tricksonAll I have seen as of late from AMD is there need to put the MHZ to there CPU line nothing really more than that. This was some thing Intel did with the P4 and it did not work all that well for Intel or the P4.

considering your running your own cpu flat out at 4Ghz im surprised you dont think that a positive but hey ho:)

theoneandonlymrkconsidering your running your own cpu flat out at 4Ghz im surprised you dont think that a positive but hey ho:)

The difference is that his cpu stock clock is 3Ghz. "Intel" did not need to clock it all the way up to 4Ghz because the performance is effective at 3Ghz as well, and it also clocks well.

It is rumored that changes made in steamroller was made by the magic hands of "Jim Keller" and all this was made within the first week of being re-hired.
I hope they let him do something extra on steamroller to improve it even more.
Go Jim Keller.

AvonXIt is rumored that changes made in steamroller was made by the magic hands of "Jim Keller" and all this was made within the first week of being re-hired.
I hope they let him do something extra on steamroller to improve it even more.
Go Jim Keller.

Good point, this Jim Keller person can make a big difference for the AMD. If he limits the sharing among the modules like adding an extra decoder per module for total 2 decoders instead of having 1 decoder that got bottlenecked, this alone can improve performance by a lot.
I also think they need to break up the FPUs into 4 blocks of 64-Bit where they can be combined to either 128-Bit x 2 or 256-Bit x 1 or 64-bit x 4 or 128-Bit x 1 and 64-bit x 2 n so on. Maybe this will work good too, but not sure right now.

nt300I also think they need to break up the FPUs into 4 blocks of 64-Bit where they can be combined to either 128-Bit x 2 or 256-Bit x 1 or 64-bit x 4 or 128-Bit x 1 and 64-bit x 2 n so on. Maybe this will work good too, but not sure right now.

That might add a little to much complexity for the FPU & might require redesign things. Depending on how the current one is designed, of course.
And, I bet they wouldn't hesitate on doing it if it would give a performance boost that justifies the effort required to do so.

AvonXThe difference is that his cpu stock clock is 3Ghz. "Intel" did not need to clock it all the way up to 4Ghz because the performance is effective at 3Ghz as well, and it also clocks well.

You got that right!

AvonXThe difference is that his cpu stock clock is 3Ghz. "Intel" did not need to clock it all the way up to 4Ghz because the performance is effective at 3Ghz as well, and it also clocks well.

Yeah right,

The starting clock has little to do with it's affectiveness of performance. It's to do with marketing and it's perception to consumers.

If intel thought they'd get 1% more sales by starting their lower models at 4GHz they would do it too.

Dent1Yeah right,

The starting clock has little to do with it's affectiveness of performance. It's to do with marketing and it's perception to consumers.

If intel thought they'd get 1% more sales by starting their lower models at 4GHz they would do it too.

I
Aaaaaaahhhhhh no. Amd needs the sales more. If this were true, everything amd released would be 4.3 & above. The marketing comes in by mere name recognition and the price follows accordingly. Want a Benz.....gonna have to pay for a Benz

Dent1Yeah right,

The starting clock has little to do with it's affectiveness of performance. It's to do with marketing and it's perception to consumers.

If intel thought they'd get 1% more sales by starting their lower models at 4GHz they would do it too.

Ummmm what? :wtf:

This makes no sense at all.
All AMD is doing is the SAME thing Intel did when the P4 was out. Intel kept jacking up the CPU clock speed and got no were fast. Now I heard this from all the AMD people (Including MYSELF!) But when AMD does the very same thing it is some how marketing? DUDE put the pot pipe down.

ensabrenoirI
Aaaaaaahhhhhh no. Amd needs the sales more. If this were true, everything amd released would be 4.3 & above.

If AMD and Intel could maintain the advertised TDP at 4.3GHz they would.

And

If AMD and Intel find a way to supply retail boxes with a better cooling system without compromising profit we would see 4.3GHz stock

ensabrenoirThe marketing comes in by mere name recognition and the price follows accordingly. Want a Benz.....gonna have to pay for a Benz

Marketing is clock speed as well. Because the non-technical gifted i.e. the average joe assumes higher clock equals better performance, thus healthier profit.

tricksonUmmmm what? :wtf:

This makes no sense at all.
All AMD is doing is the SAME thing Intel did when the P4 was out. Intel kept jacking up the CPU clock speed and got no were fast. Now I heard this from all the AMD people (Including MYSELF!)

But how can you say this with certainty without Piledriver reviews?

If Piledriver proves to have the same IPC as Bulldozer at stock speeds then your argument makes sense. But right now we have no clue how Piledriver performances so we cant even make an educated guess why they've increase the stock clocks.

tricksonDUDE put the pot pipe down.

