Monday, June 22nd 2015

AMD Doesn't Trust its Own Processors - Project Quantum Driven by Intel Core i7-4790K

One of the three unexpected products based on the "Fiji" GPU, which AMD announced at its E3 event, Project Quantum, or the quest to design a 4K-worthy SFF gaming PC, which runs two "Fiji" GPUs in CrossFire, had the press assume that the rest of the system could be AMD-based, such as AMD-branded (albeit Patriot Memory manufactured) memory, AMD-branded (albeit OCZ manufactured) SSD; and importantly an AMD-made CPU or APU. Given its liquid-cooling, the prospect of a 95W "Godavari," or even upcoming "Carrizo" APU didn't seem far-fetched. Even a 95W FX CPU could have been deployed, since AM3+ on mini-ITX is not impossible.

When taken apart, Project Quantum was shown to be running an Intel Core i7-4790K "Devil's Canyon" CPU, on an ASRock-made mini-ITX motherboard, with its non-essential parts soldered out. The i7-4790K is neighbored by a pair of half-height Crucial Ballistix memory modules, which is excusable, since there are no half-height AMD Radeon memory modules, yet. The SSD is AMD-branded. The unit features a unified liquid cooling solution that's custom-made for AMD, by Asetek. A large (200 mm?) radiator, with a single fan, cools the CPU, the PCH, as well as the two "Fiji" GPUs.
Source: Kitguru
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188 Comments on AMD Doesn't Trust its Own Processors - Project Quantum Driven by Intel Core i7-4790K

#1
Mutagen240
Very misleading title. AMD clearly knows that Intel was the only way to go. As stated there are no m-itx motherboard for FX CPUs and APUs would be a huge bottleneck so they could only have chosen Intel. Its not that they don't trust they're CPUs, its that they're not stupid. Please change the title.

Yours sincerely, AMD fanboy
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#2
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
Mutagen240, post: 3302047, member: 158104"
Very misleading title. AMD clearly knows that Intel was the only way to go. As stated there are no m-itx motherboard for FX CPUs and APUs would be a huge bottleneck so they could only have chosen Intel. Its not that they don't trust they're CPUs, its that they're not stupid. Please change the title.

Yours sincerely, AMD fanboy
Changed title to "Processors," a term AMD uses for both CPUs and APUs; and mentioned that AMD COULD HAVE USED FX, because it turns out that you CAN design mini-ITX motherboards using the 2-chip chipset after all. Below is an example. It runs 890GX+SB850. AMD 970+SB950 has a lower TDP than 890GX due to lack of integrated graphics. So you can build ITX boards with AMD 970 and AM3+. You'll just have to use SO-DIMM instead of standard DIMMs, which shouldn't be a problem. MSI's 4K Gaming notebook uses SO-DIMMs.

Posted on Reply
#3
MikeMurphy
Performance, heat and power consumption needed to be considered. It has nothing to do with trust.
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#4
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
MikeMurphy, post: 3302058, member: 6751"
Performance, heat and power consumption needed to be considered. It has nothing to do with trust.
Then why stop at CPUs? AMD should have used two NVIDIA GPUs.
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#5
RejZoR
Is it a prototype? YES
Can you buy Quantum? NO

Where is the problem? You'll likely see Quantum be available next year when they'll have Zen and when R9 Fury Maxx will be released, most likely some time in the fall or even winter 2015. Zen comes in 2016. But for the prototype they were forced to use Intel. You won't believe what all companies use to make prototypes and what then actually ends up in the same products when customers can buy them...
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#6
ZoneDymo
Kind of odd to use a term as "trust" for this.
Its not like their own processors are know to spontaneously combust or something.

AMD just knows the competition has more high-end stuff out, a level at which they themselves dont compete at atm.
So for a so called high end machine, you turn in this case to the competition.

Here is hoping AMDs new future cpu's will wow us and perhaps will put them back in the high end category and perhaps power future Project Quantum setups.
Posted on Reply
#7
ZoneDymo
btarunr, post: 3302060, member: 43587"
Then AMD should have used two NVIDIA GTX 980s (good enough for 4K).
Because those are better then two fiji's?
That some insider info there man, watch out for that NDA
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#8
Xaled
-When AMD uses its own cpu peple say:
"Too sad for such hardware to get bottlenecked by such cpu just because AMD wants to use its own hardware"

-when AMD uses Intel cpu they say:
"AMD doesnt trust its hardware..
Posted on Reply
#9
GreiverBlade
what if it's a joint venture ? and btw ... 4 days too late ... ;)

"omigodz AMD is using Intel CPU in a AMD branded mITX PC"
am i the only one who just say : "so what?"

