Dr. DroThe RTX 4090 (excluding 4090 D) has likely outsold the entire RDNA 3 stack plus RTX 4070 Ti and RTX 4080 combined. I wish I was making it up, but I was fortunate enough to see the GPU-Z numbers. It's crazy skewed towards Nvidia.

None of what you say matters, AMD made 14 billion. That is not change. So that means your feelings do not effect the truth of the situation.

kapone32None of what you say matters, AMD made 14 billion. That is not change. So that means your feelings do not effect the truth of the situation.

I didn't bring my feelings into this? And if I may ask, 14 billion of what? Anyway, of course, if the business wasn't viable, they would fold and seek more profitable business ventures.

Dr. DroIt's crazy skewed towards Nvidia.

We know Nivida has the vast majority of the market share, I don't know why you said this as if it was supposed to be shocking or surprising.

Vya DomusWe know Nivida has the vast majority of the market share, I don't know why you said this as if it was supposed to be shocking or surprising.

Because of the sheer scale. The 4090 outsells practically anything and everything at every other segment and then some, even at its prices.

Dr. DroBecause of the sheer scale. The 4090 outsells practically anything and everything at every other segment and then some, even at its prices.

This is the same "record gaming sales" thing from the mining craze. How many of those do you think are bought by gamers and how many do you think are in some chinese server farm ?

Ignore AMD, you do not seriously believe more gamers have bought 4090s than 4070tis come on dude.

Dr. DroI didn't bring my feelings into this? And if I may ask, 14 billion of what? Anyway, of course, if the business wasn't viable, they would fold and seek more profitable business ventures.

When you say the things you say they come across as hyperbolic. That was revenue for the 3rd quarter

AusWolf2. Not everyone plays in 4K. Up to 1440p, 12 GB is still fine, in my opinion. How fine it will be in the near future when the PS5 Pro is out and new games get developed for it, we'll see.

That goes out the window with RT enabled. The 4060 Ti 8GB chokes to death on RT at 1440p. 1440p and RTing future proofness will demand 16GB. 12GB will be needed for AAA 1080p games with RT.

Dr. DroBecause of the sheer scale. The 4090 outsells practically anything and everything at every other segment and then some, even at its prices.

How long is it going to take to realise that sales numbers don't matter?

If I run a burger joint with 3 employees, and we sell 1,000 burgers a week with a $4 profit on each one, that's $4,000 profit per week. Divided equally, that's $1,000 per person per week. Is it anywhere near the profit McDonald's makes around the world? Definitely not. But it's more than enough for me and my 3 employees to make a comfortable living. Heck, it's way more money than what a McDonald's employee makes!

TLDR: AMD is a much smaller company than Nvidia, with much smaller expenses, so they have to sell a lot less to stay afloat.

AusWolfAMD is a much smaller company than Nvidia

6.28X between market caps Nvidia/AMD @9 February.

TumbleGeorge6.28X between market caps Nvidia/AMD @9 February.

My point stands: it doesn't matter as much as some people think it does.

AusWolfMy point stands: it doesn't matter as much as some people think it does.

Agree with you.

AusWolfHow long is it going to take to realise that sales numbers don't matter?

If I run a burger joint with 3 employees, and we sell 1,000 burgers a week with a $4 profit on each one, that's $4,000 profit per week. Divided equally, that's $1,000 per person per week. Is it anywhere near the profit McDonald's makes around the world? Definitely not. But it's more than enough for me and my 3 employees to make a comfortable living. Heck, it's way more money than what a McDonald's employee makes!

TLDR: AMD is a much smaller company than Nvidia, with much smaller expenses, so they have to sell a lot less to stay afloat.

Don't think this is the correct way of looking at this, not because I don't agree with you here but because to Nvidia, GPUs are their primary business, while to AMD, it's one of their departments, the company's primary focus is and has always been CPUs.

Dr. DroDon't think this is the correct way of looking at this, not because I don't agree with you here but because to Nvidia, GPUs are their primary business, while to AMD, it's one of their departments, the company's primary focus is and has always been CPUs.