A few of you should deffinately do this, and trickson runs his at 1Ghz extra so clearly wasnt fully satisfied with it at 3 and once you hit the limits of IPC your faced with higher clocks or more cores to increase performance it is that simple, and on both these points Amd are up and running, P4 just straight up didnt work and had nowhere to go whereas BD ,PD steamroller and excavator are all completely modern rewriten arch to attain better modularism(not sure thats a word) so that Amd can make a 5 Ghz 64 core 8x GPU soc chip before intel does, and easier and they are doing ,these be opinions here.


Avonx please figure out the Edit button you have been here in this thread long enough(chatting the same nonesense) to figure it out by now, yet keep throwing the odd Dp inn:shadedshu

I personally love high hertz cpu's, ive ran all mine just below their actual wall all their lives and yes i killed a few of them, but not before three years and that will do for me, so 5Ghz is my next un power efficient target, my webz pages should fly then:p.

AvonXe difference is that his cpu stock clock is 3Ghz. "Intel" did not need to clock it all the way up to 4Ghz because the performance is effective at 3Ghz as well, and it also clocks well.

no Dp see;)

the absolute truth of the matter is that alpha ,beta chips and hard evaluative validation testing decide what speeds intel and AMd sell their chips at, they are binned according to their actual performance into bins that all befit a certain quantity(reqd) and performance and Lifespan criteria so all in they have little choice most of the time and are binned according to market demand often and not performance, thats why were here, after all not all oems are willing to put a 4 Ghz chip in anything unless its still cheap and the difference is good for oems as a price scale, more Ghz = yep more moneys................

Dent1Marketing is clock speed as well. Because the non-technical gifted i.e. the average joe assumes higher clock equals better performance.

Not really, The average "Joe" is only interested in one thing can this computer do what I need it to do. That is really all. Most people do not care if the CPU is Intel or AMD just as long as the computer it's self can do what they need it to do.
you are assuming that the average "Joe" Knows that the faster the CPU the better. In some cases yes this would be true, But for the web/video/youtube surfer there is only one thing can I get my 4g to work with this computer.
I believe that AMD is ringing every little bit out of what they have now just to stay competitive with Intel. Too bad they are resorting to cheap tactics to get there. Hey her is an Idea AMD should be rethinking the CPU design altogether and for go the jacking up of the CPU speeds. Some real thought and real innovation is needed. Just like they did with the K10!

theoneandonlymrkA few of you should deffinately do this, and trickson runs his at 1Ghz extra so clearly wasnt fully satisfied with it at 3

I run at 4.0GHz because I can. Just how many of then 4.2 and 4.3GHz AMD CPU's do you really think will be overclock-able? It just looks to me like AMD is out of Ideas and has resorted to jacking up core speeds. I wounder just when AMD will have to put liquid coolers in there CPU packages and soon! WOW I wonder just how HOT them things are really going to be.

tricksonNot really, The average "Joe" is only interested in one thing can this computer do what I need it to do. That is really all. Most people do not care if the CPU is Intel or AMD just as long as the computer it's self can do what they need it to do.
you are assuming that the average "Joe" Knows that the faster the CPU the better. In some cases yes this would be true, But for the web/video/youtube surfer there is only one thing can I get my 4g to work with this computer.

When the average Joe buys a computer they are bombarded with numbers. People learn to count as a toddler and are trained to assume a higher number is better. In essence they are trained to believe that a higher number means it can "do what they need" better.

tricksonI believe that AMD is ringing every little bit out of what they have now just to stay competitive with Intel.

To stay competitive in performance? That is their secondary concern.

To stay competitive with Intel financially yes.

tricksonSome real thought and real innovation is needed. Just like they did with the K10!

Bulldozer was innovative. Innovation and performance have different dictionary meanings.

trickson. Just how many of then 4.2 and 4.3GHz AMD CPU's do you really think will be overclock-able?

Maybe you should wait for Piledriver and find out how overclockable it is? - Rather than talking shit before the product hits the shelves.

tricksonI run at 4.0GHz because I can. Just how many of then 4.2 and 4.3GHz AMD CPU's do you really think will be overclock-able? It just looks to me like AMD is out of Ideas and has resorted to jacking up core speeds. I wounder just when AMD will have to put liquid coolers in there CPU packages and soon! WOW I wonder just how HOT them things are really going to be.

