Monday, November 14th 2022
Zen 4 X3D Limited to 8-Core and 6-Core, No Meteor Lake in 2023: Frosty Year Expected for CPU Market
A reliable source with CPU and platform leaks, ECSM_Official, made some new predictions about release timelines of upcoming desktop processors, and how 2023 could play out for Intel and AMD. 2022 is done, with no new desktop processor SKUs expected to launch from either brands. Intel is expected to flesh out its 13th Gen Core "Raptor Lake" desktop processor family in Q1 2023, with the addition of "locked" non-K SKUs spanning all four brand extensions (i3/i5/i7/i9). Besides these, Intel is expected to launch its new flagship, the Core i9-13900KS, with boost frequencies hitting the 6 GHz mark, in an attempt to ward off the threat from "Zen 4" with 3D Vertical Cache, a technology that springboarded "Zen 3" gaming performance to match that of "Alder Lake."
Both the i9-13900KS and AMD Ryzen 7000X3D processors are expected to launch toward the middle of H1-2023 (March-April). AMD is only expected to launch 6-core/12-thread and 8-core/16-thread SKUs with the 3DV cache technology. These would be single-CCD packages. There's no word on dual-CCD ones with 12-core or 16-core counts, so a Ryzen 9 7950X3D is not on the horizon. AMD is expected to debut its entry-level A620 motherboard chipset in Q2-2023. This chipset reportedly lacks CPU overclocking capability, is expected to lack PCIe Gen 5, and caps memory speed to DDR5-4800.Intel is expected to refresh its 13th Gen Core processor lineup with new SKUs in Q3-2023. For now, all that's known about these "Raptor Lake Refresh" processors is that they come with 100-200 MHz speed bumps over existing 13th Gen Core SKUs of the time. This would also mean that the LGA1700 platform and "Raptor Lake" will be Intel's mainstay throughout 2023, and the 14th Gen "Meteor Lake" isn't launching until 2024.
While "Meteor Lake" will dominate Intel's mobile processor lineup, it will have a limited presence on the desktop side, due to its core-count of 6P+16E, despite IPC uplifts on both the P-cores and E-cores. These processors will, however, debut the next-generation Socket LGA1851 platform. 2024 will see Intel launch both the "Meteor Lake" and 15th Gen "Arrow Lake" processors. The "Arrow Lake" SoC will restore core-counts to the familiar 8P+16E, with IPC uplifts for at least the P-cores, over those on "Meteor Lake." In summary, 2023 will be a lukewarm year for new processor/platform launches, mainly due to the downturn in the PC industry. Intel and AMD will want to make less-risky bets.
Sources:
ECSM_Official (bilibili), ECSM_Official (bilibili), VideoCardz
Both the i9-13900KS and AMD Ryzen 7000X3D processors are expected to launch toward the middle of H1-2023 (March-April). AMD is only expected to launch 6-core/12-thread and 8-core/16-thread SKUs with the 3DV cache technology. These would be single-CCD packages. There's no word on dual-CCD ones with 12-core or 16-core counts, so a Ryzen 9 7950X3D is not on the horizon. AMD is expected to debut its entry-level A620 motherboard chipset in Q2-2023. This chipset reportedly lacks CPU overclocking capability, is expected to lack PCIe Gen 5, and caps memory speed to DDR5-4800.Intel is expected to refresh its 13th Gen Core processor lineup with new SKUs in Q3-2023. For now, all that's known about these "Raptor Lake Refresh" processors is that they come with 100-200 MHz speed bumps over existing 13th Gen Core SKUs of the time. This would also mean that the LGA1700 platform and "Raptor Lake" will be Intel's mainstay throughout 2023, and the 14th Gen "Meteor Lake" isn't launching until 2024.
While "Meteor Lake" will dominate Intel's mobile processor lineup, it will have a limited presence on the desktop side, due to its core-count of 6P+16E, despite IPC uplifts on both the P-cores and E-cores. These processors will, however, debut the next-generation Socket LGA1851 platform. 2024 will see Intel launch both the "Meteor Lake" and 15th Gen "Arrow Lake" processors. The "Arrow Lake" SoC will restore core-counts to the familiar 8P+16E, with IPC uplifts for at least the P-cores, over those on "Meteor Lake." In summary, 2023 will be a lukewarm year for new processor/platform launches, mainly due to the downturn in the PC industry. Intel and AMD will want to make less-risky bets.