But then it would still hold water, except in a slightly different way: AMD even diversifies so has even less need for volume in that one market/branch. Perhaps the right analogy there would be that the profit in the burger joint is SO good, all employees can work 8 hours less and invest those in a second job where they learn to make the best burgers on the planet.

Since AMD has CPU and GPU - and also custom silicon! - they get huge synergy advantages, reducing the need for their GPU division / R&D to turn a direct profit even further.
And then we look at the real market and we see how AMD's discrete graphics strategy aligns perfectly with that and what we see in their pricing strategy. They're not trying to undercut Nvidia hard to gain volume in sales. They're past that, because they know it won't work, and they've already chosen a different strategy. Synergistic advantages between branches, extracting value by volume on consoles, a push into enterprise/server with CPU.

And eventually, in some not-so-distant future where the CPU gets more parallelism and starts looking more like a GPU (already happening with the increasing core count and E-cores on MSDT, in a way), they have a well tried and tested chiplet technology to mix and match all these aspects however they want. This is also why the chiplet GPU is such a thing and why RDNA3 is a success. It further entrenches AMD in the forefront of chip technology. They're leading in packaging/chiplet experience right now, and its already paying off just by their CPU product advantages alone, but the real payoff is in its synergy with other developments.

Vayra86Since AMD has CPU and GPU - and also custom silicon! - they get huge synergy advantages, reducing the need for their GPU division / R&D to turn a direct profit even further.

That's a direct contradiction to your follower opinion that they don't even try to compete by aligning the corresponding products according to the real value, not by the wishful thinking how much profit margins they would like to extract, and to scalp us all.
Keep in mind that these scalper prices deny many people from the desire to obtain those products.
And it will get only worse - mainly for the consumers like us, because AMD ill find a way to sell directly to the government... :rolleyes:

Vayra86And then we look at the real market and we see how AMD's discrete graphics strategy aligns perfectly with that and what we see in their pricing strategy.

AMD has no pricing strategy. It simply looks at what Nvidia has already done and price in a mirror way - hence there is no competition.

Vayra86They're not trying to undercut Nvidia hard to gain volume in sales. They're past that, because they know it won't work

It has worked. Remember that AMD has had market share over 40%. Now it's 3 or 4 times less!

Vayra86RDNA3 is a success

What about it do you think is a "success"?
If you take a look at the Steam hardware survey, you will see a single RDNA 3 offering there and it's the most unexpected - AMD's fastest RX 7900 XTX with 0.34%.



AMD has a chance to compete, to clinch the much needed market share if it embraces the new TSMC 3nm process which a good full-node optical shrink, not like the previous joke 5nm that is a half-node shrink to 7nm... :rolleyes:

3valatzyThat's a direct contradiction to your follower opinion that they don't even try to compete by aligning the corresponding products according to the real value, not by the wishful thinking how much profit margins they would like to extract, and to scalp us all.
Keep in mind that these scalper prices deny many people from the desire to obtain those products.
And it will get only worse - mainly for the consumers like us, because AMD ill find a way to sell directly to the government... :rolleyes:



AMD has no pricing strategy. It simply looks at what Nvidia has already done and price in a mirror way - hence there is no competition.



It has worked. Remember that AMD has had market share over 40%. Now it's 3 or 4 times less!



What about it do you think is a "success"?
If you take a look at the Steam hardware survey, you will see a single RDNA 3 offering there and it's the most unexpected - AMD's fastest RX 7900 XTX with 0.34%.



AMD has a chance to compete, to clinch the much needed market share if it embraces the new TSMC 3nm process which a good full-node optical shrink, not like the previous joke 5nm that is a half-node shrink to 7nm... :rolleyes:

One strategy does not exclude the other, but I think its pretty clear where the focus is for AMD. I'm not saying they execute their pricing strategy on RDNA well - but hey, that's what we know AMD for.

Would they have sold more if they dropped prices earlier, of course. But it would not have changed the dynamic, I think.

Dr. DroDon't think this is the correct way of looking at this, not because I don't agree with you here but because to Nvidia, GPUs are their primary business, while to AMD, it's one of their departments, the company's primary focus is and has always been CPUs.

