The Ugly Truth About Hackers

[eidairaman1]

I get most of the possibly pirated movies I have from my friends... I recently brought, WIndows 7, Transformers 1 and 2 on Bluray, 2012 on Bluray... So yeah I do occasionally spend money on movies... But the prices are still silly.

You didn't have to buy them on Blue Ray, You could of saved money and gotten the DVDs. If I'm not mistaken most BD players Upconvert older medium. DVDs are the common thing hence why prices are less.

 

[TheMailMan78]

I get most of the possibly pirated movies I have from my friends... I recently brought, WIndows 7, Transformers 1 and 2 on Bluray, 2012 on Bluray... So yeah I do occasionally spend money on movies... But the prices are still silly.

Off topic how much did you spend on your pre-built?

 

[Aceman.au]

Ive seen the DvD versions and Ive found Bluray is much better quality... Not to mentions Ive brought, COD4, BF2, CODMW2, Crysis, LOTRBFME1+2 and much much more legitimately...

 

[Aceman.au]

Off topic how much did you spend on your pre-built?

What do you mean?

 

[eidairaman1]

Ive seen the DvD versions and Ive found Bluray is much better quality... Not to mentions Ive brought, COD4, BF2, CODMW2, Crysis, LOTRBFME1+2 and much much more legitimately...

I probably am incriminating myself for saying this but Ive downloaded maybe 1 complete game in the past and that was to replace a scratched disk. I kind of figured if I already own the game per se why should I have to buy it again. Its just like ROMs for Emulation the rules are do not download unless if you own the game.

You know what I say about the BD thing, It was the same exact deal with DVD over VHS, Quality was higher, well its fact You could cram more 1/0s onto a disk where as you would need a mile of VHS tape to match the quality. I found the advantage of DVDs being the Size and weight, Disadvantage is Durability and price at the time they weren't common. Only thing I seen that was special with BDs maybe was the Menu system being a little more in depth over a DVDs menu system.

Also for BD to look any better than DVD you need a HDTV to run it. Which All HDTV is just a Higher amt of Pixels on the Screen vs a CRT. Shoot I already had HD capability back in early 2000s with this Monitor. Know why? The Pixel Density is higher than it is on the CRT. Most CRTs run at 640x480 or 1024x768. People don't even know what 1080p means. TBH I'd rather have a 5:4 or 16:10 Aspect Ratio over a 16:9. Most TV programming appears distorted still on HDTVs (wider than it should be as compared to 4:3). Also I can't stand letterbox format movies one bit, Put the Picture on the Entire Screen like a Projector Does.

 

[tacgnol]

It's not a very good article, or very interesting either. It keeps on going on about hackers and piracy but really hacking has very little to do with piracy. The reversing/cracking scene is what enables the continued release of pirate software.

Cracking copy protection is not hacking, it's cracking.

Anyway, that said obviously it's bad if you hack to do something like fraud, obviously good and bad things have come about as a direct or indirect result of hacking, cracking, etc. It's not that clear cut so it really depends on exactly what is done in each case.

 

[Steevo]

I was wrong, but Intel did grant a patent right to AMD as a second source for processors.

Wasn't around in the 70's......

 

[v12dock]

I tired buying tv episodes off iTunes once but after learning that I could only download them once I quit

 

[Deleted member 67555]

The more companies fight this the more people they will have to fight in the end the end consumer is getting screwed and very few of them are going to see the hackers as the bad guys Specially when games are coming out with Cheaper features on older engines at higher prices (Infinity Ward) and stripped of the Features that consumers want..

I personally do not want DRM's on my PC at all
wait what do I mean..

I mean I don't want DRM's at ALL
att all

and I do not see any theft when any consumer rids themselves of them..
people want products and not (for all intents and purposes) Damages to there stuff when they buy a game

 

[imperialreign]

The more companies fight this the more people they will have to fight in the end the end consumer is getting screwed and very few of them are going to see the hackers as the bad guys Specially when games are coming out with Cheaper features on older engines at higher prices (Infinity Ward) and stripped of the Features that consumers want..

