Monday, March 26th 2018

Drunk on GeForce Partner Program Koolaid, MSI Openly Slanders AMD Radeon

MSI was caught openly slandering AMD Radeon graphics processors in promoting its MSI Gaming Series notebooks featuring NVIDIA GeForce graphics chips. The company is a signatory of the draconian GeForce Partner Program (GPP) by NVIDIA which, in boilerplate regulator-baiting language, tells its add-in card (AIC) partners not to use the same gaming sub-brand (eg: ASUS ROG, MSI Gaming, GIGABYTE Aorus, etc.,) for GPUs from any other brand (i.e. AMD Radeon). When it's in effect, ASUS, for example, can't sell an ROG Strix-branded Radeon graphics card, MSI can't sell an RX Vega 64 Gaming X, and it's probably why GIGABYTE stripped the RX 580 Gaming Box of Aorus branding.

In one of its regional Facebook pages, an official Facebook page customer response handle was seen openly stating "NVIDIA currently are ahead in the GPU experience," (keyword being "experience" and not performance), suggesting that its competition is sub-par. The handle was responding to a question as to why the notebook didn't come with AMD Radeon graphics options. Facebook users were quick to torch the MSI handle with a flame-war, and MSI corporate redacted the post stating "We apologize for making an inappropriate comment. It did not represent MSI's official views."
Source: Forbes
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95 Comments on Drunk on GeForce Partner Program Koolaid, MSI Openly Slanders AMD Radeon

#1
bug
I wouldn't worry about their staff's posts.
It took me one inquiry to MSI tech support for me stop buying their products altogether. They're basically clueless. That or they don't give a rat's ass.
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#2
Recus
When Linus Torvalds says it about Nvidia it's all good. When MSI or somebody else say something about AMD, you offend religion.

Also Jason Evangelho is former AMD's Senior Technical Marketing Specialist who doesn't forget his old habits.
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#3
LemmingOverlord
Puh-tay-toe, Puh-tah-toe.

I'm neither an Nvidia nor an AMD fanboi, but, pray tell... where does AMD have *any* sort of performance advantage over Nvidia (you incorrectly state the rep isn't talking about performance but he says "If it's up par with performance, MSI will definitely be able to do so", so he IS talking about performance, and more specifically gaming performance as the Geforce Partner Programme focuses on the gaming sub-brands.

Also, be careful what you call "slander". Slander is a legal term, with a very specific meaning. If you took this to court, MSI would easily provide proof that AMD's VEGA 64 is, gaming-wise, inferior to their GeForce GTX 1080 ti. They'd just hit up all the major benchmark rankings (e.g. 3DMark, Unigine) which provide public data showing GTX 1080 ti is scoring much higher than VEGA 64. It wouldn't be a wise move, but they could easily defend this argument.

I'm not saying it's in any way or form "smart" for MSI to dismiss AMD as a solution for GPUs. The fact that MSI apologised really means they aren't complete idiots and know they shouldn't piss off the "other" GPU brand, lest they get shafted next cycle.

Queue the haters... :(
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#4
dj-electric
Boo hoo
Some MSI rep gets misunderstood online, community goes ultra-offended torch mode.
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#5
_Flare
Consumers will notice that the Nvidia-only sub-brands are like "kidnapped".

Beside the fact, that most "if available" AMD 8GB cards are gaming-wise overpriced,
the hurt done to AMD or the consumer is quiet low.

Nobody should blindly buy a card just by its name. Every top-brand could have a quality-issue sometime.
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#6
Vayra86
Realistically the guy is right. AMD has little to nothing on offer right now, and also nothing tangible to offer in the pipeline except for that unicorn they call Navi, which is some unspecified MCM solution.

