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Throttlestop overclocking Desktop PCs

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Any know for sure if W5580 is unlocked? It can be ran in dual CPU setup, which would be interesting if it was indeed unlocked and potentially overclocked with Throttlest.
It is not. IIRC, none of the 45nm Gainestown Xeons were unlocked, "officially". You'd be better served by a 32nm Westmere-EP based Xeon such as an X5672 if you want to stay with a quad core. They run cooler and OC better. An X5660, X5670 or X5675 are in a similar price range and off a much better value. All of the Westmere-EP series Xeon's are dual CPU compatible.

A full list of Xeon's are included in the following list;
https://www.techarp.com/guides/workstation-server-cpu-comparison/9/
 
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Any know for sure if W5580 is unlocked? It can be ran in dual CPU setup, which would be interesting if it was indeed unlocked and potentially overclocked with Throttlest.
It was tested here and we found out it wasn't. The only unlocked dual CPU is the QX9775 LGA771. There were rumors,an article, and a CPUZ validation that pointed to that conclusion, but it isn't so. The QX9775 in dual CPU configuration is hampered by the DDR2 FBDIMMs which can provide good bandwidth in 3 or 4 channel mode but add huge amounts of latency and heat in all configurations to do so. The MB usually requires extra power connectors for the extra CPU and RAM which complicates things further.
The W3570, and W3580 4C/8T 45nm CPUs are unlocked. Their main attraction is very low price. $15-20. Even cheaper than the unlocked LGA775 chips. With HT and 3 channel memory not a bad deal really. But the fastest dual CPU LGA1366 is the X5687 4C/8T 3.60 Ghz.
 
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Upowa

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Her's another Youtube video. A 6 core shootout. Not one of our unlocked CPUs, but X58 X5675
I watch his vids from time to time, but generally I follow the computer tech daily. Pretty awesome how an old 6 core can keep up with today's new systems with a high end gpu. The 4core nehelam with ddr3 can still compete with modern gaming systems. Power efficiency is best with haswell and onward though.

Lga775 lags behind too much due to the DDR2 memory. Putting a 4 core xeon into them is pretty cool through bios modding. I have a P35 board w/E5462 running a radeon 4850. Even now coffee lake cpus can be put into older 100/200 series boards, but not that significant once 300 series boards become cheaper. I think the next Intel cpu will use a new board altogether by next year.
 
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There were some DDR3 LGA775s but 50% more bandwidth from 3 channel memory is hard to compete with. The unlocked Nehalem Xeons cost about 1/4 of an unlocked C2X. I see the prices are going up on the unlocked Gulftowns. They're just now starting to bring what QX9650s have been going for.
 

T3500

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A W3680 that I got from eBay arrived today and I've had a first go at OC'ing with TS. Tested up to x30 multiplier on all cores step by step. Got 875 on Cinebench at 4GHz; had to up the TDP limit to 180 as the previous run with the TDP at the normal 130 exhibited what I assumed was thermal throttling, the multiplier was jumping up and down. Temps got pretty toasty, yet it wasn't until 80 degrees that the front case fans on the T3500 ramped up at all. This was all without any additional cooling mods. Gonna try with a 80/90mm fan cable-tied to the heatsink and see how much it brings the temps down. I did a Userbenchmark run which gave a single core score lower than what I thought it would get at 4GHz; again the multiplier was jumping up and down so it didn't stick at 4GHz the whole time, despite the 180W TDP limit. Might this be because the test isn't very demanding, and it felt that full turbo wasn't needed?
 

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unclewebb

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Here is a T3500 - W3680 Cinebench run for comparison.



I think I ran this while using the 31 multiplier. Not 100% Prime stable at this speed but it was stable enough for Cinebench. A little extra air flow through the OEM heatsink can make a big difference.

what I assumed was thermal throttling
Technically it is not thermal throttling. Intel CPUs also throttle based on power consumption. You might have to bump up the TDC a little too. Do whatever is necessary to keep the multi from sagging down while under load. Also make sure you are using the Windows High Performance power profile with the Minimum processor state set to 100%. Disable C1E too while testing.
 
