Thursday, December 6th 2018

Microsoft's Edge Browser Confirmed Dead; Long Live Microsoft Edge

So, it goes like this: Microsoft has confirmed they will be killing of their own-developed Edge browser in favor of a Chromium-based alternative. However... The new browser will retain Microsoft's Edge nomenclature, instead of parting ways with the (likely damaged) branding. Microsoft is committing to the open-based Chromium backbone, and will be building upon its database to contribute towards a more open Internet.

The idea is to deliver more frequent updates - and of course, reducing the engineering and coding efforts to keep an in-house browser up to date and secure from all manner of Internet threats. And this will likely be achieved; whether Microsoft's efforts will bring it a higher market share than the current 4%, though, is anyone's guess. It seems to be a usual Microsoft dilemma in that the first search on its browsers is for another web browser... And it might remain especially so without a branding change. Living in Chrome just sounds better than living on Edge.
Sources: Microsoft Blogs, Image via TechCrunch
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102 Comments on Microsoft's Edge Browser Confirmed Dead; Long Live Microsoft Edge

#76
R-T-B
R0H1T, post: 3956453, member: 131092"
Alright I have to ask, what's the historical context (if any) in adding "long live" in sentences such as the title above? Sorry if it's "too" off topic :ohwell:
In British and other monarchies, it was often customary to say when the king died:

"The king is dead: Long live the king!"

Typically this rite was performed when crowning a new king.
Posted on Reply
#77
Steevo
Ms, instead of indexing and sharing a good search function for the internet and your PC we are going to force you to use Edge to dl another browser, and Cortana will run in the background as a useless search assistant that takes significantly longer than searching the whole internet with less plausible results.
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#78
Easo
While the Chromium is not the "next shiny thing", I do remember Nadella, uhh, regretting chasing them (it was interview this.. November, I think) and leaving consumers behind when dropping those shiny things for another one, read, mostly Windows Phone, but Zune, Band and so on can be added to the list. This seems like another MS chasing the quick (quicker?) cash, instead of long term planning.
P.S.
Oh, as there was some discussion about Application Guard (and yes, it is a step further than sandbox, but, details), I wonder how much work MS will have to do after this change to make it work... Knowing Windows there probably is some stupid integration deep in OS tied to the current rendering engine (actually, there was one, IIRC UWP apps will die without Edge and some stuff wont render correctly, dont quote me on that). I expect issues xD
Posted on Reply
#79
Raevenlord
News Editor
Vayra86, post: 3956093, member: 152404"
You're getting pretty good at this.
Namaste :toast:
newtekie1, post: 3956094, member: 20670"
Anyone else bugged by the fact that there is an open parentheses with no closing parentheses?
Yeah, it bugged me too. Wanted you to fill in the blank with your imagination.

(corrected, thanks)

londiste, post: 3956227, member: 169790"
WITNESS ME!
Shiny and chrome...
Exactly what I was thinking on the last sentence :p

rtwjunkie, post: 3956231, member: 56774"
Okaaaay. Semantics. Fact is Raevenlord made an intentionally deceptive headline that sounds as if Edge is disappearing.

Not a direct knock on him. All the news writers on TPU are falling into the same pattern lately with every other story.
Well, the rendering engine is changing, but Edge is living on in branding and interface - which, I agree, are the most important parts of any web browser. Hence the second part of the headline. It's a turn of phrase meant to convey that while things change, they remain the same - edge is dead, but it isn't. The intention isn't to be deceptive.
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#80
StrayKAT
Easo, post: 3956532, member: 70901"
While the Chromium is not the "next shiny thing", I do remember Nadella, uhh, regretting chasing them (it was interview this.. November, I think) and leaving consumers behind when dropping those shiny things for another one, read, mostly Windows Phone, but Zune, Band and so on can be added to the list. This seems like another MS chasing the quick (quicker?) cash, instead of long term planning.
P.S.
Oh, as there was some discussion about Application Guard (and yes, it is a step further than sandbox, but, details), I wonder how much work MS will have to do after this change to make it work... Knowing Windows there probably is some stupid integration deep in OS tied to the current rendering engine (actually, there was one, IIRC UWP apps will die without Edge and some stuff wont render correctly, dont quote me on that). I expect issues xD
Windows Phone is a huge loss, but mp3 players were a fad (smartphones along with streaming sort of killed even iPods off). So while MS wasted money on Zune, it wasn't going anywhere anyhow. Not sure about Band. I don't use anything like that. But I'm happy that Fitbit has become a big name for that tech.. it's good that a smaller company somehow rose to the top (or at least, is up there with Apple atm).