Meanwhile we see APUs flying around and again a focus on low-end and midrange.
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#7
kruk
LemmingOverlord said:
Also, be careful what you call "slander". Slander is a legal term, with a very specific meaning. If you took this to court, MSI would easily provide proof that AMD's VEGA 64 is, gaming-wise, inferior to their GeForce GTX 1080 ti. They'd just hit up all the major benchmark rankings (e.g. 3DMark, Unigine) which provide public data showing GTX 1080 ti is scoring much higher than VEGA 64. It wouldn't be a wise move, but they could easily defend this argument.
Congratulations on providing a single outlier. Now prove how Vega56 << 1070, RX580 << 1060, RX570 << 1060 3GB, RX560 << 1050, RX550 << 1030 in gaming performance. Good luck! :)

Regarding MSI, their reply seems further prove GPP is in action (we already saw SKUs dissapearing from MSIs website). Now that AMD is out of the premium gaming brands competition, they will be able to push prices sky high for next gen GPUs ...
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#8
Aldain
Recus said:
When Linus Torvalds says it about Nvidia it's all good. When MSI or somebody else say something about AMD, you offend religion.

Also Jason Evangelho is former AMD's Senior Technical Marketing Specialist who doesn't forget his old habits.
Um he was correct and still is.. At the time when he said it NVIDIA linux support was UTTER GARBAGE
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#9
I No
Who gives a rat's ass ? It's their business they can do whatever they want with it. People really have to pick something else to argue over seriously this is getting Idiocracy level of stupid. Naming schemes really? Like anyone in their right minds would go "I'm not buying this if it doesn't have GAMING X on it"... queue in the pitchforks and torches over something worthwhile this is just pure garbage.
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#10
RejZoR
Recus said:
When Linus Torvalds says it about Nvidia it's all good. When MSI or somebody else say something about AMD, you offend religion.

Also Jason Evangelho is former AMD's Senior Technical Marketing Specialist who doesn't forget his old habits.
Context people, context. The GeForce Partner is piss on the customers. Literally. If you think consumers will benefit from it, you should get on rehab from that koolaid. NVIDIA only makes it to screw everyone and reinforce their market position. Which is on a market with only 2 players even more damning for the consumers.
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#11
Vayra86
kruk said:
Congratulations on providing a single outlier. Now prove how Vega56 << 1070, RX580 << 1060, RX570 << 1060 3GB, RX560 << 1050, RX550 << 1030 in gaming performance. Good luck! :)

Regarding MSI, their reply seems further prove GPP is in action (we already saw SKUs dissapearing from MSIs website). Now that AMD is out of the premium gaming brands competition, they will be able to push prices sky high for next gen GPUs ...
Right, and now, let's try and buy one at a somewhat comparable price! Oh wait...
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#12
Vya Domus
"We apologize for making an inappropriate comment. It did not represent MSI's official views."
Bollocks. No one calls one of the products they sell from a manufacturer they are partnered with sub-par by mistake while simultaneously praising the other. I can only imagine how much pressure Nvidia has put on their AIBs for them to go out and say this in such a carefree way. I knew everyone wanted green but now it looks like sooner or later you wont have a choice.

Everything about this industry is so screwed at this point that I have no hope to see it go back to normality ever again.

RejZoR said:
The GeForce Partner is piss on the customers.
Actually they did that long ago , this is them taking "a piss" on the market as a whole. It's obvious that no cretin in charge at MSI , ASUS , GIGABYTE, etc. would possible want to reject this GPP program when the majority of cards they sell come form Nvidia. It's is what it is , they are becoming the new Intel and many are probably fine with that.
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#13
RH92
I No said:
Who gives a rat's ass ? It's their business they can do whatever they want with it. People really have to pick something else to argue over seriously this is getting Idiocracy level of stupid. Naming schemes really? Like anyone in their right minds would go "I'm not buying this if it doesn't have GAMING X on it"... queue in the pitchforks and torches over something worthwhile this is just pure garbage.
T H I S !!! Thank you i was about to comment something along these lines , glad to see there are still peoples using their brain on internet .

Besides that it's not like those brands are going to stop making AMD cards . MSI could easely go and make a new brand using the same TwinFrozr cooler and just name it something else with a bit different aesthetics and voila . Not only this but to be fair there are other " AMD exclusive " brands who make excelent coolers , Sapphire is a perfect example .
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#14
jabbadap
RH92 said:
T H I S !!! Thank you i was about to comment something along these lines , glad to see there are still peoples using their brain on internet .