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Some of the guys said they got Speedfan to work on these.
 

T3500

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Some of the guys said they got Speedfan to work on these.
Yeah it does on mine, but it doesn't always respond to speed change commands and it makes the whole pc laggy, it freezes for a split second at regular intervals when it's running
 
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Back on page 8 there's a monster fan and cooler swap. The last photo was supposed to be first. So if you run the slideshow forward from the end it makes sense. I've been busy the past month and never got it wired up and running. That fan doesn't speed up either. It just doesn't need to. If you liked that you'll love page 9.
 
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T3500

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Yeah that's quite a hefty heatsink you've got there! You had to remove the OEM backplate to mount it yes? How did you keep the CPU retention bracket in place? AFAIK it's attached by screws that go through the mobo into the backplate
 
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No it screws down on the Dell studs. The Thermalright stuff is the same thread size. The larger Ninja 4 cooler had to use TR parts to mount it. A threaded spacer goes on the MB studs, then the bracket mounts on top of that with bolts. I did shim it a little between the crossbar and the heatsink with metal tape, but nothing major.
If you liked that you'll love page 9.
 
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Yeah that's quite a hefty heatsink you've got there! You had to remove the OEM backplate to mount it yes? How did you keep the CPU retention bracket in place? AFAIK it's attached by screws that go through the mobo into the backplate
I removed the OEM backplate on my T3500 board...I can't specifically remember what I used to hold the CPU retention bracket in place, but I do remember I had to remove it and remount...if you're really stuck, I can have a better look and see how I did it...I know I can mount any cooler now with the backplate removed, and am currently using a AIO liquid cooler.
 

T3500

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I removed the OEM backplate on my T3500 board...I can't specifically remember what I used to hold the CPU retention bracket in place, but I do remember I had to remove it and remount...if you're really stuck, I can have a better look and see how I did it...I know I can mount any cooler now with the backplate removed, and am currently using a AIO liquid cooler.
Nice, I've got my eye on an AIO on eBay at the moment, and I don't think it'll mount on the Dell plate's screws
 
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Nice, I've got my eye on an AIO on eBay at the moment, and I don't think it'll mount on the Dell plate's screws
Got my AIO for $10 Canadian on a local classified site (Kijiji.ca), might want to check for a similar deal in your area!
 

T3500

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Benchmark Scores Cinebench - 875cb - W3680 @ 4.0GHz http://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/8909928
Question: With my combo of TS + W3680 + Dell mobo there is no option to change voltage in TS (nor does CPU-Z report it). So when OC'ing by upping the multiplier, is the voltage being increased behind-the-scenes so to speak to support the faster speed, or is the voltage staying the same?
 

unclewebb

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is the voltage being increased behind-the-scenes so to speak
Good question. The amount of voltage increase is somewhere between minimal and none. The amount of voltage increase when overclocking, if there is any, is not enough to run a W3680 at what it is truly capable of.

For comparison, I have a very similar but locked W3670 installed in an EVGA board with full voltage adjustment. In a T3500, a typical W3680 is probably going to max out at somewhere around 4000 MHz to 4133 MHz due to the limited CPU voltage. On the EVGA board with the CPU voltage set sky high, a similar W3670 can run at 4700 MHz.



X58 boards with voltage control are usually not cheap on EBay. You can buy an entire T3500 system with memory for less than the cost of a typical X58 board. If you are on a limited budget, I find that the T3500 is a good compromise.
 

dorsetknob

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X58 boards with voltage control are usually not cheap on EBay.
Typicaly they cost as much or more now than when they were 1st released.:(
its one of the few "vintage parts that have held or increased in value"
 

T3500

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Good question. The amount of voltage increase is somewhere between minimal and none. The amount of voltage increase when overclocking, if there is any, is not enough to run a W3680 at what it is truly capable of.