That's even more reason not to draw any conclusion from sales numbers alone.

Vayra86I think its pretty clear where the focus is for AMD.

AI - I don't use.
Instincts - I don't use.
Consoles - I don't use.
EPYCs, Threadrippers and Ryzens - CPUs in general can be upgraded much less often, so don't care about them too.
Graphics cards - the most important PC hardware component and we are unfortunate to see AMD who don't give enough efforts to offer good enough products, hence the market reaction - trend of ever declining market presence.

3valatzyAMD has a chance to compete, to clinch the much needed market share if it embraces the new TSMC 3nm process which a good full-node optical shrink, not like the previous joke 5nm that is a half-node shrink to 7nm... :rolleyes:

It's unfortunate that I cannot edit my comment. Just one correction - the 5nm process node is not a half-node optical shrink.

The Ti super should be this price and that's for an insanely overpriced asus strix model

Vayra86This is also why the chiplet GPU is such a thing and why RDNA3 is a success.

Not showing up in discrete graphics card marketshare.

And AMD has all abandoned discrete GPU sales for notebook PCs.

But I'm sure RDNA3 will be great in the Sony Playstation 6.

3valatzyThat's a direct contradiction to your follower opinion that they don't even try to compete by aligning the corresponding products according to the real value, not by the wishful thinking how much profit margins they would like to extract, and to scalp us all.
Keep in mind that these scalper prices deny many people from the desire to obtain those products.
And it will get only worse - mainly for the consumers like us, because AMD ill find a way to sell directly to the government... :rolleyes:



AMD has no pricing strategy. It simply looks at what Nvidia has already done and price in a mirror way - hence there is no competition.



It has worked. Remember that AMD has had market share over 40%. Now it's 3 or 4 times less!



What about it do you think is a "success"?
If you take a look at the Steam hardware survey, you will see a single RDNA 3 offering there and it's the most unexpected - AMD's fastest RX 7900 XTX with 0.34%.



AMD has a chance to compete, to clinch the much needed market share if it embraces the new TSMC 3nm process which a good full-node optical shrink, not like the previous joke 5nm that is a half-node shrink to 7nm... :rolleyes:

Since when has the Steam Hardware become factual data? I have 5 PCs at home and do you know what Steam lists in my hardware? My 3060 laptop. If AMD was doing as bad as people are saying the 6700Xt would not be the best selling GPU in Canada. There is also the fact that the Steam Deck is outselling E sports Games (that cost nothing to install) speaks volumes as well.

kapone32Since when has the Steam Hardware become factual data? I have 5 PCs at home and do you know what Steam lists in my hardware? My 3060 laptop. If AMD was doing as bad as people are saying the 6700Xt would not be the best selling GPU in Canada. There is also the fact that the Steam Deck is outselling E sports Games (that cost nothing to install) speaks volumes as well.

Canada is easily the country where AMD has the most market share outside of Europe, simply because ATI is primarily Canadian and it's been pretty much the go to Canuck GPU. But Steam's hardware survey has always been some of the most accurate measurements of GPU market share, even though it's actually a little skewed towards AMD because Valve's very much Linux friendly and... Nvidia isn't.

Dr. DroCanada is easily the country where AMD has the most market share outside of Europe, simply because ATI is primarily Canadian and it's been pretty much the go to Canuck GPU. But Steam's hardware survey has always been some of the most accurate measurements of GPU market share, even though it's actually a little skewed towards AMD because Valve's very much Linux friendly and... Nvidia isn't.

There is also the fact that you can you can build an entire high end AM5 PC for the price of the 4090 in Canada. Then when you look at the 4070TI and see 12GB of VRAM you are whelmed. That is the exact same buffer as the 6700XT (In terms of capacity). Those facts have more impact than perceived patriotic brand loyalty. You obviously don't understand how Steam Hardware survey works if you think that is always (or stills is) accurate. Just doing anecdotal data on Newegg. There are way more user reviews for the 7900XT than the 4070TI.