Besides that it's not like those brands are going to stop making AMD cards . MSI could easely go and make a new brand using the same TwinFrozr cooler and just name it something else with a bit different aesthetics and voila . Not only this but to be fair there are other " AMD exclusive " brands who make excelent coolers , Sapphire is a perfect example .
Well the thing is that there ain't TwinFrozr cooler design for radeons on weaker segments either i.e. RX 580s on their side(Armor MK2 is Torx 2.0 fan). Though in current mining graze, they could think there's no point of making one to replace old radeon RX 580 gaming series(Maybe the supply for polaris 20 chips ain't there for them).
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#15
kruk
RH92 said:
T H I S !!! Thank you i was about to comment something along these lines , glad to see there are still peoples using their brain on internet .

Besides that it's not like those brands are going to stop making AMD cards . MSI could easely go and make a new brand using the same TwinFrozr cooler and just name it something else with a bit different aesthetics and voila . Not only this but to be fair there are other " AMD exclusive " brands who make excelent coolers , Sapphire is a perfect example .
Market doesn't work like this. You can't establish a new brand and expect from it to be successful without a massive investment ...
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#16
RH92
jabbadap said:
Well the thing is that there ain't TwinFrozr cooler design for radeons on weaker segments either i.e. RX 580s on their side(Armor MK2 is Torx 2.0 fan). Though in current mining graze, they could think there's no point of making one to replace old radeon RX 580 gaming series(Maybe the supply for polaris 20 chips ain't there for them).
I think you responded by yourself there .

Frankly the way i see this i believe we have to wait until next gen from both Nvidia and AMD and see how things will play out . Then and only then we can make some conclusions .
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#17
I No
kruk said:
Market doesn't work like this. You can't establish a new brand and expect from it to be successful without a massive investment ...
No but the market is based on supply/demand. So if MSI makes chicken feed off AMD's offerings reason would dictate that you go with what rakes in the money. If AMD outsold nVidia 10-1 the situation would be the same, this would be cutting the loss. Could they establish a brand for AMD's stuff? Yes, would it pay off on the long term? Probably not. Hence the situation. Blown out of proportion as it may be, bad or good decision I repeat it's their business and they can do whatever the heck they want with it, the only thing that would concern them at this point is if it pays off or it does not, the reaction from the "internet" twards this is the real kool-aid.
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#18
tvamos
Vayra86 said:
Right, and now, let's try and buy one at a somewhat comparable price! Oh wait...
MSRP is comparable. Sadly supply and demand have skyrocketed prices for AMD far more than nVidias and it doesn't help price/perf. comparison at all.
Posted on Reply
#19
RH92
kruk said:
Market doesn't work like this. You can't establish a new brand and expect from it to be successful without a massive investment ...
You got me wrong , i wasnt meaning an entirely new brand , what i meant there was a new branding name for their premium cooling solution , along with some minor aesthetic changes .
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#20
Rowsol
I laughed way too hard at the MSI post.
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#21
Vayra86
tvamos said:
MSRP is comparable. Sadly supply and demand have skyrocketed prices for AMD far more than nVidias and it doesn't help price/perf. comparison at all.
That is the point. Current stock is non-existant or priced beyond sensible for the gamer, high end beyond a 1070 isn't even touched proper (there are barely any Vega's that aren't going into an MI25 or Frontier version), and even a 1060 6GB's inflated price right now is 60-100 EUR below the AMD equivalent RX580 - and this is in Netherlands where supply is certainly not bad in a relative sense.

