Monday, February 4th 2019

Intel Core i5-9400F Processor Lacks STIM, Uses Thermal Paste

With its 9th generation Core processor family, Intel introduced STIM (soldered thermal interface material) to transfer heat between the processor die and the metal integrated heatspreader (IHS), as opposed to fluid thermal pastes. Enthusiasts prefer soldered IHS for their superior heat-transfer characteristics. It was known since the series launch that STIM will be restricted to the unlocked "K" SKUs, such as the i9-9900K and i7-9700K, while locked SKUs would retain thermal pastes. PC enthusiast @momomo_us (Twitter handle) de-lidded a Core i5-9400F sample to confirm this.

The Core i5-9400F was de-lidded (its IHS removed) and placed next to a de-lidded i5-9600K, showing you TIM residue surrounding the i5-9400F die, and solder fragments on that of the i5-9600K. Interestingly, the i5-9600K die looks visibly larger than the i5-9400F, despite both being 6-core processors with 9 MB L3 cache. This isn't because the latter lacks an iGPU (not physically anyway). The i5-9400F die appears to be roughly as big as the 6-core "Coffee Lake" die used in 8th generation Core 6-core processors, while the i5-9600K appears to be carved out of the 8-core "Coffee Lake" die by disabling two CPU cores. The iGPU is physically present on the i5-9400F, but disabled.
Sources: Tom's Hardware, momomo_us (Twitter)
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24 Comments on Intel Core i5-9400F Processor Lacks STIM, Uses Thermal Paste

#1
Enterprise24
9400F use the same die as CFL 6 cores. No STIM = No surprise. The die is too thin to support STIM.
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#2
bajs11
The iGPU is physically present on the i5-9400F, but disabled.
if the igpu is physically present on the cpu then why did they create the F cpus in the first place
wouldn't the cost to manufacture them be the same?
Posted on Reply
#3
Flaky
So... since this cpu uses the same die as 8th gen, does this mean that they don't even get the supposed hardware spectre & meltdown hardening?

Paste here is ok. No need for solder on locked cpus.
Posted on Reply
#4
Tsukiyomi91
incoming folks who are offended at Intel chips not using sTIM but generic thermal paste. TBH, thermal paste is fine for a non-K, non-iGPU variant of the processor.
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#5
SetsunaFZero
bajs11, post: 3987181, member: 171095"
if the igpu is physically present on the cpu then why did they create the F cpus in the first place
wouldn't the cost to manufacture them be the same?
Probably the iGPUs are damaged but still Intel can sell it otherwise this would go straight in the bin.
Posted on Reply
#6
bajs11
SetsunaFZero, post: 3987190, member: 79285"
Probably the iGPUs are damaged but still Intel can sell it otherwise this would go straight in the bin.
ah! makes sense
kinda like Celeron then
I wonder why they haven't done that in the past considering 99.9% of the pc gamers dont really use igpu
Posted on Reply
#7
bencrutz
bajs11, post: 3987197, member: 171095"
ah! makes sense
kinda like Celeron then
I wonder why they haven't done that in the past considering 99.9% of the pc gamers dont really use igpu
because in the past they don't have many chips with broken iGPU part, i guess now they have plethora defective iGPU chips :roll:
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#8
XXL_AI
on the intel page, it says; "Use Conditions: PC/Client/Tablet" tablet? 65W CPU without iGPU? wtf intel? are you kidding?
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#9
OSdevr
bajs11, post: 3987181, member: 171095"
if the igpu is physically present on the cpu then why did they create the F cpus in the first place
wouldn't the cost to manufacture them be the same?
I imagine it would also free up the power budget. Disabling the iGPU would reduce the chips TDP.
Posted on Reply
#10
R0H1T
Tsukiyomi91, post: 3987189, member: 129086"
incoming folks who are offended at Intel chips not using sTIM but generic thermal paste. TBH, thermal paste is fine for a non-K, non-iGPU variant of the processor.
Using a good quality TIM should be the last thing Intel should look to skip, but knowing Intel - they're always the cheapskates they're usually blamed for, not to mention their artificial market segmentation!
Posted on Reply
#11
Vya Domus
Enterprise24, post: 3987179, member: 137706"
The die is too thin to support STIM.
No such limitation.
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#12
Enterprise24
Vya Domus, post: 3987278, member: 169281"
No such limitation.
Explain why CFL 8 cores die is so thick.
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#13
Vya Domus
It's not the die that is thick , it's the layer on top.

