Monday, July 10th 2017

No End to GPU Supply Woes: Germany Supplier Hit by Shortage, Pulls Cards

There seems to be no end in sight for current high-performance, discrete graphics cards' supply constraints. If you've been looking for a specialized graphics processing unit to push eye-candy on your favored 3D experiences to the max, you've probably been having trouble for a while now. It all stems from a crazy, dizzying wave of cryptocurrency mining. And the fact that this mining spree has already taken global mining power consumption to levels close to a 17 million population country, as one of our editors puts it, kind of has a human problem. And it would seem that not even NVIDIA and AMD's partners' attempts to sate current miners' appetite for profit-generating graphics cards has put a dent on demand.
Now, one of Germany's most relevant retailers, MindFactory, has sent out an email to Tom's Hardware responding to inquiries relating to an apparent lack of stock on high-performance GPUs. And get this: they're expecting new stock in "at least three months". That's how long the retailer is estimating meaningful supply might be available again: in three month's time. Specifically, MindFactory said that "In fact we ordered the GPU's but because of the high demand on the RX and GTX graphic cards which is related to BitCoin farming the manufacturer can not give us a delivery date. We expect a delivery time of at least 3 months. This shortage affects the whole of Germany, maybe even whole Europe. "
Well, this editor can attest that yes, Europe is definitely being affected. Even in my own country, tiny Portugal, westernmost country of the European Continent, there have been shortages on RX 570 and 580 graphics cards on some of the most renowned digital stores. This phenomenon has come to stay, folks. Just hold on to your horses, and do your best to endure it.Source: Tom's Hardware
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42 Comments on No End to GPU Supply Woes: Germany Supplier Hit by Shortage, Pulls Cards

#2
RejZoR
Crypto miners can get offended all they want, I'm also tired of their useless bullshit. The current situation is total garbage. You literally can't buy a graphic card of choice. It's all so overpriced, they have ridiculously long availability times or they simply aren't obtainable. Wanna buy RX480 or even RX570/RX580? GTX 1060 maybe? Tough luck.

I was looking at RX560 4GB like 3 weeks ago. 125€ Today? Exactly the same one 154€. F**k off. I ended up paying a bit more and grabbing cheapest GTX 1050Ti for the time being at 168€ because I opted for dual fan one with heatpipe cooler instead of singe fan one with block of aluminium as heatsink, until RX Vega gets released. I hear Vega is terrible at mining which is already great news.

@dumbo
He's not tired of reading about crypto miners, he's pissed off because they totally f**ked up the graphics cards market. And so am I.
Posted on Reply
#3
dumbo
RejZoR said:
Crypto miners can get offended all they want, I'm also tired of their useless bullshit. The current situation is total garbage. You literally can't buy a graphic card of choice. It's all so overpriced, they have ridiculously long availability times or they simply aren't obtainable. Wanna buy RX480 or even RX570/RX580? GTX 1060 maybe? Tough luck.

I was looking at RX560 4GB like 3 weeks ago. 125€ Today? Exactly the same one 154€. F**k off. I ended up paying a bit more and grabbing cheapest GTX 1050Ti for the time being at 168€ because I opted for dual fan one with heatpipe cooler instead of singe fan one with block of aluminium as heatsink, until RX Vega gets released. I hear Vega is terrible at mining which is already great news.

@dumbo
He's not tired of reading about crypto miners, he's pissed off because they totally f**ked up the graphics cards market. And so am I.
I agree that the demand has inflated the market to unfair prices, but part of the blame should be placed on manufacturers. There is no reason they shouldn't be able to keep up with the demands placed on them. At launch they're able to release thousands upon thousands of cards, yet a week to a month later every single store is sold out and none of them have an expected restock date. It seems like manufacturers are intentionally decreasing production upon release.
Posted on Reply
#4
kruk
TBH, the more I read about the GPU shortage problem, the more it looks like an artificial way to inflate prices ...

/edit: ^heh, too slow :)
Posted on Reply
#5
RejZoR
_Flare said:
additionally: "Seems like they get sold out before they get to the Importer."

to make a picture of HOW bad it is look at this price-comparison-site
https://geizhals.eu/?cat=gra16_512&v=k&hloc=at&hloc=de&hloc=pl&hloc=uk&hloc=eu&fcols=9808&fcols=132&sort=p&xf=132_6144#productlist
Of course, it's quick bucks for sellers to sell batch of 30 graphic cards to one person instead of selling them one by one to 30 people. But crypto mining is nightmare for vendors. They don't bring brand loyalty or gaming ecosystem, they just ride the wave for as long as it lasts and then they flood the market of used cards, disrupting future sales of new cards and not contributing to business via loyalty. We know how gamers are attached to certain brands. Miners don't care for as long as everything is the cheapest with max output.