So point me to the incorrect statement, again, from this MSI rep. Regardless of whether it was a cool thing to do - I can see where he's coming from. And while I also agree this GPP and its characteristics are horrible business practice, the only reason Nvidia is capable of pulling a stunt like this is because its competitor dropped the ball bigtime.
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#22
theoneandonlymrk
I No said:
No but the market is based on supply/demand. So if MSI makes chicken feed off AMD's offerings reason would dictate that you go with what rakes in the money. If AMD outsold nVidia 10-1 the situation would be the same, this would be cutting the loss. Could they establish a brand for AMD's stuff? Yes, would it pay off on the long term? Probably not. Hence the situation. Blown out of proportion as it may be, bad or good decision I repeat it's their business and they can do whatever the heck they want with it, the only thing that would concern them at this point is if it pays off or it does not, the reaction from the "internet" twards this is the real kool-aid.
You see it through your perspective like many other Enthusiasts, wrong.
This is to rake money off joe regular. Not you.
And your also downplaying how many Amd cards sell nice bit of undermining there but also wrong.

The reaction to Gpp is spot on imho ,it might be their business but they won't be getting any more of my cash acting like this because I am a wallet voter.
Posted on Reply
#23
MAXLD
I No said:
Naming schemes really? Like anyone in their right minds would go "I'm not buying this if it doesn't have GAMING X on it"... queue in the pitchforks and torches over something worthwhile this is just pure garbage.
If it's all about the name, then kinda yes, from the consumer point of view all this is a bit overblown... although the already existent sub-brands like GamingX/ROG are a powerful marketing tool, easily recognizable, and have a certain reputation already built. Nothing a new powerful AMD series couldn't put into irrelevance levels if they actually come one day... (that and miners start using something more efficient to mine, releasing stock)... but until that day comes, nVidia is just trying to grab anything they can to put any marketing power tools into their side of the battlefield. Not because they need any of them right now, but because they can exploit it (+ AIBs are open to it), and AMD doesn't have any "pow€r" to even try stopping it. The only thing AMD can do is hope the media and consumers create a massive backlash... but that won't make any difference if there's no superior AMD cards to buy (specially at decent prices). Therefore, the AIB partners will cash in that stinking green money that nVidia has plenty to throw around, and nVidia will gladly pay the rent for those remaining marketing tools AIB have available just to polish even more that nVidia gaming advantageous position, and take them away from AMD (that currently doesn't have the cards to outshine them anyway).

Thing is... for the consumer it's not really about a "name", it's about the cooler that come with it. Mostly for the cooler performance, then for the looks, and even for the childish "bragging rights". Buying a "GamingX" cooled card is different than buying an "Armor" cooled card (cooler performance and design wise). Now you can argue that they can use the same "TWIN FROZR VI - GamingX" cooler, but apply a different sub-brand "name" and colours to AMD cards. Sure, that's what's expected, but will that actually happen? The point of this nVidia move is to stop having AMD cards looking like nVidia ones (specially the top ROG/GamingX series) and take advantage of those already well established gaming-related sub-brandings (extra marketing material). Therefore, would brands like Asus and MSi use the same top cooler on AMDs anyway, just with different colours and different stickers slapped on it? Logic and history says yes, it's their flagship cooler tech, but then again, can't nVidia actually pay for "cooler exclusivity"? Remains to be seen, but maybe not doing so would kind of defeat a point of this propaganda/investment (AMD cards not looking similar to top nVidia ones). "Buying" the sub-brand is kind of a worrying but logic marketing move, but buying a top cooler design exclusivity from each partner would be the real issue here. That would be an even more anti- consumer choice move.

We can all say there's no way a brand like MSi and Asus would "rent" their top cooler designs to one single partner, after so much R&D investment made... but then again, their GamingX/ROG sub-brands were also a money pit to establish for sure and, as we can see today, they have no issues renting them to nVidia exclusively (and get some money back).
Maybe it's just my tinfoil hat speaking. Hope so.
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#24
AsRock
TPU addict
MSI bending over for nVidia is no surprise, iin fact i would not be surprised if most did as money talks. I will find it extremely funny if some one finds a loophole were they can get fined for such actions.

Only been buying XFX over the years as they have always treated me well and last time they stud up again nVidia and glad this will not effect them again. I bet they are glad they don't have to take up the A from nVidia this time.

Shame people will not stand up for their principles as well to send a fat FU right back for the BS nVidia do every year.
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