The die is as thick as the wafer.
Posted on Reply
#14
Metroid
so for them there is no need for stim for 65w cpus as overclock is blocked and no more than 65w will be used.
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#15
TheinsanegamerN
bajs11, post: 3987181, member: 171095"
if the igpu is physically present on the cpu then why did they create the F cpus in the first place
wouldn't the cost to manufacture them be the same?
Because it would cost them more to create a special die for GAMERZ that cant accept that the iGPU does not impact their CPU's performance.

So they just disabled it and sell it to fools with more money then brain cells who think the lack of iGPU will give them L33T OC Skillz. Intel was never going to make a separate die for this, that would be a laughable waste of money. Such a die has long existed in the HDET world, and GAMERZ never bought them, because said customers are just cheapskates that want to pay less for the same thing and think intel should spend millions to make that happen.
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#16
notb
bajs11, post: 3987197, member: 171095"
I wonder why they haven't done that in the past considering 99.9% of the pc gamers dont really use igpu
Of course they have. Non-iGPU dies used to be sold as Xeons.
Intel doesn't offer non-iGPU Xeons with 8C or 6C/6T (there is a 6C/12T). They had to do something with the dies, so they created a new consumer category.
XXL_AI, post: 3987214, member: 182013"
on the intel page, it says; "Use Conditions: PC/Client/Tablet" tablet? 65W CPU without iGPU? wtf intel? are you kidding?
I ordered a carrot salad and a tea yesterday, but the bill said "food" and "drinks". WTF database categorization?!
Learn how to use Intel ARK. And grow up.
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#17
Mats
bencrutz, post: 3987198, member: 96369"
because in the past they don't have many chips with broken iGPU part, i guess now they have plethora defective iGPU chips :roll:
Yeah, I bet the difference this time is the overall shortage of Intel CPU's (although maybe not anymore), combined with the fact that they don't have anything new coming up right now. (AFAIK)

Maybe a desperate move, but I guess they don't have much to lose from doing it.. :D
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#18
delshay
I wonder who did the delidding. Delidding a soldered processor is no easy feat for most users.
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#19
gdallsk
delshay, post: 3987376, member: 171810"
I wonder who did the delidding. Delidding a soldered processor is no easy feat for most users.
The soldered coffee lakes are quite easy to delid, as the solder is somewhat brittle.
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#20
Chloe Price
Didn't come as a surprise since IIRC they said that only the K ones would be soldered.
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#21
newtekie1
Semi-Retired Folder
bajs11, post: 3987197, member: 171095"
I wonder why they haven't done that in the past considering 99.9% of the pc gamers dont really use igpu
They have done it in the past, they just called them Xeons...
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#22
EarthDog
Tomorrow's news.... the sun will come up in the east. :p
Posted on Reply
#23
bajs11
TheinsanegamerN, post: 3987322, member: 127292"
Because it would cost them more to create a special die for GAMERZ that cant accept that the iGPU does not impact their CPU's performance.

So they just disabled it and sell it to fools with more money then brain cells who think the lack of iGPU will give them L33T OC Skillz. Intel was never going to make a separate die for this, that would be a laughable waste of money. Such a die has long existed in the HDET world, and GAMERZ never bought them, because said customers are just cheapskates that want to pay less for the same thing and think intel should spend millions to make that happen.
first time I heard there are "gamerz" who actually believe that cpus with igpu would give less fps...
but then again i know there are ppl who believe that only a i9 9900k is able to give smooth frame rates in modern games
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#24
Andrew LB
TheinsanegamerN, post: 3987322, member: 127292"
Because it would cost them more to create a special die for GAMERZ that cant accept that the iGPU does not impact their CPU's performance.

So they just disabled it and sell it to fools with more money then brain cells who think the lack of iGPU will give them L33T OC Skillz. Intel was never going to make a separate die for this, that would be a laughable waste of money. Such a die has long existed in the HDET world, and GAMERZ never bought them, because said customers are just cheapskates that want to pay less for the same thing and think intel should spend millions to make that happen.
I love arrogant people like yourself who make grand assumptions (albeit logical ones) in order to make themselves feel smarter than everyone else. But what i like even more is their reaction when someone proves them to not know what they were talking about. Most of the time such evidence is met with a doubling down and defensive posture. Its rare to find someone who admits their mistake and learns a bit from it. So lets see how you roll after reading this?

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-9900kf-vs-9900k-overclock-comparison,6038.html
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