I personally do not want DRM's on my PC at all
wait what do I mean..

I mean I don't want DRM's at ALL
att all

and I do not see any theft when any consumer rids themselves of them..
people want products and not (for all intents and purposes) Damages to there stuff when they buy a game

What's the big deal over DRMs?

I mean, seriously, everyone gets uber 1337 when it comes to DRMs, and pronouncing them as one of the coming signs of the apocalypse.

Personally, I've never had any major issues with them, and most people I know have never had issues, either. Sure, they can be annoying at times (especially if you don't take TLC of your disks), but they serve their function perfectly . . . they keep pirates from immediately cracking the software, which takes longer for bootlegs to start circulating. Add in the fact that a lot of game developers have gotten into a habit of patching any disk-checker out of the game, usually at least a year after initial release, it's ensuring their financial stability - especially with "hot" titles.

When it comes to small-time developers, I'd much rather such protections be in place . . . they need the income from the release for further development and to continue to grow. I'm a major supporter of small-time game developers, they tend to have some of the biggest innovations and ambitious projects. Sadly, they don't tend to last as long, either, and the rapid growth in piracy over the last 10 years really doesn't help.

Anyhow, most arguments regarding DRMs is plain nonsense anyhow, and isn't really backed up by anything substantial.

If you haven't checked it out yet, there's an excellent and extremelly well researched read regarding DRMs here: http://www.tweakguides.com/Piracy_8.html

 

[Solaris17]

What's the big deal over DRMs?

I mean, seriously, everyone gets uber 1337 when it comes to DRMs, and pronouncing them as one of the coming signs of the apocalypse.

Personally, I've never had any major issues with them, and most people I know have never had issues, either. Sure, they can be annoying at times (especially if you don't take TLC of your disks), but they serve their function perfectly . . . they keep pirates from immediately cracking the software, which takes longer for bootlegs to start circulating. Add in the fact that a lot of game developers have gotten into a habit of patching any disk-checker out of the game, usually at least a year after initial release, it's ensuring their financial stability - especially with "hot" titles.

When it comes to small-time developers, I'd much rather such protections be in place . . . they need the income from the release for further development and to continue to grow. I'm a major supporter of small-time game developers, they tend to have some of the biggest innovations and ambitious projects. Sadly, they don't tend to last as long, either, and the rapid growth in piracy over the last 10 years really doesn't help.

Anyhow, most arguments regarding DRMs is plain nonsense anyhow, and isn't really backed up by anything substantial.

If you haven't checked it out yet, there's an excellent and extremelly well researched read regarding DRMs here: http://www.tweakguides.com/Piracy_8.html

DRM's sucks for people like me who just up and format and then relize i cant get that "activation" back and they cant "reset" it. I just think its kinda dumb that I need to sit their with a brand new mobo sitting next to me and instead of installing it and watching my e-peen grow I need to sit their and chain smoke for an hour and uninstall and "deactivate" my games. That got old fast...even faster when i ran out of ciggs.

 

[eidairaman1]

DRM does cause compatibility issues.

 

[imperialreign]

DRM's sucks for people like me who just up and format and then relize i cant get that "activation" back and they cant "reset" it. I just think its kinda dumb that I need to sit their with a brand new mobo sitting next to me and instead of installing it and watching my e-peen grow I need to sit their and chain smoke for an hour and uninstall and "deactivate" my games. That got old fast...even faster when i ran out of ciggs.

Do you use Steam or some other form of digital distro?

Most activations, though, only become overly picky when a game is installed off a specific disk too often. I've never had to "deactivate" any of my games, the REG key is tied to the disk and the specific DRM instance itself. As long as the REG key is good, and the disk in the drive matches up, it all comes together.

DRM does cause compatibility issues.

I realize it does occasionally happen, but it's not a common occurance, is what I meant.

There's occasional compatibility problems with any form of low-level software or app - be it DRM, OS, hardware drivers, etc. It'd be foolish to assume that DRMs would be "perfect little angels" . . . which is what most people seem to want them to be.