I run mine at 4+ because i can too and because i prefer the snapyness, i wasnt haveing a dig so wind your neck in, fair enough thats your opinion but i agree with this ,

Dent1If AMD and Intel could maintain the advertised TDP at 4.3GHz they would.

as for mentioning temps imho sandy and ivybridge dont run that cool nor phenom II so all in its not much of a point, as im an enthusiast anyways and allready have a waterblock for all hot chips, currently 7th month since rebuild and at 100% 24/7 folding cpu 57 gpu's 52-58 mobo 45 and im running 4.175Ghz bring on vishera i say its nearly winter anyways and ill show you how it Oc's:p.

you dont get extra Trolling points for double posting by the way trickson:p

Hopefully this will be good!

tricksonI agree. There is this inherent desire to keep things in the dark. We will all just have to wait to see how well PD really is. All I have seen as of late from AMD is there need to put the MHZ to there CPU line nothing really more than that. This was some thing Intel did with the P4 and it did not work all that well for Intel or the P4. This is what I am seeing at any rate.

This was Intel's specific design, where higher clocks is required for performance increases. The only inefficiency in the P4 design was the Net burst Architecture and that lousy FSB nonsense.

Don't know why AMD went the deeper pipeline route, but Excavator will change this, with Steamroller bringing the first major changes to the Bulldozer Design.

AMD should be patted on the back for such outside the box innovation, but also get kicked in the nuts for a lousy execution due to upper management. Today's Bulldozer should have been at the very least Steamroller, if not Excavator. AMD no has to backpeddle and repair this, and they will...

Here we go again with the nonsense. You guys need to chill out.
If bulldozer was so good they would all remain at their positions and they would not of gotten fired.
We can see that also in the FX-8300 series that they just cranked up the "Ghz" to gain some performance, because most of it came from that and there was not much "innovation" in it.
This is plain and simple, AMD run out of "tallent" and skillful engineers.
"Hence" why now we have "Jim Keller" at AMD because they were left with no other options.
"Jim Keller" was hired to hopefully fix all this junk. But this will take some time.

Difficult times at AMD: www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/17/us-advancedmicrodevices-cfo-idUSBRE88G1DC20120917

I wonder where are those who claimed that AMD products are "still" selling well.

AvonXDifficult times at AMD: www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/17/us-advancedmicrodevices-cfo-idUSBRE88G1DC20120917

I wonder where are those who claimed that AMD products are "still" selling well.

Ouch......:banghead:.....dont want to.loose my gpu company....:shadedshu..

AvonXbecause most of it came from that and there was not much "innovation" in it.

No innovation?

So designing the first processor with a module with a dedicated schedulers and integer units for each thread isn't innovative?

That is a huge innovation and achievement. AvonX what have you done with your life that is so fantastic?

AvonXDifficult times at AMD: www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/17/us-advancedmicrodevices-cfo-idUSBRE88G1DC20120917

Difficult times at Intel:

www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/07/us-intel-outlook-idUSBRE8860BR20120907

AvonXHere we go again with the nonsense. You guys need to chill out.
If bulldozer was so good they would all remain at their positions and they would not of gotten fired.
We can see that also in the FX-8300 series that they just cranked up the "Ghz" to gain some performance, because most of it came from that and there was not much "innovation" in it.
This is plain and simple, AMD run out of "tallent" and skillful engineers.
"Hence" why now we have "Jim Keller" at AMD because they were left with no other options.
"Jim Keller" was hired to hopefully fix all this junk. But this will take some time.

You really need to examine what you post before somebody takes it as fact You have absolutely no idea what went on within AMD when Hector Ruiz was CEO. When Dirk Meyer took the job, the company was in a mess. It was like Hector stripped the funds from the CPU R&D budget. Dirk Meyer did OK for a time, but was quickly let go. Bulldozer's research began I believe one year before Hector left. Anyhow, The Board of Directors made bad desicions which led the Bulldozer project to a bad start.
Rory has a game plan and so far it seems to be working.

Also your opinion regarding the FX 8300 will be nothing more than an OC'ed Bulldozer is just that a none Facial statement that holds no water. In October when Piledriver is released, you will eat those words :D

AvonXDifficult times at AMD: www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/17/us-advancedmicrodevices-cfo-idUSBRE88G1DC20120917

Dent1Difficult times at Intel:

www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/07/us-intel-outlook-idUSBRE8860BR20120907

Hehe!

erockerOkay, these kind of posts can stop. They serve no use other than flamebaiting. I'm quite sure you have made your point several times in this thread, I see no reason for you to post in this thread any longer.

This wasn't a suggestion.

ummmmmmmmmmm

so vishera is gonna be a little bit better than bulldozer but the real improvements are gonna be steamroller

i would say BD = 100% PD = 110-115% and SR = 135-45%