Chrispy_130% of MSRP is still nowhere near 50% of MSRP

Very true, and the wording of this article is really bad, but

Chrispy_and only a few years ago anything more than 100% of MSRP was considered a scam or a rip-off.

this is ... questionable. MSRP has been a "baseline SKUs only" thing for GPUs for quite a while now. But then again, that used to mean a $30-100 premium on your $200-500 GPU, not a fancy SKU of a lower-midrange GPU with an already stupidly high $379 MSRP selling for $600.

Valantarthis is ... questionable. MSRP has been a "baseline SKUs only" thing for GPUs for quite a while now. But then again, that used to mean a $30-100 premium on your $200-500 GPU, not a fancy SKU of a lower-midrange GPU with an already stupidly high $379 MSRP selling for $600.

The MSRP applies to the product in question. Nvidia sets the MSRP of base models using the reference design as well as the FE models with binned silicon and Nvidia's own cooler design.

If a manufacturer makes a higher-quality card with more expensive components, then it's valid for them to set a new MSRP for that specific model. Should a specific model have a ridiculous MSRP that offers minimal performance or QoL benefit for the extra money, then it's up to the market to reject that MSRP and vote with their wallets.

I am thankful to NVIDIA, they helped me to understand that even the GTX 1060 6GB (of 2016), this is not a dead horse in relation with my REAL gaming needs at 2022.
This is a connection lost for several years now, Rich people buying habits VS reasonable spending habits.

Yesterday a close friend of my, a Dad of three kids, he got an 3050 few months back, now the PC is dead, needs a New PSU, and he cannot afford it.
Food on the table ? or a new PSU ? (150 Euro)
The first priority now this Wins.

Chrispy_The MSRP applies to the product in question. Nvidia sets the MSRP of base models using the reference design as well as the FE models with binned silicon and Nvidia's own cooler design.

If a manufacturer makes a higher-quality card with more expensive components, then it's valid for them to set a new MSRP for that specific model. Should a specific model have a ridiculous MSRP that offers minimal performance or QoL benefit for the extra money, then it's up to the market to reject that MSRP and vote with their wallets.

Looking past the fact that "voting with your wallets" is pretty much nonsense, you're somewhat right, but in the current market that logic just doesn't apply. Profit-focused OEMs focus on producing higher end SKUs, which pushes the real-world pricing of any GPU up, regardless of base model MSRP. When all you can get is a higher end SKU, that's the baseline price for that product, even if there theoretically exist lower end ones. And OEMs are massively exploiting the supply crunch by making their high-end SKUs ever more ridiculous and charging customers to match. But still, the statement that "a few years ago anything more than 100% of MSRP was considered a scam or a rip-off" just isn't true. Higher-than-MSRP pricing for anything but base models have been the norm for a long time. Of course we also used to see prices drop below MSRP way back when, with promotions or as time passed. Me? I'm hoping for that to come back. As well as sensible MSRPs, of course.

ValantarLooking past the fact that "voting with your wallets" is pretty much nonsense, you're somewhat right, but in the current market that logic just doesn't apply. Profit-focused OEMs focus on producing higher end SKUs, which pushes the real-world pricing of any GPU up, regardless of base model MSRP. When all you can get is a higher end SKU, that's the baseline price for that product, even if there theoretically exist lower end ones. And OEMs are massively exploiting the supply crunch by making their high-end SKUs ever more ridiculous and charging customers to match. But still, the statement that "a few years ago anything more than 100% of MSRP was considered a scam or a rip-off" just isn't true. Higher-than-MSRP pricing for anything but base models have been the norm for a long time. Of course we also used to see prices drop below MSRP way back when, with promotions or as time passed. Me? I'm hoping for that to come back. As well as sensible MSRPs, of course.

Voting via wallet is not nonsense, it just only works large scale. When and if the bulk of buyers decide that USD1500 for a 3080 (for example) is stupid, ASPs will settle somewhere else. There are absolutely confounding factors, among them manufacturers and developers pushing expectations as you said.