 

[Easy Rhino]

this is turning into the ugly truth about TPUers...

 

[Solaris17]

this is turning into the ugly truth about TPUers...

ya you need skin cream bad bro that avvy is rough

Do you use Steam or some other form of digital distro?

Most activations, though, only become overly picky when a game is installed off a specific disk too often. I've never had to "deactivate" any of my games, the REG key is tied to the disk and the specific DRM instance itself. As long as the REG key is good, and the disk in the drive matches up, it all comes together.

steam for some games. Not to big on steam though I like having hard copies. I do however install my games to a seperate drive. And my drive letters change all the time.

 

[imperialreign]

this is turning into the ugly truth about TPUers...

I see you starting to get a bit worried TPU might be turning into the next piratebay . . .

 

[Deleted member 67555]

Here is a good reason I don't like them
I replaced a Video card i did not change anything else since I got it and for some reason I've installed it 3 times But if I call them and explain it they will give me 1 more Activation
that is in no way cool by me I paid for it i have not installed more than once but i got to call them and proclaim it was just a hardware upgrade and I'm not a thief no thank you

 

[FordGT90Concept]

They need to put another warning label on their packaging:
The DRM in this application may drive you to piracy.

this is turning into the ugly truth about TPUers...

PC gamers are starting to get pissed off about all this DRM BS, especially this latest fiasco by EA (Command & Conquer 4) and Ubisoft (Silent Hunter 5, Assassin's Creed 2). TPU isn't the only place where gamers are voicing their annoyance.

 

[eidairaman1]

DRM Pushes More users to Pirated games because the DRM stuff is removed in Pirated software. DRM causes nothing but headaches especially when installing on a Fresh machine after a format, and It still causes Problems. DRM is like a Rootkit.

 

[imperialreign]

EA is pretty gestapo with their titles - I'll definitely give you that. But, again, if it happened after installing a new video card, it sounds like a low-level application conflict (which, there's not much one can do about).


But, it brings up one bad aspect of DRMs - pirates and users with pirated copies using legit activation keys. It screws those who have legitimately purchased the title.


You might want to look into the specific DRM itself - a lot of the companies offer a means of "reseting" or removing the activation, as long as you're current install is legit. I had to go through those hoops with one title recently (I want to say it was CoD:WaW, but I don't remember), and it was a PITA, but no problems at all now.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

EA doesn't. All they offer is these rather large applications (5.5-5.8 MiB) which will deauthorize the current install so that you can authorize it one more time. If you already formatted or did something that caused the authorization count to increment, you're out of luck.

 

[Deleted member 67555]

Ok I will admit EA's DRMs in specific are what I have a problem with...and not just that example
EA's DM's DRM has played Havoc on non related programs in which I had to track down a patch to deal with (Legit patch)

i don't like having to do that..and it's not like these drm's are actually doing anything next to increasing the price of Software due to the added expense of DRM production (obviously if they were effective Piracy rates would be going in the opposite direction)
I would give further explanation but I've already been given a friendly reminder on the Forum rules a few days ago on another post

oh wait I forgot about UbiSoft's ridiculous DRM's as well i have had more than a few problems with those as well

 

[imperialreign]

EA doesn't. All they offer is these rather large applications (7+ MiB) which will deactivate the current install so that you can activate it one more time. If you already formatted or did something that caused the activation count to increment, you're out of luck.

I see . . .

So, that sounds more like some communisitic control tendancies on the part of the publisher . . . not that of a 3rd-party DRM.

. . . and that's one thing I do have a problem with. I don't believe the publisher should have full, absolute control over the software like that. Leave the DRM to the 3rd-party developers who've managed to both make their apps secure, and operate in a fair and user-friendly way . . . as I pointed out, the 3rd-party DRM developers tend to have some means of deactivating or reseting the DRM as long as you have a legit copy . . . a publisher (such as, and especially, EA) would never offer such.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

This authorization crap (EA and Ubisoft) is a function of SecuROM 7, a Sony DADC product (aka, third party).