70 Comments on Zen 4 X3D Limited to 8-Core and 6-Core, No Meteor Lake in 2023: Frosty Year Expected for CPU Market
There are tons of gamers just sitting out AM5 purchases & waiting for the X3D's. Bet there will be pretty good sales (despite high platform costs) if it delivers dominant gaming performance. If I remember correctly they "decoupled" the core clocks (or voltage?) for the cores & the 3D V-Cache for the 7000 series, so core clock limitations won't be an issue on the 7000 series CPU's as they where on the 5000 series. Everything more than 8 cores will be a dual CCD CPU, so there might be some technical limitation for a higher core X3D variant. I don't think it's a thermal limitation, I guess it's the side effects of "bridging" two CCD's, like extra latency or something like that. Skatterbencher has a pretty good breakdown of AM5 CPU's, but it's way over my head. Maybe someone can read something out of it.
PC computing isn't just gaming.
I'm also a gamer, but I won't buy a X3D CPU if productive performance are lower than on "non X3D" SKUs, like it's happening on 5800X3D vs 5900X, for instance.
Gamer? V-cache is for you. Server/HPC? Same. Video editor, CAD user, music producer, programmer, whatever? No need for V-cache, just get as many cores as you can afford.
I think AMD is going all-in on gamers, but gaming on a PC is becoming more and more expensive, and lackluster sales by Zen 4 are the demonstration people don't want to put so much money on an hobby...
A520 was a perfectly reasonable chipset given CPU OCing is going the way of the dinosaur. Had It allowed PCIe 4.0 form the CPU I'd have likely picked it up.
I was looking forward to A620 for budget builds (especially given it would have PCIe 4.0 now) but if they do indeed limit ram OC via chipset then its going to be a no go. Back to Intel for budget needs I guess.....
-the ongoing economic downturn
-everyone, their grandmother and their dog all buying gaming PCs durbing lockdown
-poor value propositions of current gen CPUs and systems compared to used parts and parts users already own.
AMD definitely isn't all in on gamers, they're all in on servers, with gamers being an important but small market far behind that. That's part of why we're currently seeing such high prices and poor value - if they really wanted the volume rather than high margins, they could cut prices quite a lot and still make a killing, but increase DIY sales quite a lot. The only problem with that is that DIY sales are a tiny drop in the bucket compared to both OEM, laptop and server sales. Which is precisely my point. These chipset have always been heavily limited. And for what they are, that's fine. They've never been positioned as a value gamer option.
/s
Most people wouldn't even have a clue that things have slowed down. The only people to be negatively affected would be the very, very small minority called "enthusiasts" -- with enough cash, a constant (read "mostly meaningless") upgrade itch and total lack of self-control. I almost feel bad for them.
Anecdotal, I know, but here goes: I recently picked up a used A320 board with an Athlon 3000G and 8GB of 2400 RAM for cheap -- just to tinker with it. I pushed the memory from 2400 to 3200 (3400 was a bit unstable). If I replace the CPU* and install a proper GPU** - boom, cheap gamer rig!
* Given how far pushed out of the box CPUs have become, manual tuning is now unnecessary, bar some limited scenarios.
** PCI-E 3.0 doesn't bother me at all -- I can live with the low single-digit FPS loss it would cause, plus I'm not likely to use top tier cards anyway.
What OS ?
As for Meteor Lake delays, I said this 6 months ago, 2023 was a joke and yet the media kept spouting this nonsense. The good news for AMD is Zen 5 will be a chance to be out not long after ML. I also said Arrow Lake won't be out before 2025 and will probably be facing off against Zen 6.
The one bright thing for Intel IPC uplifts on Redwood cove are said to be 22-34% over Raptor cove, and Crestmont is something like 15% over Gracemont. Arrow Lake apparently gets bigger uplifts than this! So 6P Redwood cores with up to 34% IPC uplifts could still beat 8P Raptor cores. The 16 E cores though will be much stronger and overall in MT we might see good gains. But Zen 5 is a much bigger change in architecture than Zen 4, so all bets are off as to how they compare. AMD will be breathing easier seeing Intel has cancelled plans for much higher E core counts in ML and Arrow Lake.
I think you are overestimated the servers market and underestimated the gaming market if you are saying AMD is keeping platform prices high on purpose.
Yes, servers market is very important, but gaming is very relevant.
They just overestimated themselves , thinking people would have bought Zen 4 platform at any asked price, and I'm quite sure they will correct that pretty soon.
big difference between CS:GO and Cyberpunk
If there actually is a 7600X3D, it will be a real winner. I want a CPU focused entirely on gaming performance.