Monday, July 10th 2023

Intel Core i7-14700K has an 8P+12E Core Configuration

The upcoming Core i7-14700K "Raptor Lake Refresh" processor has a core configuration of 8P+12E. That's 8 "Raptor Cove" performance cores, and 12 "Gracemont" efficiency cores spread across 3 E-core clusters. Compared to the i7-13700K, which has been carved out of the "Raptor Lake-S" silicon by disabling 2 out of the 4 available E-core clusters and reducing the L3 cache size to 30 MB from the 36 MB present; the i7-14700K gets an additional E-core cluster, and increases the shared L3 cache size to 33 MB, besides dialing up the clock speeds on both the P-cores and E-cores in comparison to the i7-13700K.

The processor likely has a P-core base frequency of 3.70 GHz, with a 5.50 GHz P-core maximum boost. In comparison, the i7-13700K tops out at 5.40 GHz P-core boost. An alleged i7-14700K engineering sample in the wild has been put through Cinebench R23, where it scores 2192 points in the single-threaded test, and 36296 points in the multi-threaded test. The processor also scored 14988.5 points in the CPU-Z Bench multi-threaded test. Intel is expected to release its 14th Gen Core "Raptor Lake Refresh" desktop processors some time in October 2023.
Sources: harukaze5719 (Twitter), wxnod (Twitter), VideoCardz
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181 Comments on Intel Core i7-14700K has an 8P+12E Core Configuration

#26
Tomgang
bugYou may want to take another look at that math ;)
Hey don't bug me...:p

But you are right. Has been corrected.
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#27
Darmok N Jalad
I get the feeling it's going to be like Comet Lake--same node, higher clocks, even higher power consumption than previous gen. Any improvement they made in the process is going to go into more clocks rather than less power consumption.
Posted on Reply
#28
Tomgang
Darmok N JaladI get the feeling it's going to be like Comet Lake--same node, higher clocks, even higher power consumption than previous gen. Any improvement they made in the process is going to go into more clocks rather than less power consumption.
You are not alone about that taught.

It's really seems like 14nm++++++++++ all over again. Now just with 10nm++++++
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#29
dyonoctis
DavenI don’t own a lot of CPUs but I can read benchmarks so I can buy the best CPU. And the benchmarks say that AMD’s 16 Zen 4 cores perform like Intel P-cores but sip energy closer to Intel E-cores. That’s why Intel’s solution just doesn’t work. I'd rather have 16 fully functional cores than 8 with a bunch of disabled versions and a complex thread scheduler especially if the overall performance is the same but the power is much lower.
Intel solution do work with their current architecture. You want to see how a 16 P-core at PL1 200w PL2 240w perform versus the 13900k (PL1 125w PL2 253w) ? Well it's losing, and it's not even much more efficient when it lose. They are only a match for zen3 at stocks settings...wich was supposed to be the competition, But you know, intel fabs bla bla.... :D
and for RPL, keep in mind that Intel Foundries yet again forced intel to stretch a fab process/architecture beyond it's original scope.

Intel problem is that they keep designing their architecture around a fab process that never get there on time. Rocket lake ? That was never meant to be on 14nm. Sapphire Rapids ? That was supposed to be a 2021 launch. Raptor lake ? It only exist because Meteor lake wasn't going as planned, 10nm wasn't supposed to compete against TSMC 5nm.
Originally, Intel planned to release Meteor Lake as a successor to Alder Lake, but when timelines for Meteor Lake stretched out, Intel decided to create Raptor Lake, a design that required minimal resources to create, but could deliver compelling performance gains over Alder Lake. Meteor Lake should have been Intel's 13th Generation series of Core processors, now 13th Gen is Raptor Lake
Intel confirms that Raptor Lake was not originally part of their CPU roadmap | OC3D News (overclock3d.net)

Meanwhile AMD got the luxury of designing a chip around a precise Fab calendar. They never had to backport, or create a stop gap zen 3.5.

