Monday, August 31st 2020

Performance Slide of RTX 3090 Ampere Leaks, 100% RTX Performance Gain Over Turing

NVIDIA's performance expectations from the upcoming GeForce RTX 3090 "Ampere" flagship graphics card underline a massive RTX performance gain generation-over-generation. Measured at 4K UHD with DLSS enabled on both cards, the RTX 3090 is shown offering a 100% performance gain over the RTX 2080 Ti in "Minecraft RTX," greater than 100% gain in "Control," and close to 80% gain in "Wolfenstein: Young Blood." NVIDIA's GeForce "Ampere" architecture introduces second generation RTX, according to leaked Gainward specs sheets. This could entail not just higher numbers of ray-tracing machinery, but also higher IPC for the RT cores. The specs sheets also refer to third generation tensor cores, which could enhance DLSS performance.
Source: yuten0x (Twitter)
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131 Comments on Performance Slide of RTX 3090 Ampere Leaks, 100% RTX Performance Gain Over Turing

#26
Turmania
I will.never buy the card but it sure looks sexy.
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#27
thepath
Calmmo
So the 3-4x RT performance gain rumor was fake after all.
Are you seriously thinking that you will get 3-4x fps gain in one generation ??

However, if you are talking about RT cores themselves being 3-4x faster then that possible. But it does not mean you will get 3-4x fps because games are not pure ray tracing. ALso, RT cores themselves only handle BVH traversal and ray-triangle intersection. Ray tracing depends on both RT cores and FP32 Cores. 4x faster RT does not mean you will get 4x fps or even close to that.
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#28
bug
BoboOOZ
It's hardware accelerated on both sides, the neural network is trained at Nvidia and is put at work in real-time on each GPU to "guess" how to extrapolate those images.
Yeah, but the recognition part of a NN is only some math functions, I don't think there's dedicated hardware for that.
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#29
BoboOOZ
bug
Yeah, but the recognition part of a NN is only some math functions, I don't think there's dedicated hardware for that.
The AI is dealt with by tensor cores, dedicated hardware for nn/machine learning.

Edit: Machine learning itself it's just math functions, just operations on tensors (fancy matrixes) and floating-point numbers, that's why accelerating them on GPUs works so well.
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#30
RedelZaVedno
Games that support RTX ray tracing as of now...
1. Amid Evil / 2. Battlefield V / 3. Control / 4. Call of Duty: Modern Warfare / 5. Deliver Us the Moon / 6. Justice Online / 7. JX3 / 8. Mechwarrior 5: Mercenaries / 9. Metro Exodus (and The Two Colonels DLC) / 10. Minecraft / 12. Quake II RTX / 13. Shadow of the Tomb Raider / 14. Wolfenstein: Youngblood

and DLSS 2.0...
1. Cyberpunk 2077 / 2. Death Stranding / 3. F1 2020 / 4. Minecraft / 4. Bright Memory / 5. Mechwarrior V: Mercenaries / 6. Deliver Us The Moon / 7. Control / 8. Wolfenstein : Youngblood / 9. Anthem /10. Metro Exodus / 11.Battlefield / 12. Shadow of the Tomb Raider / 13. Final Fantasy XV / 14. Monster Hunter: World

Is it worth the price increase over Maxwell/Pascal? NO
Posted on Reply
#31
Hattu
If these numbers are correct, I don't think you can have that (3090) card at any reasonable price. At least here in Finland. Cheapest 2080Ti is still 1200€ last time I checked. So, if this rumoured $1400 is correct, it'll cost at least 1800€ here. In that case my estimates for the prices are +1200€ for 3080 and +2200€ for 3090 (taxes etc). Latest Titan RTX is +3000€ here atm.

But I think the top model will really be at least 2600€, since I don't believe in rumours and because it's too close to Titan RTX.

Just my 2 cents... I won't be bying it anyway.
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#32
Vayra86
lynx29
You guys are completely forgetting about DLSS 2.0, it basically looks like 1440p or 4k even though its running the game at 720p or 1080p, Control is the best example, but I have a feeling Nvidia is all in with RTX and DLSS 2.0 being a combined feature. Just my guess, but yeah.
I don't think we're forgetting it, I think we're very aware of the fact its not a technique that can be applied on every game unless Nvidia says its okay.

They can train a lot, but they do have to train it, so legacy is off the table and reality is that it will probably only appear in , as you say, RT capable titles. Until...? Its a nice technology. But the caveats are too big to ignore. Its like a new 'SLI support' issue waiting to happen. You'll have it most of the time... until Nvidia loses interest.