AMD is also a GPU manufacturer and ... for that nice attempt ;)
btarunr, post: 3302060, member: 43587"
Then why stop at CPUs? AMD should have used two NVIDIA GPUs.
nope Fury X is better than what they offer :roll:

intel is not tied to nvidia luckily (nor is AMD GPU to AMD CPU )

also since the next AMD CPU line is not up, and the APU are not meant for that use: no big deal about using a Intel CPU for that demo, right...

dont make them say what they didn't say
Xaled, post: 3302066, member: 158027"
-When AMD uses its own cpu peple say:
"Too sad for such hardware to get bottlenecked by such cpu just because AMD wants to use its own hardware"

-when AMD uses Intel cpu they say:
"AMD doesnt trust its hardware..
:roll:(that post is good) ahah
Posted on Reply
#10
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
Xaled, post: 3302066, member: 158027"
-When AMD uses its own cpu peple say:
"Too sad for such hardware to get bottlenecked by such cpu just because AMD wants to use its own hardware"

-when AMD uses Intel cpu they say:
"AMD doesnt trust its hardware..
When people use AMD FX CPUs in their own builds, they say "this CPU doesn't bottleneck any GPU on the planet"
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#11
ZoneDymo
btarunr, post: 3302068, member: 43587"
When people use AMD FX CPUs in their own builds, they say "this CPU doesn't bottleneck any GPU on the planet"
Yeah.... his comment was aimed at the "anti AMD" crowd, and how they change position in order to suit the scenario that makes AMD or their product look bad.

Sorta like how the rightwingers call Obama both a dictator and a "mom jean wearing weakling that should be more like Putin", whatever suits them best atm to use against Obama.
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#12
bencrutz
btarunr, post: 3302068, member: 43587"
When people use AMD FX CPUs in their own builds, they say "this CPU doesn't bottleneck any GPU on the planet"
ever occurred to you that thermals may be the consideration instead of the bottleneck?
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#13
GreiverBlade
also it might be for PCiEX 3.0 ... didn't think about that one??? pfah! then yes ... it's a CFX in a X8/X8 configuration iirc, so.... what are the only PciEX 3.0 compatible CPUfrom AMD... YEP the APU Kaveri and Godavari.
so then : logical choice (even for a demo)

even if a dual X8 2.0 is not a bottleneck atm (for actual card ... for that kind of cards used in : who knows)

bencrutz, post: 3302073, member: 96369"
ever occurred to you that thermals may be the consideration instead of the bottleneck?
yeah right ... a AMD cpu : 125w a intel CPU: 88w... HUGGGE difference "OH MY GOD" effect inserted... (well the one in the box seems to be OC'ed so it's closer to 130w than 88w )


tho that setup seems to be good new for me ... i can put a CFX Fiji in my rig and keep only a single loop cpu/gpu on the 2 240mm rad ... bhahahaah (just need to witch the DC12-220 to a 260/400 maybe...)
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#14
Digital Dreams
Shitty thread title IMO. As "editor and senior moderator" I expect better from you. This has nothing to do with trust at all. Also people calling you out on your shit hardly makes them fanboys. :rolleyes:
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#15
bobbavet
Dual Zen. Why do you think its called quantum?
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#16
bencrutz
GreiverBlade, post: 3302074, member: 105443"
yeah right ... a AMD cpu : 125w a intel CPU: 88w... HUGGGE difference "OH MY GOD" effect inserted... (well the one in the box seems to be OC'ed so it's closer to 130w than 88w )
ok, so 42,5% more is not huge, eh? :wtf:

anyway, it's more of a proof of concept methink, so it wouldn't matter what processor they use
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#17
ensabrenoir
...poking at anything Amd before a major launch is to court Fanboy Fury!!! :laugh: But seriously guys.... the behind the seen conversation at Amd had to be priceless. Imagine if Ford had to use a Dodge Hemi in a truck prototype.....or if all Intel's office and factory computers were Amd powered....gotta learn to laugh at it all :roll:
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#18
R-T-B
RejZoR, post: 3302061, member: 1515"
Is it a prototype? YES
Can you buy Quantum? NO