Posted on Reply
#30
R0H1T
dyonoctisMeanwhile AMD got the luxury of designing a chip around a precise Fab calendar
What do you mean precise? What's the cadence of TSMC's latest nodes, since when have they been following this "precise" calendar? By the same token do you not attribute Intel's success in the last decade or so only down to their fabs? At one point AMD was 2.5 nodes behind Intel, and at least 1-1.5 node behind for 10+ years :rolleyes:
Posted on Reply
#31
bug
Darmok N JaladI get the feeling it's going to be like Comet Lake--same node, higher clocks, even higher power consumption than previous gen. Any improvement they made in the process is going to go into more clocks rather than less power consumption.
Fine by me, I can always constrain TDP from the BIOS. Already doing it to my 12600k ;)
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#32
Daven
TheinsanegamerNThis is a red herring argument. Nothing you have listed is run on a DIY desktop, nor does what these services run on have ANYTHING to do with "unsuspecting DIY PC enthusiast community misses the real winners: ARM SoCS and GPU accelerators"

So, how are "unsuspecting DIY PC enthusiast community misses the real winners: ARM SoCS and GPU accelerators"?

Again, how are "unsuspecting DIY PC enthusiast community misses the real winners: ARM SoCS and GPU accelerators"? Sure sounds to me like they are benefiting from them just fine.
Oh i also forgot all the telecom and networking equipment in your home and elsewhere that uses ARM and Nvidia technologies.

But the biggest effect on us DIYers is the huge loss of income that prevented Intel from improving its node manufacturing and CPU technologies. Thankfully AMD minimized this loss to some extent by actually competing against ARM and Nvidia. Intel just sat there for the longest time causing windows app performance stagnation.
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#33
phanbuey
ram latency looks promising if thats with stock ram probably 7200 sticks judging by the aida scores... core VID at 5.5ghz looks less promising. Was hoping for lower power and temps due to powervia, maybe that will still be achieved.
Posted on Reply
#34
Dan.G
Seems decent enough. Looks like a more "afordable" Core i9. Still waiting for a decent desktop APU with DDR5.
Would also like to see an nVidia iGPU (similar to what i7-8705G offered). :eek:
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#35
Unregistered
Why they are stuck at 8 cores? Something with 10 cores could give them the edge over AMD in gaming.
#36
Pepamami
P4-630Says the guy who doesn't even own a 12/13 gen Intel CPU.....
I have 12700k on PC for some werk (since P-cores perform on some tasks better than my older 5900X), I think 4 E cores is more than enough no maintain Windows and other "background garbage", since E core does not have good power efficiency, and u need them mainly to offload "garbage" from glorious P cores. I would like to see more bipPP cores on Intel CPU, than scammy E-cores.
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#37
phanbuey
Xex360Why they are stuck at 8 cores? Something with 10 cores could give them the edge over AMD in gaming.
They already designed the chip and it's stuck on 8. The meteor lake for laptops is ready to go, but on the desktop side there was some issue that made it a nonsensical product, so they took the old 8 core design and tweaked it a bit.

10 cores would be amazing, more cache or a few gigs of HBM would be amazing too...
Posted on Reply
#38
R0H1T
Xex360Why they are stuck at 8 cores? Something with 10 cores could give them the edge over AMD in gaming.
It wouldn't, AMD would just release probably a 4c/5c Zen chip with 24-32 cores & obliterate them!
Posted on Reply
#39
phanbuey
R0H1TIt wouldn't, AMD would just release probably a 4c/5c Zen chip with 24-32 cores & obliterate them!
right with their thread scheduler the way it is... 7950x3d but with e cores. w00f. Better make sure that game bar is ready for that.
Posted on Reply
#40
R0H1T
No I meant just the (lite?)c cores, more cores doesn't help gaming in particular but does help with MT tasks. More cache helps & even there AMD is way ahead, for now at least.

If Intel's fighting the core wars they lose, if they're fighting with cache they'll probably still lose.
Posted on Reply
#41
phanbuey
R0H1TNo I meant just the (lite?)c cores, more cores doesn't help gaming in particular but does help with MT tasks. More cache helps & even there AMD is way ahead, for now at least.

If Intel's fighting the core wars they lose, if they're fighting with cache they'll probably still lose.
They're 2 nodes behind so the fact they're even remotely competitive is a small miracle. It's forcing their design teams to get creative which I kind of like.

I used to be a huge AMD fan in the early zen days but since Zen 3 i feel like they're changing roles.
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#43
Daven
phanbueyright with their thread scheduler the way it is... 7950x3d but with e cores. w00f. Better make sure that game bar is ready for that.
I’m not a big fan of any heterogeneous computing products. At least on the desktop, we should have tons of P-cores only with equal access to cache.

