.
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
11,233 (2.59/day)
System Name Pioneer
Processor Intel i9 9900k
Motherboard ASRock Z390 Taichi
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 @ DDR4-3400 14-14-14-34-2T
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1080 FTW2
Storage HGST UltraStar 7K6000 3.5" HDD 2TB 7200 RPM (w/128MBs of Cache)
Display(s) LG 32GK850G-B 1440p 32" AMVA Panel G-Sync 144hz Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) Onboard Toslink to Schiit Modi Multibit to Asgard 2 Amp to AKG K7XX Ruby Red Massdrop Headphones
Power Supply Seasonic PRIME 750W 80Plus Titanium
Mouse ROCCAT Kone EMP
Keyboard WASD CODE 104-Key w/ Cherry MX Green Keyswitches, Doubleshot Vortex PBT White Transluscent Keycaps
Software Windows 10 x64
And that doesn't raise questions?
It does. But rather than throw everything out because one piece doesn't fit, Occam's Razor would have us ask "What Changed?" rather than throwing out what seems a perfectly good theory.

Only if none of the explanations make sense can the theory truly be discarded. That is not the case. If you really think those explanations are impossible, please do detail what you see wrong with them beyond "lol too fast therefore aliens."
 
Joined
Feb 2, 2015
Messages
2,707 (1.69/day)
Location
On The Highway To Hell \m/
The question is...why are stupid people allowed to live and/or procreate? When will we evolve to that level? Ever?

Hint: Then "when" and "ever" are semi-rhetorical. The time will come. I'm just pissed off it's not sooner than later. Anywho...enjoy your stay while it lasts idiots!
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
11,233 (2.59/day)
System Name Pioneer
Processor Intel i9 9900k
Motherboard ASRock Z390 Taichi
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 @ DDR4-3400 14-14-14-34-2T
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1080 FTW2
Storage HGST UltraStar 7K6000 3.5" HDD 2TB 7200 RPM (w/128MBs of Cache)
Display(s) LG 32GK850G-B 1440p 32" AMVA Panel G-Sync 144hz Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) Onboard Toslink to Schiit Modi Multibit to Asgard 2 Amp to AKG K7XX Ruby Red Massdrop Headphones
Power Supply Seasonic PRIME 750W 80Plus Titanium
Mouse ROCCAT Kone EMP
Keyboard WASD CODE 104-Key w/ Cherry MX Green Keyswitches, Doubleshot Vortex PBT White Transluscent Keycaps
Software Windows 10 x64
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
476 (1.14/day)
Location
Upstate NY
System Name HexaCore
Processor AMD Phenom II X6 @ 3.5Ghz
Motherboard Biostar A880GZ
Cooling Fractal Designs S36 360mm Liquid Cooling System
Memory 8GB DDR3 @ 1600Mhz 7-8-7-16
Video Card(s) MSI RX580 Gaming X 8GB
Storage 3 x 80GB Intel SSD
Display(s) 1080P
Case CoolerMaster Sileo 500
Audio Device(s) Integrated
Power Supply Antec NeoPower 650W Blue
Mouse Microsoft Intellimouse
Keyboard Dell
Software Windows 10 Pro
Evolution is the process of successful selection
Evolution is the process of successful mutation. Which is impossible and paradoxical when you consider the odds. Fill the entire state of texas with quarters, a total of 10 feet high and pick the golden quarter not just once, but over and over again for every single animal. 99% of mutations are bad.
 

dorsetknob

"YOUR RMA REQUEST IS CON-REFUSED"
Joined
Mar 17, 2005
Messages
8,139 (1.56/day)
Location
Dorset where else eh? >>> Thats ENGLAND<<<
And that doesn't raise questions? How those "empty" ecological niches got filled so sudden by random mutations that usually take millions of years to develop?