As for the other stuff you said, you voiced what I was trying to say, but in a less agitated way. Thanks :D
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#81
Ferrum Master
They are releasing it first for MacOS platform actually, that's pretty reasonable to me.
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#82
newtekie1
Semi-Retired Folder
rtwjunkie, post: 3956325, member: 56774"
I just checked Avant, which I have installed but not opened in a couple years. It was always a great alternative to IE, and built on IE engine.

Not anymore. It’s using the Chrome rendering engine, and still looking and acting exactly like Avant used to.
I used to be a long time Avant user, like I used it since the early 2000s. It used to default to use the IE engine, but it had all 3 rendering engines that you could use, which is what I liked. Back when I was doing websites, this was nice, because I could have one browser that I could use to test the three major rendering engines in. I want to say maybe 2 or 3 years ago they defaulted to using the Chrome engine by default, but the other engines are still there, and you can set it to use any of them by default when you open Avant.

The problem I had with Avant, and what finally made me stop using it, was the developer(which I think was only one or two people) could not keep a regular enough update schedule. And Google, for security, made it so that the Chromium rendering engine would "expire" after 6 months. This meant that Avant would start to not work properly if you used the Chromium engine, things like printing would stop working when using the Chromium rendering engine. Plus, it was annoying knowing that the version of Chromium you were using in Avant was sometimes 6 months old with now security updates. I'm sure this won't be an issue with Edge, since Microsoft has a much better development team(because they have the money for it), that can push out Chromium updates to users automatically with Windows updares, and regularly to keep it up to date.

There are some things I still miss from Avant, but I've transitioned to using actual Chrome as my main browser now.
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#85
FordGT90Concept
"I go fast!1!11!1!"
TheOne, post: 3956899, member: 83206"
Mozilla isn't happy.

https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2018/12/06/goodbye-edge/
I might have to give up on Internet Explore/Edge and go Mozilla for the reason cited.

I'm extremely disappointed in Microsoft. Edge has only been around for four years and it managed to get and hold 4%+ market share while up against the 66%+ dominance of Chrome, is pretty damn good.
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#86
RealNeil
Raevenlord, post: 3956087, member: 166527"
It seems to be a usual Microsoft dilemma in that the first search on its browsers is for another web browser... And it might remain especially so
^^This^^

I have an install of Ninite.com programs on a flash drive and I never even use Edge.
Posted on Reply
#87
Ravenas
Still find it hard to believe Bing can capture 33% of market share, but Edge can only capture 4%? You're telling me Chrome has 70% market share, and 29% of Chrome users change their default search engine to Bing... On a Google based browser? Lol...
Posted on Reply
#88
FordGT90Concept
"I go fast!1!11!1!"
Bing and Yahoo are one in the same and a lot of people use Yahoo yet.

There's also a lot of problems with determining browser market share. Namely, not every browser hits a single webpage on the internet and even if it does, it can be different users and many hits a day. I'm not really sure market share has anything to do with the decision any way: Microsoft is likely looking at cost/revenue and sees Edge as a pointless business venture.
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#89
R0H1T
Ravenas, post: 3957131, member: 39482"
Still find it hard to believe Bing can capture 33% of market share, but Edge can only capture 4%? You're telling me Chrome has 70% market share, and 29% of Chrome users change their default search engine to Bing... On a Google based browser? Lol...
Actually if you count Android there's no browser close to chrome, Chrome is the market leader for a reason & even if we don't always get along with Google chrome's superior to any other browser across platforms, except Safari due to Apple's walled garden approach.

The numbers for Bing seem off, is that worldwide or just in the US?
Posted on Reply
#90
Ravenas
R0H1T, post: 3957140, member: 131092"
Actually if you count Android there's no browser close to chrome, Chrome is the market leader for a reason & even if we don't always get along with Google chrome's superior to any other browser across platforms, except Safari due to Apple's walled garden approach.

The numbers for Bing seem off, is that worldwide or just in the US?
To say Apple Safari is successful due to a walled garden approach is kind of like saying Google Maps was only successful because it was available only on Android for an extensive period of time.
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#91
StrayKAT
RealNeil, post: 3956945, member: 150651"
^^This^^

I have an install of Ninite.com programs on a flash drive and I never even use Edge.
People don't need to search anything on Edge. The minute you go to Google, you get continuous pop ups to install Chrome. First the home page, then the subsequent search pages for a few times.