I will say... for me DLSS is a non issue in the purchase decision as a whole. Its bonus. And it really doesn't matter how many games Nvidia decides to support. The fact remains, they have to support it.

IMHO the final and only common idea of performance gen to gen is still raster perf. Its cool they get however much more efficiency out of their addons, but they are addons and most of the time you won't use them. Besides, its not hard to iterate with a big jump on your first implementation of this tech, let's be honest.
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#33
Shatun_Bear
10gb on the 3080 is a stupid move by Nvidia. For an $850 card it should have 16gb minimum, 10gb 3080s are going to drop in price hard when the 20gb version and RDNA2 16GB cards release.

The tier up from that is 3090 for a bonkers price, as $800 for a card is already obscene.
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#34
Imsochobo
bug
Yeah, but the recognition part of a NN is only some math functions, I don't think there's dedicated hardware for that.
Control's dlss 1.5 wasn't accelerated at all, even said it straight out, it's just a normal shader operation.
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#35
DuxCro
RedelZaVedno
Games that support RTX ray tracing as of now...
1. Amid Evil / 2. Battlefield V / 3. Control / 4. Call of Duty: Modern Warfare / 5. Deliver Us the Moon / 6. Justice Online / 7. JX3 / 8. Mechwarrior 5: Mercenaries / 9. Metro Exodus (and The Two Colonels DLC) / 10. Minecraft / 12. Quake II RTX / 13. Shadow of the Tomb Raider / 14. Wolfenstein: Youngblood

and DLSS 2.0...
1. Cyberpunk 2077 / 2. Death Stranding / 3. F1 2020 / 4. Minecraft / 4. Bright Memory / 5. Mechwarrior V: Mercenaries / 6. Deliver Us The Moon / 7. Control / 8. Wolfenstein : Youngblood / 9. Anthem /10. Metro Exodus / 11.Battlefield / 12. Shadow of the Tomb Raider / 13. Final Fantasy XV / 14. Monster Hunter: World

Is it worth the price increase over Maxwell/Pascal? NO

WCCF has hands down the most mentally challenged/ fanboy infested comment section i have seen in all my years on the internet. Please keep this mental attitude for garbage websites like WCCF.

TPU, please don't turn into WCCFtech.
Posted on Reply
#36
Zareek
DuxCro
WCCF has hands down the most mentally challenged/ fanboy infested comment section i have seen in all my years on the internet. Please keep this mental attitude for garbage websites like WCCF.

TPU, please don't turn into WCCFtech.
I dunno, I think it's funny but I don't go to WCCFTech at all. Ngreedia is getting a bit nutty but we'll see what the official launch prices are tomorrow. We really need some competition in the market segment!
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#37
Manoa
trust me, THIS is absolutely not fake:
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#38
thepath
Shatun_Bear
10gb on the 3080 is a stupid move by Nvidia. For an $850 card it should have 16gb minimum, 10gb 3080s are going to drop in price hard when the 20gb version and RDNA2 16GB cards release.

The tier up from that is 3090 for a bonkers price, as $800 for a card is already obscene.
You might have a point if the extra video memory was useful. But it won't
RedelZaVedno
and DLSS 2.0...
1. Cyberpunk 2077 / 2. Death Stranding / 3. F1 2020 / 4. Minecraft / 4. Bright Memory / 5. Mechwarrior V: Mercenaries / 6. Deliver Us The Moon / 7. Control / 8. Wolfenstein : Youngblood / 9. Anthem /10. Metro Exodus / 11.Battlefield / 12. Shadow of the Tomb Raider / 13. Final Fantasy XV / 14. Monster Hunter: World
Many of these game you mention are not DLSS2.0
I'm pretty sure that Battlefield, Tomb Raider, FFXV, Metro ..... are all using DLSS1.0

However, more and more game will use DLSS2.0 in future and some of them are big titles like Cyperpunk 2077
Posted on Reply
#39
DuxCro
Zareek
I dunno, I think it's funny but I don't go to WCCFTech at all. Ngreedia is getting a bit nutty but we'll see what the official launch prices are tomorrow. We really need some competition in the market segment!
Yup. I hope RDNA 3 with their chiplet approach and intel GPU's turn out good. I am not loyal to any manufacturer. Only to who can give me better price/ performance. RTX 3090, and probably RTX 3080 will be unaffordable for me.
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#40
neatfeatguy
I love those graphs without numbers. It's like saying drink this 16oz Red Bull - it will give you 2x the energy of an 8oz Red Bull. Just because there is 2x more product, doesn't mean you'll get 2x more results.