As for that last paragraph, notice where all the DRM is focused (Windows) and who is authoring 90%+ of the current DRM in use (Sony). Think of the big dog they have in the gaming race (PlayStation 3). It is in Sony's best interest to create draconian DRM to drive people away from Windows gaming to PS3. A shame Ubisoft and EA don't realize this.

Tages and Star-Force are even more brutal. The enemy here is the publishers: they are the ones deciding to use DRM, they are the ones to tell consumers that, if the DRM acts up, you're out of luck, they're the ones paying for the DRM, and they are the ones ignoring all the complaints directed at DRM. Tages, Star-Force, and Sony DADC are just making a product and selling it. Sony DADC obviously has a conflict of interest going on there but all forms of DRM conflict with the consumer's right to use what they purchased (guilty until proven innocent).

The only developer I know of to consistently free their games of DRM (via patch) is Egosoft in cooperation with Deep Silver--the only publisher with some common sense. Every publisher will openly admit that their titles only make real money in the first 6 months. After that period is when Deep Silver/Egosoft releases a patch which instantly removes all DRM related issues and insures the DRM will never prevent the game from running in the future. Most publishers, for whatever reason, deem it unnecessary to offer this common courtesy to those interested in their product. Problems created by the DRM rear their ugly head five years later and you are just out of luck because the publisher has intentionally forgotten they ever even published that title. For example, try to find anything on EA that's useful in regards to SimCity 3000 or James Bond 007: Nightfire. Don't bother, EA has forgotten about those titles and it is in your best interest if you do too. :/

 

[imperialreign]

. . . and that's one of the things I've had a problem with, regarding the DMCA.

It extended the publisher's rights to protect their media, while infringing upon the EU rights to backup and archive their bought media.

It start to get into a lot of grey area from there - if you download an app to crack the DRM (or bypass it) so you can make a backup copy, are you reallt doing anything illegal? Going by the Sect117 amendments, you're not, so long as those copies aren't being distributed. What you're downloading is a tool, not a complete pirated version.

This is where we start getting into things like whether a "fixed" .exe is illegal or not . . . it's not a pirated copy of the game, instead merely a means of bypassing the DRM . . . a "tool" in a sense.

Personally, I don't have a problem with such "cracks," as it's (IMHO) a means for the EU to protect their outlined rights . . . as long as one isn't doing anything else illegal (i.e. downloading or distributing full bootlegged versions), I personally view it as acceptable (and one of the only "questionable" practices I view as such, too) . . . although, the government probably wouldn't think so.

Sadly, in the US, the rights of corporations always come before those of the general public.

This authorization crap (EA and Ubisoft) is a function of SecuROM 7, a Sony DADC product (aka, third party).

As for that last paragraph, notice where all the DRM is focused (Windows) and who is authoring 90%+ of the current DRM in use (Sony). Think of the big dog they have in the gaming race (PlayStation 3). It is in Sony's best interest to create draconian DRM to drive people away from Windows gaming to PS3. A shame Ubisoft and EA don't realize this.

Tages and Star-Force are even more brutal. The enemy here is the publishers: they are the ones deciding to use DRM, they are the ones to tell consumers that, if the DRM acts up, you're out of luck, they're the ones paying for the DRM, and they are the ones ignoring all the complaints directed at DRM. Tages, Star-Force, and Sony DADC are just making a product and selling it. Sony DADC obviously has a conflict of interest going on there but all forms of DRM conflict with the consumer's right to use what they purchased (guilty until proven innocent).

Ties in with what I just mentioned about the DMCA extending publisher's rights while infringing on the EU's.

The only developer I know of to consistently free their games of DRM (via patch) is Egosoft in cooperation with Deep Silver--the only publisher with some common sense.

Some others do, too. ID had worked out with Activision to patch out DRM after so long (Activision seems to go on a "per-developer" basis, THQ is good about removing DRM with a games "final" patch as well . . . Eidos does sometimes, it kinda depends on the title.