Intel quad and six P-core products without E-cores as well as the 7800X3D and the other non 3D-cache Zen 4 chips avoid heterogeneous computing (although there is some problems with identical AMD chiplets clocking consistently).
Posted on Reply
#45
P4-630
sethmatrix7Hope you're enjoying 720p lmao
i7 12700K beats the 5800x3d at all resolutions...
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#46
Why_Me
Xex360Why they are stuck at 8 cores? Something with 10 cores could give them the edge over AMD in gaming.
The 7800X3D out performs the 7900X3D in gaming.
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#47
dyonoctis
R0H1TWhat do you mean precise? What's the cadence of TSMC's latest nodes, since when have they been following this "precise" calendar? By the same token do you not attribute Intel's success in the last decade or so only down to their fabs? At one point AMD was 2.5 nodes behind Intel, and at least 1-1.5 node behind for 10+ years :rolleyes:
Since Global Foundries gave up on bleeding edge, which also coincide with zen really taking the fight to Intel with zen 2 :D. AMD Desktop roadmap have been more reliable than Intel's. Zen 2 had what ? a one month delay ? That's insanely better than intel's 2 years delay (or outright cancelation).

What I was trying to say, is that AMD doesn't give optimistic roadmaps. 3 years ago, AMD said that zen 4 was going to be a 5nm product scheduled to launch in 2022. And that's exactly what happened. In 2018 they said that Vermeer was coming in 2020, on a matured process. That's exactly what happened. To me it sounds like that AMD/TSMC actually know where they are going, and have an efficient communication channel.




Now I never denied that Intel enjoyed a node advantage in the past. But they don't anymore, their fabs are actually a liability, but they keep on giving optimistic roadmaps that they cannot fulfil, and resort to a lot of stop gap, or emergency release. Rocket lake was replaced in less than a year and forced onto a node that it was never meant to be used on. Meteor lake was two year late, and was ultimately cancelled for the desktop. And now there's rumors that Intel finally yield, and Arrow lake will be a TSMC CPU at 100%, because Intel finally decided to be cautious, an rely on TSMC much higher fabs reliability. Intel 20A isn't doing so hot apparently. Intel new goal to take the leadership back is 18A :rolleyes:
Posted on Reply
#48
Why_Me
sethmatrix7Hope you're enjoying 720p lmao
You don't understand why they test at that resolution do you? Not surprised.
Posted on Reply
#49
phanbuey
DavenI’m not a big fan of any heterogeneous computing products. At least on the desktop, we should have tons of P-cores only with equal access to cache.

Intel quad and six P-core products without E-cores as well as the 7800X3D and the other non 3D-cache Zen 4 chips avoid heterogeneous computing (although there is some problems with identical AMD chiplets clocking consistently).
I think that a general 'jack of all trades' core will always lose badly to a set of specialized cores when it comes to power and performance. If the communication and scheduling technical hurdles can be overcome (which are easier to overcome than designing a god-core) , and it's backwards compatible, then i think heterogeneous computing is the next step in squeezing out more performance as we run out of manufacturing density.

Intel being in the top 20% of charts, and even contesting the performance lead in some cases, while being 2 nodes behind is a bit of proof in itself. If zen 4 had to be manufactured on 10NM+++++ i think the benefits of the mixed design would be much more obvious. Apple M2 is another example...
dyonoctisWhat I was trying to say, is that AMD doesn't give optimistic roadmaps. 3 years ago, AMD said that zen 4 was going to be a 5nm product scheduled to launch in 2022. And that's exactly what happened. In 2018 they said that Vermeer was coming in 2020, on a matured process. That's exactly what happened. To me it sounds like that AMD/TSMC actually know where they are going, and have an efficient communication channel.
^ in the real world -- specialized companies vs general purpose company :P.
Posted on Reply
#50
R0H1T
dyonoctisWhat I was trying to say, is that AMD doesn't give optimistic roadmaps. 3 years ago, AMD said that zen 4 was going to be a 5nm product scheduled to launch in 2022. And that's exactly what happened. In 2018 they said that Vermeer was coming in 2020, on a matured process. That's exactly what happened. To me it sounds like that AMD/TSMC actually know where they are going, and have an efficient communication channel.
I'd give slightly, or a lot more, credit to Apple ~ they're really the driving force behind TSMC's node leadership! They're basically funding the bleeding edge almost all by themselves.
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