It's particularly bad for AMD. They desperately need market share and with mass sales of mining cards, they aren't gaining any and with no availability of their cards, it means most people will defect to NVIDIA. Guess what they'll continue buying in the future. It'll probably be NVIDIA by default after that. It's a short term financial injection for AMD which will hurt them a lot long term...
Posted on Reply
#6
close
dumbo said:
There is a simple solution to your problem. Just don't read it. Nobody is forcing you read about mining. If you don't like it ignore it. The world does not cater to one person. There are many more who find it interesting, but thank you for sharing your thoughts on why you believe journalists should stop reporting on something.

Sincerely,
Some dickhead that's not offended about you talking about mining, but by your ignorance.
It's just that you're kind of reminded by it when you want to... say... buy a graphics card.

And there's no point in denying you were at least a little offended. If you took objection at ignorance in general on the internet you'd basically have to spend 100% of your time "flagging" it to the ignorant party :).
Posted on Reply
#7
Thalles Adorno
Brazil is also affected, a RX 580 costs the same as a 1080ti here. NVidia prices are unaffected
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#8
P4-630
The Way It's Meant to be Played
Well at least it makes me feel a bit better again somehow that I bought my MSI GTX1070 Gaming X at day 1 for 519 Euros, they are currently going for 600 and up in my country! :D:p
Posted on Reply
#9
LightningJR
Brand loyalty is just another flawed human condition. I buy the thing I want at the cheapest price I can find it at an example would be my 1070.

I love how people are mad on the internet.

Posted on Reply
#10
Prince Valiant
RejZoR said:
Crypto miners can get offended all they want, I'm also tired of their useless bullshit. The current situation is total garbage. You literally can't buy a graphic card of choice. It's all so overpriced, they have ridiculously long availability times or they simply aren't obtainable. Wanna buy RX480 or even RX570/RX580? GTX 1060 maybe? Tough luck.

I was looking at RX560 4GB like 3 weeks ago. 125€ Today? Exactly the same one 154€. F**k off. I ended up paying a bit more and grabbing cheapest GTX 1050Ti for the time being at 168€ because I opted for dual fan one with heatpipe cooler instead of singe fan one with block of aluminium as heatsink, until RX Vega gets released. I hear Vega is terrible at mining which is already great news.

@dumbo
He's not tired of reading about crypto miners, he's pissed off because they totally f**ked up the graphics cards market. And so am I.
I heartily agree with all of this.

One thing I'd like to add though: I am sick to death of people saying 'oh just sign up for notifications'. As if email speed is 100% reliable and the miners don't already have notifications set for everything.
Posted on Reply
#11
RejZoR
LightningJR said:
Brand loyalty is just another flawed human condition. I buy the thing I want at the cheapest price I can find it at an example would be my 1070.

I love how people are mad on the internet.


Brand loyalty is a thing whether you like it or not. Once you know some design and features work for you and you can't live without, that is brand loyalty. Be it vendor like ASUS or MSI or lower on AMD and NVIDIA level. AMD has some really neat features like way cooler interface, integrated overclocking, power saving features like Chill and frame rate target without the need to use 3rd party tools which are often all glitchy. And NVIDIA on the other hand has an upper hand with two superior V-Sync modes (Fast and Adaptive) which AMD doesn't have. If you favor one over the other, that's brand loyalty, because it'll ensure you stay with one brand because you like those features.
Posted on Reply
#12
zlobby
I love the whole blockchain concept. I hate the mining craze, though! I also hate the huge waste of energy in the mining process, or to be precise, the conversion of CO fuels into heat.

I was genuinely in need for a good 580-like GPU and had to wait for 2.5 months for it. At least I got it for 300 EUR back then. Now you can't even find one. Lol!