Where is the problem? You'll likely see Quantum be available next year when they'll have Zen and when R9 Fury Maxx will be released, most likely some time in the fall or even winter 2015. Zen comes in 2016. But for the prototype they were forced to use Intel. You won't believe what all companies use to make prototypes and what then actually ends up in the same products when customers can buy them...
Good RejZor, you've learned not to declare things before a product ships... they may even ship with a Zen next year for all we know. It's a prototype.

Now if only btarunr would learn the same lesson, but I'll let him slide because journalism and headlines IS what he does afterall, lol. (Just messing with you a bit, man).
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#19
mroofie
Digital Dreams, post: 3302076, member: 104134"
Shitty thread title IMO. As "editor and senior moderator" I expect better from you. This has nothing to do with trust at all. Also people calling you out on your shit hardly makes them fanboys. :rolleyes:
doesn't change the fact that quantum is using intel :rolleyes:
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#20
R-T-B
ensabrenoir, post: 3302090, member: 83675"
...poking at anything Amd before a major launch is to court Fanboy Fury!!! :laugh: But seriously guys.... the behind the seen conversation at Amd had to be priceless. Imagine if Ford had to use a Dodge Hemi in a truck prototype..... gotta love it!!!
I'd say in modern gaming, the CPU is less the engine than the GPU. The CPU is more like a secondary-but-still-important piece. Maybe transmission?
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#21
Xaled
btarunr, post: 3302068, member: 43587"
When people use AMD FX CPUs in their own builds, they say "this CPU doesn't bottleneck any GPU on the planet"
Yeah FX 6300 is the best cpu on the planet :)

They may offer an excellent performance/price ratio but we do know that AMD has lost big share of laptops market share juat because they insist on using their own cpu, 7970 mobility was an excellent gpu but it was killed by AMD..
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#22
ZoneDymo
ensabrenoir, post: 3302090, member: 83675"
...poking at anything Amd before a major launch is to court Fanboy Fury!!! :laugh: But seriously guys.... the behind the seen conversation at Amd had to be priceless. Imagine if Ford had to use a Dodge Hemi in a truck prototype.....or if all Intel's office and factory computers were Amd powered....gotta learn to laugh at it all :roll:
Many a performance Ford has its engine made by zeh Germans.
Posted on Reply
#23
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
bencrutz, post: 3302073, member: 96369"
ever occurred to you that thermals may be the consideration instead of the bottleneck?
FX-8370E has just 7W higher TDP than an i7-4790K. And this is a chip which AMD is recommending on its website, for "enthusiasts."
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#24
rooivalk
Digital Dreams, post: 3302076, member: 104134"
Shitty thread title IMO. As "editor and senior moderator" I expect better from you. This has nothing to do with trust at all. Also people calling you out on your shit hardly makes them fanboys. :rolleyes:
If people agitated over miniscule detail over thread title, I think it's pretty suitable to call them fanboys.

Besides, CPU is one of AMD core business. If they're not using their own products over their own AMD branded project and worse, give a way to their SOLE competitor, it's fair to say <insert any brand here> doesn't trust their own product.

There're too much example for this. For example: French president is using Citroen/Peugeot for official state car, even though it's just compact or medium car not full size (and probably better armored) sedan which is commonly used by the presidents of the rest of the world. France Air Force is also bought it's own Rafale before exporting it (although they don't really want to buy it) far before Rafale hit jackpot with Indian Air Force.

It's logical for end user to use Intel over AMD CPU but not for AMD themselves. It's simply bad precedent.
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#25
GreiverBlade
bencrutz, post: 3302088, member: 96369"
ok, so 42,5% more is not huge, eh? :wtf:

anyway, it's more of a proof of concept methink, so it wouldn't matter what processor they use
well ... nope ... the cpu should mostly be around 130w so the difference is not so big ... tho it mean a AMD CPU would have no OC headroom which kinda put the Thermal design kinda true :laugh:

for the second line yes pretty much: it doesn't matter.
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