Random mutations need much, much longer times
No it does not
evolution has been Scientificly Documented with Various Species within the lifetime ( and to be more precise Acedemic lifetime ) of Scientist and reserchers
 
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
539 (0.31/day)
evolution has been Scientificly Documented with Various Species within the lifetime ( and to be more precise Acedemic lifetime ) of Scientist and reserchers
Like said... if you believe that, then more power to you. But you are not different than any other believer. BTW the others have "documented" their beliefs too. Dogma is something that you are not allowed to question.
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
11,233 (2.59/day)
System Name Pioneer
Processor Intel i9 9900k
Motherboard ASRock Z390 Taichi
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 @ DDR4-3400 14-14-14-34-2T
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1080 FTW2
Storage HGST UltraStar 7K6000 3.5" HDD 2TB 7200 RPM (w/128MBs of Cache)
Display(s) LG 32GK850G-B 1440p 32" AMVA Panel G-Sync 144hz Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) Onboard Toslink to Schiit Modi Multibit to Asgard 2 Amp to AKG K7XX Ruby Red Massdrop Headphones
Power Supply Seasonic PRIME 750W 80Plus Titanium
Mouse ROCCAT Kone EMP
Keyboard WASD CODE 104-Key w/ Cherry MX Green Keyswitches, Doubleshot Vortex PBT White Transluscent Keycaps
Software Windows 10 x64
Evolution is the process of successful mutation.
Mutation just brings new genes in. Selection decides which ones win out.


Which is impossible and paradoxical when you consider the odds.
No, not really. Not even close to really. A lot of selection has gone on over the last millions of years alone.
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
11,233 (2.59/day)
System Name Pioneer
Processor Intel i9 9900k
Motherboard ASRock Z390 Taichi
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 @ DDR4-3400 14-14-14-34-2T
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1080 FTW2
Storage HGST UltraStar 7K6000 3.5" HDD 2TB 7200 RPM (w/128MBs of Cache)
Display(s) LG 32GK850G-B 1440p 32" AMVA Panel G-Sync 144hz Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) Onboard Toslink to Schiit Modi Multibit to Asgard 2 Amp to AKG K7XX Ruby Red Massdrop Headphones
Power Supply Seasonic PRIME 750W 80Plus Titanium
Mouse ROCCAT Kone EMP
Keyboard WASD CODE 104-Key w/ Cherry MX Green Keyswitches, Doubleshot Vortex PBT White Transluscent Keycaps
Software Windows 10 x64
Like said... if you believe that, then more power to you.
I do believe in the ability of people who've spent a lifetime on this to know more than me, yes.

I also do my own research to fact check and understand the theories, as I understand (from history ironically) recorded "fact" can be very very wrong (Columbus, anyone?)

You claim to do the same but I have honestly yet to see it. You see the difference? You have choosen the path you liked. I chose the path that has the most things add up.
 
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
9,144 (5.24/day)
Location
Too Long to fit in a single line here.
Processor i7 8700k 4.7Ghz @ 1.26v
Motherboard AsRock Fatal1ty K6 Z370
Cooling beQuiet! Dark Rock Pro 3
Memory 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX 3200/C16
Video Card(s) MSI GTX 1080 Gaming X @ 2100/5500
Storage Samsung 850 EVO 1TB + Samsung 830 256GB + Crucial BX100 250GB + Toshiba 1TB HDD
Display(s) Eizo Foris FG2421
Case Fractal Design Define C TG
Power Supply EVGA G2 750w
Mouse Logitech G502 Protheus Spectrum
Keyboard Sharkoon MK80 (Brown)
Software W10 x64
The question is...why are stupid people allowed to live and/or procreate? When will we evolve to that level? Ever?

Hint: Then "when" and "ever" are semi-rhetorical. The time will come. I'm just pissed off it's not sooner than later. Anywho...enjoy your stay while it lasts idiots!
Our current society and systems are actually very good at exponentially increasing the % of idiots and failing at natural selection ie. evolution, under the guise of humane and equal policies.. And ironically, even a great war is not a very good tool for natural selection, yet its the only way to radically reduce that number at some point in the future. And it gets worse, we're now even thinking of sending our best and brightest off-planet, to a Mars colony or something likewise.

Painful, I say.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top