Imagine when this is all over! Tons of 580s, dime a dozen! I bet you'll wish you bought these multi-PCIe mobos!
Posted on Reply
#13
FordGT90Concept
"I go fast!1!11!1!"
RejZoR said:
I hear Vega is terrible at mining which is already great news.
The only way Vegas get consumed by the mining craze is if supply is so constrained on all the cards below it that the higher output of Vega justifies the higher cost (and because those cards have got so expensive). We can reasonably use GTX 1080 Ti as a gauge for that right now. Since miners aren't gobbling up all the GTX 1080 Tis right now, it's a pretty safe bet that Vega isn't attractive either. The moment 1080 Ti prices start climbing, they'll be buying (or already bought) Vega too.

dumbo said:
I agree that the demand has inflated the market to unfair prices, but part of the blame should be placed on manufacturers. There is no reason they shouldn't be able to keep up with the demands placed on them. At launch they're able to release thousands upon thousands of cards, yet a week to a month later every single store is sold out and none of them have an expected restock date. It seems like manufacturers are intentionally decreasing production upon release.
Actually, the manufacturers are in a lose-lose situation. They're all assuming the crash is going to happen again and they don't want anymore second hand cards and excessive inventory than necessary. They're hesitant to place massive orders to fix the shortage.

They hate the fact that gamers can't get cards but with miners buying them all up, the GPU market has become as volatile as cryptocurrency has. Minimal inventory is safer for them.

There's a big push to get mining cards out to the market. I think the main purpose for this is because then they have more control over RMAs (when it crashes, they can say "LOL, NOPE").

kruk said:
TBH, the more I read about the GPU shortage problem, the more it looks like an artificial way to inflate prices ...

/edit: ^heh, too slow :)
The inflated prices aren't MSRP. They're other people/businesses/retailers in the market selling cards at non-MSRP capitalizing on the limited supply.

RejZoR said:
It's particularly bad for AMD. They desperately need market share and with mass sales of mining cards, they aren't gaining any and with no availability of their cards, it means most people will defect to NVIDIA. Guess what they'll continue buying in the future. It'll probably be NVIDIA by default after that. It's a short term financial injection for AMD which will hurt them a lot long term...
This is about the only situation I would even consider an NVIDIA card because price/performance, GTX 1050 Ti is really the only option. That said, my loyalties aren't changing. I still firmly believe NVIDIA is a terrible company. :p
Posted on Reply
#14
bogmali
Stop crapping this thread!!! If you have no interest in it, why post? Last warning before I start issuing tickets;)
Posted on Reply
#15
R-T-B
zlobby said:
I love the whole blockchain concept. I hate the mining craze, though! I also hate the huge waste of energy in the mining process, or to be precise, the conversion of CO fuels into heat.

I was genuinely in need for a good 580-like GPU and had to wait for 2.5 months for it. At least I got it for 300 EUR back then. Now you can't even find one. Lol!

Imagine when this is all over! Tons of 580s, dime a dozen! I bet you'll wish you bought these multi-PCIe mobos!
This is where I stand.
Posted on Reply
#16
RejZoR
@FordGT90Concept
I wouldn't say NVIDIA is a terrible company. Their practices are shit and they've had the upper hand for too long which makes them bad. But you can't deny their technological superiority at the moment. The gap started with Maxwell 2 and was just reinforced with Pascal.

I was thinking about grabbing RX560 4GB, but then decided for GTX 1050Ti. At least it was obtainable in 1 day (others were for 15 days!) and for extra 10€ it has dual fan proper cooler with heatpipe instead of just a large chunk of aluminium heatsink. RX570 and RX580 were totally out of the question even though I'd prefer that. RX580's sell for even up to 450€. That's just crazy.

Thanks to mining, we are stuck in months of worst time to buy a graphic card because of heavily inflated prices and no availability. Just in time when I decide to buy one as replacement... Just pissed 30€ because I haven't grabbed one just few weeks ago.
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#17
ppn
Cryptographers didn't do wrong by depleting legacy cards supply. We don't need that overpriced year old garbage anyways. Now we can have pascal refresh or volta whatever it may be much much sooner. An build on 12nm with 40% more CUDA cores compared to their previous gen counterparts, So it is win win for gamers that can also mine these 2-4 months and get second card of their choice for free.
Posted on Reply
#18
Tatty_One
Super Moderator
There are a few still available in the UK, 580's or GTX1060's at reasonable prices, yes many that are still available are over inflated but if you know where to look there are still some to be found. Was thinking of jumping on the bandwagon and selling my 290X but in order to get a decent performance improvement to make it worthwhile I would need to go 1070 and in most cases they are crazy prices at the moment.
Posted on Reply
#19
Casecutter
Honestly if RGT add to the margins they will sell Vega for to AIB's I say do it... It sucks for gamers but AMD/RTG should try to have a hand to re-coupe at least while miners want to buy! As so as it goes "bust" do a price-cut and get to gamers for less than what they first intended on the market.