It doesn't even do this for Firefox. Not sure about Safari.
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#92
rtwjunkie
PC Gaming Enthusiast
Ravenas, post: 3957131, member: 39482"
Still find it hard to believe Bing can capture 33% of market share, but Edge can only capture 4%? You're telling me Chrome has 70% market share, and 29% of Chrome users change their default search engine to Bing... On a Google based browser? Lol...
People are more particular about their browsers than search engines, I think.
Posted on Reply
#93
StrayKAT
I don't think MS is making up anything. For whatever reason, Bing is making a boatload of cash every quarter.. and that's been on record. Probably one of the few newer divisions that I won't fault Nadella for sabotaging (same with Surface and Azure). None particularly make me happy about the future of Microsoft though. They're not exactly conducive to their namesake (software). edit: In fact, they've killed off Windows division in name.. and put it in the Azure division.
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#94
R0H1T
Ravenas, post: 3957146, member: 39482"
To say Apple Safari is successful due to a walled garden approach is kind of like saying Google Maps was only successful because it was available only on Android for an extensive period of time.
Maps was a thing way before Android became the number one OS in the world, that's like saying Chrome's successful only because Google is pushing it. The difference with iOS is the rendering engine can only be webkit based, unlike Android or Windows.
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#95
windwhirl
Ravenas, post: 3957131, member: 39482"
Still find it hard to believe Bing can capture 33% of market share, but Edge can only capture 4%? You're telling me Chrome has 70% market share, and 29% of Chrome users change their default search engine to Bing... On a Google based browser? Lol...
Well, Bing at least gives you a nice picture to look at before you actually search for something, maybe that's why :laugh:

Though, that 33% market share is probably US only. Worldwide is much lower, ranging from 2 to 5%.
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#96
StrayKAT
windwhirl, post: 3957248, member: 175818"
Well, Bing at least gives you a nice picture to look at before you actually search for something, maybe that's why :laugh:

Though, that 33% market share is probably US only. Worldwide is much lower, ranging from 2 to 5%.
I think it may be coming from the Yahoo partnership. Alexa would tell you that Yahoo is still one of the top 10 sites in just about every country. Maybe people are searching through there. "Live.com" is also one of the top sites, but that's the domain for Office/Onedrive/Outlook servers. Not sure about Bing.

edit: Yeah, Bing.com is separate. And worldwide, it ranks 47. In the US, it's 26.

Strangely, I was perusing a BSD Unix forum not long ago, and a poster there was referencing Bing in his searches that he was posting. It stuck with me.. since it was the most unlikely place (I thought) to see a bing fan. But then again, a lot of Open Source people know that Google is the actual enemy. There's nothing more depressing than seeing the Internet get owned and "standardized" by a damn Ad company.
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#97
lexluthermiester
Raevenlord, post: 3956087, member: 166527"
Microsoft's Edge Browser Confirmed Dead; Long Live Microsoft Edge
Should read;
Microsoft's Edge Browser Confirmed Dead; Long Live Microsoft Chrome
Would make more sense.

StrayKAT, post: 3956331, member: 174092"
Why would you want to lose control over things that are on the OS level like this?
Simple answer, because you don't/can't trust the base OS/Browser.

Caring1, post: 3956369, member: 153156"
Why fix what isn't broken, unless the transition is due to cost cutting.
It is broken. They keep having problems with vulnerabilities and no one wants to trust it because it's not open source and doesn't have anywhere near the plugin/extension support Chrome does.
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#98
Ravenas
windwhirl, post: 3957248, member: 175818"
Well, Bing at least gives you a nice picture to look at before you actually search for something, maybe that's why :laugh:

Though, that 33% market share is probably US only. Worldwide is much lower, ranging from 2 to 5%.
I use Bing as my default search engine. Then again, I also use Edge and Safari exclusively. I really don’t mind the change Microsoft is making. However I do think the Microsoft needs to stand their ground on 1st party software and hardware going forward.

Dropping the mobile phone hardware segment was the catalyst for the end of IE/Edge.

R0H1T, post: 3957191, member: 131092"
Maps was a thing way before Android became the number one OS in the world, that's like saying Chrome's successful only because Google is pushing it. The difference with iOS is the rendering engine can only be webkit based, unlike Android or Windows.
You stated an app is only successful because it’s exclusive to an OS and defaulted as a browser. The same was true for Google maps for a period of time. Too much green, yellow, and red in your vision.
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#99
Alexandrus
In part, that is too bad, Edge has some advantages over Chrome, ironically, most of them are most visible on Google sites such as GMail, especially the new interface which loads faster on Edge and has WAY less issues that it does in Chrome.
Plus, diversity is a good thing.
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