For comparison, I have a very similar but locked W3670 installed in an EVGA board with full voltage adjustment. In a T3500, a typical W3680 is probably going to max out at somewhere around 4000 MHz to 4133 MHz due to the limited CPU voltage. On the EVGA board with the CPU voltage set sky high, a similar W3670 can run at 4700 MHz.


X58 boards with voltage control are usually not cheap on EBay. You can buy an entire T3500 system with memory for less than the cost of a typical X58 board. If you are on a limited budget, I find that the T3500 is a good compromise.
That's interesting, thanks! I can get to 4.27 GHz and stay stable in Cinebench, but beyond that it gives a BSOD - so similar to what you say. I've not tested/stressed with anything else yet.
 
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Here is Unclewebbs earlier post on this.
Software voltage control was part of the Core 2 design. When Intel released the first generation Core i, simple voltage control was removed. I think it was not until the 4th Gen Haswell that voltage control returned as part of their Fully Integrated Voltage Regulator (FIVR).

When you go into the bios on a Dell T3500, there is no option available to increase the voltage going to the CPU. The EVGA Classified3 X58 board has a ridiculous number of voltage control options so you can finely adjust the voltage going to every part of the CPU. Luckily you can leave most of these voltage settings on AUTO and still get great results.


Adjusting TDP or TDC does not have any effect on voltage. These 2 values determine when the CPU will start to throttle (reduce) the amount of turbo boost being used. TDP controls power in Watts and TDC controls the amount of current that can flow through the CPU in amps. The 4th Gen and newer CPUs calculate an estimated power consumption value internally and then this info is used to control how much turbo boost the CPU is allowed to use. When power consumption exceeds the set TDP value, the CPU will slow down just enough to keep the calculated TDP under this limit. I will post some pics later of my overclocked W3680 to show what happens to the MHz when it starts hitting the default 130W TDP value. These power values can be increased on the unlocked W3680 and W3690.

For the 1st Gen Core i, there is no publicly documented way to report power consumption. This data is generated internally within the CPU but no way to know exactly what it is. It is more of a guessing game. If you set the TDP to 130W and the CPU is not reaching full speed then it must be throttling. If you increase the TDP and it starts running faster, then you know it must have been hitting the TDP limit. Some of the Asus X58 boards were running into throttling problems because one of these limits was not set high enough for extreme overclockers. Asus ended up releasing some special bios versions under the table to keep the overclockers happy but they never offered these on their website.


CPUs use a voltage look up table. The CPU determines what speed / load / temperature it is running at and then asks the motherboard to give it the appropriate amount of voltage so it can run stable. Intel CPUs always ask for a little extra voltage so the CPU will continue to run stable well after the warranty is over. This extra voltage allows the CPU to run stable even when it is overclocked a little. On the 6 core Xeon W3600 series, the amount of voltage needed really starts to go up significantly when you go beyond 4 GHz. On a board with no voltage control, the built in VID voltage table only seems to have values good enough to run stable at 4 GHz and not much beyond. The Intel specs list the VID Voltage range for all of these processors as 0.800V - 1.375V. I think my Xeon W3670 needs approximately 1.375V to run stable at 4 GHz. Without adjustable voltage, that is approximately where you will end up.

There is no real difference between the Xeon W series or the Core i7-990X Extreme. It is all luck of the draw. Maybe a CPU with a high VID table will give the CPU a little more voltage when used in a Dell T3500 and this will allow slightly more overclocking or maybe a CPU with a low VID voltage table will allow a user to overclock more because it is a great overclocker without needing a lot of voltage. That might be perfect for a board that does not offer voltage adjustment. The Xeon W3680 does just fine on a voltage locked or voltage unlocked board. Definitely not worth paying 2 or 3 times as much to get an Extreme Core i7.