As an aside, eBay US selling prices for 2060s look like they might get back down to launch MSRP (USD350) in not too long, at least if current trends continue. 1080s can also be had for less than USD400 as of this post.

Hi,
Buyers market and sellers market have always confused people :laugh:
I prefer a buyers market but miners and scalpers have gotten in the way quite a bit over the present and past years.

80-watt HamsterVoting via wallet is not nonsense, it just only works large scale.

Which is precisely why it's nonsense, as there is literally a single example historically - the anti-apartheid movement - that has succeeded with a large-scale boycott. Other than that, companies just don't care about that blip in their sales numbers from a few angry enthusiasts.

80-watt HamsterWhen and if the bulk of buyers decide that USD1500 for a 3080 (for example) is stupid, ASPs will settle somewhere else.

Except the past two years is showing us that this doesn't seem to be the case. So, does this only work one way? Or have people been 'voting with their wallets' to keep prices up too?

80-watt HamsterThere are absolutely confounding factors, among them manufacturers and developers pushing expectations as you said.

As well as the sheer impossibility of organizing any such effort, and calling the vague shifts in large-scale markets re: affordability "voting with your wallet" is dramatically overstating the effects and predictability of such things. A vote is a direct political statement with a concrete, measureable effect. Saying that a purchase is even on the same spectrum is really problematic.

ValantarLooking past the fact that "voting with your wallets" is pretty much nonsense, you're somewhat right, but in the current market that logic just doesn't apply. Profit-focused OEMs focus on producing higher end SKUs, which pushes the real-world pricing of any GPU up, regardless of base model MSRP. When all you can get is a higher end SKU, that's the baseline price for that product, even if there theoretically exist lower end ones. And OEMs are massively exploiting the supply crunch by making their high-end SKUs ever more ridiculous and charging customers to match. But still, the statement that "a few years ago anything more than 100% of MSRP was considered a scam or a rip-off" just isn't true. Higher-than-MSRP pricing for anything but base models have been the norm for a long time. Of course we also used to see prices drop below MSRP way back when, with promotions or as time passed. Me? I'm hoping for that to come back. As well as sensible MSRPs, of course.

It has been nonsense for the last 18 months simply because demand massively outstripped supply and people paid stupid money through desperation for a GPU.

Now that availability is increasing and most models are managing to stay in stock, MSRPs are finally becoming relevant again.

Hi,
If you can get past the original price jump that is lol
Nvidia pricing was always a big pill to swallow 20 & 30 series worst of all only sold at some bestbuys in the US on 30's

Other oem's were always stupidly overpriced and predictable.

ValantarWhich is precisely why it's nonsense, as there is literally a single example historically - the anti-apartheid movement - that has succeeded with a large-scale boycott. Other than that, companies just don't care about that blip in their sales numbers from a few angry enthusiasts.

That's what I mean by large scale. The entire market needs to move.

ValantarExcept the past two years is showing us that this doesn't seem to be the case. So, does this only work one way? Or have people been 'voting with their wallets' to keep prices up too?

It is the case, just in the wrong direction.

ValantarAs well as the sheer impossibility of organizing any such effort, and calling the vague shifts in large-scale markets re: affordability "voting with your wallet" is dramatically overstating the effects and predictability of such things. A vote is a direct political statement with a concrete, measureable effect. Saying that a purchase is even on the same spectrum is really problematic.

We clearly parse the phrase "vote with your wallet" differently here. I'm using it colloquially more-or-less as a substitute phrase for market forces, and not in a political context at all. Perhaps that was a mistake.

80-watt HamsterThat's what I mean by large scale. The entire market needs to move.

Yes. But calling that "voting with your wallet" is stretching that metaphor so thin that you've gone so far past the point of it being a useful metaphor you're about to circle back around the globe to where you started. As I said: the only movement that has ever managed such a shift consciously and with clear direction is the anti-apartheid movement. Nothing else has ever come close. And for it to be "voting", then it must be clear, unequivocal and directed political action. Otherwise it's just people doing stuff. And that's not voting, that's just life.

80-watt HamsterIt is the case, just in the wrong direction.

Which also just serves to illustrate that people pull out this metaphor when convenient, rather than actually considering what it means.