Folks need to relax and be patient for actual benchmarks. Things aren't that far off.
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#41
Chrispy_
Oh, double the raytracing performance? Given the leaks and claims of quadruple raytracing performance that's underwhelming.

I guess this is still just a leak. What's the released day supposed to be again - Sept 12th?
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#42
Xex360
One thing for sure we need to part way with some organs if we want to get one of those, on the bright side we'll lose weight too.
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#43
RedelZaVedno
I'm only interested in increased raw rasterization performance and improvements in price to performance ratio. DLSS & RT are nice features to have but let's be honest how many titles have them implemented? 10, maybe 13... No game I primarily play (Elite dangerous, No Man's Sky, Project Cars 2, rFactor 2, IL-2, DCS world, X-Plane, MS Flight Simulator 2020) uses these features. I'm VERY afraid of tomorrow Jensen coming on the stage and saying: "3090 is 100% faster than 2080TI and costs only 40% more", leaving out the fact that he's talking about ray tracing + DLSS, not standard rasterization performance. If he'd be honest and say +40-50% better in standard rasterization performance for 40% more $ and 100-150W more power consumption, crowd would likely whistle him off stage.
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#44
Hardware Geek
DuxCro
WCCF has hands down the most mentally challenged/ fanboy infested comment section i have seen in all my years on the internet. Please keep this mental attitude for garbage websites like WCCF.

TPU, please don't turn into WCCFtech.
Wccf is the absolute worst. Just awful people on there in general. The comments section is almost always a bunch of political BS that has nothing to do with the article posted. I don't understand the fanboying either.
Posted on Reply
#45
PowerPC
DuxCro
WCCF has hands down the most mentally challenged/ fanboy infested comment section i have seen in all my years on the internet. Please keep this mental attitude for garbage websites like WCCF.

TPU, please don't turn into WCCFtech.
We're way past that. Nvidia vs. AMD is like Conservatives vs. Democrats. It will never stop.
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#46
lynx29
B-Real
Wow, so good! No. Who the heck cares about RT?

And what other game supports DLSS 2? Anyway, honestly I do not want to use lowered options when I buy a $800-1200 card: I want to use it on native resolution and don't want it to be used on lower resolution that won't match native one.
I understand your concern, but you can't really tell the difference, that is the genius of DLSS 2. but, you also make a great point, like 4 games support it perfectly and that is it. so eh. I'm with ya.

I have a feeling these gpu's launch tomorrow, not just an announcement. I'm on the fence about it. I think i am going to be patient and get big navi 2 and ryzen 4800x upgrades like i had planned. unless benchmarks show insane gains then ya im gonna cave and just buy me a 3080 most likely lol
Posted on Reply
#47
Punkenjoy
Features like ray tracing and DLSS can be related to the problem of the eggs and the chicken.

It's true that not many games are around using theses features, but there is not that many cards that can run them (and run them fast !)

The more card that there will be around supporting theses features, the more game developper will use them.

The more game that use them, the more people want to have these cards.

it's quite normal that it's start slow. Even more since it's only supported by one of the vendor and not even across all the range. Once all new cards support ray tracing and some kind of DLSS like upscaling, these features will become quite common in new games and almost mandatory on AAA games.

Same things with memory size. games won't make use of 24 GB if there is only a small margin that have that much(except maybe few flagship game). But once most of the market are 24+GB cards, most game will use it.
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#48
Vayra86
Manoa
trust me, THIS is absolutely not fake:

You forgot the second half of the chart. I marked 2018 for you, so you get your facts straight.

Stock growth at five times the rate of its branch, technology. Hmmm

PowerPC
We're way past that. Nvidia vs. AMD is like Conservatives vs. Democrats. It will never stop.
Only in the eyes of the beholder man. Its easy to unsee and even easier to punch through. I mean honestly. You can't defend either company with any trace of sanity. They're both filth. But then... hmm maybe it really is like cons vs dems after all. :toast:
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#49
Metroid
So there we have, as soon as I saw the image nvidia comparing 2080ti x 3090 then it became clear, 3090 was meant to be 3080ti but for some reason they wanted a different name but in truth 3090 = 3080ti.
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#50
BoboOOZ
Metroid
So there we have, as soon as I saw the image nvidia comparing 2080ti x 3090 then it became clear, 3090 was meant to be 3080ti but for $$$$$ome reason they wanted a different name but in truth 3090 = 3080ti.
There, I fixed it for you.
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