I have seen a hard mod before and some great results when feeding a 1st Gen Core i7-920XM Extreme mobile CPU some extra voltage. I think it was svl7 on Tech Inferno that did this. Unfortunately every time I try to go to their website, my antivirus software warns me about a Miner virus so I would not recommend going there.
 
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I've been looking into RDIMMs since we're getting into the T5500 MB swap here, and I supect ther may be an issue for TS OVerclocking there. I posted the long version in the Dell Workstation Owners Club. https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/dell-workstation-owners-club.243124/page-2
Basically RDIMMs are intended for dual CPU systems and servers. With memory controller on the CPU it seems the single CPU Xeons don't support RDIMMs. The DUAL CPU Xeons do.
So the unlocked Xeons will probably require UDIMMs even if the system supports RDIMMs. Single CPU systems using dual CPU Xeons should be OK with RDIMMs ( if the MB supports them), but can't be TS overclocked.
I'm seeing written reports (but no evidence) that 3600 series Xeons support RDIMMs, I'm also seeing W3680 having issues with it in HP workstations. Since I've already bought some I guess I'll find out the hard way. All I could get out of Crucial.com was "Xeons USUALLY support RDIMM".
 
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Hi...I’ve been lurking on this thread for a while and you folks have really got me interested!

I had already ordered some LGA 1136 parts off fleabay and it turns out you all are doing exactly what I was thinking.

Low budget, high performance. TS is obviously the key component to make it happen.

Afte reading here, I jumped on a Dell T5500 motherboard deal, so hopefully I can get with the fun soon.

Waiting for it to arrive...
 
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Software Win7-64, Throttlestop 6.00 overclock
Benchmark Scores 3DMark 11 P7644 (52% )In Win7 64, Firestrike 6892 ( 58% ) http://valid.x86.fr/l2j5p1
I hope you realize that the Dell T5500 MB isn't ATX. If you don't have a T3500/ 5500 to put it in you've got some work to do.
 
Joined
Jun 1, 2018
Messages
108 (0.19/day)
Location
Southeast USA
System Name “Frankenstein” Dell T5500 (installed in T3500 case)
Processor Xeon X5675
Motherboard Dell T5500
Cooling Dell Air cooler 0U016F
Memory 24 GB ECC Registered. DDR3 (4GB x 6)
Video Card(s) Sapphire R9 380X Nitro 4GB
Storage SATA SSD and WD HD
Display(s) Dell 24” LCD
Case Dell T3500 (donor)
Audio Device(s) Intel 2.0 HD audio on board
Power Supply Dell T5500 875 watt job. Nice beefy PS, but ugly power harness.
Mouse Um...generic?
Keyboard Dell basic keyboard
Software Windows 10 Pro 64 and PC Linux OS Mate 64
Benchmark Scores Coming!
Yes, I had read enough to know that much.

I am keeping my eyes open for a T3500 or T5500 locally, and imagine that’s what I will start playing with.

I appreciate all great info you have been sharing.

That T3500 build you have going is awesome!
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2016
Messages
608 (0.43/day)
Location
South Florida
System Name BTXTREME
Processor QX6800 SLACP Core2 Extreme
Motherboard Dell 0WG864 LGA775 BTX
Cooling Dell T9303 heatpipe cooler, Delta GFB1212VHG 2 motor fan.
Memory 8GB Dell DDR2@800
Video Card(s) Sapphire Dual BIOS R9-285 ITX O/C 2GB DDR5
Storage Crucial M500 240GB SSD
Display(s) Dell 22" LCD
Case Dell Dimension E 520 MT
Audio Device(s) onboard sound with Logitech Z523 speakers
Power Supply EVGA B2 750W semi modular
Mouse Logitech wireless (two installed)
Keyboard Logitech wireless backlit
Software Win7-64, Throttlestop 6.00 overclock
Benchmark Scores 3DMark 11 P7644 (52% )In Win7 64, Firestrike 6892 ( 58% ) http://valid.x86.fr/l2j5p1
Thanx. I've been too busy lately to finish it. I'll get back to it soon.
 
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