80-watt HamsterWe clearly parse the phrase "vote with your wallet" differently here. I'm using it colloquially more-or-less as a substitute phrase for market forces, and not in a political context at all. Perhaps that was a mistake.

There is literally no way in which "voting with your wallet" cannot be political. It means making a conscious and conscientous choice about your purchasing decisions in order to attain some goal or more broadly exert some form of pressure on actors in that market. That is by definition political.

That's really the problem with this phrase: it's often trotted out after the fact as a post facto explanation of why some dumb/bad thing failed (or, more rarely, some smart/good thing succeeded), but ultimately that's just lazy armchair economics that disregards the massive complexity of large-scale purchasing patterns, and instead tries to ascribe a nonexistent sense of control and rationality to huge masses of people. In other words, this use of the term is deeply reductive. And the other use, the one we see here, is mostly just hand-wavy "well, things will (hopefully) work out in the end"-type gesturing towards vaguely defined market fluctuations, but with the same ideological baggage of pretending people's purchasing decisions are simple, rational, and well informed. It's a phrase that deserves to be left behind, as it's mostly just pure fiction.

If it wasn't for the title being so misleading, one could forgive the mangling and misuse of the English language in the quest for readership and clicks if it were not Techpowerup.
Graphics Cards are at RECORD HIGH PRICES and recently they have reduced from the highs, but nowhere in the English language could this be confused with record lows.
For a starting point a record low would have to be below the recommend selling price to be an accurate statement both in English and from a marketing stance.
Please try and inject some accuracy into you article title. If we want click bait there are plenty of other choices.

80-watt HamsterWe clearly parse the phrase "vote with your wallet" differently here. I'm using it colloquially more-or-less as a substitute phrase for market forces, and not in a political context at all. Perhaps that was a mistake.

Hi,
Indeed just tapout once he finds something to harp on there's no way to explain otherwise :laugh:

Seemed like a simple term "vote with your wallet" to me but wow some people just want to argue bottom line :kookoo:

Surprised the title of this thread never got changed given the feedback.

chrcolukSurprised the title of this thread never got changed given the feedback.

Hi,
Indeed EU market is in the story but should be in the title to.

chrcolukSurprised the title of this thread never got changed given the feedback.

That the fact that it's inaccurate..

www.antonline.com/Evga/Computers/Video_Cards/Graphic_Cards/1429478
EVGA GeForce RTX 3080 Ti 12GB GDDR6X XC3 ULTRA GAMING Graphics Card $1,429.99 USD

I have a 3060 ti but I'm seriously considering a 3080 Ti @1300 pounds to have smoother 4K gaming. What is wrong with me :confused:

LifeOnMarsI have a 3060 ti but I'm seriously considering a 3080 Ti @1300 pounds to have smoother 4K gaming. What is wrong with me :confused:

You could always look at getting a 3080 12GB card. It nips at the heels of a 3080Ti and should be a little cheaper, just an idea.

LifeOnMarsWhat is wrong with me :confused:

Nothing, you're just jones-ing. We all do it from time to time. Save your money and lower some settings or play at a lower resolution if you want higher FPS. Prices are coming down and with cryptocoins getting the ban-hammer in a lot of countries, serious restrictions in many others, coupled with ROI on GPU mining tanking, GPU prices will likely fall below MSRP in the next 4 to 5 months.

I'm going to offer you the same advice I'm giving my clients/customers: Be patient, right now is a terrible time to buy a GPU.

noname00I don't want to say this is bull$hit as we all know what were the prices of graphic cards for the past few years, but I have a friend that bought his RX6800 at 670€ on launch day from an online store, no special discount or any favors.

i got my 6800 at 680euro from online store during the middle of the shitshow, while they were around 1000 otherwise. just needed to look hard enough and get some luck.

6800 XT's are $1k minimum and RTX 3080's are about $1200. Still around 80% overpriced.

Best choice for rich frame-rates, toss away the internet connection, and connect to the game server due telepathy = zero lag

Affordable? You mean when 6600 XT costs $199, right?

Record lows, huh? In what universe?