Sorry if someone is willing to pay a premium price, RTG should be able to get back there engineering investment.
Posted on Reply
#20
TheinsanegamerN
Casecutter said:
Honestly if RGT add to the margins they will sell Vega for to AIB's I say do it... It sucks for gamers but AMD/RTG should try to have a hand to re-coupe at least while miners want to buy! As so as it goes "bust" do a price-cut and get to gamers for less than what they first intended on the market.

Sorry if someone is willing to pay a premium price, RTG should be able to get back there engineering investment.
Except that if AMD starts trying to raise margins for their cards in accordance with a temporary price hike, AIBs will simply stop making AMD cards and go to nvidia. Its happened before over pettier reasons. Raising margins is unheard of in the chip industry for good reason. AMD would be insane to try and raise prices of year and a half old parts when they still have not delivered on their high end GPU.

AMD especially needs gamers to buy their products for long term health. Miners bought up tons of 7000/200 series cards for mining, remember? Remember what happened net? AMD hitting 17% shipping marketshare and loosing huge chunks of the market to nvidia's cards, even when the AMD parts were considered better. This kind of craze does long term damage to AMD.

What AMD needs to do is create a mining only card, which they are already doing, and perhaps make a card that, either through hardware or drivers, sucks at mining to dissuade miners from buying them. VEGA supposedly is like this, very poor at mining and expensive to boot. Or perhaps develop the ASIC that would be used for mining, thus preventing the scalping of their GPUs.
Posted on Reply
#21
Prince Valiant
Crippling through software might work but I think via a hardware solution would be the only permanent solution.

Watching the miners rant, even if only for a day, because of driver crippling would bring a grin to my face though.
Posted on Reply
#22
Bones
Look through the listings on fleabay - You'll see there isn't many if any up for grabs and the ones you do see are from sellers with next to if not 0 feedback.
These new sellers with weirdly spelled names are scammers - These guys will take a broken card and try to sell it as a working unit, using the fleabay/PayPal system to get away with it too because the info as to where they are and where it's coming from as examples are faked.

Know a guy personally that had an RX460 for sale and had a ton of "Buyers" make bids and offers on his card BUT all of these buyers were as described above so he pulled the listing to keep from getting ripped off.

You can use/manipulate the system fleabay uses to rip sellers off with no recourse to the seller if you know how..... And even as a buyer you can be ripped too, have a nephew this happened to not long ago.

There is $$ in the mining of AND selling of the equip to do it with since the cards are certainly meant for more than just mining or there woudn't be supply issues for guys that are gamers for example. In fact I highly suspect there is a certain "Enterprise" behind much of this of a criminal nature. It's already been proven criminal organizations use crypo currency because there is no easy way to track where the money goes or what it's used for.
This for example can make money laundering EZPZ to do if they wanted to - And BTW they already have before.

With the recent ransomware attacks, the supply of certain GPU's drying up, what I've noted about fleabay in general with these GPUs just adds up to all this in my mind and it's all too coincidental to be much anything else.

OK - I'm done now guys.... :fear:
Posted on Reply
#23
yotano211
I love all of the angry gamers who continue to cry about not having their GPUs. Instead of crying about lack of something, why not join in the fun and learn on why their is a shortage and maybe profit from it.

There are ways to get a hold of certion cards at a small profit mark-up, buy the cards, and then resell them for profit for use them what ever way you want. I'm not complaining, I got my 100+ gpus before the the shortage happened and now will unload most of it for a nice profit.
Posted on Reply
#24
erocker
Senior Moderator
Because the mid range cards are all being eaten up. Anything above a 460/560 for AMD are being eaten up and 1060's/1070's no longer seem to exist. This makes up a vast majority of GPU buyers/users. Sure, maybe they can "join in the fun and profit from it", but with no cards, how? Your recommendation is to use hardware like a commodity? Sorry, but there's way better choices for that.

Demand has overrun supply, it happens. Prices go up until things balance out. GPU makers are happy, they're selling faster than they can make them.
Posted on Reply
#25
yotano211
erocker said:
Because the mid range cards are all being eaten up. Anything above a 460/560 for AMD are being eaten up and 1060's/1070's no longer seem to exist. This makes up a vast majority of GPU buyers/users. Sure, maybe they can "join in the fun and profit from it", but with no cards, how? Your recommendation is to use hardware like a commodity? Sorry, but there's way better choices for that.

Demand has overrun supply, it happens. Prices go up until things balance out. GPU makers are happy, they're selling faster than they can make them.
There is ways to look for cards that most people dont know they just dont bother to look for it. I am not saying you can find cards easily and in large quantities, maybe 1 or 2 here and there but enough to make a 6 gpu mining rig.
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